finally caught it! (pistol) why not to add one to your tank (pics and related video)

[K' Family Reef]

about 4 or 5 mos ago
added a pistol shrimp to our 125 display... before adding it we asked around wanting to be sure it was going to be reef safe and not harm any of the other inhabitants in the tank (heard nothing but ooosss and ahhhs - praise!). we intended to get a goby to pair it up with later... plus being familiar w/ RC - seemed to be a popular choice w/ people here too - pistols and gobies!

basically to make a long story short
the pistol ate all my aiptasia fighting crew of 6 peppermints and a fire shrimp... managed to spare our favorite cleaner only bec the cleaner shrimp resides in a far away land on the other side of the tank!... probably assasinated various other hermits etc in the process (speculation on my part based in part on what others have said tying that in w/ seeing half eaten hermit legs scatterred around the pistols place of residence)...

speaking of assasination :blown:
for those who havent already seen it... check out this video of a pistol taking out a cleaner shrimp in slo-mo!

http://www.milkandcookies.com/link/62380/detail/


although this wasnt exactly an impulsive purchase
we hadnt heard from anyone that these (((could be))) a problem in a reef (killing inverts) - in fact theres usually nothing but praise about these on this forum and others... bec i have relied on peppermints to take care of the aiptasia and hermits as part of the cuc - for us atleast it was not a welcome addition! and was counterproductive to the overall funtioning of (((our))) reef... boils down to more research should have been done about this on my part!!!

for anyone thinking about adding one -
this being perhaps - the rest of the story that one doesnt hear about!

admittedly feel a sense of victory
having captured this guy and having gotten it removed from the system (it could have been worse having to get all the rock out of the tank ETC) - cant believe that finally things will start getting back to normal (adding peppermints! to wipe out the massive colony of aipstasia that have since grown!)... yet as look at my display looks like a leftover battlefield w/ rocks and corals lying around in no certain fashion ("the thrill of victory... the agony of defeat!" all in one!)

oh right now he is in a holding tank
or should say our 30gal softie tank... until we figure out for sure if we want to keep it either in the 30gal mini or the 150 fowlr (if up to me its going back to pet store!)

http://i213.photobucket.com/albums/cc130/WarrenAmyMadelinne/DSC07751.jpg

[HPD Turbo]

Cool video.
Congrats on the catching!!!!

[ALittleSalty]

Cool video. I saw this on the discovery channel a few nights ago, it was a documentary, but I forget what the name was. I tivo'd it and it got erased on accident.

Jon

[chrismunn]

momentarily reaches the temp. of the sun, the video says...

[seapug]

Wow. You must have gotten one with a bad attitude. I have a large bullseye pistol in my 90 and have never had those problems with it. I also have a small randalls with a Yashia goby in my 28 that's shy as can be.

[sk8rreefgeek]

that was awesome! We were actually about to buy one for my Goby....still might lol

can they hurt clowns? or any other fish?

[Anemone]

Yep, I have a tiger pistol too and never had an issue. I used to think it was funny when the pistol would pick up a hermit shell, put it on the wall of its burrow, then come back 5 minutes later to find the hermit walking away (and pick it up and put it back into the wall of the burrow). Never saw any aggression toward the hermits or cleaners that I had.

Kevin

[masonicman]

WarrenAmy&Maddy

How did you catch it?

[jlt23]

I have two of the exact same one in my tank that live in the same cave. The only problems that I have is that they move sand everywhere.

[pezcubano]

Mine is awesome. he keeps to himself, but has never paired with my goby. He only comes out at night, or during feeding time.
The only complaint I have is that he is a BULLDOZER... moving sand around all over the place. Last night he tried to bury my Elegance Coral!!!

[DrBegalke]

I've kept a pistol shrimp with a fire shrimp for years, sorry about your bad luck.

[foolish08015]

that was so cool !!!!

[masonicman]

I hear mine but have never seen it. It's been in the tank for over a year. Hitch hiker. And no!!! I and a few experienced reefers believe it's not a mantis. I see the burrow it lives in but only hear it's pop at night in the same area. I even used a red light. Can't see it!!!!!
I sure would luv to see it. Any sug???

[K' Family Reef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11662398#post11662398 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by sk8rreefgeek
that was awesome! We were actually about to buy one for my Goby....still might lol

can they hurt clowns? or any other fish?

you know i am not sure!

recom researching this a bit further before making your decision - they are not easy to catch w/out taking out alot/all LR from tank - the larger the tank and more LR - the more difficult the challenge!

regards

[Twz]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11663112#post11663112 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Anemone
Yep, I have a tiger pistol too and never had an issue. I used to think it was funny when the pistol would pick up a hermit shell, put it on the wall of its burrow, then come back 5 minutes later to find the hermit walking away (and pick it up and put it back into the wall of the burrow). Never saw any aggression toward the hermits or cleaners that I had.

Kevin
Rofl i used to have a puffer that had a ''Pet'' Crab the puffer would pick up the crab put it in the corner of the tank and watch it, once the crab started walking away he would put him back...
and for people to say fish are stupid!

[K' Family Reef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11663140#post11663140 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by masonicman
WarrenAmy&Maddy

How did you catch it?

MasonicMan

once i realized where his hole and rock was
then i covered up all the entrances to his burrow by covering them up w/ sand - so he couldnt escape while i started pulling literally every piece of LR from that half of the 125 (we have over 200# of LR in this system!)

so as one could imagine -
this was something i had dreaded doing and procrastinated for about 2 mos... bec i planned to remove the pistol the same time i did a water change (thus having bins water in them to store the rock as it was removed from display)...

once i got enough rock away from the center of the display
i took a glass cover (previously used as cover for tank) and divided the tank in half or used it as a divider... so that when i pulled the rock up then the pistol could not get away by swimming over to the other half of the tank.. i then pumped out the rest of the water for the water change bringing it down to the level of the top of the glass (keep it from going over the top of the glass)

basically once all rock was out from that side of the tank
where it was located - i lifted up the rock that i (((((hoped))))) he was still under - and hola! there he was - of course first thing he did was hit the glass divider trying to head for cover under more liverock - but then it was easy just netted him out!

pretty much my tank now looks like a war zone
utter and total destruction - literally corals lying all over upside down etc etc - LR just stuck back in the display in no particular order - but it was a well executed sweet triumph over this pistol who have tried to catch so many other times :lol:

:dance:

[K' Family Reef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11663762#post11663762 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by masonicman
I hear mine but have never seen it. It's been in the tank for over a year. Hitch hiker. And no!!! I and a few experienced reefers believe it's not a mantis. I see the burrow it lives in but only hear it's pop at night in the same area. I even used a red light. Can't see it!!!!!
I sure would luv to see it. Any sug???

MasonicMan
i was lucky in that most of the rocks it decided to adopt as its home - were towards the front of the tank... i would just look for a freshly dug hole then shine a flashlite in there (day or nite) to see if i could spot its whiskers sticking out or coming up to the top of the hole - that was how i knew where it was...

just try and find a fresh burrow hole and keep an eye on it - eventually you will spot it or something moving down in the hole... or might start out by covering EVERY burrow hole you can see w/ sand... then when it digs its way out - you will know exactly where it is based on the fresh hole it digs.

good luck!

regards

[StunnaShadez]

that sucks that your pistol is killing your other shrimps and hermits. mines is scared of hermits. the yashia actually brings down plenty of floating algae. wether its chaeto or some leafy macro and i see it spit it into the hole for the red banded shrimp.

[ACBlinky]

This is the first time I've heard of a tiger pistol being nasty -- I know there are certain species that are aggressive, but tigers tend to be pussycats. Mine has been with me for three years, he was the first SW animal I ever purchased. He's on his third goby now, and seems happy as can be in his little corner of the 90g. He's never shown any aggression towards fish, shrimp, hermits or anything else.

I'm so sorry to hear yours is a nasty one -- are you positive beyond a doubt that it's your pistol that did the killing? When you mentioned scattered hermit legs etc. the first thing I thought of was a mantis. Mantis shrimp also click, and are known for leaving carnage (shells mostly) near their caves. It's entirely possible to have both living in close proximity -- I've caught two small mantis shrimp in the last two years, both were living for a long time in the same rockwork as the pistol; when I caught the first one, it was living about 6" away from the pistol's cave. The second one was living at more of a distance, but still only about 18" away. I wouldn't give up on your tiger yet - listen to your display for clicking, and keep checking for carnage. If you don't find anything in the next few weeks, I'd say you caught your culprit. If not... you might have to dive back in and catch something else! :)

[K' Family Reef]

fellas...
after reading all the positive reports everyone else gave about their pistol experiences...

there is NO DOUBT ABOUT IT WHATSOEVER...

this fella is a bonafide KILLAH
vicious cold blooded murdering KILLAH...

he must have come from the depths of the ocean
hardened by survivial in the real fish world (like a real gangsta living in the hood to one of us)

i was given no choice but to give this pistol the death sentence!

here are some before and after shots... the most recent taken just minutes ago.


http://i213.photobucket.com/albums/cc130/WarrenAmyMadelinne/DSC07751.jpg

http://i213.photobucket.com/albums/cc130/WarrenAmyMadelinne/byeBYEpistolSOB.jpg

:thumbsup: mmmmmmmmmmmm goood!

only kidding - wouldnt do that!
:wavehand:
in reality he has already taken up residence of the back corner of our 30gal mini reef - has already dug up about 5 burro holes under a rock - stuck it in there until can figure out if we are going to keep it or not - easy enough to catch in there and we might like him in there better paired up w/ a goby!

[K' Family Reef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11665808#post11665808 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by ACBlinky
This is the first time I've heard of a tiger pistol being nasty -- I know there are certain species that are aggressive, but tigers tend to be pussycats. Mine has been with me for three years, he was the first SW animal I ever purchased. He's on his third goby now, and seems happy as can be in his little corner of the 90g. He's never shown any aggression towards fish, shrimp, hermits or anything else.

I'm so sorry to hear yours is a nasty one -- are you positive beyond a doubt that it's your pistol that did the killing? When you mentioned scattered hermit legs etc. the first thing I thought of was a mantis. Mantis shrimp also click, and are known for leaving carnage (shells mostly) near their caves. It's entirely possible to have both living in close proximity -- I've caught two small mantis shrimp in the last two years, both were living for a long time in the same rockwork as the pistol; when I caught the first one, it was living about 6" away from the pistol's cave. The second one was living at more of a distance, but still only about 18" away. I wouldn't give up on your tiger yet - listen to your display for clicking, and keep checking for carnage. If you don't find anything in the next few weeks, I'd say you caught your culprit. If not... you might have to dive back in and catch something else! :)


ACBlinky

i can say beyond any reasonable doubt
that it was the pistol that atleast killed all the peppermints and the fireshrimp

based on these facts...

had peppermints in the tank for probably atleast 6 mos if not longer to include the fire shrimp and the cleaner (part of the original cleaning crew purchased for the tank)

before i added the pistol
i pretty much knew where the p'mints were hanging out - somewhat hidden but w/n eyeshot...

once added
the few that were in the area that it took up residence WERE GONE... and the last one that was hanging out in the same area (which was basically the left side of tank next to overflow) was the fire shrimp... i had already started to suspect that the pistol was going for the p'mints and when i noticed the fire shrimp was still there (the only one left standing on that side of the tank) - then i thought either the fire shrimp is a tough sob able to stand up to the pistol - or anyday he was going to be toast too... and literally the very next day i didnt see the fire shrimp again!

then there were peppemints on the right side of the tank too
pretty much knew where they were also - but in short time i no longer saw them again either... there is also a cleaner who is the last shrimp standing - but he hangs out perhaps higher in the rock and entirely on the right side of the display about 5 ft from where the pistol resided...

all these disappeared w/n a week of adding the pistol

am 100% certain my water parameters are all within normal limits and have been... its a 210gallon system (125 display) and has a 50gal display refugium as part of it also... everything that i am keeping corals fish inverts (whats left) appear to all be thriving, growing etc

like those whom have posted in this thread
i felt very comfortable purchasing this pistol... others i asked also people here on RC etc...

there has only been one other person
that i have come across who has had a similar experience (here on RC said it was a tiger too)... they reported bec they couldnt catch it that they were just learning to accept reefing w/ it in their tank... although they were the ones to first bring it to my attention that since adding the pistol they could not keep a crab in the tank.

perhaps its possible couple of things
either there is some other type of or related 'tiger' pistol... or some of them are just mean sob's

regards

[K' Family Reef]

hey thanks to all who replied to this thread.
:fun4:

unfortunately some pistols
might not be the same as others that appear to be more compatible living in harmony w/ the other inhabitants of our reefs... it would appear atleast (from all the replies) that getting one like i ended up with is more rare/unusual then most - but that possibility should still be kept in mind when considering purchasing one.

this was pretty much an all day affair
removing all the liverock from display and putting in bins trying to catch it then getting it all back where it belonged... not a lot of time considering... but the main point here is that my reef is a real MESS now... rocks/corals all in disarray - will probably take another 1/2 day+ to get the rockscaping just right (taking it all out again then putting it all back carefully piece by piece - placed 'just right') - there is also over 200# of LR in this system.

and i posted the video for anyone interested in adding pistols
and all those who are having great experiences w/theirs - to see what these shrimp are capable of doing... although they seem like adorable lil creatures in our tanks - the natural 'behavior' in the wild (or in my tank!) should perhaps be given primary consideration before buying one!

regards
:wave:

[adtravels]

silly question but did you ever try feeding it? i.e putting food in or nearits burrow, it may have been drivento killing.

[K' Family Reef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11666109#post11666109 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by adtravels
silly question but did you ever try feeding it? i.e putting food in or nearits burrow, it may have been drivento killing.

whenever i fed the tank
i would shoot some frozen mysis down into one of the burro holes.

regards

[flameangel88]

Wow! Sorry to hear the bad experience with your pistol shrimp but hope I'll NOT be more sorry than you as I pick-up 3 lg cleaner shrimps and 3 lg fire shrimps on Monday 1/21. I've 2 pistols and one of them is a large 1.5"+ paired with a YWG for a year and a half now. The good thing is my sandbed on my new setup is only about 2" and I can see where they are from the bottom glass.

[RedSoxReefer]

I have the same type of pistol...At first he was really shy but now he is constantly bulldozing behind his body guard, a yellow watchman, he made several burrows that he reinforced with rubble and he rotates the rennovation of them all. The relationship is really cool to see but there are sandstorms in my tank quite often as a result. I am missing a small red bali star now and after reading this I hope that the pistol isnt the prime suspect. Also the watchman has become very territorial toward my purple firefish. So as these guys are pretty neat to own there are some drawbacks that make me sometimes second guess ever purchasing a pair again...

[K' Family Reef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11667441#post11667441 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by flameangel88
Wow! Sorry to hear the bad experience with your pistol shrimp but hope I'll NOT be more sorry than you as I pick-up 3 lg cleaner shrimps and 3 lg fire shrimps on Monday 1/21. I've 2 pistols and one of them is a large 1.5"+ paired with a YWG for a year and a half now. The good thing is my sandbed on my new setup is only about 2" and I can see where they are from the bottom glass.


i hope things go w/o a hitch for your new tank inhabitants!
(fire shrimp and cleaners can make expensive 'fish' food!)

[aztbs]

I always say that it is a love/hate relationship. My large tiger pistol lives under a rock with a Randall's goby (see avatar). I really enjoy watching him build and move sand. The pair is one of my family and friend's (nonreefers) favorite things about my tank.

Drawbacks (the hate part):

- the pistol did kill my small male ocellaris clown fish. The shrimp burrow opening was very close to the BTA host of the clown. The clown got to close, startled the shrimp. About 6 loud pops later, the clown was swimming upside down and had to be removed.

- the shrimp will take anything he can move for his building, and he can move a lot. See this vid: http://projectbat.com/Aquarium/shrimpdeco.mov
I have lost a lot of frags that I thought were secure. You have to give them lots of rubble to play with and keep the supply replenished

- the shrimp will bury things in mounds of sand. If he can't move it, he will just pile a huge mound of sand over it. I lost a large colony of alveopora this way.

- the shrimp will make a mess of your water. I always have a mess kicked up from his digging into new areas.

If I could catch him without destroying my corals I would and I would move him to a different tank. He is a pain, but I would not get rid of him. All that being said, I have a ton of hermits and he never kills them. I have seen him carry live ceriths, hermits, and nassarius snails and evict them from his burrow. I don't have any other shrimp.

[K' Family Reef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11668478#post11668478 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by aztbs
I always say that it is a love/hate relationship. My large tiger pistol lives under a rock with a Randall's goby (see avatar). I really enjoy watching him build and move sand. The pair is one of my family and friend's (nonreefers) favorite things about my tank.

Drawbacks (the hate part):

- the pistol did kill my small male ocellaris clown fish. The shrimp burrow opening was very close to the BTA host of the clown. The clown got to close, startled the shrimp. About 6 loud pops later, the clown was swimming upside down and had to be removed.

- the shrimp will take anything he can move for his building, and he can move a lot. See this vid: http://projectbat.com/Aquarium/shrimpdeco.mov
I have lost a lot of frags that I thought were secure. You have to give them lots of rubble to play with and keep the supply replenished

- the shrimp will bury things in mounds of sand. If he can't move it, he will just pile a huge mound of sand over it. I lost a large colony of alveopora this way.

- the shrimp will make a mess of your water. I always have a mess kicked up from his digging into new areas.

If I could catch him without destroying my corals I would and I would move him to a different tank. He is a pain, but I would not get rid of him. All that being said, I have a ton of hermits and he never kills them. I have seen him carry live ceriths, hermits, and nassarius snails and evict them from his burrow. I don't have any other shrimp.



not glad to hear about your clown

but atleast there is more info surfacing about these
especially as my wife says - all the overwhelming support for keeping them (perhaps) in contrast to what they actually represent (ie the video and 'pistol' whipping in the wild) that is a 'predator'

regards

[ACBlinky]

This thread has gotten me thinking. More than once, I've introduced shy new fish into the tank, perfectly healthy after being quarantined, only to have them turn up dead within days. New fish tend to dive into the rockwork, and I've always heard lots of clicking but thought nothing of it -- Digger is forever clicking at hermits and established fish that come too close to his burrow. Now I'm wondering if the new fish were actually killed, rather than just being frightened away; most of the established fish have had a chance to get used to Digger (they were there before he was transferred over), and those that joined the group later on were larger, bolder fish.

My CUC is down to three ceriths, a nassarius, a Babylon whelk, two hermits and a large CBS. I assumed they had just died off over time, and figured some were likely killed by the mantis before I found and removed it. Now I'm wondering, maybe my sweet little Digger isn't so innocent after all...

[Sk8r]

Tiger pistol, just like mine. I have 4 large peps and numerous hermits, and have absolutely no trouble with mine: one pep hangs out upside down right above its fave burrow. Mine is paired with a male YWG, and the only thing I've ever seen the pistol do is carry off a hermit, who immediately walked back out of the burrow unharmed.

I do have all very small fishes, so maybe the stress level is a little low in my tank. All my burrowing gobies are out hanging in the water or perching all the time, and maybe the pistol feels a little less defensive. He's only 'popped' twice, once initially to attract the YWG and once when startled by an inbound hermit, who took the blow on his shell and was unharmed.

[flameangel88]

I hear pops everyday but have never seen the pistol causing any harm as the pistol/YWG pair are always under sand/rocks. I have quite a number of empty snail/hermit shells and I always assume it was a hermit eating the other as I always see hermit holding onto other shell trying eat them. My YWG is very defensive of its territory and will come out to move angels out of the way and will come way out to move my pair of Dragon gobies when they are in sight.

The pistol/goby pair is beautiful to watch and it's a risk I've to take at least till I see they cause harm to my tank.

[K' Family Reef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11669434#post11669434 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Sk8r
Tiger pistol, just like mine. I have 4 large peps and numerous hermits, and have absolutely no trouble with mine: one pep hangs out upside down right above its fave burrow. Mine is paired with a male YWG, and the only thing I've ever seen the pistol do is carry off a hermit, who immediately walked back out of the burrow unharmed.

I do have all very small fishes, so maybe the stress level is a little low in my tank. All my burrowing gobies are out hanging in the water or perching all the time, and maybe the pistol feels a little less defensive. He's only 'popped' twice, once initially to attract the YWG and once when startled by an inbound hermit, who took the blow on his shell and was unharmed.

do you spot feed the pistol?
(i would shoot food into one of its burrow holes)

dont have a goby -but is there any sharing of food etc taking it back to burrow - when they are paired up?

i also have what i would consider atleast to be a very peaceful tank... about the most aggressive thing would be a yellow tang - and it cohabitates fine w/ everything else w/out any territorial issues going on (the tang is probably the boss!)

i am really surprised to hear that you have only heard it pop 2x
i would hear mine everyday and everynite... i have/had a lot of hermits and anytime would start hearing the popping would see one or two over close to the pistols burrow... wonder if perhaps the hermits that (may have been) killed actually wandered down and into the burro hole thus meeting their demise - probably going after food that i would have shot down into the hole w/ the handy turkey baster.

glad to hear Sk8r that yours displays exemplary behavior
in your system... sounds like he is a model citizen!
;)


regards

[flameangel88]

I've had 2 pairs of pistol/YWG and never seen the goby bring food back but then I've never seen my GSM clowns bring food to the BTA either.

[K' Family Reef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11669614#post11669614 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by flameangel88
I hear pops everyday but have never seen the pistol causing any harm as the pistol/YWG pair are always under sand/rocks. I have quite a number of empty snail/hermit shells and I always assume it was a hermit eating the other as I always see hermit holding onto other shell trying eat them. My YWG is very defensive of its territory and will come out to move angels out of the way and will come way out to move my pair of Dragon gobies when they are in sight.

The pistol/goby pair is beautiful to watch and it's a risk I've to take at least till I see they cause harm to my tank.

i am just glad to see the 'debate' about their behavior
being addressed - here on RC... atleast allowing for better 'informed' decisions to be made by people considering getting one...

perhaps it could be added to the 'mostly' reef safe list
like so many other fish that some of us decide to use... although more then likely considering how popular this fish is - people will continue to view it as it is currently viewed.


i am sure the pair are beautiful to watch together!

in my system atleast -
i depended on the peppermints to act as aiptasia clean up (and strongly prefer this over injections etc - just easier! and more natural predation)... so w/ this pistol atleast that 'option' was eliminated thus having to weigh the benefits of keeping the pistol vs that of the peppermints...

hands down i choose to get rid of the pistol
or atleast move him across to the other side of the world known as our home office 30gal mini reef - until further notice atleast (and he may even be evicted from there)
;)

regards

[Sk8r]

Interesting.
I agree: almost every species we keep has SOMETHING it will aggress against [be it mysis shrimp] if you hit the right combination of circumstances. It's why I think threads about: what are your experiences with--- are valuable. Possibly the water flow---possibly the fish load---possibly just one shrimp getting too curious----so hard to figure what pulls the trigger on a situation.
My peps have gotten all my aiptasia, except the ones in the fuge. I should get some for down there.

[flameangel88]

I'm glad you posted this thread as I never would have thought pistols could cause so much harm (the video link was great) and now I've to keep a watchful eye on them. This is the kind of threads I enjoy reading with hobbists sharing their experiences and not being defensive one way or the other.

Great thread! :)

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11669808#post11669808 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by WarrenAmy&Maddy
i am just glad to see the 'debate' about their behavior
being addressed - here on RC... atleast allowing for better 'informed' decisions to be made by people considering getting one...

perhaps it could be added to the 'mostly' reef safe list
like so many other fish that some of us decide to use... although more then likely considering how popular this fish is - people will continue to view it as it is currently viewed.


i am sure the pair are beautiful to watch together!

in my system atleast -
i depended on the peppermints to act as aiptasia clean up (and strongly prefer this over injections etc - just easier! and more natural predation)... so w/ this pistol atleast that 'option' was eliminated thus having to weigh the benefits of keeping the pistol vs that of the peppermints...

hands down i choose to get rid of the pistol
or atleast move him across to the other side of the world known as our home office 30gal mini reef - until further notice atleast (and he may even be evicted from there)
;)

regards

[sk8rreefgeek]

dang I really want one, but my black/white is pretty dear to me. don't know if I can risk it...

[K' Family Reef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11668478#post11668478 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by aztbs
I
- the shrimp will take anything he can move for his building, and he can move a lot. See this vid: http://projectbat.com/Aquarium/shrimpdeco.mov
I have lost a lot of frags that I thought were secure. You have to give them lots of rubble to play with and keep the supply replenished



entertaining video!
and the goby along as the lookout AND an accomplice in the matter!
:p

regards

[sk8rreefgeek]

I tried to watch the video twice, and had to restart my computer both times

[warriorss08]

has anyone had problems with pistols and small seahorses?

[warriorss08]

ps video was great. I didn't know that the bubble got as hot as the sun!

[K' Family Reef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11670589#post11670589 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by sk8rreefgeek
I tried to watch the video twice, and had to restart my computer both times

dont know -
it took a short while to come up on mine before it finally did - if its not locking up your computer you might just wait it out to see if it comes up.

regards

[K' Family Reef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11670862#post11670862 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by warriorss08
ps video was great. I didn't know that the bubble got as hot as the sun!


think it might have been DrBegalke (???) who posted on another thread here on RC that they had read the temp was 115degrees or something (iow as hot as the sun? - probably not!)

regards

[sk8rreefgeek]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11670865#post11670865 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by WarrenAmy&Maddy
dont know -
it took a short while to come up on mine before it finally did - if its not locking up your computer you might just wait it out to see if it comes up.

regards

Oh, the first video was fine, it was that projectbat.com one

idk...:rolleye1:

there were a bunch on you-tube tho

[Apparition]

Well, one thing to remember too is that there are some pistol shrimp that are more active hunters than others. Specifically, the one shown in the first post video is not commensal with shrimp gobies. Live Aquaria had a few for sale recently that weren't commensal with gobies and stated that they were not reef safe. Pistol shrimp that are paired with gobies or that traditionally do pair with gobies tend to rely more on algae that the goby brings it.

That being said, a tiger pistol is one of the reef safe, commensal ones. The only thing I can think of is that maybe it was hungry because it didn't have a goby to bring it food, but it still is really odd that it killed so many in a week. Just like with fish, they have individual personalities as the bulk of experiences here are that they are reef safe. Every animal can surprise you if you expect something from it. I'd hate to have had to break down all that live rock, but good thing you got the little guy out! Crazy that he was tearing up the shrimp like that, but that's why they have the claw.

[RedSoxReefer]

My YWG brings the pistol food and I have seen him bring macro down into the burrow several times...

[hyperfocal]

My pistol shrimp is definitely on the aggressive side. It's taken out an Emerald Crab and several Hermits -- I saw it take out one of the Hermits just the other day *pop* *pop* nom nom nom.

Up until last weekend, it and it's buddy (Cryptocentrus leptocephalus) had the nano to themselves...

http://reef.eldersign.org/wp-content/uploads/2007/11/dsc_9414.JPG

Last weekend I added a couple of Yellow Damsels, figuring if anyone could stand up to the pistol shrimp it'd be those ill-tempered little buggers. Of course, as soon as they hit the water the new fish dashed for the liverock... a few seconds later *pop**pop**pop* The Damsels didn't seem any worse for wear; certainly not stunned stupid like the hermit. It seemed at the time that things might work out.

I just looked into the tank tonight after a few days away on business aaaaand one of the Damsels has two bloody streaks on the base of it's caudal fin... just like you'd imagine it'd get if it managed to break free of a strong claw. The fish is eating well, and I'm pretty sure it'll recover unless it gets got again.

And yeah, they're little bulldozers :lol: I knew when I put the tank together that I was going to have one, so I put the liverock up on acrylic pegs, like this:
http://reef.eldersign.org/wp-content/uploads/2007/10/img_5352.JPG
and I'm glad I did. The shrimp seems quite happy digging out underneath all the rockwork. The sand is piled about 6" deep in the front of the tank with none under any of the rock. I've had to put the Trachyphylia and Fungi onto live rock 'platforms' so they wouldn't get buried (something both species really hate...)

Given their potential aggressiveness and bulldozing behavior, I'm inclined to think of them as critters best suited to species tank. My nano just became a species tank. The tank is only a 20H, so there isn't a lot of room to begin with. I don't think there are a lot of fish out there that'd fit in the tank and not be predated by the shrimp. It's a bit bummer, but overall I'm okay with it. The shrimp/goby pair is cool enough to make it worthwhile.

[Icefire]

The video show a type of pistol shrimp that is not used in our hobby, ours are blind and that one can see very well (predatory).

Most pistol are model citizen, add a goby and have fun!

[hyperfocal]

Mine isn't blind. Some may be, but not all.

[K' Family Reef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11672137#post11672137 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Apparition
Well, one thing to remember too is that there are some pistol shrimp that are more active hunters than others. Specifically, the one shown in the first post video is not commensal with shrimp gobies. Live Aquaria had a few for sale recently that weren't commensal with gobies and stated that they were not reef safe. Pistol shrimp that are paired with gobies or that traditionally do pair with gobies tend to rely more on algae that the goby brings it.

That being said, a tiger pistol is one of the reef safe, commensal ones. The only thing I can think of is that maybe it was hungry because it didn't have a goby to bring it food, but it still is really odd that it killed so many in a week. Just like with fish, they have individual personalities as the bulk of experiences here are that they are reef safe. Every animal can surprise you if you expect something from it. I'd hate to have had to break down all that live rock, but good thing you got the little guy out! Crazy that he was tearing up the shrimp like that, but that's why they have the claw.

hey i appreciate you coming in on the discussion
you seem like you might know more about these pistols!

i dont know that the shrimp would have been eating the peppermints and various hermits i hold it accountable for
(if at all???)

as much as simply protecting its real estate!...
(snapping - then the hermits finishing the 'salvage' job??) but w/ so many hermit crabs in there - he did seem to keep rather busy day to day - snapping at them (imagine the same would have held true at nite w/ the peppermints coming out doing their 'business')...

i know that after he was first put in -
i found shrimp carcasses in the back of the tank - initially thinking the shrimp had molted - then began suspecting the pistol of assasinating these other shrimp... it wasnt long before i didnt notice any peppermints at all yet there was still the fire shrimp standing - unfortunately right above where the pistol resided... that was when like i mentioned in a previous thread... that i thought to myself the fire shrimp bec he was larger must be more resilient to the tiger pistols whip!

then like i said before -
the very next day the fire shrimp was gone never to be seen again... that did all the convincing i needed to have about the pistol!

factoring in the cost of
x6 peppermints
x1 fire shrimp
hermit here hermit there ?
then the cost of the pistol
= i have about 150+++ dollars tied up into this pistol...

anyone want to buy a well 'fed' and reef 'seasoned' pistol for 150bucks?
(free shipping)
;)

(actually its double that now that i am going to replace these things since the pistol has been removed!)

and that does not factor in the most important thing into the equation = ((((( my time !!! )))))



for whatever reason
the particular tiger that i had appeared to exhibit (((perhaps))) more aggressive behavior (whether he was 'eating' or being more 'territorial')... dont know - but i do feel confident this pistol is the culprit in this case - and it seems obvious!

i have wondered if a goby would have been added
if perhaps this would have all been avoided ???... being that they form a "commensal" relationship (didnt know if that pertained to feeding as well)...

but the history speaks for itself
and perhaps it boils down to the fact that this shrimp might not be as reef safe/harmless as people 'think' they are... which adds them to a long list of other animals we keep/or not in our reefs!

i hope this thread has been informative and educational
to all who have read it... so whether one person necessarily agrees w/ another - the fact probably remains that there is perhaps more 'risk' assoc w/ these pistols then was previously thought... until there might be an 'answer' regarding why one might be more aggressive over another (lack of a goby, more hermits/shrimp the more territorial ETC) - then 'risk' is probably considered appropriate attached to keeping a pistol...

thanks again to all who have replied w/ info to this thread!

regards ;)

[sk8rreefgeek]

this has been a fun thread to follow (esp since i'm in the process of getting one for my YWG)
after all this, I doubt anyone will want THAT pistol hahaha!

One thing that can be determined for sure: those are some bad dudes

[K' Family Reef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11678219#post11678219 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by sk8rreefgeek
this has been a fun thread to follow (esp since i'm in the process of getting one for my YWG)
after all this, I doubt anyone will want THAT pistol hahaha!

One thing that can be determined for sure: those are some bad dudes

:eek1: :blown: :hammer: :uzi: :uzi: :uzi: :hmm5: :hmm3:


:wavehand:

:dance:

[K' Family Reef]

UPDATE...

the pistol had been removed and stuck into a 30gal mini reef... this fella has literally dug up the sand bed from right side (where it started out) completely to the left side... tunneled out... from side to side... perhaps because there is a 5-6" of sand in the main reef - and only about 2" in this tank - has caused it to completely redo the sandbed as it keeps hitting bottom...

anyone else keeping one of these in a smaller tank?

regards

[adamn]

I have had both a randalls and a red pistol. Both were nasty and killed things in my tanks. One attacked my royal gramma, and attacked and killed a brittle star. The other attacked and very near killed my watchman goby, but I pulled him out in the process. I will never get a pistol again.

[ACBlinky]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11711949#post11711949 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by WarrenAmy&Maddy
UPDATE...

the pistol had been removed and stuck into a 30gal mini reef... this fella has literally dug up the sand bed from right side (where it started out) completely to the left side... tunneled out... from side to side... perhaps because there is a 5-6" of sand in the main reef - and only about 2" in this tank - has caused it to completely redo the sandbed as it keeps hitting bottom...

anyone else keeping one of these in a smaller tank?

regards Yep! Digger started out in a 14g (my first reef was a nano). We soon upgraded and he went to live in a 30g (24" x 12" x 24"H), and eventually moved to a 65g and then into our 90g.

In the two smaller tanks, he made one heck of a hill on the left side of the tank, removing nearly all the sand from the right to deepen the area around his primary cave entrance and exit. He used all the spare hermit shells, frags, hermits, snails, pieces of macroalgae and anything else he could get his claws around for building material. I could drop a shell into the bare side of the tank, and within minutes Digger would be out dragging it home.

Now that he's in a larger, more aggressive tank with large fish swimming overhead (tang, swallowtail angel) Digger tends to stay closer to home. He and Goober used to go for walks, looking for all the world like a little old man with his seeing eye dog, it was very cute. Now they're constantly on the lookout, often dashing into their cave when fish swim by. They stay in a 12" x 12" area, in the back right corner of the tank. Goober is fat, Digger continues to molt, so I think they're doing well, just not as 'social' as they used to be when their world was smaller and less populated. They've moved just as much sand, it's just not nearly as noticeable with a 48" x 18" footprint.

[K' Family Reef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11712031#post11712031 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by adamn
I have had both a randalls and a red pistol. Both were nasty and killed things in my tanks. One attacked my royal gramma, and attacked and killed a brittle star. The other attacked and very near killed my watchman goby, but I pulled him out in the process. I will never get a pistol again.


well i feel the same way
unfortunate that they are such a neat pair together... for right now this guy is going to stay in our mini reef - the only other fish in there is a damsel and few hermits/snails... dont like that it tore up the entire sandbed from side to side but atleast its not in my main display disturbing the DSB... in the smaller tank it can be more of a 'species' type tank to hold the pair (if we decide to keep it and get a goby to pair it up with)...

we were only undecided in that we were thinking might put seahorses in this tank.

that is something that it killed the brittle star
:eek1:

regards

[adamn]

I did have a YWG and pistol pair in the past, and they were great! That is why I got one to hopefully pair up with my new YWG (red pistol this time), but this one tried to kill him! The one that killed the brittle was also a randalls, he litterally chased the star up the heater cord to the top of the tank out of the water where his snapping at the star could be heard from upstairs, by that point all the stars legs were chopped off and the pistol took the body and scooted into his hole with it.

[K' Family Reef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11712426#post11712426 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by ACBlinky
Yep! Digger started out in a 14g (my first reef was a nano). We soon upgraded and he went to live in a 30g (24" x 12" x 24"H), and eventually moved to a 65g and then into our 90g.

In the two smaller tanks, he made one heck of a hill on the left side of the tank, removing nearly all the sand from the right to deepen the area around his primary cave entrance and exit. He used all the spare hermit shells, frags, hermits, snails, pieces of macroalgae and anything else he could get his claws around for building material. I could drop a shell into the bare side of the tank, and within minutes Digger would be out dragging it home.

Now that he's in a larger, more aggressive tank with large fish swimming overhead (tang, swallowtail angel) Digger tends to stay closer to home. He and Goober used to go for walks, looking for all the world like a little old man with his seeing eye dog, it was very cute. Now they're constantly on the lookout, often dashing into their cave when fish swim by. They stay in a 12" x 12" area, in the back right corner of the tank. Goober is fat, Digger continues to molt, so I think they're doing well, just not as 'social' as they used to be when their world was smaller and less populated. They've moved just as much sand, it's just not nearly as noticeable with a 48" x 18" footprint.

did you see the video that Aztbs posted
of their pistol/goby pair - and the pistol dragging a piece of LPS over to its cavern? - pretty neat might check it out!

regards

[Paddlefoot]

I have a green pistol and a yellow watchman. So far so good but it has only been a few weeks. The goby dutifully pulls clam chunks into the cave. I have not seen the p/s(except for an occasional puff of sand) since I put him in but he has dug a nice cave and keeps the mouth clear. I have 2 cleaner shrimp and 6 sexy shrimp and they have not been harmed ...yet. I have not seen him venture out at night so maybe he is being fed enough. Also, the shrimp and the goby were introduced at the same time.

[K' Family Reef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11718583#post11718583 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Paddlefoot
I have a green pistol and a yellow watchman. So far so good but it has only been a few weeks. The goby dutifully pulls clam chunks into the cave. I have not seen the p/s(except for an occasional puff of sand) since I put him in but he has dug a nice cave and keeps the mouth clear. I have 2 cleaner shrimp and 6 sexy shrimp and they have not been harmed ...yet. I have not seen him venture out at night so maybe he is being fed enough. Also, the shrimp and the goby were introduced at the same time.


Paddlefoot
hope that you dont have any problems - you have quite a few other shrimps in there like i had... perhaps since your p/s is paired up w/ a goby - it will be less aggressive???... had wondered if the problems i had w/ it was bec it was solo - vs whatever role the goby plays in the relationship - foodfinding/sharing ??? etc...

good luck!

regards

[Paddlefoot]

Thanks Warren, I hope it works out. If all hell breaks loose I will let you know.

[K' Family Reef]

UPDATE on this tiger pistol :

we added this pistol to our 30gal mini reef
as a holding tank until we figured out if we would keep it or not and get a goby to pair it up with...

the only fish in this tank was a damsel
and there were a few hermits in there too...

i just went to feed the tank
and noticed the damsel was GONE!

this is pretty surprising considering it was a damsel!
when i stuck it in there i figured there would be nothing to worry about in this tank and as far as i know this pistol hadnt taken out any fish in the tank it had come from (125gal display)

i know people like to think warm fuzzy feelings
to these pistols... it has been anything but that w/ the one i have owned... aside from those who posted on this thread - have heard of one other person here on RC who had the same experience i have had w/ mine... noting that he could not keep shrimp or crabs in his tank anymore and that he had learned to live w/ it in his system...

after taking out about all the LR to get this fella out
i still have yet to redo all the rockscaping - still a mess sitting in my living room... and in the process of removing the pistol and doing a water change at same time... i lost about 10 branches of my prized euphylias (almost certainly due to DISTURBING the DSB when moving things around!!!)... gladly everything is returning to normal and my corals are again looking perty! ;)

i couldnt put a price on what this pistol has cost me
think i figured it up earlier in the thread just based on the livestock it had 'taken care of' (150+/-)... but then factoring in my time dealing w/ all of this $$$ then the loss of some of my prized euphylias... this has been a 'hard' learning experience!... quite possible that this particluar pistol was a 'genuine killa' as quoted earlier in the thread... perhaps more aggressive then most for whatever reason!

now :rolleyes: :mad:
its a matter of taking apart the 30gal to remove this pistol then off to the LFS probably for store credit of what maybe 5 bucks!
:lol:

good luck to all those who keep these most fascinating creatures and i hope that no one encounters some of the problems that i have dealt with w/ mine!

regards

[sk8rreefgeek]

you know, I was pretty much 100% on getting a little tiger pistol for my YWG. My girlfriend really wanted one too. we were literally going to order one the same day this thread started up. I took into account all the good stories of these guys, and was still gonna get one.

but the thought of it jackin up my percs was just too much. I would just feel like an idiot if I screwed up my tank after the warnings.
anyways, I have an idea on why your pistol turned to the dark side: He got hooked on dope at an early age. then turned to pistol fighting to support his habit. he was good, he was DAMN GOOD! but one day, he was forced to fight his OWN BROTHER. he faught his brother, and he KILLED his brother! still haunted to this day, he has resorted to a life of violence

[K' Family Reef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11794905#post11794905 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by sk8rreefgeek
you know, I was pretty much 100% on getting a little tiger pistol for my YWG. My girlfriend really wanted one too. we were literally going to order one the same day this thread started up. I took into account all the good stories of these guys, and was still gonna get one.

but the thought of it jackin up my percs was just too much. I would just feel like an idiot if I screwed up my tank after the warnings.
anyways, I have an idea on why your pistol turned to the dark side: He got hooked on dope at an early age. then turned to pistol fighting to support his habit. he was good, he was DAMN GOOD! but one day, he was forced to fight his OWN BROTHER. he faught his brother, and he KILLED his brother! still haunted to this day, he has resorted to a life of violence

too funny!...

perhaps he is a 'GOODFELLAS' type of pistol !

:uzi: :hmm4:



i know its a toss up...
so many report having good experiences w/ their 'pairs'... was really surprised by this one... that damsel was the first marine fish we ever had!...

regards

[cristhiam]

How big do pistols get? or how long do the live? I have one that is about 3.5" +/- and besides going on a shooting spree once in a while in the middle of the night messed up my DSB by digging everywhere and causing it to partially crash I think sine my nitrates are high. It has not killed anything yet problably snails here and there but, I have not lose a fish. It used to be about 1" when I got it. It's nearly impossible to catch it.

[K' Family Reef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11795802#post11795802 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by cristhiam
How big do pistols get? or how long do the live? I have one that is about 3.5" +/- and besides going on a shooting spree once in a while in the middle of the night messed up my DSB by digging everywhere and causing it to partially crash I think sine my nitrates are high. It has not killed anything yet problably snails here and there but, I have not lose a fish. It used to be about 1" when I got it. It's nearly impossible to catch it.


tell me about it - nearly impossible to catch
i had to take out a lot of LR - like literally around 100pounds (all LR on the left side of tank)...

as far as life span?
no idea.

good luck!

regards

[K' Family Reef]

actually decided to give this pistol away
w/ a ***WARNING*** to whoever it ends up with

very doubtful the lfs will pass on the warning
to anyone who purchases it so decided to just give it away to someone who is familar w/ the history of this particular specimen...

now time to dig him out of the 30gal its in -
should be about as fun as it was digging him out of his original home in the 125 it came from.

regards

[flameangel88]

I'll take the pistol off you if you're in NYC/NJ (Middlesex). Oh, you are welcome to see its new home before you decide to turn it over to me.

[K' Family Reef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11796872#post11796872 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by flameangel88
I'll take the pistol off you if you're in NYC/NJ (Middlesex). Oh, you are welcome to see its new home before you decide to turn it over to me.

hey Flameangel88
too bad you werent closer!... we already have someone interested locally...

regards
:rollface:

[flameangel88]

Not a problem. Thanks. I feel your pain in getting the little bugger out.