Which is the best suplement? [Archive] - Reef Central Online Community

CarlosS

03/27/2007, 03:11 PM

Hi Guys:

Currently I have a 400 watts, 14.000ºK, Hamilton MH Bulb. I suplement this with a 96 watts PC blue bulb. I would like change this PC for a HO(T5) or VHO, super actinic or true actinic or whatever.

I talked to premium aquatics and they told me that UV (T5) are the best suplementing Metal Halides with actinics. Also I am thinking in buy a actinic 03 PC bulb.

Which would you recommend?

northbay-reefer

03/27/2007, 03:25 PM

Their is nothing better actinic wise than VHO actinic bulbs by URI

CarlosS

03/27/2007, 03:34 PM

Thaanks for your soonest response:

Now. What do you think about two of these:

http://www.premiumaquatics.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=36BVHO&Category_Code=URIblue

Or only one would be enough?

northbay-reefer

03/27/2007, 04:03 PM

For actinic supplement you only need 2 blue actinic bulbs, Especially with the 14k halide

CarlosS

03/27/2007, 04:08 PM

Great!!!,

Thanks for your help

CarlosS

03/28/2007, 06:21 AM

Vote please!!!

bosworth

03/28/2007, 06:42 AM

I second the vote for VHO Actinic by URI these are the best bulbs on the market. So far the T5 version of this bulb hasn't been able to reproduce the same light.

CarlosS

03/28/2007, 08:44 AM

Thanks for your comments.

Bt you can see that there are people that still like T5 HO. Why is that. I think that it is very different to VHO

CarlosS

03/28/2007, 01:23 PM

Who is voting for T5 HO???, I can't believe it!!!. Why it is supposed that is best??

killagoby

03/28/2007, 02:40 PM

I heard you do not need actinics with 14K MH's.

bureau13

03/28/2007, 03:05 PM

14Ks have a lot of blue (450 nm or so) not so much 420 nm (the violet look that makes greens, etc glow) which is what you get from actinics.

I voted for T5 HO, because IMO the actinic T5 from UV Lighting (this is the company that used to be URI, the maker of the VHO actinics that everyone is raving about) looks outstanding IMO, and with proper reflectors, you get more bang for the energy buck from T5HO. Now, I have never compared the UVL T5 side-by-side with the VHO counterpart, but I'm very happy with mine.

jds

CarlosS

03/28/2007, 03:19 PM

bureau13

I heard that the T5 can last 3 years with proper intensity? Is that true?

Cubman777

03/28/2007, 04:08 PM

Now that they make a true actinic T5, it is my actinic supplementation of choice. It takes up less room and creates less heat and requires less wattage, and I feel still does the trick.

CarlosS

03/29/2007, 06:14 AM

Excelent!

For the results, I think that the T5 is the winner. Does anybody want to vote??

In the other hand, Is the ICE cap ballast the best option for these T5?

bureau13

03/29/2007, 11:25 AM

I heard two years, but I can't say for sure. I do know that of my 4 AB Ocean Blue bulbs that came with my fixture, 3 died in less than a year. I've since replaced them with a combination of UVL Actincis and ATI Blue+ so hopefully I will get something more like their expected life this time.

jds

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9592233#post9592233 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by CarlosS
bureau13

I heard that the T5 can last 3 years with proper intensity? Is that true?

CarlosS

03/30/2007, 12:16 PM

Nobody else wants to vote?

Come on!!! Try an let you know you position!!!

CarlosS

03/30/2007, 12:20 PM

bureau13

But VHO is winning, as you could see.

CarlosS

03/30/2007, 12:22 PM

And VHO is cheaper

hahnmeister

03/30/2007, 02:38 PM

The lumen/watt of the T5s is greater than the VHO, but most people are conparing one super actinic (110watts) to one T5 (54watts)... not exactly the fairest of comparisons.

If you compare dual 54wattT5 super actinics to one 110watt VHO.... the T5s trounce the VHOs.

The other reason I like T5s better is not actinic at all, but the blue bulbs. The blue bulbs are where its at for me, and what most halides really need for supplimentation, not actinic (most 10,000Ks have tons of actinic already... more than a 20,000K... its the blue spike that they lack). The blue+ style T5s have a much higher visual impact and output than the actinics as well.

CarlosS

03/30/2007, 02:52 PM

hahnmeister:

Yes you are right, but the super actinics improve the coral colors better than the blue ones.

In this matter I am considering in by two T5 39 watts, 36" for suplementing my MH, 400w, 14.000ºK. But i really would like super actinics. Blue ones are great, talking about visual impact, but actinics have a purple color that boost the colors of corals and fish.

AZDesertRat

03/30/2007, 06:59 PM

Nothing comes close to URI (UV Lighting now I guess) VHO Super Actinics for color or bulb life. They also don't get very hot, I can hold on to my 140w 60" bulbs powered by a Coralvue E ballast all day long, they just don't get that hot.

reef_doug

03/30/2007, 07:33 PM

I'm tagging along and thinking about supplementing my 3 ea MH XM10K DE (72" canopy) with 2 x 72" VHO URI Super Actinic and 2 36" T5 Blue+ (mount inline 1 x 72").

Are there any major drawbacks to 72" URI Actinic bulbs?

aninjaatemyshoe

03/30/2007, 08:10 PM

One thing that should be meantioned is that T5s are more appropriately paired with metal halides in terms of optimal opperating temperature. Metal Halides run at a higher optimal temperature than any other lighting used for aquariums. T5s are the closest to MH in terms of optimal opperating temperature. This means that you can run them closer to the MH without worrying about loosing bulb life and/or efficiency. The T12 VHOs run much cooler than T5s, which means they are more adversely affected when placed close to a MH.

This may only be a problem with crowded lighting fixtures. But, with the amount of light that we try to squeeze on the top of our aquariums, I'd say T5s are the way to go.

hahnmeister

03/31/2007, 01:19 AM

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9608642#post9608642 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by CarlosS
hahnmeister:

Yes you are right, but the super actinics improve the coral colors better than the blue ones.

In this matter I am considering in by two T5 39 watts, 36" for suplementing my MH, 400w, 14.000ºK. But i really would like super actinics. Blue ones are great, talking about visual impact, but actinics have a purple color that boost the colors of corals and fish.

I wouldnt say that one improves coral coloration better than another. There are 3000K bulbs out there that are used to improve coral coloration. A full range of spectrums will cause corals to pigment up the best. 10,000K bulbs already have loads of actinic in their output (more than a 20,000K, you just dont see it because of all the other warmer spectrums)... why add more? To me, I never understood it... pairing 10,000Kish bulbs with actinics just makes a day-purple look that isnt natural. Pairing blue+ bulbs with 10,000Kish halides gives a more natural look.

Sure, actinics have a 'blacklight' effect with many corals, but the blue has more output that the corals can use. I use both blue+ and actinics... thats the best of both worlds. Im just saying, you cant find blue VHO bulbs like with T5s. If I had to pick one, I would pick the blue over the actinic.

Reef Sponger

03/31/2007, 10:16 AM

1st choice VHO, 2nd choice T5

CarlosS

03/31/2007, 01:20 PM

CarlosS

04/01/2007, 06:34 PM

yeap

VHO winning. I am thinking is the more wanted

CarlosS

04/02/2007, 07:42 AM

Ok. Guys:

I think that I could have a problem. Currently I don't have a chiller,the tank temperature rounds about 27ºC, if I would use T5, could I have temperature raise?

For the moment, I have a PC 96 watts. Which is the coolest, VHO or T5 compared to PC??

AZDesertRat

04/02/2007, 07:59 AM

Easily VHO. You can also get a little 7" clip on fan from places like WalMart for about $8. Its amazing what this fan can do for temperatures.

CarlosS

04/02/2007, 08:03 AM

AZDesertRat:

Currently I have two 4.5" fan coolers, really cool down the temperature. One blowing and other extracting

DrBDC

04/02/2007, 09:45 AM

I can't believe all the people voting for T5's for an actinic effect. They have obviously never ran both types on a tank. I can say from exact experience of being able to turn one off and then the other on, there isn't even a slight comparison in actinic effect. The VHO trounces the t5 actinics by AT LEAST 2X! :rolleyes: Lemmings.

CarlosS

04/02/2007, 05:35 PM

DrBDC:

So do I!!. You are convincing me!!!

For the T5 experts: Which do you think are the best for me:

Two T5 39w or,
Two VHO 95w ??

GSMguy

04/02/2007, 05:41 PM

i picked t5 for the inceased output :) knowing that the supplimentation is better with VHO i just think the t5s are the better choice they use less electricity as well

the 39w t5s will have more par than the 95w vho but the vho if its UVL actinic will have nicer color

CarlosS

04/02/2007, 05:45 PM

GSMguy:

Are you sure?. I am comparing 78w against 190w. As DrBDC said, is just for actinic effect.

AZDesertRat

04/02/2007, 07:13 PM

There is no comparison on the colors though. You wil also find VHOs on a good electronic ballast do not draw the full rated wattage, I just checked my 2x140w VHO URI Super Actinics with a Kill a Watt meter and they draw a total of 132 watts for the pair on a Coralvue E Ballast.

bureau13

04/02/2007, 08:46 PM

2x what though? If you're talking "pop" or whatever, the thing most people seem to be fond of VHO for, then that seems purely subjective to me. If you're talking output, then given the proper bulbs, ballasts and reflectors, you're just wrong...plenty of people have proven that with PAR meters, etc. That may seem to be a pretty big given but it does seem that a little more thought has to go into the T5HO reflector choices in order to get those advantages.

If you are talking the "pop" factor, then you do seem to be in the majority...I'm curious though if you did this side-by-side comparison using UVL actinics on both the T5HO and VHO? You would think, given that the whole point was to recreate the VHO color in the superior :D T5HO form, that UVL would be able to do that.

jds

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9627396#post9627396 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by DrBDC
I can't believe all the people voting for T5's for an actinic effect. They have obviously never ran both types on a tank. I can say from exact experience of being able to turn one off and then the other on, there isn't even a slight comparison in actinic effect. The VHO trounces the t5 actinics by AT LEAST 2X! :rolleyes: Lemmings.

DrBDC

04/02/2007, 09:20 PM

Yes I did use those bulbs on both. The T-5's were far brighter no question but this thread was asking about supplementing the halides FOR the "pop" and glow of the corals not for growth or overall ppfd/par.

USC-fan

04/02/2007, 09:40 PM

i voted for t5 because they don't get washed out as much as VHO. Plus t5 have a lot of other advantages.

hahnmeister

04/03/2007, 12:01 AM

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9627396#post9627396 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by DrBDC
I can't believe all the people voting for T5's for an actinic effect. They have obviously never ran both types on a tank. I can say from exact experience of being able to turn one off and then the other on, there isn't even a slight comparison in actinic effect. The VHO trounces the t5 actinics by AT LEAST 2X! :rolleyes: Lemmings.

They are voting for best 'suppliment', not 'best actinic'. When is the last time you saw a blue+ VHO? Huh? Thats why people are voting T5. The blue bulbs are a much better suppliment than the actinics are. The actinics are for our viewing pleasure, thats all. Considering the much higher (usually 2x) PAR of the blue bulbs, the much higher visual impact they bring, etc... its no wonder. If I had to pick only one or the other, I would pick blue supplimental T5s over VHO actinics. The corals would agree.

Also, remember, even with just actinics... one bulb to one bulb is not fair to compare. Two actinic T5s are 110 watts, and one VHO is 110watts... so comparing 2 T5s to one VHO... now who is the winnner? T5, youbetchurbooty.

hahnmeister

04/03/2007, 12:09 AM

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9626569#post9626569 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by CarlosS
Ok. Guys:

I think that I could have a problem. Currently I don't have a chiller,the tank temperature rounds about 27ºC, if I would use T5, could I have temperature raise?

For the moment, I have a PC 96 watts. Which is the coolest, VHO or T5 compared to PC??

VHOs top out at about 60 lumens per watt (for daylight mind you), and HO T5s at about 85-90 (up there with halide). 1st Law of thermaldynamics says that what goes in, must come out, so if you have two bulbs, and one produces more light then the other, then the other must produce more of something else. Now, the possibilities are... microwaves, EM fields, heat, etc... Anyone want to take a guess how VHO's spend that extra energy? Heat.

hahnmeister

04/03/2007, 12:15 AM

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9631101#post9631101 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by CarlosS
DrBDC:

So do I!!. You are convincing me!!!

For the T5 experts: Which do you think are the best for me:

Two T5 39w or,
Two VHO 95w ??

First of all, if you like the 450nm PCs, those are blue, and so if you want that same color output, not actinic, then T5s are the best option. ME personally, I like a bit of both... one actinic and one blue+... that would look great.

What type of 14,000K are you using though? 400watts on a 65g? You might consider scaling that back to a 250wattDE or something. 400watt halide paired with 2x39wattT5s is more light than just about any coral I know of would even want. What do you have, a 5 hour photoperiod? Either that, or you are running a very crappy reflector, ballast, or bulb setup that most 250wattDEs could outdo.

If you tell me what type of halide bulb you are using, I can suggest more. Some 14,000Ks are much different than others. A UShio 14,000K for instance, has loads of actinic already in its output, and so only needs blue bulbs for supplimentation (the only thing it lacks).

CarlosS

04/03/2007, 02:36 PM

hahnmeister

Do you mean that the VHO is heater than the T5?

My halide is Hamilton.

In the other hand I really like 420nm color not 450. As I have enough light as you could see, I want actinics. I used 250 watts, 14000K hamilton, but the tank looked like very "blue" for me. Now with 400 watts is white or yellow for me, I liked to give a purple tone to the water.