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Kzinti
09/18/2008, 09:32 AM
Hello, I installed a sump on my 55gallon tank and I am getting a decent amount of air bubbles coming out of the return pump. I glued all of the PVC together so I am unsure how the air is getting into the system. I was suggested to silicone all of the joints, if this is a viable solution can someone please provide me with what type of silicone I should order(A link would be amazing).

Also does anyone else have any other ideas or suggestions? Your help is appreciated!

Thanks,
-Curt

rockworm
09/18/2008, 09:51 AM
Many use GE Silicone I (http://www.caulkyourhome.com/sil1_window_door.html) Almost any will work, just make sure that it does not have mildew resistors in it.

Before the silicone, are the bubbles coming from the return pump itself, or is it possible they are being created in the sump from the drain lines or protein skimmer and being returned to the display tank.

Kzinti
09/18/2008, 10:26 AM
The bubbles are coming out of the return, I do not know where they originate though. Thats why I was going to silicone all of the joints to see if air is leaking in somehow. There are bubbles in the sump though.

rockworm
09/18/2008, 11:31 AM
My first thought is that the bubbles are being created with the water draining into the sump and not a result of the return lines. The bubbles are not escaping the water in the sump before it is returned to the display tank.

Any chance we can get a picture of your sump?

How big is your sump and did you place baffles in it or create a bubble tower? The first method, baffles, forces the water over, then under, then over a series of glass or acrylic panels glued across the width of the sump. This forces the bubbles to the top and generally allows them to escape the water column before they ever hit the return pump.

The second method is to create a box that allows water to escape only on the bottom. This box is filled with rock rubble and the drain line(s) go into the box. The rubble generally keeps the air above the water.

Take a look at Melev's sump pages (http://www.melevsreef.com/allmysumps.html) . He is a master at sump design and has excellent diagrams that many of us have used.

Another method that people use is filter socks. The drain water goes into these and they effectively remove most of the air bubbles. The advantage to these is they also collect detritus. The disadvantage is they have to be cleaned regularly.


<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13376986#post13376986 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Kzinti
The bubbles are coming out of the return, I do not know where they originate though. Thats why I was going to silicone all of the joints to see if air is leaking in somehow. There are bubbles in the sump though.

Kzinti
09/18/2008, 11:42 AM
I lost the cord for my camera ---> PC(the usb one) so no pics :(.

I have the drain line already going into a filter sock, and I have sump seperated into three areas through the use of egg crate. With the drain/protein skimmer in the first section, chaeto in the second and the return pump in the third. I also made a "cartridge" insert between the first and second area that houses more filter pad material.

I will check out that page, do you think I should place rubble in the bottom of the filter sock?

Thank you very much for your time btw.

kgross
09/18/2008, 12:48 PM
How does the water get in to the final return section? Does it fall over a baffle? If it does this can create bubbles. What I would suggest you do is get a flashlight and watch the return pump intake if you see any bubbles going into the pump that is your problem. Once you see that we might be able to help a lot more.

Kim

rockworm
09/18/2008, 12:51 PM
Curt,

I don't think rubble in the sock will help any. The sock is pretty good by itself. This is probably a dumb question, but is the top of the sock above the water line in the sump?

If it is, I am guessing that your protein skimmer is probably the culprit. I suspect it is throwing some bubbles into the water and the "cartridge" is not catching them. Anything that gets beyond the cartridge will flow direct to the return pump. Is there a significant increase in bubbles if the cartridge is removed?

The best solution is to implement the bubble trap as shown in Melev's site. i know it is a pain in the butt with the sump already in operation, but long term you will not regret it.

And just to let know that you are not alone in the bubble issue, i am going through the same thing. I added a 220 FOWLR to my system late in the build. Unfortunately my sump is too small to handle the extra flow and bubbles won't escape before they hit the return. I have a remote fish room and am currently adding another tank to handle the extra flow.

Finally, it is my pleasure in trying to help. Reefers helping reefers.



<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13377398#post13377398 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Kzinti
I lost the cord for my camera ---> PC(the usb one) so no pics :(.

I have the drain line already going into a filter sock, and I have sump seperated into three areas through the use of egg crate. With the drain/protein skimmer in the first section, chaeto in the second and the return pump in the third. I also made a "cartridge" insert between the first and second area that houses more filter pad material.

I will check out that page, do you think I should place rubble in the bottom of the filter sock?

Thank you very much for your time btw.

AZDesertRat
09/18/2008, 03:08 PM
How big is the sump? What pump do you have? How is it plumbed, meaning what size pipe, does it have any bends or fittings, valves etc? Is anything restricting the suction side of the pump? Does the sump have vertical baffles to force the water to change directions like over under and over so the bubbles off gas? How big is the return section of the sump?
How does water enter the sump from the overflow, does it drop from above and carry entrainedair or does the overflow plumbing extend below the surface at an angle so there is a smoother transition and less air entrapment?
How long has the system been set up? Do you have a skimmer and if so how and where does it discharge?

A quick way to check for bubbles in the sump is to shut off the lights and shine a flashlight through the sump side to side or end to end. The water will look milky if bubbles are present.