Is this shell disease??? (P. Ciliata

[deboM3]

I found this guy at a LFS tonight, and snapped this pics. He was in a little 5g? tank and had no rocks to hide. He didnt look too good, but I might be willing to try to save him. Should I buy him?????? Does he have shell disease??? Also, do you think he would kill a 1.5 inch blue damsel????? He is just under 3 inches...


Here is a picture
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y162/louisdogg/mantis131Medium.jpg

Thanks in advance everyone

[Pea-brain]

that doesn' look good. If he isn't too expensive I would take him in. He's a cute one. If it molted very soon (If that is shell disease) It MIGHT survive. I wouldn't bet on it. But he has a better chance in your tank I'm guessing.....

[deboM3]

Hey Pea-brain, does that look like the same thing that Knives has on his back????

[Pea-brain]

It looks similar, but knive's spots are not nearly as dark and are much smaller than that Ciliata's spot. Also I belive knives will molt soon. However, knives spots are a white ring around a darker spot, Like I see in that mantis (unless the dark spot is algae on the glass)

[justinl]

eee.... that doesn't look great. If you go ahead and save that P. ciliata, Id suggest putting him in his own tank. I wouldn't trust a lfs who lets a mantis get in that bad a shape. If you don't buy though (please?), could you do the mantis a favour and tell the lfs to throw some LR in there and soak its frozen foods in a supplement?

[deboM3]

Pea-brain,

Thats not alae, I remembered your description and thinking that this one looked similar. Ill keep checking your thread to see if there are any updates. Best of luck...

I dont really have a hospital tank or anything to put it in. I just have two tanks, one is FOWLR, and the other is going to be a mantis tank but it has a blue damsel in it for the time being.

I will definitly tell the lfs to give it someplace to hide, and soak the food in a supplement.

Its really frustrating, because the pet store i go to normally has a mantis on order for me, but I guess they are having a hard time getting one from the wholeseller, and i refuse to pay anything more than 30 bucks.

I wish he was in good health =0/

[Pea-brain]

Thanks. I am pretty sure that if I can keep the water in good shape, and keep the feeding up until he molts he will come out fine. I hope that poor mantis from the LFS comes out ok. Also good luck obtaining a mantis from that other place :)

Also, is it me or is P. ciliata coming up more and more on the forum lately? Since I have one maybe I'm just noticing it now.....

[andromedia226]

Hey debo, where'd you see this fella? I was in at chris' LFS and he mentioned your order they had one G. chigara there. i picked her up and she's absolutely ferocious, but pitch black.

if you don't mind i might want to take a shot at the p. ciliata if you dont' want it...

[deboM3]

Ill let you know. If it wasnt in such bad condition i would have bought it today. Did you have an order in there too or just walk in and see it?

[andromedia226]

I've had an order for "lime green mantis" (g. smithii) that over the months has transformed into ANY mantis that they can find! I'm going up north to the bay area and am going to call around again. found one last weekend up there, and I called at least 15 or 16 stores before someone had one. Drove up the 200 miles and guess what? PISTOL SHRIMP! argh.

Hey, have you tried ordering mantis shrimp from any other stores in the area? They might have different suppliers with healthier shrimp. The two I got from A Adventures were/are both sketchy. One had a parasite and this Chiragra has stretched out, unhealthy looking ventral "melting armor".

[deboM3]

Well i just picked this guy up a few hours ago, and he is now in my tank. He seems pretty active as he is exploring his new habitat.

So as for food, I should soak frozen krill or silversides in selcon and feed that??? Is there anything else I can do to help him get past the shell disease?

(I am still not sure that it is shell disease, im just assuming)

[Thurge]

Keep your water Clean Clean Clean.
Feed an assortment of foods like Silversides, Krill, scallops, fresh fish, squid all soaked in Selcon. You can also feed it inexpencive live damsels. :D
Keep heart, the reason my G. chigra is named Hairy is because he was sporting an algae mowhawk when I got him (along with some spots of shell rot) and he has been with me for well over a year now.
And he is back to sporting the bald look, thankfully.

[justinl]

UV sterilisers help too if you feel like getting one. And keep the lights off more often than on.

[deboM3]

Hey Thurge, what is shell rot??? Maybe that is what this poor guy has because it doesnt quite look like the shell disease that ive seen in Dr. Roy's gallery. Also, he has one leg that is all bent up and non-functional.

I will keep the lights off more than normal, and definitly soak the food i give him in selcon.

Thanks for the advice guys, and heres some pictures just for fun...

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y162/louisdogg/fish078Medium.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y162/louisdogg/fish086Medium.jpg
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y162/louisdogg/fish091Medium.jpg

[andromedia226]

Cute little guy! Glad it got rescued!

I like the fish/killing machine mesh divider - it's a nice touch, haha.

[justinl]

Isn't shell rot the same thing as the shell disease? I thought it was.

I like that last pic. The mantis is looking across the divider almost longingly... "mmm, damsel"

[deboM3]

lol, yeah my GF would kill me if anything happened to that damsel. I didnt know that shell disease and shell rot were the same thing.

[Thurge]

Thats shell rot/disease.

Go tell your GF that she has two choices. She can go tank shopping with you so the Damsel has a safe home, or she can kiss the fish good bye. You can SEE the drool in the second picture, and she will probably figure out how to get to the other side.

[deboM3]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9288007#post9288007 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Thurge
She can go tank shopping with you so the Damsel has a safe home,

yeah she is, the netting is only temperary. Im planning on getting another live feeder damsel in a week maybe...

[Pea-brain]

It is my understanding that live foods are healthier than frozen and freeze dried. I would suggest feeding the fish a very healthy diet (maybe brine shrimp soaked in selcon) to make it as nutritional as possible. I believe its called gut loading in the reptile world ;)

[A.T.DAWG]

yes i used to breed rats and gut load them for my snake :)
used gut load crickets when i owned a lizard too.

[justinl]

That sounds like a wonderful life. can you imagine that poor unsuspecting cricket...

"Man this guy must really love us crickets! All the wonderful fooooood! mmm so good, and so much of it, it's like a 24/7 banquet! Oh what's this? he's tranfering me to a brand new home now. hm it's warmer here. and look, my new room mate... oh crap"

[mattyice]

haha heck with the cricket what about the rats knowing they are with a snake and the snake isnt killing them yet, then when they think its safe WHAM, haha actually now i know what my peacocks entire kill list felt like

[justinl]

lol what an existence. Oh well i suppose being high on the foodchain has some benefits. that's life.

hey debo, that P. ciliata jumped the barrier to that tasty damsel yet?

[deboM3]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9297071#post9297071 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by justinl
hey debo, that P. ciliata jumped the barrier to that tasty damsel yet?

lol, not yet...

hey what do you guys think i should do. The first day i had him i fed him a piece of krill ( maybe a little too big) and he took it. I thought he ate it, but then last night i saw him come out of his cave and he had it in his hands.

How do you guys get uneaten food that the mantis stores in its lair??? Or do you think he will eat it eventually???

(edit: You can actually see the piece of krill in one of those pictures i posted.)

[mattyice]

at least they wont bury it (i dont think at least) like peacocks do

[deboM3]

He molted tonight! I got 90-95 percent of the molt out of his PVC cave. His back is clean as could be! No more spots! :D

[justinl]

yay! Im really glad that it ended up being okay. Just to be on the safe side though I would advise you keep up the routine of less light and supplemented food.

[Pea-brain]

Thats great! That is one lucky little spearer. You're lucky too! what with having a mantis shrimp actually CAPABLE of killing things! (Knives only has 2 tiny, pale little sticks. They almost look dangerous, but the fish apparently disagree, as they always hang right outside his cave :D ) I'm curious, did yours stay yellow after the molt also?

[deboM3]

Thanks justinl, I will definitly keep up the supplemented food, and less light.

I am actually leaving for the weekend, so I was thinking about placing a small damsel in the tank with the mantis in case it gets hungry. I think I will leave the lights in the tank off, but leave the window blinds open so that the tank will have some low light during the day.

The mantis still is a little yellow, but I think it is more green now. Its pretty cool to see the molt. I have one of its spearers on my desk. It is really sharp. lol

Also, the portions of its shell that seemed infected with the shell rot seemed to be ALOT less rigid than the non infected parts. That is when i tried to bend the shell, it broke at the rotted part very easily...

Thanks for the advice everyone.

[justinl]

cool, good plan to just leave the lights off with the shutters open.

can we get some pics of the molt/mantis? :)

[deboM3]

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y162/louisdogg/mantis155.jpg

This is the only crappy picture of the molt... The mantis hasnt really came out of the burrow. Just kinda peeks his head out and looks around lol.

[Thurge]

That rocks!!
Smart move in keeping the lights down through another molt. I would definately up the lighting after the next molt to try to keep your mantis yellow.
Something I just thought of is maybe slowly replacing your white Argonite with Seachem's Golden Shores Argonite. http://www.seachem.com/products/product_pages/images/full-size/GoldenShores.jpg I know in keeping Frog Fish, that if you don't have similarly colored decorations that a colored froggy may not keep its coloration. I wonder if this may be true in Mantis or if like N.wennera that come from different depths having different coloration, its a funtionality of light received?