Filled my tank with tap water....Should I filter before adding salt?

[joem1cha3l]

Just bought a 29g tank to start my salwater experience. I filled the tank with tap water. Should I cycle my water before adding salt or is it ok to just go ahead and add the salt now? I will not be adding liverock for a couple of days but wanted to get my water all straight before hand. Thanks guys. Also calcium, phosphate tests, etc...should I check them of my tap water or will they be inconclusive until I add salt.

[IndoorOcean]

I strongly advise against using the tap water. You will need to use RO/DI water or at least RO. If you don't have an RO unit then go to your LFS to purchase some water. Most LFS will carry RO water for purchase. Usually not too expensive... I think mine charges 75 cents per gallon. You could even go to Wal-Mart and purchase RO or distilled water. I did that when I first set up my 20 gallon 5 years ago. You could probably get by with purchasing RO for all of your future water changes as well with a 29 gallon tank, but in the long run it would save you money to purchase your own RO unit.

HTH

[jdmcivicek9]

what you should do is take the water out...go get some Reverse Osmosis Water and mix the salt and water in a five gallon bucket to around 1.024-1.026 salinity and with the rinsed sand that you bought assuming you bought sand and rinsed of coarse lay a trashbag over the top of it and begin pouring your saltwater into the tank...

[seapug]

if you are using tap there's no reason to test it. You can pretty much be assured the parameters are not what you want.

Go ahead and add the salt and let it run. I'd get the rock in there within a couple days of running it, as the cycle won't start until it's added.

[k9gunner]

Are you doing fish only or reef? If you are going to have any corals or anything reef, dump that water and get RO/DI.

[AquaReeferMan]

I would take the tap water back out first and for most. Go out and get an RO unit or simply fill the tank with distilled water. Trust me, save the future headache and never use tap water for a saltwater tank. Cycling a tank with freshwater is a waste of time and will accomplish nothing. You need the salt in the water to start the build up of any beneficial bactera.

[joem1cha3l]

I plan on cycling the water for a while...There is no cycling that can change my tap water to the parameters I want? Not even a long period of time? I am doing reef by the way.

[HABS#1]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12159412#post12159412 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by joem1cha3l
Just bought a 29g tank to start my salwater experience. I filled the tank with tap water. Should I cycle my water before adding salt or is it ok to just go ahead and add the salt now? I will not be adding liverock for a couple of days but wanted to get my water all straight before hand. Thanks guys. Also calcium, phosphate tests, etc...should I check them of my tap water or will they be inconclusive until I add salt.

Don't get it from teh LFS they usually charge way way more than it is worth. I would reccomend going to your local waterdepot or culligan store and getting the RO water if you are going to it tends to be much much cheaper. Out LFS was 8 dollars for a 5 gal jug and the waterdepot was only 2.45 for 5 gal jugs.

Myself I just use tap water and have had no issues at all but that is my experiance.

[ImprezaSTi]

Many people use tap water and have had success. IMO I think that it is not much of a big deal to use tap water instead of RO.

I have always used tap water and have had no problems. But I will leave a filter in it for a night or two.

[bsagecko]

i use tap with a puri filer on it.....i live in florida and i have a well so i know that there are no phosphates...copper....what i did because i know i couldnt afford an RO and i wanted to do reef is i called my local water tester guy that puts in the really expensive filtration stuff and had him come over one night to test the water since "water anaylsis" was free....i had him test for everything and my water was fine i just dont use hot because then there is a lil copper but with the puri filter thingy there is no copper.........but i had him test everything from ph to iron to tatic acid.........my iron is 0.5 ppm and the tatic acid has no affect on saltwater and since i live in fl my water is already basic and full of calium

[bsagecko]

oh and then my mom told him we werent interested because he was to expensive you should have seen the look on his face it was priceless.........but it was freee......

[NewFish3]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12160041#post12160041 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by ImprezaSTi
Many people use tap water and have had success. IMO I think that it is not much of a big deal to use tap water instead of RO.

I have always used tap water and have had no problems. But I will leave a filter in it for a night or two.

And you have been in this hobby for how long......OH....I see...since nov..2007.....Wow a veterin........So what your saying is that the members here that been doing this for 40 plus years have no clue to what their doing???? You been doing it for 5 months & you have all the answers.

By the way......Please feel free to ask us for help when your tank crashes. No body here wants to see someones tank crash, so please ask questions when it does. We'll do our best to help.

To the guy with the original post. Start by flushing that tap water down the toilet. Get some RO/DI water from your LFS. IF you cant get RO/DI water, at least go to the store & get distilled water. Distilled water will be ok, you can always use RO/DI water after that.

TAP water has to much crap in it to make it taste beter. RO/DI has 98% to 100% of the crap takin out of it, so your starting with good clean water......no crap

[NewFish3]

bsagecko.

In my last few posts, I dont mean to come across as a As*Hol*....But COME ON....if your going to be in this hobby, buy the tools you need to be in this hobby. Get a TDS meter and go test your water the the $10.00 an hour guy tested....There is no way that water tested ok.

DID he test the TDS.....does he even know what TDS is....DO YOU????

The TDS for a tank needs to be 0.0 or close. I would bet you the cost of a plane ticket that your waters TDS is in the 300 to 400 range...By the way I also have a home in Boca Raton...so its not far.

SORRY for the rant........BUT its like....I going to be a skydiver.. but I not going to spend that kind of money for a parachute.

[uglyryder]

that seemed uncalled for....he was just saying what he does, not what should be done. im a newbie but i think you should relax, thats the 2nd post ive read of your's that was in that nature, with the same quote of 40 plus years.

[Patrick12]

If you are gonna plan on a reef tank, then you will be adding some undesirables with tap water. Additionally, most municipal water supplies now use chloramines. These can be neutralized by some of the higher end dechlorinators....like Amquel and Prime...but otherwise take 5-7 days to dissipate. Also, you will be adding phosphates, nitrates, and other heavy metals that will hurt you later. Now if you were doing fish only with LR, then you could probably get away with more, but a reef tank really will need cleaner water than any tap will yield.

All in all, go with RO/DI water...you will be glad you did. If the cost of the water is already causing you a problem, then I would really recommend a waiting period until things improve. The water for maintenance in this hobby will be one of the least of the costs.

Good luck.

[Patrick12]

I have to agree Newfish3. You really don't need to come across the way you did. It is As*Hol* ish behavior that causes many to not post and ask for the help they could use. If you don't have anything constructive to say, then just move on.

[seapug]

To stay on topic-- the chlorine that is probably in your tap water will dissipate within 24 hours. That's not the issue-- the issue is with the Nitrate and Phosphate that is usually very abundant in mosttap water. It won't "gas off" like chlorine.

You may be one of those lucky people who has great tap water, but chances are you aren't. It's not such a big deal when first setting up a tank, but it can cause serious problems down the line if used for topoffs and water changes over time. If you don't use purified water at start up, at least look into investing in an RO unit down the line. It's better water for you and your tank.

[joem1cha3l]

If i were to use the tap water for just the intial start up and then started to insert RO or Distilled water with water changes would this work?

[DGlove904]

i have a 110 gallon tank just add some seachem prime to the tap water and place raw uncooked shrimp into the water to start the cycle.

[george81]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12161078#post12161078 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by uglyryder
that seemed uncalled for....he was just saying what he does, not what should be done. im a newbie but i think you should relax, thats the 2nd post ive read of your's that was in that nature, with the same quote of 40 plus years.

i think he hit the nail right on the head, the truth hurts sometimes. if hobbyists dont know what they are talking about they shouldnt give advice, 5 months of experience and claim "i have never had a problem" and instruct someone to make the same mistake and have the same future headaches is wrong.
thats a big problem with this board it has a ton of good information but double the bad from people who just dont know giving advice.

thats my 2cents

dont use tap water as stated you have too many unwanted items in there that will cause you grief..i.e. nitrates. phosphates, heavy metals, you going to have algae issues, water clarity issues, keeping coral alive. not to mention you re live rock will suck up all the unwanteds and leach them once you switch to pure water source. tap water is not for saltwater, fish only or reef.

[GoingPostal]

Just add some prime and your salt and start the cycle, go get a ro unit and by the time you are adding anything of value you will probably have switched out most of the water anyways. I doubt starting with tap is going to be the end of the world.

[jdmcivicek9]

i started a tank both ways...the first time i used tap water with prime declor for my 55gal and it took forever to get all the params undercontrol let alone all the red slime and hair algae that started growing and im pretty sure it was due to crappy tap water... so for my second tank a 29 gal biocube i started it with ro/di and honestly never had a problem it cycled fast and i havent had to deal with redslime or any type of hair algae so just my .02 if i ever upgrade i will be doing starting out with ro/di no question about it!!

[Lightsluvr]

Yup, just like most other "forums" on the internet, the know-little experts come out and in all their infinite wisdom, give bad advice to the know-nothing folks...

I was a know nothing 9 months ago , but fortunately I read and took to heart advice from the likes of Randy Holmes Farley (see the Chemistry threads here on RC) who really does know what he is talking about. You won't see Randy or any other real expert in saltwater aquariums recommending the use of tap water. Nor will he recommend quick fix chemicals to "purify" water.

You might start your search here: http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=102605

So to the OP...this is a great hobby, but you have to really be careful where your advice is coming from. It's real expensive to take the wrong advice and ruin hundreds of dollars worth of live rock, fish or coral... be very, very careful.

You'd be well served to find a local mentor who has had several years success with saltwater aquaria. Success that you can lay your eyes on...that is much more reliable that conflicting advice like you'll receive here...

Hell, if you can't get people to agree on something basic like H2O, what good is the advice anyway?

JMHO

LL

[ultimatemusky]

Where's demonsp when you need him. You want to see someone on a rant. Avoid headaches go with RO.

[DGlove904]

yeah ro would be better but if your cheap like me then ......

[ultimatemusky]

Even if RO water is bought it is still cheaper than just about anything else you are going to put in the tank so why not start right. Periodic water changes will be minimally expensive per month in a 29 gal. Loss of livestock is considerably more costly.

[DGlove904]

yeah my lfs gives out free ro water

[uncleant]

i filled my 125 gal up using tap water, put some tap water conditioner in there let it run for about a week and then added salt. every thing is fine

[uncleant]

i filled my 125 gal up using tap water, put some tap water conditioner in there let it run for about a week and then added salt. every thing is fine. But now i use RO/DI water for everything else

[Tim the Stick]

I agree that most of your typical city water systems have many things in them that reef systems don't agree with. But if it's the case that ALL reefers MUST use RO/DI, then why does Michigan's largest coral propogator use standard Detroit City water in thier propogation tanks?

Since Tropicorium's coral propogation tanks (about 10 or so of them) are 4 feet deep, 20 feet across, and 30-40 feet long, I asked them how they could RO-DI so much water for changes. They laughed. They have never RO-DI'd any water in any of thier tanks. They "rotate" water. One of the tanks gets a tear down and derocking (pretty much stripped to the liner), then they add ALL fresh TAP water, then salt mix, then that mix gets pumped to all the other tanks and the removed water from the coral tanks gets passed on to the fish tanks, etc. They recycle every drop of water they have and use tap water from a hose to top off every day. I shook in fear. How is this possible? This can't be! You can't grow coral without RO-D water!

I took a few tips from some serious pros that sounded almost insane (per the status quo) and havn't looked back since.

I'm an engineer. To me, time is $$$. Spending any more than 2 hours a week on tank maint. wasn't going to cut it. I needed to reduce my time setting up water changes, make it easier on my body, my reef, and most importantly, my cheque book.

After spending the first 3 years in this hobby in persistant newby-ville, was ready to give reefing up entirely. The cost was astronomical, my RO/DI made me a whopping 15 gallons of water in 19 hours, which when you are putting it into a 20 gallon spare tank means you have to come home from work early or end up with water all over the floor in the basement. And since I did this ALMOST every other week (bi-weekly 15 gallon changes), that meant that 2 days a month I had an RO/DI spillover. Then I had to mix it, air it, let it sit and stir for 3 days while I tested it, blahh blahh blahh. Ohh, and then lug the 5 gallon buckets up stairs.

Enter my introduction to Tropicorium. I asked questions. I listened. I took thier suggestions and tried them. I now am glad I did and havn't looked back since. Here's my water change regiment now:

-Line up 3, 5 gallon buckets with tap water.
-Add reef crystals salt and stir.
-Get a quick salinity check to be "in the ballpark".
-Drop into each bucket an aereating powerhead.
-Go to work.
-Come home from work, check temperature and salinity.
-Adjust. If cold, add hot tap water. If hot, add cold tap water. More salt, etc...
-If within 3 degrees + or - and exactly 1.024 salinity on the refractometer, walk the buckets to the tank. Bring 3 dirty water buckets too.
-Scrape glass with magnetic scraper.
-Put my "fresh water change pump" into the clean bucket.
-Pull my drain hose with a pump on the other end out of the refugium.
-Turn on the the drain pump.
-Turn on the filler pump.
-Wait for 1 minute. Switch buckets. Repeat untill all fresh is in, and all old is out.
-Pull overflow filter sponge and rinse.
-Pull wet-dry filter pad and change/rinse.
-Watch fish. Possibly feed.
-OPTIONAL: Get out the test kit. Test all parameters and decide if anything is high or low, possibly add Aragomite, etc... Seldom do I ever find anything off and havn't added anything but a water change in about 2 months.

Total time: 15 minutes to set up in the AM. 15 minutes to change all water and dump it at night. And a bucket of reef crystals lasts me about 3 months. No RO-DI filters to change, no spills on the basement floor, no spare mixing tanks. No water spilling on the basement floor. Again, no water spilling on the basement floor. It's simple. It's easy. It works for me, works for my fish, and works for my corals.

If like me, you are also doing softies like Mushrooms, Zoos, Plates, etc... you won't find an issue. I've had my yellow Gorgonians going for over a year now with pretty good growth. I scrape Shrooms off the glass. Zoos are like locusts. My plates are almost a foot around and divided once. I started doing this about a year ago, and before this the only thing I succeeded in doing was "maintaining" corals, never before propogating them.

Is Detroit's water just that good? Yes, it's pretty good, but still, by all standards should still be RO-DI'd and I'm not having a problem. Nor are any of the hunderds even thousands of Michigan reeferes around here who aren't RO-DI'ing either.

Is it "better" to RO-DI? Absolutely.
Is it neccessary? Absolutely not.

Food for thought for you there joem1cha3l.

Stick

[ludnix]

I congratulate Tim the Stick for having such good luck with tap water, but I know when I used my local tap water I had algae problems consistently until I switched to RO/DI water.

[jdmcivicek9]

yeah the majority of us have tap water full of chemicals and what not so if you have good tap water more power to ya and your lucky!!but until i get that im keeping with ro/di

[AZDesertRat]

The biggest problem with tap water is inconsistency. It may be fine today but what about tomorrow after the large watermain break down the street, or the change in treatment after that big storm blew though?

You have absolutely no control over tap water quality.

Its not worth the the risk in my mind and I'm a water treatment plant supervisor by profession.

[seapug]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12164953#post12164953 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by AZDesertRat
Its not worth the the risk in my mind and I'm a water treatment plant supervisor by profession.

This is great-- the manager of a municipal water treatment plant won't even use his own product in his tank. Not sure what other testimonial about the quality of tap water you need.

[george81]

tim you re absolutely incorrect with you re its not necessary to ro...how about you try to keep sps alive in you re system...

here is a little proof of the damage tap water can cause.

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=ref=http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1080179

[Tim the Stick]

You are absolutely correct George. I can not keep SPS in my tank. Nor would I want to try with a Queen and an Emperor Angel in a 75. I can however outgrow softies in the time it takes them to lawnmower from one side of the tank to the other. I just let them eat whatever they want. Usualy they don't strip an entire rock, they just munch and move, and thier munching just about keeps up with my overgrowth issues. I just wish they'd eat the corals that stick to the glass instead of the stuff on the rocks.

He has a 29 gallon starter reef. I don't think he'll be ANYWHERE near capable of supporting SPS for a while. If he would have started this thread with "Hey, I just got my custom wall inset, bottom drilled 300 gallon with enough metal halides to be a second sun going..." I would have said YES. Yes, you need to RO/DI. But it's his first tank. It's 29 gallons. Not what I'd call an SPS tank.

It likely has insufficient light, insufficient filtration, and insufficient everything else you need to grow SPS. In this case, running an RO/DI isn't neccessary unless he's pulling water from a well. If he's pulling water from a well, or has lousy city tap water, then yes, RO/DI. If his tap water is as good as Detroit's, don't bother. Grow all the fish, softies, and purple coraline you want on tap water alone.

I try to tell newcomers this:
Save your $$$ and invest it in a good upgrade for the future if this is something you find that you enjoy. Once you have decided if reefing IS or ISN'T for you, then you can upgrade your equipment to a more sizeable and stable environment and purchase equipment that will give more satisfaction in the long run. When you start off, start simple. Do things like get your salinity correct every time you do a water change. Don't worry about testing for Ca, Mg, K etc... untill you can add a 5 gallon bucket of water with salt in it and not kill your fish. If you can do that, AND LIKE IT, then step up and get a good tank. Get good equipment. Take your time. Set it up right. Enjoy it.

It's exactly what I'm doing. I found a GREAT Art Deco bar made in 1938 constructed out of Tigerwood and glass. It's 24 feet long, 8 feet high, and will come about 28 inches off the wall. And has 4 mirror sections that are 48x30. 2 are broken. Hey, what's 48x18x30? A 90 gallon tall! Yup, you guessed it, 1/2 the bar will be "bar", the other half will be aquariums. And in order to afford it, I'm skipping the RO/DI for now in leiu of a black marble countertop. Once that's in, and the drilled tanks are in, and the sumps are in, the UV sterilizer, the calcium reactor, etc... then I'll get my RO/DI and start these tanks off right so they COULD be capable of supportng SPS corals. One will be FOWLR and house my 2 coral biters and some 'shrooms etc, the other will be a nice reef with whatever I want in it.

And at that point, the effort of RO/DI will be well spent.

Stick

[AZDesertRat]

Starting from the very begining with RO/DI is a much wiser choice. If contaminants never get introduced to begin with you can count them out as possible problem sources in the future.
I recommend RO/DI as the starting point always. If you cannot afford to provide the best environment for your tank and inhabitants the maybe you should not be considering the reef hobby, that sounds harsh but it needs to be done right from the beginning. Lay the correct groundwork.

[Patrick12]

What is the reason you (the originator of this thread or anyone else for that matter) would NOT want to use RO/DI water?

I think that is the real heart of the matter rather than all the benefits of the RO/DI. I mean really, why would the sale production and use of these water filters be so widespread and "standard" if you could really get away without them?

The cost in money and aggravation will certainly make you regret the use of tap water.

Also, chloramines and chlorine are tow different chemicals. Most municipal water supplies use the chloramines....which do do dissipate in 24 hours. They can remain for 7-8 days in some instances. One of the reasons for their use is because of this fact. This makes them more devastating to those of use who grew up just letting our FW tanks run for 24 hours and good to go....no so nowadays with chloramines. That is why prime should be used to neutralize these things......if you are enough of a gambler to try tap water.

[tundra1000]

Wow, a lot of debate here. I know very little about salt water chemistry, that is why I am reading this thread. I do though have some common sense. After reading all these posts I can say that-
Tap water works for some but does have a large element of risk
RO/DI water- you know your all set
If I am going to spend the time and money on a saltwater reef you can be sure I am going to go on the side of caution. You can pick up a RO unit for under $100. That is nothing compared to livestock, sps frags $$$.
Start it off right- One thing I have learned from these forums is that reefing is not something to be taken lightly!

[RJeremy]

Get your hands on RO/DI anyway you can. Beg, borrow, bribe someone with a setup, whatever it takes. Be careful after adding your salt, also. Salt is very caustic and needs time to "settle." Mix it up with a good airstone or venturi pump for a day before you add it to the tank. I know I'm paranoid, but I haven't had a problem yet.

[coralnub]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12160149#post12160149 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by NewFish3
And you have been in this hobby for how long......OH....I see...since nov..2007.....Wow a veterin........So what your saying is that the members here that been doing this for 40 plus years have no clue to what their doing???? You been doing it for 5 months & you have all the answers.

By the way......Please feel free to ask us for help when your tank crashes. No body here wants to see someones tank crash, so please ask questions when it does. We'll do our best to help.

To the guy with the original post. Start by flushing that tap water down the toilet. Get some RO/DI water from your LFS. IF you cant get RO/DI water, at least go to the store & get distilled water. Distilled water will be ok, you can always use RO/DI water after that.

TAP water has to much crap in it to make it taste beter. RO/DI has 98% to 100% of the crap takin out of it, so your starting with good clean water......no crap

This is just in mean spirits. Are YOU the one with 40 years experience? How about you let the experienced people talk for themselves and stop just parroting what you're told.

[wiscsaltwater]

So much of this hobby is about control, controling parameters, elements, lighting, filtration, all of this you can control, it might take thousands of dollars but you CAN control it. That being said, yes, i will concede that SOME, very few, but some areas have tapwater that can be suitable for SOME types of saltwater branches, however, i would wager to say 90% of US tapwater has trace elements in it undesirable to the hobby.

lets say you live in one of the blessed areas where you can get away with it. There isnt a municipality in the world whos water system does not fluxuate, a broken line 10 miles away can put sediment in the water system, a valve on the chlorinator can stick and dump in too much. My point is even if you live in a blessed area you still Cant control the water source, why on earth would someone whos serious in this hobby even think about risking the single most important element to something they cannot control, when complete control is a couple hundred dollars away or less.

With time and knowledge and patience and money Everything in this hobby can be controlled, why risk hundredds, thousands of dollars of livestock to a municipal water system.

Can you get by with tapwater: yes
Should you: if at all possible NO

If you dont have the money to invest in even a cheap RO unit then wait, read, learn about the hobby until you can.

[george81]

well put wiscsaltwater ,

[george81]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12172129#post12172129 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Tim the Stick
You are absolutely correct George. I can not keep SPS in my tank. Nor would I want to try with a Queen and an Emperor Angel in a 75. I can however outgrow softies in the time it takes them to lawnmower from one side of the tank to the other. I just let them eat whatever they want. Usualy they don't strip an entire rock, they just munch and move, and thier munching just about keeps up with my overgrowth issues. I just wish they'd eat the corals that stick to the glass instead of the stuff on the rocks.

He has a 29 gallon starter reef. I don't think he'll be ANYWHERE near capable of supporting SPS for a while. If he would have started this thread with "Hey, I just got my custom wall inset, bottom drilled 300 gallon with enough metal halides to be a second sun going..." I would have said YES. Yes, you need to RO/DI. But it's his first tank. It's 29 gallons. Not what I'd call an SPS tank.

It likely has insufficient light, insufficient filtration, and insufficient everything else you need to grow SPS. In this case, running an RO/DI isn't neccessary unless he's pulling water from a well. If he's pulling water from a well, or has lousy city tap water, then yes, RO/DI. If his tap water is as good as Detroit's, don't bother. Grow all the fish, softies, and purple coraline you want on tap water alone.

I try to tell newcomers this:
Save your $$$ and invest it in a good upgrade for the future if this is something you find that you enjoy. Once you have decided if reefing IS or ISN'T for you, then you can upgrade your equipment to a more sizeable and stable environment and purchase equipment that will give more satisfaction in the long run. When you start off, start simple. Do things like get your salinity correct every time you do a water change. Don't worry about testing for Ca, Mg, K etc... untill you can add a 5 gallon bucket of water with salt in it and not kill your fish. If you can do that, AND LIKE IT, then step up and get a good tank. Get good equipment. Take your time. Set it up right. Enjoy it.

It's exactly what I'm doing. I found a GREAT Art Deco bar made in 1938 constructed out of Tigerwood and glass. It's 24 feet long, 8 feet high, and will come about 28 inches off the wall. And has 4 mirror sections that are 48x30. 2 are broken. Hey, what's 48x18x30? A 90 gallon tall! Yup, you guessed it, 1/2 the bar will be "bar", the other half will be aquariums. And in order to afford it, I'm skipping the RO/DI for now in leiu of a black marble countertop. Once that's in, and the drilled tanks are in, and the sumps are in, the UV sterilizer, the calcium reactor, etc... then I'll get my RO/DI and start these tanks off right so they COULD be capable of supportng SPS corals. One will be FOWLR and house my 2 coral biters and some 'shrooms etc, the other will be a nice reef with whatever I want in it.

And at that point, the effort of RO/DI will be well spent.

Stick

yeah Tim, so instead of starting to steer him in the right direction and with the correct water source and correcting any equip mistakes assuming he has any you just send him up to fail because of the size of his tank and the fact its a starter reef? what if this is all this guy could afford and has dreams of a beautiful 29 gallon reef tank? how is it that a 300 gallon reef differs from a 29 gallon reef? if the 300 you would say hey use rodi why not on the 29 gallon? i am sure they both have the same objective..a successful reef. how do you know that he does not want to keep sps or will in the future?
you re logic is completely wrong. sorry sounds like you re back paddling a little.

sorry but you re one of those guys i referred to by saying if you re dont know what you re talking about dont give advice and have other people make the mistakes you re making.

btw a emperor angel fish requires a min of 100 gallons you re tank is too small for that fish. be more responsible and research you re animals prior to purchase. This is a living animals that has needs respect it as such.
from www.marinedepotlive.com

Imperator Angel (Juv) - Pomacanthus imperatorAlso known as: Imperator - Changing, Emperor Angel
Maximum Size: the Pomacanthus imperator grows up to 16 inches.
General Size Specifications: small 2 to 3; inches; medium 3 to 4; inches; Sizes may vary slightly due to availability.
Minimum Tank Size: The Imperator Angel (Juv) prefers a tank of at least 100 gallons with plenty of places to hide & swim.
Diet: The Pomacanthus imperator is a omnivore and likes to eat veggies, meats, and angel preparations, sponge, algae.
Level of Care: The Imperator Angel (Juv) is a medium maintenance fish.
Minimum Tank Size: The Imperator Angel (Juv) prefers a tank of at least 100 gallons with plenty of places to hide & swim.

[SkyPapa]

[QUOTE]<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12160149#post12160149 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by NewFish3
[B]And you have been in this hobby for how long......OH....I see...since nov..2007.....Wow a veterin........

Don't be so quick in assuming how long a person has been keeping salt water by looking at their RC join date.
I have been on RC since 2000 but re-registered when my email addy changed. Other long term SW fans may have just found RC.
Many people my age don't even have a computer at home.

I also have been keeping SW for 40 years.
Up until the last 10 years or so, and with the advent of the internet, a RODI system was prohibitivly expensive and the info on them and other SW practices were only sparsely available. Remember books?

I used tap water for years and kept lots of fish and inverts with an undergravel filter and a HOB with carbon and floss.
Granted, no SPS, but they weren't for sale much anyway.
I did have some hard coral I picked up while diving in the Gulf of Mexico and they survived,

I have used RODI for about 10 years now and would never go back to tapwater, but it IS possible to be successful with it in some cases.

OK, rant off.

[Patrick12]

If the point hasn't been made by this point and the original question answered......then it never will.

This one needs a fork now.