Why did you make DIY Rock?

[Insane Reefer]

I understand for most people it was a variety of factors that spurred them to make their first rock, but I am seeking the Primary Reason - the reason that was foremost in your mind at the time.
I'm curious about this. I have some thoughts, but need statistical data to work with to see if they are correct.


I would really, really like to limit this poll to people who have made their rock in the last 3 years - the statistics are in relation to this particular time-frame, so if you made your rock 10 years ago, that won't have any correlation to the here and now. You need to have made the rock after August 2004.
If you made your rock before then, you can still post and tell us why (that might even be helpful - say when and why) - that would be very cool, just don't vote the poll.

Ok?

Thanks!!!
-------------------
Rock On~

[Kentanner11]

I would say all three but mostly (the one I voted for) was the price! I remember when I was first reading about it and was like wow! no way Im going to do this! That was the same time I was saying wow Mh, no way! lol!

[customcolor]

i voted custom shaped rock cuz u cant to this with store bought<BR>http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s193/customcolor/fullfront.jpg

[EQCM2B]

It was the price for me as well. Dead rock @ $3.00 a pound or DIY at about 90 pounds for $20.00.

[Insane Reefer]

I still think that is one of the more dramatic displays I've seen, CustomColor.

Any recent pics - or is this as far along as it is?

And those that post, if you have pictures of the tank itself, with the rock in it, please don't hesitate to post a pic - preferably something recent with life on it :)

[afelder]

I needed a rock for a specific spot

[happyface888]

I have not made any DIY rocks but if I knew this before I bought any rocks I would rather make them instead, because it saves alot of money. I remember buying 25lbs for 100 dollars and wow each lb of rocks that are DIy dont even cost more than a dollar or even less. And not only that a DIY rock can have better shapes than normal rocks, more unique looking.

[airinhere]

I have to agree about how nice it is that making my own rocks saved me a ton of cash.

That being said, I had to vote for the custom shape being more important to me.

I have 2 90 gal tanks and wanted each one to have a rock wall from top to bottom that I could plant my corals onto. I tried making the rock wall with live rock and after about the third time everything collapsed (and I lost a few corals) I decided to make aragocrete walls for them.

Now nothing will ever fall over in my tank.

Aquascaping is a thing of the past, but no more avalanches.

[spi4life]

I have to say that when I made the rock it was the first thing I did for my tank. I knew that it was going to take a while to cure so I just collected things as the rocks cured.

To me it was a sense of accomplishment to see it one year later in my tank growing coraline on it.

pic of when I first made rock

http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r309/Ncprowler/fishtank032.jpg

circled is the DIY

http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r309/Ncprowler/diyrock.jpg

This is just a full tank shot

http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r309/Ncprowler/fishtank024.jpg

These pictures were taken probably in DEC.- Jan. They are completely covered in Coraline now and Some of the rock I used as Frag rock so corals have now taken over some of the pieces that were made.

If I could make more Rocks I would chose to make them more porous(probably spelled wrong) But I like how they have turned out.

[Insane Reefer]

For those who have missed it somehow, there is an excellent and very long thread on DIY rock:

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=10529703#post10529703

Some new developments have occurred, that if you are planning on making rock in the future, you might want to know about.

:)

[Paul B]

Although I have been building rocks since the sixtees I still build some every few months. Most of my rock I collected myself and I have some nice rock but I wanted custom rock designed for my tank and animals. I now build all of my rock hollow with PVC skeletons and I like it much better than the rock I can collect.
I also think the hollowness of the rock contributes to nitrate reduction.
Most of the rock I have no Idea if I collected it or built it
Paul
http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/13094DSC01323.JPG
this three foot piece is hollow and has a PVC skeleton
http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/13094Copy_of_Copy_of_Copy_of_DSC00857-med.jpg

[customcolor]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10527610#post10527610 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Insane Reefer
I still think that is one of the more dramatic displays I've seen, CustomColor.

Any recent pics - or is this as far along as it is?

And those that post, if you have pictures of the tank itself, with the rock in it, please don't hesitate to post a pic - preferably something recent with life on it :)
thanks, and yes thats how far i am on the tank so far. almost done with the test plumming.

[Insane Reefer]

Paul,
My husband and I were talking last night, and you would be the exact person to ask since you have been making rock since it was first introduced? I thought MMLR was developed in the 80's, but I guess I was wrong, lol. Actually that makes one point I was curious about even more likely, but I will post that after the poll has a few more days and I have time to think about the stats.

What I wanted to ask was this. How heavily do you rely on the LR for filtration? And how important do you think that chemical and mechanical filtration are now-a-days?
Back in the day, folks relied mostly on chemical and mechanical filtration - biological, as far as I know, is a fairly recent development (last 25 years or so?), as far as spread of usage among hobbyists. I myself started my fist tank with bells and whistles - skimmer, UV, MH, CA Reactor, etc. And very little LR - I had been taught that rock was for mounting corals and to look nice - not that it helped with filtration. I didn't do so well with that tank, and due to that got back out of the hobby for a few years. That was about the time of BBS's (the beginning of the internet), and I learned a lot from the people there, including the value of LR. Since then, I keep my systems simple, and I also keep simple life as I still consider myself a beginner. My two current tanks are on powerheads, light and heat. That is it. Oh, and live rock. I have no major problems, and other then feeding, dosing and water changes (and I can go weeks without), I ignore my tanks other then to admire them. Granted, this might change as I progress in the hobby and try to keep harder organisms, but I think that is a matter of load - keep the load reasonable and the system should be able to handle it without a bunch of equipment.

So my feelings are that the Ol' Skool ways of keeping a tank are starting to go the way of the Dodo, and a shift to the biological is happening, and that someday, only people who really want all the fancy equipment will be the one's who have it and think they can't live without it.
Do you agree?

[Paul B]

Insane Reefer, actually Old school was a hang on filter and a regular run UG filter. That was how salt water tanks were in the sixtees as were freshwater tanks, there was no difference.
I rely almost 100% on rock as my filtering material of choice along with a skimmer. I also use ozone. Thats as high tech as I get.
I do use carbon occasionally as I believe substances will accumulate in a tank and there is no other way to remove them. Water changes do not get rid of all the substances as we usually do not change 100% of the water. Nitrates are also only removed by anerobic bacteria which mostly takes place in rock.
In the early days the fish would not live many years because our nitrates often read 60 or more. There were no reefs and no rock. We used dead coral sheletons which we bleached every few weeks. We diden't know about anerobic bacteria and thought we were doing something good by sterilizing the dead corals.
I think you are correct in stating that Old School ways will be replaced by technology. New systems of course work, DSBs are fairly new but I doubt you can keep one going for twenty years.
My methods are very old school and when I tell people how to cure "Pop Eye" with a hypodermic needle in a few minutes, use Clorox to purify and oxidize organics in NSW or how to cure ich in a day they think I am senile. These methods will fall out of favor which is a shame. When the salt hobby started in about 1970 we had no experts so we had to use trial and error. We learned the hard way how to solve problems and we lost a lot of fish in the process. Now, unfortunately, we have an abundance of information and a lot of it is incorrect or at least not the best method. You can read dozens of ways to cure ich, most of them wrong.
There is a lot to be said for commom sense and this is one thing that is in short supply in this hobby.
As for the newer technology like refractometers, orp meters, etc. these things are useful but in my opinion not needed. I think the best system is plenty of live rock, a good skimmer and live and fresh food. You don't need anything else.
OK lights.
Take care.
Paul

[seanb1]

i made my rock mostly because of the price,i made approximately 180 pounds for 60 bucks,with most of the cash going to arrgonite sand.
after getting better at it and looking at real pieces of live rock in people tanks here, i made some really cool pieces that i think most people would have a hard time telling the differance between the two.
the only differance is the texture,but i think the crushed oyster shell texture is pretty cool looking,very rough sharp rocks,not smooth at all.
i can pour water thru them,the water goes in the top and a couple seconds later it comes out the bottom, so i know theres plenty of room for microrganisms in there.

i like the way they turned out. by the way, they are still sitting in a pool in my yard,been in there since late may, early june i believe.
i take them out once every couple of weeks and stack them on a picnic table getting an idea how to stack them in my tank, and spray them off and change the water in the pool.

i figure that for the size tank im starting i have saved myself 700.00 dollars,but still plan on buying 300.00 dollars worth of real live rock,to get the fake rock going.

[Paul B]

Here is an article I wrote about 15 years ago about building rock from smaller pieces.
http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/6279/RaiseCementHomemadeConglomerateRocks.html

[Insane Reefer]

Thanks for your reply, Paul :)

So that is you? I read that article years ago, lol - inspired me to try something other than just "rock" shapes.

:)

[Paul B]

Yes that was me. Unfortunately I have been doing this for too long :lol:

[Insane Reefer]

:D

Oh, and Santa, I've been a very good girl. I would like a nano chiller, some yellow yuma and a sea pony...
PS - Johnny doesn't believe in you anymore so don't bring him anything.

[Paul B]

Your chiller and yuma (whatever that is) is on the way.
Johnny gets squat :eek1:
:sad2:

[Insane Reefer]

Awesome! Santa Rocks! In your face, Johnny!

PS - A yuma is a fancy ricordea, Santa :)
http://www.aqua-escape.com/images/P/6823_1_b.jpg

[Paul B]

It looks yummy
Insane Reefer, if you want to see an Old School tank, here is mine in the early seventees next to that good looking guy.
All of the "rock" is dead coral skeletons which we bleached unfortunately killing all of the bacteria. I did manage to keep those expensive (at the time) blue devils alive for eight years and they even spawned many times but the general animal health was no where like it is in a reef with live rock. The filtration in this tank was mostly filter floss and carbon with a UG filter.
That tank which is now in larger glass is my still running reef which evolved into the tank it is today. I traded a lot of that dead coral for fish.
Paul
http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/13094Old_tank_and_me.jpg
This top picture from the eightees appeared in "Marine Fish Monthly"
http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/13094Historic_3.jpg

[Insane Reefer]

Yeah - at $150 a polyp, they better be yummy, lol!

Awesome picture :D

So how many years old was the tank you had setup the longest?
Boy - that isn't a good sentence at all, but I can't think of a better way to ask that...

[Paul B]

Insane reefer, that tank in the picture eveoved into my reef. It is now in a 100 gallon tank but all the stuff then was transfered into larger quarters in about 1980 or so. The tank was actually started earlier maybe the early sixtees as a brackish tank until salt water animals became available in about 1972.
There were only blue devils and seargeant majors and they were not too cheap.
I am sure you saw this but if not this is an article about the tank that was published about 15 years ago, I don't remember which magazine it was in, either Marine Fish Monthly or Aquarium Fish Magazine.
http://reefcentral.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=2127079

[mr.wilson]

So what's the one day ich cure Paul???? Quinine? Mercurochrome?

You've got a 7 year head start on me, so you've gotta pass the info on to the next generation. My first marine tank was 35 gallons in 1979.

I had a UG filter with the famous Silent Giant air pump, two Dynaflows, pretty much the same Penplax heater they still sell today, the new revolutionary plastic frame "Allglass" aquarium, and the Hagan Solar canopy that's still on the market. I think Rolf Hagan has paid off the mold cost by now.

I had the usual carnage of dead coral skeletons and dolomite substrate, and to finish it off, the classic crumpled blue foil background.

[Insane Reefer]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10538779#post10538779 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by mr.wilson
...and to finish it off, the classic crumpled blue foil background.

Oooo - classy ;)

I have always hated the backgrounds. When I was 15 (1984), I painted an underwater "fantasy" for my 10g Sicilian Worm tank with glass paint - based on HP Lovecrafts "R'lyeh" - I did it as a reverse painting, and it was pretty cool and sort of creepy - especially at feeding time with 5 worms..

[mr.wilson]

If you want classy (and I mean sexy when I say classy), they had mirrors on the backs of the tanks at the LFS back then.

I'm thinking giant Frank Frazetta mural for my next tank, or at least on my van.

[Insane Reefer]

Didn't they put mirrors all over everything way back then? LOL
:D

Which Frazetta?
I always thought these would be cool one's to do...
http://frankfrazetta.org/viewimage.php?loc=ffcolr30.jpg
http://frankfrazetta.org/viewimage.php?loc=frank_frazetta_thegodmakers.jpg
http://frankfrazetta.org/viewimage.php?loc=QMan_FF_Legacy_570_A_Requiem_for_Sharks.jpg

Although this is probably my favorite piece:
http://frankfrazetta.org/viewimage.php?loc=frank_frazetta_wildride.jpg

[mr.wilson]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10539585#post10539585 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Insane Reefer
Didn't they put mirrors all over everything way back then? LOL
:D

Which Frazetta?
I always thought these would be cool one's to do...
http://frankfrazetta.org/viewimage.php?loc=ffcolr30.jpg
http://frankfrazetta.org/viewimage.php?loc=frank_frazetta_thegodmakers.jpg
http://frankfrazetta.org/viewimage.php?loc=QMan_FF_Legacy_570_A_Requiem_for_Sharks.jpg

Although this is probably my favorite piece:
http://frankfrazetta.org/viewimage.php?loc=frank_frazetta_wildride.jpg

If it didn't have mirrors, it had shag or purple faux fur.

I actually had a huge terrarium with white flokati covering the outside of it in the 80's. I had it all back then.:)

As for the Frazetta, something you could blame for missing fish.

[Insane Reefer]

LOL :D
Enough with the Flashbacks...
:bum:

Anyway - now returning the readers to the regularly scheduled thread...

[Paul B]

Mr Wilson, the one day ich cure is Copper with Formulin and Quinicrine Hydrocloride.
One day cure, guaranteed. But you should leave the fish in there for a week.
Paul

[mr.wilson]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10546376#post10546376 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Paul B
Mr Wilson, the one day ich cure is Copper with Formulin and Quinicrine Hydrocloride.
One day cure, guaranteed. But you should leave the fish in there for a week.
Paul

That's what I use, but I can't say it works 100% every time. It's certainly better than the "wait and see - garlic" approach most people use.

After aquatronics closed, it's hard to find Quinacrine hydrochloride (Quinsulex) and formalin (Formalin #1, 2, & 3) in a retail store. I think Sera is the only aquarium company to still offer it in their medicinal cocktails. There's certainly no shortage of aquarium companies selling garlic, cayenne pepper, peroxide, and salt. I'm getting hungry just thinking of it.:)

Now back to the topic at hand.

[Paul B]

OK maybe it doesen't always work in 24 hours, sometimes it takes 25 hours. It's cretainly better than garlic and hypo. Quinicrine is used on people so it can't be that toxic. All of those medications would tend to kill the paracite in different stages of their life cycle.
Last night I caught about 50 blue claw crabs which will be dinner tonight, thats what I use garlic and pepper for.
Paul

[Izshocker]

Main reason for doing DIY rock for me, was to be able to say I made those. The saving money is a big part to.

[rustybucket145]

Where's 'All the above' ????

There were many reasons, all listed!

[Insane Reefer]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10526536#post10526536 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Insane Reefer
I understand for most people it was a variety of factors that spurred them to make their first rock, but I am seeking the Primary Reason - the reason that was foremost in your mind at the time.

Ummm. Does this answer your question?
:rolleyes:

[Electrobes]

So I voted in this poll while poking around in RC, and thought hey why not bring back from the dead? :)

Paul, that picture of you from the eighties is awesome!

Insane Reefer, you still around?

[KafudaFish]

I had a specific use: I did a wall back ground for one of my tanks and I have made other rocks for specifics.

If and when I do a large display like 300 I plan on DIY my rock to meet that need once again.

Also it is an interesting artisitc process for those of us that can barely draw straight lines.

[der_wille_zur_macht]

People replying should keep in mind that this thread is more than two years old.

[johno4]

People replying should keep in mind that this thread is more than two years old.

I voted before I actually read anything:hmm4:

[shookbrad]

I made mine because I needed custome shapes to hide plumbing. I also incorporated real rock into the design to help make the MMLR.
This is about 85% MMLR
http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n55/shookbrad/42%20Hex/12-18-2007020.jpg
http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n55/shookbrad/42%20Hex/Picture026.jpg
http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n55/shookbrad/42%20Hex/Picture006.jpg
Slide show of the entire build
http://s109.photobucket.com/albums/n55/shookbrad/42%20Hex/?albumview=slideshow

I had a bad algie outbreak from not running Phosban media and not doing water changes. I have cleared all the algie up since these pictures.

[KafudaFish]

People replying should keep in mind that this thread is more than two years old.

Ok so it just is not as large as some other two year old threads and large amounts of time have passed between posts.

[iceman79]

I think buying live rock is a waste of money everything takes forever in this hobby why not wait for dead rock to turn live yeah it wont be purple for a long time but when it does get some coraline its worth the wait IMO

[Electrobes]

http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n55/shookbrad/42%20Hex/12-18-2007020.jpg

Awesome job man!

[shookbrad]

Christian-Thanks!

Iceman79, I agree. As long as you add a little live rock to ensure you get beneficial bacteria that comes in on rock.

[lordofthereef]

Just curious, what are you collecting the data for?

[iceman79]

Yup thats what i did only bought two pieces of live rock just to seed the tank

[der_wille_zur_macht]

Ok so it just is not as large as some other two year old threads and large amounts of time have passed between posts.

Absolutely. Not trying to discourage participation, just trying to make it clear that the thread is outdated, especially since the OP mentions a time component and a specific goal for collecting this data - it's still a relevant discussion, but probably fair to say that questions like this:

Just curious, what are you collecting the data for?

Aren't really relevant. :)

[KafudaFish]

Yeah I know what you meant. It is too bad that computers don't have scratch and sniff features so we could better smell sacrasm.

I really like the tank above and it may have helped me with a 44 corner I want to do one day.
Congrats on number three btw.