Cleanup Crew... Do I Need More?

[dismayed]

I have a 90 gallon recently set up tank (2-3 months old) that I hope to have lots of both fish and reefs in some day. I was wondering if you could look at the cleanup crew I have in place and give me any suggestions on what else I should be adding? Thanks.

100 lbs. of premium live rock
20 lbs ? of live sand
About 850 gallons per hour of flow from a Korallia powerhead; I'm considering doubling that soon
Basic filtration, no skimmer yet but I plan to add one at 6 months

1 large sand-sifting starfish
1 red thorny starfish
12 HUGE turbo snails
12 nassarious snails (small and medium sized)
6 red legged crabs
1 coral-banded shrimp
1 cleaner shrimp

[tspors]

Go to
http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/scateg.cfm?pCatId=420
You will see a good recomendation for your tank size.

[papagimp]

Personal preference, I'd go a little more rock, definatly more sand.

Definatly need more flow, I got over twice that in a 75g and it's not enough. I would say don't wait 6 months, get a skimmer ASAP.

Livestock, research the reasons you should not have a sandsifting starfish. Not a good choice or responsible choice.
Not sure on the red thorny starfish, but check on those as well, many/most starfish are NOT reef safe.

other specimens that would cause concern for me, the large tubors can wreck havoc knocking frags over, and the coral banded shrimps just tick me off, had one that wouldn't stop killing mushrooms in my tank. Best of luck with him. :D

Can't stress enough doing your own research prior to spending money on something that's going to harm your system rather than help (like the starfish)

[dismayed]

Papagimp, let me get on my soap box a moment.

By this time I have read literally a thousand pages of very expensive books that I have purchased, been to too many websites to count, and talked to far too many people, yes even at COMAS meetings, to count. The most frustrating thing about this hobby is that NO ONE AGREES on anything.

Do a quick Google search on Echinaster Echinophorus. Literally half of the websites say the star is reef safe, and half say it isn't. My own personal experience with my other tank is that I haven't had any problems with the one I have had in it for at least a year now. Sure maybe it will mature and that will be a problem, I don't know. But apparently a lot of people, including aquarium store owners, don't seem to have a good answer for that either.

The same is true of just about any topic. Go take a poll of local aquariasts that have been in the hobby a long time, or even own a LFS. It is *amazing* to me how many of them don't even have QT tanks and have seemingly rationalized explanations on why. Go ask about clean up crews like I have and you will get the same mixed answers.

Go to authoritative books on fish and what do you see? "Feed three times daily." Ask anyone local how often you should be feeding your fish and it is always "every other day."

The marine aquarium hobby today reminds me a lot of computers as a hobby 15-20 years ago... there are a lot of "experts" but not many Experts.

I have done as much pre-research as I possibly can stomach at this point. I'm open to suggested reading sources but honestly I am sure I will find more conflicting viewpoints on absolutely everything.

Honestly that is why I often post here, just to get a sampling of what people are really doing out in the field.

I do appreciate your comments.

[tspors]

Touché

[petoonia]

The problem with sand sifting star is that they eat the beneficial life out of your sand bed. Once they wipe out the life in the sand bed they tend to starve to death. This can take up to 18 months to happen.

Personally I wouldn't trust the other star, if half of the sites say its not reef safe, I would avoid it just to be on the safe side. Since you dont have any corals yet you dont have to be too concerned, but I would consider removing it before you add any corals.

I have 1 large turbo that has been in my tank almost 2 years the thing is huge. If it were me I would take out about 10 of them, and get more of a variety of snails. I like trochus, astrea, cerith, regular turbo, and margaritas.

i wouldn't add any more nassarius for now, since the tank is new and your not feeding fish yet.

I would add a second cleaner shrimp, since they tend to be more active in pairs.

I would also add another type of hermit, they are much more effective when you have different types. I like the dwarf zebras, dwarf blue legs, or scarlet hermits. Be sure to add plenty of empty shells for them to move into as they grow.

Good luck with your new tank!!!