Nitrates

[Tony Romano]

I am fighting with Nitrates.

Is there a consensus here about BB vs DSB?

I've been thinking DSB is the answer...am I wrong?

Also what is best test kit for Nitrates?

[spaceyboy]

I think Salifert makes the best test kits

There are alot of posts about the BB vs DSB topic...I would run a search, People find success with both.

Are you doing regular water changes with RODI?

[chaseracing]

I do not believe a DSB will help with Nitrates. Nitrate is a final by product that is removed by doing water changes.

-=E=-

[graveyardworm]

A DSB will help reduce nitrates same as LR will, DSB's need to be set up properly and there is some maintenance involved. What sized tank are we talking about? There is a lower limit that a DSB can be maintained successfully. BB tanks rely more heavily on high flow to keep particles suspended where they can be removed through aggressive skimming and regular water changes.

[victor_c3]

I'm a beginner and I don't really know what I'm talking about here, but there is a thread in the "advanced topic" forum about how to build your own Remote Deep Sand Bed.

After reading the thread, basically you just fill an old 5 gallon bucket with sand, install a two bulkheads, and pass your water through the bucket (over the top of the sand) and let nature take its course.

From what I've been reading, it sounds like you only need to change the sand in the buckets every 2 years or so. I'm going to set something like this up with my tank.

But don't take my advice, I'm just a beginner. Read the thread and make your own decision.

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=896352

[illal]

i second the salifert test they are by far the best.... as far as the nitrate..what size tank??? how many fish???? if your nitrates are really that high do a 50% water change..this will help alot...if your nitrates are high you obviously havnt been keeping up on yur water changes

[davidryder]

hmm... there are many other factors besides DSB and BB that determing nitrates. nitrates IMO is a measure of the overall health of your system... it isn't proven to be harmful to fish or corals. to me it's just a way to gauge the overall health of my system. high nitrates usually means there is something else that is off-balance.

[melev]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9431325#post9431325 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by ajromano@mylinuxisp.
I am fighting with Nitrates.

Is there a consensus here about BB vs DSB?

I've been thinking DSB is the answer...am I wrong?

Also what is best test kit for Nitrates?

A DSB (deep sand bed) de-nitrifies the water. So yes, it is a huge asset especially for those that are new to the hobby.

Big water changes are another way to lower them. 50% water changes will drop the nitrates to half of what they were.

However, you may have your system set up in a way that adds more nitrates, such as using a wet/dry filter with bioballs. What are your test results? Tell us about your set up.

[Tony Romano]

Nitrates are testing at 10-20 on Salifert.

We have a 215 and a 90 common plumbed. 90 has 6" of sand, 215 has 3-4, I had major crash last summer have been fighting to come back. Root cause was a dead mushrrom i missed after moving. I am/was converting tank to sps and attempting not to start over. Also i thought my tank was at zero nitrates due to crappy test kit.

I have been doing 110 gallon changes with Red Sea Coral Pro, seems to be working.

Also have skimmer and some macro in sump/fuge (ex-mirical mud set-up, that did not work well)

[melev]

If you aren't in a hurry, you can use Algone ( www.algone.com ) to lower nitrates over time. Just toss a pillow in the sump and let it work its magic for 14 days, then replace.

10 to 20ppm isn't horrible. 80 is horrible. I think the water changes are your faster solution, and the Algone will bring it down over a 6 to 8 week period if you are patient. My tank's was quite high when I had a ton of fish, but I have less now, and mine read 3ppm (Salifert) for many months.

[toccata]

You might want to check out this latest thread..

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1062393

[Tony Romano]

Algone? Is it like Purigen?

[melev]

Tony, check their website for all the information about it. As far as I know, that is the only product they sell.

[SgJsg35]

Does that algon really work? Will it work if your nitrates are in the 70-80 range or do you need to start with a low reading?

[melev]

It will work, but probably take even longer that 6 weeks. You have to change it out every 14 days. A box has 6 pillows in it, and be sure you buy the correct size for your tank.

[Tony Romano]

My base rock is all over 5-7 years old. Due to my inexperience and a damaged coral last summer ther was a major crash.

THe big debate I am having with myself is weather or not to 100% rework 215. It has the purple "cyno" crap and many aptasia, bubble algae. Tank is currently pretty healthy after many water changes.

All my basics are ok, I skim, have Tunzi etc.

I want to end up with SPS.....hate the idea of moving rock and starting process again.

[melev]

Tony, perhaps nitrates are not your main culprit. Having old rock can be a detriment if it is fully loaded up with detritus. You may be able to cook it and rejuvenate it (be sure you research cooking live rock to understand what that term actually means). Test your phosphate and let us know what it is.

I would do huge water changes back to back to lower those nitrates. Why not? It'll be a hassle, but if you do 50% changes every other day this week, they will be reduced 87.5% (from 80 to 10ppm).

[Tony Romano]

Detritus maybe the key, you have hit on where i am with my thinking now. I thought that detritus eventually became inert. Am I wrong? My my step is going to be installing pads in sump and using targeted flow to clean rock. There was not as much detritus as expected last summer when i rework tanks after crash. I hope some regular cleaning will fix it up. if i eve rework my sump i will add sock, big error with this setup is it started with no skimmer and mud in refugium.

I will look at boiling.

I am confused by old rock thing in general, I thought old ment better established bacteria...

[Tony Romano]

phosphate test zero, also I added Purigen and Phosban last night.

[melev]

It isn't 'boiling' either. Take a look at this thread:
http://www.dfwmas.org/Forums/viewtopic.php?p=109759#109759

Rock can get loaded up with stuff over time, and cooking it will clean it all out and make it ready to use once again.

You stated you have a lot of base rock. This is commonly more dense than liverock, and may be one of the reasons your nitrates stay so high. I don't use any base rock at all. Since it is the main filtration of my tank, I chose to buy only LR as I could afford it. It takes time this way, but every rock in the tank is working for me and the reef.

[Tony Romano]

All is live rock.

[Tony Romano]

All is live rock.

I actually am doing this with some rock now, without ph. I was assuming bacteria would stay alive.

[Tony Romano]

Also added Purigen and Phosban last night.

[melev]

This is what you said above:
My base rock is all over 5-7 years old.

You must have flow on the LR, and it would be good to skim it and change the water weekly.

[Tony Romano]

Right, I user term wrong, my error.

[Tony Romano]

http://www.mylinuxisp.com/~ajromano/newreef.htm

Here is tank new, it would be very difficult to remove all rock.

Rodge on proper way to cook.

Thanks again.

[melev]

It looks pretty good to me Tony. Just go with water changes for now, and then add the Algone to your tank whenever you get it.

[poissonist]

you should go to google ask aquarium and vodka. BY USING VODKA (ethanol) you will soves all your nitrates and phosphates problems and save a lot of money. What else? you will discover other dimensions of aquarium....and be more rich!!!hahahaha

[graveyardworm]

Definately research vodka ( carbon source ) dosing before doing it. Water changes a well maintained refugium, and a DSB are all you need. Some people debate the DSB, but IMO me its the best way to go.

[poissonist]

dsb is good but not enough!refugium also!imo? what is it?
mailing? when you over load aquaria with animals take info about vodka. tested and approoved with more than 200 ANIMALS /100 LITERS.... GOOGLE VODKA AQUARIUM....

[melev]

"imo" is In My Opinion.

Using Vodka in a tank isn't a new idea. It has been discussed here on RC many times in the past couple of years. There are risks, so if someone wanted to add that to add a carbon source to the tank for the bacteria to consume, they better be ready for the ramifications.

Do your homework before you make a change.

tested and approoved with more than 200 ANIMALS /100 LITERS

Btw, 200 animals in 25g of water? Who does that?