Circulation for 1100 gallon display?

[garrettjohnson]

Hi, I have just recieved my 2x prop. tanks, and am planning to order my display this week. Prop tanks each measure 96inx48in.x12in. and are rimless with low-iron glass. I need help deciding on water movement needed for my display which will measure 144x48x37in.? Should I drill the bottom and back and use sequence hammerheads on a Closed loop system with OM'S 4-ways? Or should I go the tunze route? The overflows will be externall and mounted on both sides of the display. Any help would be appreciated! Thanks

[snulma1]

I would prefer the closed loop with the OM 4-way. I know that Tunzes are fairly slim, but I like the cleaner less intrusive look to a tank.

[carman9941]

on a tank that big I dont think tunze would look bad at all,a few 6301,s would be very nice

[SDguy]

I'd go with internal pumps like tunzes on a tank that big...they will be negligible in appearance, IMO (and I hate internal pumps :) )

[JCTewks]

my thoughts....

If you are going to do a system this large, all of these details should be planned out WELL in advance of ordering the tank....not, Oh, i forgot, i'm ordering the tank this week, do I need any holes, and how many? JMO, I would have EVERYTHING planned out 6mo-1yr in advance of doing this.

I'm not trying to be mean, just realistic.....
I hope you have some of the other aspects of the tank figured out by know too. Like, how are you going to heat/cool the tank, how are you going to deal with the humidity created by that much surface area of 78deg water, do you have enough electrical supplied to power a system this size, what skimmer will you be using...is it a custom skimmer...if so, you're prob looking at min a 2month lead time, do you have the floors supported below the tank well wnough that the house won't cave in, etc... These are just a few of the thoughts/designs that go into planning a tank this size....I hope you've done the rest of your homework better than the flow question. BTW, flow is as important if not moreso than lighting and filtration.

Happy reefing :D

[garrettjohnson]

the tank is not going to be "thrown together", I have done extensive planning for the past two years +, the only dilema I'm having is with regards to water movement. The tank will be an in-wall display, I have already had a steel stand fabricated by a local welder which would support a tank if neccessary, The tank will have a dedicated fish room measuring 30ft.x20ft. Lighting will consist of 12 400watt Lumenarc's with a mixture of 14k and 10k coralvue bulbs with twelve 48in. T-5's for supplementing. Calcium reactor will be a myreefcreations with an 80LB media capacity. Skimmer used will be an ETSS 3000 which utlizes four becketts. The display will be plumbed with two 120 gallon refugiums (one mangroves, the other for copepods and algae). I have two frag tanks, each measuring 96in.x48in.x12in with six 250 watt lumenarcs on each and T-5's. Sump is a 240 gallon long. THe system will be controlled and monitored using two GHL/Profliux units, one dedicated to lighting. I have two 300 gallon rubbermaid stock tanks stacked, the top is for RO/DI only and the bottom is mixed SW. The system is all on its own dedicated electrical system. A tradewinds 2 H.P chiller will be used for cooloing as well as a ducted vent directly overhead the tank as well as one under to keep the ballasts cool. I am also installing a commercial dehumidifier I purchased ffrom a local building supply store. Let me know what you think. I'm looking for constructive criticism.

[garrettjohnson]

the stand would support two 1100 gallon tanks if need be. All two inch steel.

[DanInSD]

I would go internal as well, for any number of reasons -- water movement, energy savings, water heating, controllability.

Good luck on this monster. Question -- why make the prop tanks out of low-iron glass? These are going to be in the fish room, right? Or is it "because you can"?

Dan

[Paulairduck]

you use low iron glass on your frag tanks when you want top of line and cost, is not a consideration, the system sounds awesome.

[JCTewks]

Garrett, it sounds like you've got it all figured out...well, other than flow. I wasn't trying to come off as condescending....I've just seen too many "i'm building a new 3000gal system...PLEASE help me do this" threads from folks who have no idea how to maintain a reef, moreless a HUGE reef. I was just making sure that you weren't "one of those".

It sounds as though money is not a huge issue for you....if that is the case, go with tunze or vortech for your flow. The intank prop pumps will use less energy, require no drilling, and can be moved/changed as the tank matures and flow needs change.

Multiple barracuda's on OM's is the other option....and not a bad one. Only prob IMO with a CL is that as the tank matures and flow needs increase, you end up having to add internal prop pumps/powerheads anyway.

There are many options in the prop pump market, but the tunzes seem to be the most reliable and are easily controlled to create "random" and changing flow patterns for night, day, occasional storms, and feeding.

[USC-fan]

option 1

do 3 vortech on each side and maybe 4 along the back of the tank.

Shouldn't take up much room and give you a lot of flow.

If you do 10, you will have 30,000gph plus return[?] so right there you have 30x+. Also the VorTech Wireless Wave Driver controls up to 10 pumps.

http://www.ecotechmarine.com/products/products.htm

How thick is your glass? I believe these pumps will not work on anything larger than 3/4".

option 2

You could go with 4x TUNZE Turbelle stream 6301[8,000gph each] and a Multicontroller 7095.

http://www.tunze.com/149.html?&L=1&C=US&user_tunzeprod_pi1%5Bpredid%5D=-infoxunter025

-bigger than the vortechs.
+cheaper
+you will have more flow
+less powerheads in the tank.

[viggen]

Would doing 1 or 2 hammerheads with penductor/eductors work? Possibly a combination of that & the vortech/tunze would work??

[sjm817]

I would suggest you post this question in the Tunze Forum (http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=92) and see what Roger recommends.

[dsanfilippo]

I have to second (third...?) the Tunze route, I would recommend using the AC III with the aqua surf, allowing you to control a minimum of 4 units, and someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I think you can split that to contol 8 pumps even.
My reasons for Tunze include...
1.) Less tank penetrations and piping outside the tank.
2.) Energy efficency
3.) Customizeable and adaptable to future needs
4.) Pump failure will not shut down entire circulation ( or at least a large portion of it)

Disadvantages...
1.) Cost ( not sure how it would compare, but probably not much more than closed loops and OM 4 or 8 ways by the time they are plumber and running...cost of bulkheads and piping alone will really add up)
2.) The look inside, if that is a concern. IMO they are only noticed for a few days then they seem to just blend in.
3.) Keeping them all clean and running, not a huge issue for me either.

[tpenn187]

at a local business the owner put in a 1200 gallon display tank that features a combination of different circulation methods. he used tunze, close loop as well as a large plunger surge system. here is a link, http://bnarc.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=1232 i hope he doesnt mind, but you are planning a very simmular setup and i think that this would really help you out. these photos are a little old it has come a long way and is stunning.

[carman9941]

I would also think about tunze wave box, I wouldnt go vortech on a tank that size and I love them, I have 2 on my 120

[garrettjohnson]

THanks for all of your advice, it was all very useful. With regards to flow on the display I believe I am going to use two sequence hammerheads on an OM 4-way Closed loop, as well as four tunzes on a multicontrolller. With regards to the prop tanks I am going to run two tunzes on each with a multicontroller. Let me know what you think.