I think I have a ich problem

[bolt696]

First I have not added any fish in over a month and prior to the last few days have not noticed ich on any fish. My tomato clown which I have had for almost 2 years now is loaded with white specs and just today I see it on the eyes in addition to the rest of the body. I also have a Orangeback Basslet which now looks like it has a lot of white specs (this happens to be the last fish I got). I don't have a hospital tank and I was looking for any suggestions out there.

thanks

[bolt696]

I was doing some reading and I see products that claim to be reef safe. Anyone use any of these?

[Fragmented 99]

try a cleaner shrimp/cleaner wrasse

[Spracklcat]

It is said that the Ich parasite can be in the tank for a long time, just under the radar, and no fish will succumb because their immune systems are working properly. A stress, bad water quality, temperature drop--any of these can add stress and cause an outbreak. Also, I don't know how successful moving them out of the tank would be, since they might just get reinfected when you put them back.

I have had good luck with garlic--add the chopped stuff, with lots of the oil it comes in, to some flake or pellet food and feed that. Also, add beta glucan to boost the immune response of your fish. The cleaners are a good idea too. Most meds I can think of (copper, formalin) are unsuitable for using in a display tank, so you could use them as dips, but then the fish would just get reinfected when they went back in.

Good water changes can only help too--

Good luck :)

[bolt696]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9743772#post9743772 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Fragmented 99
try a cleaner shrimp/cleaner wrasse

I have 2 cleaner shrimp. The problem is I got a bubble tip a few weeks ago and the clown will not leave it.

[Spracklcat]

The bubble tip could be the source of the ich, as could the last batch of fish. Might be time for that quarantine tank, no? a 10g, a sponge filter and an air pump-- less than $20.

[bolt696]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9743920#post9743920 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Spracklcat
It is said that the Ich parasite can be in the tank for a long time, just under the radar, and no fish will succumb because their immune systems are working properly. A stress, bad water quality, temperature drop--any of these can add stress and cause an outbreak. Also, I don't know how successful moving them out of the tank would be, since they might just get reinfected when you put them back.

I have had good luck with garlic--add the chopped stuff, with lots of the oil it comes in, to some flake or pellet food and feed that. Also, add beta glucan to boost the immune response of your fish. The cleaners are a good idea too. Most meds I can think of (copper, formalin) are unsuitable for using in a display tank, so you could use them as dips, but then the fish would just get reinfected when they went back in.

Good water changes can only help too--

Good luck :)

I see this stuff online with 2 great reviews and it says it is reef safe. what do you think?

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?pcatid=12100&Ntt=ich&Ntk=All&Ntx=mode+matchallpartial&Np=1&pc=1&N=0&Nty=1

[6stringpenguin]

I tried Ich-Kick in my 55. It's Reef Safe. I tried it with heavy infestations with no luck. It worked alright for small cases, but If every fish in your tank is crawling with it, you should just do the QT, but you still have to get the ich out of your main system. I'm still struggling a little with it.

[bolt696]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9744028#post9744028 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by 6stringpenguin
I tried Ich-Kick in my 55. It's Reef Safe. I tried it with heavy infestations with no luck. It worked alright for small cases, but If every fish in your tank is crawling with it, you should just do the QT, but you still have to get the ich out of your main system. I'm still struggling a little with it.

only 2 out of 6 fish have signs of it. I was reading the a UV unit can help. What do you think?

[DEXTER SOLIS]

UV, garlic, QT, & hyposalinity are weapons of choice, all the so called "cures" are not worth the bottle they are in.

this is the $1k lesson I have learned.

[Kigs]

...damn 1k dex?? think of all the Wii's you cou've bought with that cash... =( Maybe someone could post the link to one of the reefkeeping's article on garlic + ICH treatment. They say that it is most effective against ICH when it's fresh crushed garlic. Something about something in garlic that loses it's potency after time.

[billsreef]

Reef Safe Cure = Snake Oil

That said, garlic oil soaked foods have show some efficacy in light cases of ich, though not as reliable as treating with copper or hyposalinity in a QT.

[bolt696]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9746140#post9746140 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by billsreef
Reef Safe Cure = Snake Oil

That said, garlic oil soaked foods have show some efficacy in light cases of ich, though not as reliable as treating with copper or hyposalinity in a QT.

What is Snake Oil?

[Spracklcat]

So...$20 for a QT tank...or 1K for trying everything else and then getting a QT tank... Hmmm....

(I used the jarred chopped garlic in oil)

[billsreef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9746204#post9746204 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by bolt696
What is Snake Oil?

Snake Oil is a reference to bogus cures. Goes back to traveling salesmen in the 1800's that would go town to town selling "cure all" remedies. These remedies often tasted bad, like medicine (so it must be good), and had lots of alcohol. The alcohol of course made people feel better, and the medicinal taste made them think it must be good medicine, but it did absolutely nothing to cure anything ;)

[bolt696]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9746261#post9746261 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by billsreef
Snake Oil is a reference to bogus cures. Goes back to traveling salesmen in the 1800's that would go town to town selling "cure all" remedies. These remedies often tasted bad, like medicine (so it must be good), and had lots of alcohol. The alcohol of course made people feel better, and the medicinal taste made them think it must be good medicine, but it did absolutely nothing to cure anything ;)

I think I am going to get a UV unit. I have algae issues as well so I am reading it can really help. Is 25 W enough for a 125 gallon tank? I am also going to try thr garlic

[DEXTER SOLIS]

still no QT....hmmmmmmmm

[bolt696]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9746498#post9746498 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by DEXTER SOLIS
still no QT....hmmmmmmmm

I am going to get a 10 or 20 gallon QT tank today.


Do I just use tank water? I read you want lower salinity so what is the best thing to do? Does it need to cycle?

[Editour2]

Speaking of a quarantine tank: I am setting one up and already have the 10gal tank, filter and pump. Does anyone know where I can get a cheap cover w/simple light for the tank?
Frank

[DEXTER SOLIS]

just use egg crates.

[Spracklcat]

Yep, egg crate is fine, and you don't need a light.

Tank water is fine, but better would be freshly made saltwater.

[bolt696]

I must tell you that I got this stuff called Ich-Attach online in addition to a UV sterilizer. With just 4 days of treatment direct to the tank the ich is 99% gone off the 2 fish that had it. This stuff claimed to be reef safe and so far no issues with anything. After reading a few great reviews from other posters I had to try it. Now I read the UV can kill off ich in the water, but has very little effect on the ich attached to fish. I would have to give credit to this stuff. Anyone else use it.

[DgenR8]

UV can only kill ICH that passes through the UV unit. The VAST majority of your problem will never make it through your UV unit.
Familiarize yourself with the lifecycle of the parasite here; [ich]
because what you are seeing now is most likely not the end of the problem, just a different stage of the lifecycle.

[DgenR8]

FWIW, I don't believe in miracle cures in a bottle, I wish you luck with this stuff you tried, but I urge you to read up on what you're dealing with, as I think you have an uphill battle in front of you.

[billsreef]

Remember, part of the life cycle is for the ich to drop off the fish. This will give the appearance of the fish getting better, only for the ich to return in a week.

[bolt696]

I will take all the feed back and monitor the fish. I don't believe in the miracle bottle either, but for it to be gone in the same time I added the stuff would be some coincidence. For 6.99 I figured I would try it.

[bolt696]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9804810#post9804810 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by DgenR8
UV can only kill ICH that passes through the UV unit. The VAST majority of your problem will never make it through your UV unit.
Familiarize yourself with the lifecycle of the parasite here; <a href="http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-08/sp/index.htm" target="_blank">Marine Ich/Cryptocaryon irritans - A Discussion
of this Parasite and the Treatment Options Available</a>
because what you are seeing now is most likely not the end of the problem, just a different stage of the lifecycle.

I did do a lot of reading and knowing that ich only dies when it passes the uv is what brings me to believe that this stuff did help. The white spots were all over my clown, eyes lips fins but after 4 days of treatment I only count maybe 7 spots (visable spots)

Like I said I will monitor the tank and let you guys know if the ich appears again. My tank has been up and running since 2004 and I only got this outbreak weeks ago.
I did switch from the 55 to the 125 but used the same rock (some new addition) and same water (with obvious new ro/di water from my own unit)

[tcmike64]

I am a recent owner of a retail aquarium store, my partner has been in this business for over 30 years. We use ICH-X in all of our systems with fowlr and all reefs. From what I've learned, ICH lies dormant in every system and comes out due to stress and a degrade in water quality. Remember ich can come into any system a numbers of ways, live rock, corals and fish. So it is best to feed with a little garlic, you could always raise the temp on the tank a few degress and lower to salinity for a week or 2. That has also helped many of my customers.

[billsreef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9805370#post9805370 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by bolt696
but for it to be gone in the same time I added the stuff would be some coincidence.

Actually based on your first post, it's right on schedule for the ich naturally dropping off even if you did nothing. The UV might help, and I'm sure it will do more than the herbal stuff ;)