BeanAnimal's Silent overflow question - Help Please!

[LJA]

I will try to summarize this as best I can because I just wrote about a page and a half and ended up loosing it because my internet at work cut out for a second (Damn wireless air card).


Anyway, I am applying the concept of BeanAnimal's silent overflow to my 55Gallon build. Those of you who know BeanAnimal and his wealth of information particularly in this idea he came up with know that its a great idea. I'm basically doing everything exactly the same with just a few slight modifications, and thats where my questions lie. (or is it lay?) :confused:

For reference, BeanAnimal's build:

Link here (http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=1310585&perpage=25&highlight=silent%20overflow&pagenumber=1)


Basic Layout of what I'm doing:

[] Concept - Will be exactly the same as how BeanAnimal did his.

[] My drain PVC will be 1" Bulkheads adapted to 1.5" PVC. But instead of having the PVC run all the way down to my sump, I will have rubber tubing at the end so that I can easily move the lines to any compartment I wish. Is this ok, or will it make more noise?

[] My return will be implemented by either a MAG 7 or 9.5 (which would be better?) Should I consider a higher flow or different type of pump? Also, The return line will be 1" PVC with some flexible directional tubing I got from Dr. Foster Smith.


Do my flow rates look ok for my specified return pump and return line size?

I'm sure I will have some more questions later but thanks for your help! and thank you BeanAnimal for sharing your information with everyone.

Please help me get past these few questions! Thanks!

[runningstix]

mag 7 or mag 9 seems a bit overkill for a 55 return.

I am planning a 58 oceanic with his overflow system and am going with a mag 5 or quiet one 3000.

Just my opinion.

[LJA]

It is my understanding that the rate of flow is dependent of the return pump. Meaning that the drain pipes will only drain as much water as the return pump pumps into the DT up to the maximum diameter of the drain pipe. Is this right?


So if thats the case, then hypothetically, I could use a Rio 600 as the return pump and it would work fine right?

Will the drain be any more or less noisy in this situation depending on what pump I use?

Also, the return line diameter doesn't matter because it will just effect the water pressure out of the return line correct?

I may be completely wrong but I'm making these assumptions based partially on what I've researched and common sense.


Thanks.

[runningstix]

I am not saying that it wont work. I believe the most effective turnover for a sump/refugium is 4-6 times.

[coralfragger101]

I don't believe your choice of return pumps will have any bearing on the noise level through your overflow. That being said, I agree with runningstix that those pumps (at least the 9) would be overkill. You shouldn't attempt to have ALL of your flow come from the return pump. 4-6 x turnover rate is more than sufficient. The tank itself probably needs more circulation than this but that is where powerheads or a closed loop system comes into play.

The rubber tubing on the end of your overflow pipes will be fine.

[GIJOE007]

agreed with all comments to this point, I have a mag12 on my 65 as my return and its way over kill...I have it throttled back to about %15-25 using a ball valve on the return. The key is to have a slow flow through your sump to export unwanted nutrients (4-6 times as mentioned above). I've been looking to change out my return pump because of the over kill, I may use it to create a closed loop instead.

[LJA]

Thats good to hear, I will probably use a mag 7 then for the return pump. I think my biggest concern for now is drilling the three holes in my tank. I will update next week when my saw holes come in and I attempt the drill.

Thanks for the help.

[The0wn4g3]

The return pump required is mostly dependant on the head pressure, though. If you have a Mag-Drive 5 running at say 4ft vertical with 2 90's and a ball valve, you'll only be hitting about 280gph. That's equivalent to a maxi-jet 1200...
It also depends on what type sump/refugium you'll be running. Bio-balls can take some very high flow rates and still be effective, so in that case more is better. When it comes to refugiums, from the recent articles I've read it seems the myth that flow should be much slower that it is through a typical sump are fading. Higher flow rates will cause chaeto algae to roll more, causing faster and more balanced "balled" growth which will export more nutrients. Also, if you are planning a DSB in your refugium flow isn't much of a problem if it is setup correctly.
Skimmer will be dependent on the pump, so flow isn't an issue.
Go with a Mag-Drive 7, it'll have enough power to get about 1/2 across the 55, throw a koralia or such on the other end, and you're in business.

Good luck with drillin' those holes! Nerve racking stuff man =0

[BeanAnimal]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12878333#post12878333 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by GIJOE007
agreed with all comments to this point, I have a mag12 on my 65 as my return and its way over kill...I have it throttled back to about %15-25 using a ball valve on the return. The key is to have a slow flow through your sump to export unwanted nutrients (4-6 times as mentioned above). I've been looking to change out my return pump because of the over kill, I may use it to create a closed loop instead.

I do not agree with this in terms of a blanket statement.

The main detractions from a high flow sump are:

1) It takes a large pump and that same wattage would provide MORE flow from a closed loop.

2) most overflow setups produce a large amount of bubbles in the sump, my setup does not produce bubbles.


There are plenty of advantages to a high flow sump also. It is a misconception that "low flow" sumps and/or refugiums perform better than "high flow" setups.

Each setup is different and the flow requirements are dependent on MANY variables.

I can't stand the look of "power heads" in the tank. I have no problem spending a few extra Watts to derive more display flow by using a larger return pump, if it keeps power heads out of the tank. Sometimes drilling (or drilling MORE holes) is not an option, so a closed loop does not fit the needs of every tank.


I also like VERY LARGE sumps that benefit from a much higher turnover.

Anyway, the MAG 7 or 9.5 is certainly suitable for the overflow setup and capacity. The flexible hoses will work just fine with one exception. The open channel standpipe needs to be a fairly straight shot. If it runs horizontal, the water will backup and cause gurgling.

[LJA]

Anyway, the MAG 7 or 9.5 is certainly suitable for the overflow setup and capacity. The flexible hoses will work just fine with one exception. The open channel standpipe needs to be a fairly straight shot. If it runs horizontal, the water will backup and cause gurgling.

I think I might try the 9.5 just for the reason of wanting a high flow sump/fuge as well as minimizing powerheads in the DT. As for the open channel, I have not yet built my sump and a lot of the design of that will depend on this plumbing system.

I'm not doing anything else or buying any other equipment until I drill the glass though... if amazon.com ever ships them :rolleyes:


And yes, drilling is nerve racking especially since this is my first time! :eek:

[BeanAnimal]

Just take your time and use plenty of water. The worst thing you can do is force the bit (especially at the end) or let the drill slant off of plumb (it can bind the saw in the cut and break the glass).

[LJA]

Just attempted the drill, practiced about 10 times on a sheet of glass, perfect every time. Went to drill the tank and it shattered into 100,000,000 pieces.


Damn sides were tempered.

[coralfragger101]

That's not cool.

You didn't check first?

[crsswift70]

You drilled a tempered tank. Where did you drill? I did a 10 gal a bit ago and when it shattered, it scared the mess out of me. Sounded like a gun shot. nevermind, i see "sides". Sorry man :(

[rhoptowit]

was about to say arent all standard sized 55 gallons tempered on all sides.....sorry about tank shattering.

[BeanAnimal]

Good excuse to step up to a 75 or 90...

[LJA]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12909545#post12909545 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by BeanAnimal
Good excuse to step up to a 75 or 90...


Thats the only bright side to this,

Also, I only lost $40 on the tank. It wasn't in the best shape but would have looked brand new with a canopy on it.

I'm now either going to go with a 90 or 120 I think.

[LJA]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12907486#post12907486 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by crsswift70
You drilled a tempered tank. Where did you drill? I did a 10 gal a bit ago and when it shattered, it scared the mess out of me. Sounded like a gun shot. nevermind, i see "sides". Sorry man :(


Yes it was incredibly loud.