Chaeto Experiment

[thuddly]

I would like to do a little chaeto experiment.

I want to setup a 75 gallon tank that I have and start with a handful of chaeto.

No fish will be placed in the aquarium.

I am not a chemist - far from it so please don't flame me.

:D :D :D :D :D


I have a few questions:

1 - What additives should I dose to get maximum growth?

2 - Where could I obtain nitrate and phosphate additives? Ebay?

3 - What is the lowest temperature I could have in this tank since it will only contain chaeto?

4 - What temperature will give me the best growth? (I assume higher right?)


Just know I would like to grow chaeto in a separate tank without fish and need to know what additives will get me the best/fastest growth .

The tank will obviously have good lighting and flow.

I would also appreciate any other tips you can give.

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Nitrate or ammonia for iron

phosphate for phosphorus.

iron,

and that's likely about it. :)

Household plant fertilizers will likely work, if cost is a concern.

I do not know the temperature requirements for growth.

[thuddly]

Wow, lucky me! (to have you reply first)

Cost isn't a concern, I was thinking about purchasing straight nitrate and phosphorus if possible.

Forgive me for my ignorance but I found the following on ebay - will it work?
http://cgi.ebay.com/Potassium-Nitrate-KNO3-10LBS-99-9-pure-crystal-form_W0QQitemZ320219872375QQihZ011QQcategoryZ20540QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Seachems Flourish (for phosphorus):
http://cgi.ebay.com/Seachem-Flourish-Phosphorus-Flourish-Phosphorus-250ML_W0QQitemZ260215424497QQihZ016QQcategoryZ82250QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQ_trksidZp1638.m118.l1247 QQcmdZViewItem

I would be monitoring the levels of course.

I have an iron additive already by Kent.

Would plan fertilizer be a good idea though? I wouldn't want anything bad to leech into an aquarium when/if the chaeto is harvested.

[thuddly]

Another question:

What's the maximum amount (ppm) of nitrate/phosphate/iron chaeto could handle?

As I said I am looking for max growth however I dont want to kill it.

[Percula9]

It will use the nutrients as needed.

[thuddly]

Are those ebay items a good idea? Specifically the nitrate? Or is that not the correct type?

[a2fire2i]

Are you going to quit your day job, and invest all of your money and become a chaeto farmmer?

[thuddly]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11969591#post11969591 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by a2fire2i
Are you going to quit your day job, and invest all of your money and become a chaeto farmmer?

Maybe. lol

Is this the correct nitrate?
http://cgi.ebay.com/Potassium-Nitrate-KNO3-10LBS-99-9-pure-crystal-form_W0QQitemZ320219872375QQihZ011QQcategoryZ20540QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[emoore]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11969775#post11969775 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by thuddly
Maybe. lol

Is this the correct nitrate?
http://cgi.ebay.com/Potassium-Nitrate-KNO3-10LBS-99-9-pure-crystal-form_W0QQitemZ320219872375QQihZ011QQcategoryZ20540QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

I use KNO3 for my freshwater planted tank. I assume that KNO3 would be ok for saltwater macro algae but not certain.

[ChemLife]

A greenhouse or hydroponics store will most likely get you all that you need:

nitrate/ammonia source for nitrogen as
1) potassium nitrate KNO3 as mentioned above
2) ammonium chloride NH4Cl - most high end places will have this as nitrogen fertilizer
3) ammonium nitrate NH4NO3 - again as fertilizer, but if you start asking for a sizable quantity or high purity, expect questions (it is the main component to "fertilizer bombs"); the alternative source is take the cold compress packs, cut them open and use the pelts/spheres inside, that's the NH4NO3 (purity may be an issue)
4) drug store or old style deli - for ammonium carbonate
(NH4)2CO3 or "smelling salts" (this would be my last choice)

phosphorus source for phosphate
1) sodium phosphate (Na3PO4) or potassium phosphate (K3PO4) - check the phophorus fertilizers at a hydroponics place. They could also offer Na2HPO4 or NaH2PO4 which would be fine too
2) phosphoric acid H3PO4 - might be carried in a dilute solution by hydroponic places, 5-8% v/v


iron source
1) liquid iron suppliment - again hydroponic places, or contact a lab/chemical supply house to get some iron (III) chloride or ferric chloride, but don't waste your money on anhydrous stuff, the hydrated ferric chloride (3 waters of hydration I recall) is sufficient written as FeCl3 x 3H2O

Hope this helps and I hope the chemistry is clear.

ChemLife

Arrrgghhh!! Why can't I do subscripts here?!?!

[thuddly]

Thank you all for the information, wish me luck.

[sd_schoppert]

Post pictures when you have it up.

[jdieck]

I ran sort of an experiement in my 55 gal refugium for growth rate.
Tumbling vs not tumbling
High vs low light
High flow vs low flow

All other things fairly equal other than certain localized temperature difference when using MH the fastest growth was with no tumbling (But flip over once a week and using high lighting 10 K 175 watt MH vs 110 w 10K PC. There is also indication that slightly higher temperature (MH lighting) may be in part accountable for the fastest growth under MH.
Neither high nor slow flow but medium was optimal.
The groth ratio was close to 3:1

Troughout the test which lasted about two months the nitrates and phosphate readings were not detectable and no iron supplement was used but I suspect some might have come from the GFO which I was also testing at the time using a 3X the recommended dose.
The water from the main tank (225 gal) drained first to the refugium before being skimmed+ Ozone and filtered with AC, Purigen, GFO and UV.

In this pic on the left left was tumbling (rather spinning) and the right was not you can see the difference in growth after two weeks starting with about the same amounth by weight.
http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/18470chaeto1.JPG

Here you can see the setup of the lighting. moving the lamps to get different combinations og tumbling and high light, tumbling low light, non tumbling high and low light and the powerhead used to create different flow conditions.
http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/18470chaeto2.JPG