is there such a thing as to much

[zippopunk1]

i have a 65 gAllon tank with a one 400watt metal halide that covers my whole tank is that enough light for all types of coral and clams or is it to much the lowest the temp goes is 75 and the highest it goes is 81.2

[JetCat USA]

that's to much of a temp swing in a 24 hr period.

[audleon]

Might be a bit too much of a swing, just pick up a heater and set it for somewhere in the 79 deg. range. Hopefully, that will keep you temps in a more manageable range between coolest and warmest during a 24 hour period.

Hope it helps,

Danny

[JetCat USA]

a heater turned up only adds more heat to a system so bumping up the low temp 99% of the time only jacks up the high temp an equal amount. the exceptions are tanks kept in extremely cool environments.

[audleon]

I shut down my house A/C during the day and the air temp gets to about 81 in my house (Texas). At about 5:00pm I have my central A/C kick back on and cools to about 77 degrees. I have 150w MH on my Aquapod and a 250W MH with 2x96 watt PC supplementation on my 40 breeder. I have heaters in both tanks set at about 79 and it helps to stabilize my temps between a 79-82 degree range... I do run a fan across my sump for the 40g and one hitting the back corner of my 24g though. The evaporative cooling works wonders.

It might work out for him as well. Could try it and if it starts to bump temps up too high, just shut them off.

Hope it helps,

Danny :)

[JetCat USA]

the way i like to set my tank temps (and all are different) is to have the system up and running and turn off any variable heat source (in most cases just the lights). over a few days the tank will find a stable temp that it keeps pretty consistent at within a degree or two, i then set my heaters to that temp. any rise above that temp is dealt with via cooling, either a chiller or evaporative cooling with a fan. i also run my heat pump 24/7, if you tuned it off during the day with the temps we've had here lately (peaked at 107 a few days ago) the inside temp would be ridiculously high.

[zippopunk1]

that temp isnt in a 24 hour period thats just the lowest ive ever seen it go down and up since ive had the tank it usually only changes within 2 to 3 degrees in 24 hours. im also going to be going on vacation soon do u guys recomend getting another timer for my fans or just leave them on non stop while im on vacation. ive never done that before leaving them on so i dont know how much the temp might channge. usually i tern them on at 8am before going to work the turn them off at about 11pm befrore going to sleep that keeps the temp between 78 and 80 degrees

[RichConley]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10555937#post10555937 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by JetCat USA
that's to much of a temp swing in a 24 hr period.

Seems to work fine for me.


I dont think theres any reason to run a 400w on a tank like that, but if you have it, I dont see a problem. I ran a 250w on a 58g, and honestly think I would have had the same results from a 175.

[Entropy]

To answer your question I don't think it is too much light, especially if you are going with SPS and Clams, but I think you can do just as well with much less. A 250w would just as good IMO and save you 150w of power as well as being cheaper to replace the bulb and easier to keep cool.

[JetCat USA]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10558395#post10558395 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by RichConley
Seems to work fine for me.


that may well explain why your fish die, jump down the overflow, get caught up in the filter sock and are nothing but a skeleton two hours later too. :rolleyes:

[RichConley]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10558705#post10558705 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by JetCat USA
that may well explain why your fish die, jump down the overflow, get caught up in the filter sock and are nothing but a skeleton two hours later too. :rolleyes:

That was roughly 4 years ago. Grow up.


Do I need to start posting articles about temperature fluctuation on the reef?

Or are you gonna start acting like an adult and keep to the subject on hand?

[JetCat USA]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10558920#post10558920 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by RichConley

Do I need to start posting articles about temperature fluctuation on the reef?

Yes, on the reef, at coral depth, not at the surface.

also if you could, can i get a link to the volume of water in the world's oceans and the BTU required to raise that by 6.2º F

[RichConley]

http://www.reefland.com/rho/1105/reefc7.php

Heres a great article.


http://www.naia.com.fj/research/watertemp.gif
http://www.coralreefresearchfoundation.org/CRRFassets/CRRFimages/WaterTemperatures.jpg

Notice the depths, and FWIW, when scientists talk about "surface temps", they are referring to the first 50m.

[JetCat USA]

Humm, seams to me that chart clearly shows a 6.2º F change in temp takes ohhhh 3 months give or take depending on the season, nowhere in a 24 hr period did i see the equivalent, hell even in the same month.

[RichConley]

Those are average temperatures.


Read the friggen article.



Coral reef temperatures are variable on tidal, diurnal, weekly, monthly, seasonally, annually, and multiannular time scales and the scope of variation is quite large (Figure 3). Generally, variations of 1.5 ºC to 4.5 ºC (2.7 ºF to 8.1 ºF) are common in equatorial areas, and one-day extremes such as a tidal pool on the Great Barrier Reef of 25.3 ºC to 34.9 ºC (77.5 ºF to 94.8 ºF) are not uncommon (Wood, 1999). Long-term fluctuations in the monthly average sea surface temperature at equatorial localities often fluctuate over a 3ºC to 5 ºC (5.4ºF to 9ºF) range (See Figure 3). When the data for the monthly average fluctuates this much it should be understood that the values for the daily extreme temperatures fluctuate over a much high range. It is worth remembering, that as far as oceanographers and climatologists are concerned, the “sea surface” implied in the measurement of Sea Surface Temperatures (SST) extends to a depth of about 50 m (165 feet) throughout most of the tropics.

[zippopunk1]

the reason i got he 400w is because i got the whole set up for $100 and i checked it through the power company running the light 8 hrs a day would roughly cost me 8 dollars a month so i didnt think it was a bad idea especially if later on i decided to go for a bigger tank. the bulb is 10,000k is that to white of light and will that affect my corals color

[JetCat USA]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10563928#post10563928 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by zippopunk1
the reason i got he 400w is because..........i checked it through the power company running the light 8 hrs a day would roughly cost me 8 dollars a month.......

an efficient 400w setup uses 110 kilowatts/month per bulb with an 8hr daily photo period. what part of Cali are you from and what is your per kilowatt cost??

[zippopunk1]

i went on a website that calculated power usage for a 400 watt bulb run for 8 hours and it said that it would run about 10 bucks for that size bulb, i also contaced edison and they told me about the same

[JetCat USA]

400 watts x 8 hrs per day = 3200 watts per day / 3.2 KW per day (figured for a 100% efficient setup)

3.2 KW per day x 365 days in a year = 1168 KW per year

1168 KW divided by 12 months = 97.3 KW per month

8 bucks divided by 97.3 KW = 8.2 cent per KW, the cost of power in parts of California is about 3x that.

[tgreene]

I have a friend with a pair of 400's just 8" above the water level of his 75g tank...

He has anywhere from a 7-10 degree swing each day, and I cannot seem to get through to him that he has WAAAAAY to much light & heat (temps after 3 hours of burning are 85.1F) for a 75g system.

His argument is that he is a firm believer in "more is better", and that his corals will close up when they've had enough light.

Can you say bleached and boiled..?

[RichConley]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10564152#post10564152 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by JetCat USA
400 watts x 8 hrs per day = 3200 watts per day / 3.2 KW per day (figured for a 100% efficient setup)

3.2 KW per day x 365 days in a year = 1168 KW per year

1168 KW divided by 12 months = 97.3 KW per month

8 bucks divided by 97.3 KW = 8.2 cent per KW, the cost of power in parts of California is about 3x that.

JetCat, the power company may have been telling him that the cost of running a 400w'er instead of a 250 was an additional $8 a month.


In Mass, I pay about .18. In Cali, you probably pay .20, or in that range.

Like jetcat said,

97.3kwh *.2= $19.48

When you take bulb/ballast inneficiencies into account (really looking at 450w+), you're probably paying $25 a month.

60kwh (250) *.2 = $12

[BlakDuc]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10559141#post10559141 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by RichConley
Those are average temperatures.


Read the friggen article.

Sounds to me like they are talking about tide pools not the reefs.

[xtm]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10555892#post10555892 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by zippopunk1
i have a 65 gAllon tank with a one 400watt metal halide that covers my whole tank is that enough light for all types of coral and clams or is it to much the lowest the temp goes is 75 and the highest it goes is 81.2

zippo: How deep is your tank? I have a 24" tall cube with 250w on top of it and I really wouldn't push it above 250w. The pendant sits 10" above water and the heat it generates is just too intense. Actually it's not just the heat but also the intense UV that can bleach corals that you need to worry about.

[zippopunk1]

the tank itself is just a normal 65 gallon tank regular depth. my friend gave me a specialized canopy for it so the light sits up higher. temp hasnt been a problem i have it set now so that the temp ranges from 78 to 80. no ones ever told me that the light from that bulb could bleach corals. the only corals i have under the light is a birds nest that sits at the bottom. were the lights the strongest there arent any rocks piled up towards the top.the rocks build up at the end of my tank then slope to the middle of the tank. one of the big reasons i got the light was that it was cheap and i really would like to get a bigger tank in the future.

[BeanAnimal]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=10578992#post10578992 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by GrandeGixxer
Sounds to me like they are talking about tide pools not the reefs.

Actually they gave one example of a tidal pool. The swing was around 20F. It amazes me how many ways something so simple can be interpreted.

Notice the comment about the "surface temperatures" being regarded as water to depth of ~150'



A book:
http://www.springerlink.com/content/7ndlmbete5ye6nwa/

Taken from:
http://home2.pacific.net.ph/~sweetyummy42/reeftour.html
Temperature : Actually quite variable, but only variable within a set range. Which for this reef can be a low of 76 to a high of 90. The factors that determine any given temperature involves : Seasonal Fluctuations, Which for the tropics involves only two. A wet cloudy, thus cooler season, and a dry cloudless, much warmer season. On a seasonal average, I would say that during the wet season, the daily average is 80 F. While during the dry season, the daily average is 84 F. With an overall yearly average right at 82 F. Water depth and proximity to deeper water currents also greatly effect the day to day temperature swings. In the shallow grass beds, during a lull in the tides and on a sunny day, the temperature can easily reach 90 F. On that same day, the deeper, coral reef can reach 84 F. Yet when a low tide flushes the much warmer water out into the deeper reefs, the temperature climbs quickly to 86 F. The reverse happens when a high tide brings in cooler water from the much deeper open ocean. Going from 84 F. to 80 F. in a matter of hours. Night time temperature drops usually deducts about 4 degrees from the daytime average.


The NOAA website has a ton of information also.

Many reefs around the world are subjected to fairly large daily temperature swings. Storms, ocean currents, tides, etc. can all cause large areas to be flushed with warmer or colder water in a matter of hours or minutes.

[BeanAnimal]

How many BTUs does it take to raise the ocean 1 degree?

Well the wolds oceans have a volume of 1.347 × 10^9 km cubed. Or 1,347,000,000 Kilometers cubed.

A cubic kilometer has 2.64172051 × 10^11 gallons of water in it. That is 264,172,051,000 gallons

So lets say a gallon of Salt Water weighs 8.556 pounds.

That means that it would take 3.04456492E+21 BTUs to raise the all of the earths oceans 1º F

So to raise the temperature 6.2º F would take 1.88763025292683E+22 or 18,876,302,529,268,300,000,000 BTUs. That is of course assuming that the rock and atmosphere, and evaporation were not working against you. I.E. the water was perfectly insulated. I may be a gallon or two off... but you get the idea.

Does it have anything to do with the temperature swing of a reef? Not at all.