how do U keep your sand crystal clean?

[ATM]

My sand is becoming brown and dirty looking ( brown algea) because I have really fine sand.

I've noticed some of your tanks that I've seen on RC are really nice with clean sand beds that you can eat off of. How do you do it

[Andrew]

Just solve your algae problem. A good clean up crew with some sand shifting stars will keep the sand clean as well. :)

[Dubbin1]

FYI most peoples sand is not as clean as it looks in their pictures.

[Sk8r]

If you have bits of shell in your sand, they will turn color. But a good crew of nassarius snails, conches, and some sandsifting stars or gobies is a great help. So, imho, is a potent refugium with a big tight ball of cheato not only sopping up algae-fueling phosphate, but serving as a very large sponge-filter without building up nitrates, plus it's supplying copepods, which also eat algae bits.

[Randall_James]

I for one would never suggest sand sifting stars in a reef tank of any kind.... cucumbers can clean the sand without eating all the fauna out of the sand. Most common thing to happen is the star destroys all the life in the sand bed and then dies of starvation. Sort of suprised to see them suggested here..

[Sk8r]

Randall, thank you: I haven't had them myself in years, when I had an absolutely huge refugium---didn't know they were such pitas. I cancel my recommendation of a sandsifting star, then. I'd rather go with a sandsifting fish--- but no diamond gobies under 50g at least, and maybe not under 100g. Yellow watchman is much more moderate.

Cucumbers have always made me nervous, for fear of them dying and polluting the tank. I hear there are varieties a little friendlier. So you have had experience with them and they're a bit more specific about what they eat? Any info appreciated.

[Randall_James]

I have a "black" cucumber that has been with me for maybe 4 years now? I have moved it to at least 4 tanks (has been in my Anemone display tank for over a year now).

I also have a "donky" turd looking one that I need to find a new home for. Anyone in the FtWayne area is welcome to it if they want to pick it up :)

[areze]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10340608#post10340608 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Dubbin1
FYI most peoples sand is not as clean as it looks in their pictures.

this is the truth.

my solution was starboard. :)

[Andrew]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10340750#post10340750 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by areze


my solution was starboard. :)

Agreed. Much easier to keep clean and looks good. :)

[Iron Maiden]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10340608#post10340608 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Dubbin1
FYI most peoples sand is not as clean as it looks in their pictures.
Yep. When my actinics are on the sand looks great, but as soon as the brights come on you can see the diatoms and all. I have a nice size diamond goby and he keeps the sand turned quite well, looks like a mad gopher has been in there sometimes.

[Wrench]

Mine stays very clean and white even with my occasional outbreak of cyano. Members of my cleaning crew that contribute to keeping the sand bed clean are a diamond watchman goby, 2 fighting conchs and a yellow cucumber. I believe the cuke is the largest contributor since the goby has become spoiled and now eats primarily mysis and prime reef from the water column. I did notice a large difference, though, when I added the conchs. I rarely see them but they're doing their job :)

[Aquabucket]

Mine stays clean all day long and has been for 1.5 years now. Its a shallow bed @ 2" deep. I have nassarius snails and use an acrylic rod to rake it up every couple of days. What gets kicked up is good coral food. I also leave my lights off for 3 or 2 days every couple of months.

[ATM]

thanks guys

[snulma1]

I think I was reading from oregonreef.com that he siphons out and replaces his sand to keep it looking clean. To me thats just a little too much to spend. So mine stays semi dirty

[specialkb]

I just bought a Yellow cucumber yesterday was cleaning plenty yesterday, today i cant seem to find him in my tank getting a little worried. as for hoping he didn't die.

[turnburn]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10340652#post10340652 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Randall_James
I for one would never suggest sand sifting stars in a reef tank of any kind.... cucumbers can clean the sand without eating all the fauna out of the sand. Most common thing to happen is the star destroys all the life in the sand bed and then dies of starvation. Sort of suprised to see them suggested here..

I have to agree. I had a sand sifting sea star for well over a year. He was fat and happy but I couldn't figure out why the only pods in system were in my refugium. After giving the star back to the LFS my tank was crawling with pods in no time.

[Gdevine]

I've got the standard clean up crew but I also siphon my sand (just upper top level) each weekend when I do a water change. During the week I will stir up the sand just ever so little to get the "crap" into the water column and let my skimmer do the rest. Result: pretty clean stand bed.

[agoutihead]

all that is too much work. depending on tank size, nothing will ever beat a diamond goby. nassarius snails are a good addition.

stars are a waste of money and life. i have never heard anything but bad results with those.

[optimusgrind]

I HAVE A BRITTLE STAR FISH IN A REEF TANK ALONG WITH A SERPENT SEA STAR ANY BODY HAVE ANY SUGGESTIONS DO THEY HARM CORALS OR INVERTS??

[reefworm]

I'm going to piggyback with a related set of questions:

1] question about conchs in a 29 - get too big? I suppose if it does I can trade it back to the lfs for other stuff.

2] Same question about cucumbers, although finding it again to trade or even know how big it is could be an issue, no?

3] Otherwise, I'm thinking of just a sizable crew of nassarius snails - just a few at first and more as animals get added. Any idea of recommended # of snails once the tank is full [3-4 fish of 3"-4" in size] plus corals and a clam [eventually].

4] I've never stirred up the substrate, but I suppose storms do the same thing, and critters.

5] Recommended goby for a 29 with an open top?

6] Aquabucket - I'm assuming you're referring to your 40gal. breeder when you posted just nassarius [plus stirring top layer]?

7] GO PACK!

thanks in advance!

-rw

p.s. Optimusgrind - STOP SHOUTING ;)

[Wrench]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10342126#post10342126 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by optimusgrind
I HAVE A BRITTLE STAR FISH IN A REEF TANK ALONG WITH A SERPENT SEA STAR ANY BODY HAVE ANY SUGGESTIONS DO THEY HARM CORALS OR INVERTS??

You should be fine. The comment was made about sand sifting stars which are not a good addition to a reef.

[Wrench]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10341851#post10341851 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by specialkb
I just bought a Yellow cucumber yesterday was cleaning plenty yesterday, today i cant seem to find him in my tank getting a little worried. as for hoping he didn't die.

Don't worry. Mine hid for almost 3 weeks in the rock. Didn't move much at all. I thought it had died but eventually acclimated to the new tank. Keep in mind that they are nocturnal for the most part and your best be it to turn on the light in the middle of the night. You should be able to spot it then.

HIJACK!!! Here's a pic of my cuke :)

http://www.pbase.com/tonybracci/image/76089616.jpg

[Aquabucket]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10342334#post10342334 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by reefworm
I'm going to piggyback with a related set of questions:

1] question about conchs in a 29 - get too big? I suppose if it does I can trade it back to the lfs for other stuff.

2] Same question about cucumbers, although finding it again to trade or even know how big it is could be an issue, no?

3] Otherwise, I'm thinking of just a sizable crew of nassarius snails - just a few at first and more as animals get added. Any idea of recommended # of snails once the tank is full [3-4 fish of 3"-4" in size] plus corals and a clam [eventually].

4] I've never stirred up the substrate, but I suppose storms do the same thing, and critters.

5] Recommended goby for a 29 with an open top?

6] Aquabucket - I'm assuming you're referring to your 40gal. breeder when you posted just nassarius [plus stirring top layer]?

7] GO PACK!

If I were you I'd just get a few jumbo/Tongan nassarius snails and occasionally rake the sand yourself. Conchs are more suited for larger tanks and many sand sifting gobies might not do too well in a small tank. Ones that will do well might not sift your sand all that much. Others might cause sand to get all over your corals in a small tank. If you get the snails make sure you feed them sinking pellets or wafers a couple of times a week. They can starve too if they don't get enough scraps.

Yes it is my 40BR and all the tanks @ work I care for.

~THE PACK WILL BE BACK!

[agoutihead]

how many nassarius snails do you have to keep in your 40 breeder to keep the sand crystal clean?

the diamond goby is the best i think, but i know it does deplete the sand bed of fauna. I'd prefer not to have this, but i would prefer to have clean sand above and beyond everything.

so if i can get away with not having a diamond goby, that would be nice.

I plan on getting a mandarine, so i need my pod population as high as possible. I am also employing the use of a fuge.

[MTB]

I would go with some nass. snails first and see how those work for you. Some ceriths maybe as well.

[agoutihead]

i had only 1 cerith snail in my nano, but that thing was junk compared to the nassarius snails.

those things are absolute machines!

[Aquabucket]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10346304#post10346304 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by agoutihead
how many nassarius snails do you have to keep in your 40 breeder to keep the sand crystal clean?


I have six right now 4 Tongans and 2 regular. The 30" acrylic rod I got from a plastics place for under a buck does the most work though.

[kl3377]

I have a brown cuke that does a bang up job on a 120, been with me for quite a while. I have read in a couple of different places that the boring/drab looking ones are better in a reef tank.

[agoutihead]

hmm. I think im gonna end up having to get the diamond. Oh well no biggie. I like that fish, he is very active and adds alot to the reef.

[tprize]

What goby would you guys suggest for a 20G that would sift sand? Will the duel spotted goby do it?

[reefnewbie54321]

Clean Up Crew is the only way unless you plan on periodicly changing the top layer of the sand. Depends on your situation ... if its a DSB then dont touch the sand becuase its gunna screw up your DSB as a host for nitratre eating bacteria but if its a shallow sand bed then you should be periodicly vacumming/ changing out sand so it doesnt become a nitrate factory.

I'm going to assume you have a DSB....

Your sand bed clean up crew should consist of
nassarius snails
cerith snails
select hermit crabs/shrimp optional
tiger tail cucumber
fighting conch

Notes:
-you should only have 1 tiger tail cucumber per 2 sq feet or it will starve
-you should only have 1 fighting conch per 1.5 sq feet or it will starve
-2 fighting conches and 2 tiger tails will work good in 4 sq feet (thats what I use)
DO NOT get a queen conch becuase they get way to big and will starve and die ... only use fighting conches
-hermit crabs are useful when they are small but can get agressive as adults so I would suggest using blue leg hermits and buy them as small as you can
DO NOT use sand sifting gobies or sand sifting stars becuase they eat sand bed fauna that works hard to keep detrius out of your sand bed and ruin the point of a DSB that is trying to host fuana
-bristleworms are great for a sand bed even though most people think they are harmful, just weed them out as they get bigger
-if you can seed your sand bed with spaggetti worms (most die during transit of live sand so they wont make it to your DSB unless you seed them your self)

LAST THING:
before you start upgrading your clean up crew make sure your nitartes and phos are in check, even though this seems dumb most people jump to buying a heavier clean up crew before trying to solve there water parameter problems

this is exactly how my DSB has been set up for years (after doing a year of research on DSB's and clean up crews) and mine is crystal clean and very white ... hope this was helpful

-reefnewbie54321