Alkalinity and Calcium

[rtaylors3]

Had my water tested the other day and he said my alkalinity was a little low and calcium was really high. The tank has only be up for two weeks but I have 100 lbs of live rock full of coraline algae (came from someone elses established tank) so I was adding purple up once a day. Is that why the calcuim was high?

I got some B-Ionic calcium buffer system that comes with the two components but I got to looking at it and the first bottle is for the alkalinity and the second is the calcium. The directions say to use them together but I already have too much calcium. Do I just use the first bottle for the alkalinity? Would that be a problem?

[cveverly]

Yep, Purple Up will do that.

I would not add anything else until things balance out. Do a couple water changes and then if you need to add anything go from there.

[rtaylors3]

should I only add the alkalinity component? Right now my alkalinity is at 3 meg/L but I want o keep coral so it should be a bit higher right?

[jbc123]

Shouldn't dose a tank with anything except maybe a bacteria jumpstart until it's completely cycled.

Calcium and alkalinity are tied together, so you need to be careful. The last thing you want is a snowstorm that kills all life in your tank.

[stingythingy45]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13358326#post13358326 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by rtaylors3
should I only add the alkalinity component? Right now my alkalinity is at 3 meg/L but I want o keep coral so it should be a bit higher right?

What exactly was a little high on calcium?:confused:

[cveverly]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13358326#post13358326 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by rtaylors3
should I only add the alkalinity component? Right now my alkalinity is at 3 meg/L but I want o keep coral so it should be a bit higher right?

Honestly I would just hold off and not dose anything. The Purple Up has upset the balance between Alk and Ca. After a couple water changes the tank will balance out and you will have a better feel for what the tank needs. Don't just dose and pray it will work out.

[rtaylors3]

Brain fart, I didn't ask. I should be getting my calcium test kit in today.

[stingythingy45]

Don't dose it unless you can test for it.

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I would not dose anything until you get actual numbers for calcium and alkalinity. But I would maintain both right from day 1 as the corralline algae on the rocks will benefit.

I would not recommend Purple Up to boost anything measurable in the tank. It is not a useful calcium and alkalinity supplement. the fine sand in it doesn't dissolve in normal seawater, so it is wasted.

[Kieth71]

You may also want to chk your magnesium lvls as well.

[rtaylors3]

I considered checking the magnesium.

"But I would maintain both right from day 1 as the corralline algae on the rocks will benefit." -that is what I wanted to do. I would hate for it to suffer due to an imbalance while I wait.

[rtaylors3]

I thought magnesium got depleted over time? That wouldn't be the case with it only being up for 2 wks would it?

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

If you start with Instant Ocean and do not supplement, magnesium is low on day 1. :)

[Kieth71]

I chked my mag and it was at 600 or so..I have a new tank going on 2 weeks and i have live rock from an established aquarium so never really saw a cycle.I am currently working on rasing my magnesium up to the proper lvl and after that it will be maintained.I am no expert bye any means but i believe it is very possible it could be low..would not hurt to get a test kit and chk it.

[jbc123]

Coralline shouldn't 'suffer' with freshly mixed water and water changes. It takes time to grow and some magic snake-oil isn't going to propagate it overnight.

Nothing should be depleted in 2 weeks anyway, especially in a tank with no corals.

[rtaylors3]

Didn't know that. I will look into it. Thanks

[rtaylors3]

there is magnesium in Purple Up and in the second component (calcium) of the buffer I spoke of earlier.

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Coralline shouldn't 'suffer' with freshly mixed water and water changes. It takes time to grow and some magic snake-oil isn't going to propagate it overnight.

Nothing should be depleted in 2 weeks anyway, especially in a tank with no corals.


You know that coralline grows well in the magnesium present in Instant Ocean?

Alkalinity is readily depleted bycycling live rock.



I chked my mag and it was at 600 or so..

I expect a value that low is testing error.

[jbc123]

Alkalinity is readily depleted bycycling live rock.


Wouldn't waiting for the cycle to complete and doing a water change be much more preferable than spiking a tank with additives and chemicals?

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

there is magnesium in Purple Up and in the second component (calcium) of the buffer I spoke of earlier.

Let's not get into critiquing Purple Up just now (there are many threads on it), but it is not going to boost calcium, and the amount of magnesium in the small amount you'd dose is not going to boost a low magnesium salt mix to anywhere near NSW levels. That takes a HUGE amount of pure magnesium supplement.

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Wouldn't waiting for the cycle to complete and doing a water change be much more preferable than spiking a tank with additives and chemicals?

Why would it be better? Maintaining alkalinity is easy with inexpensive supplements, and can be done any time. if you look at the folks that cure live rock, they often attest to doing so:

http://www.pacificeastaquaculture.com/curingrock.aspx

"Do some water changes as you determine they are needed for your system, and supplement your tank to keep calcium and alkalinity levels at normal reef tank levels from day one and monitor this regularly! "

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Right now my alkalinity is at 3 meg/L but I want o keep coral so it should be a bit higher right?

I missed that value after you said you were told it was too low. That is not low. That is fine. I recommend 2.5-4 meq/L. There is no reason to boost it right now. These have more:

The “How To” Guide to Reef Aquarium Chemistry for Beginners, Part 1: The Salt Water Itself
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2007-03/rhf/index.php

The “How To” Guide to Reef Aquarium Chemistry for Beginners, Part 2: What Chemicals Must be Supplemented
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2007-04/rhf/index.php

The "How To" Guide to Reef Aquarium Chemistry for Beginners, Part 3: pH
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2007-05/rhf/index.php

The “How To” Guide to Reef Aquarium Chemistry for Beginners,
Part 4: What Chemicals May Detrimentally Accumulate
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2007-09/rhf/index.php

[rtaylors3]

Got my calcium test kit in and according to it I have around 360 ppm of calcium. I know that is low but I can't help but think the guy that tested it Sat. may have been off (wish I ahd asked what he came up with) or I may be off. I tested twice and cam up with teh same thing. My alkalinity really measures around 2.5 meg/L but my PH is about 8.1. Any thoughts?

[Bonneville08]

With your Calcium and Alkalinity where they are you should be able to dose your two part at recommended dosage to bring up both levels.
Once you are within acceptable limits, keep them there. Don't get hung up on a perfect level for any one thing. Keep them all in an acceptable range.
There is nothing wrong with a pH of 8.1.
If you only listen to one person on this thread, make sure it's Randy Holmes-Farley. I've read a lot of his posts, and I think he may have forgotten more about aquarium chemistry than I will ever know.
Good luck

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

That is the calcium level you'd expect using certain salt mixes, like Instant Ocean, so I would not assume it is incorrect. What mix do you use?

I'd add enough of just the calcium part of the two part, or a calcium chloride product like Kent Turbo Calcium to boost calcium to 420 ppm. This calculator shows how much to use:

Reef chemicals calculator
http://home.comcast.net/~jdieck1/chem_calc3.html

Then begin equal parts dosing, determining the dose based only on maintaining alkalinity where you want it. Calcium will follow along fine unless a water change with an off calcium level drives it up or down.

This has more:

Solving Calcium and Alkalinity Problems

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/nov2002/chem.htm

[60Cubed]

Posts: 60921

That says it all right there!