My pair of Vlamingii's

[jmccown]

Recently took a picture of this happy couple. I've had these two for a year and a half now. They are the best of friends. School everywhere together. Big one is 14" and the smaller one is 11-12".

Enjoy
http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o45/jmccown1/100_3885.jpg

[Gary Majchrzak]

I guess everyone has a different definition of "happy".
Why are they so tattered?

Might you consider removing some rockwork so they have more room to swim?

maybe I should just post "nice" :rolleyes:

[prostaff]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13991719#post13991719 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Gary Majchrzak
I guess everyone has a different definition of "happy".
Why are they so tattered?

Might you consider removing some rockwork so they have more room to swim?

maybe I should just post "nice" :rolleyes:

???? What??

Jmccown- Nice looking pair you have there. How did you know they would pair up? Did you buy them as a pair or just take a chance?

[Gary Majchrzak]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13992281#post13992281 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by prostaff
???? What??
are we looking at the same two fish?

have you any experience with healthy Naso vlamingii ?

perhaps if I have nothing nice to say I shouldn't say anything at all.... but then why bother to post on this site at all if you can't discuss something?

maybe... just maybe ... jmccown and his fish might benefit from me posting candidly.
It looks like his fish need more room. Look at them.

[DamnPepShrimp]

I see what your saying Gary. They do look a little beat up, but Jason has had them for 1.5 years. Any ideas on why they don't look 100%? Pretty cool you got them to pair!

[jmccown]

I assure you they have plenty of room for awhile. I have plans of upgrading to a tank of 700-800 gallons in the next couple of years. Till then they have plenty of swimming room.

[Snail-po]

the vlamingis(especially the small one) do look tattered. My father has one in his 215 gallon reef and its the picture of health but yours...well. On a side note they are a little on the pale side

[myerst2]

They do appear a bit tattered. Especially the darker spots are signs of stress for whatever reason, whether it is lack of swimming room or not. On the other the fish aren't emaciated and if anything perfect weight, no sign of HLLD, no signs of external parasites. They could be a little better looking but could be a hell of a lot worse looking. Not the greatest pics of Vlamingis. These guys are supper healthy vlamingi's!!!!

http://i244.photobucket.com/albums/gg22/myerst22/other%20fish/IMG_4552.jpg
http://i244.photobucket.com/albums/gg22/myerst22/other%20fish/IMG_4551.jpg'
http://i244.photobucket.com/albums/gg22/myerst22/other%20fish/IMG_4553.jpg
http://i244.photobucket.com/albums/gg22/myerst22/other%20fish/IMG_4554.jpg
http://i244.photobucket.com/albums/gg22/myerst22/other%20fish/IMG_4550.jpg
http://i244.photobucket.com/albums/gg22/myerst22/other%20fish/IMG_4529.jpg

[LisaD]

I agree. while they are not picture perfect specimens, jmccown's vlamingi pair look pretty nice to me!

where were those pictures you posted taken?

[Snail-po]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13997236#post13997236 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by LisaD
I agree. while they are not picture perfect specimens, jmccown's vlamingi pair look pretty nice to me!





Pretty nice??? not to be offensive but have you ever owned a vlamingi? its obvious that while yes these are well fed they do not seem healthy especially from a superficial stand point. I dont know what could be causing this on them other than running into rocks or getting picked on but if i were the owner of these fish i would look into making them better looking.

[LisaD]

no, I haven't ever owned vlamingi tangs, none of my tanks are big enough. I never said I was an expert on them, but I think your criticism is on the harsh side. they are a bit beat up, and I'd love to see perfect finnage, but they also don't look so bad to me. explain what is wrong with them besides some cosmetic damage. I am interested in understanding your point of view.

have you ever kept these fish? how long have you been keeping saltwater fish? how do you know how to assess fish health?

[Snail-po]

well other than torn fins they have some discoloration(probably stress) and there a little on the pale side. notice how in a early post i said on a superficial standpoint. as far as actual internal health goes there probably fine , they are well fed ill give them that. I have been around saltwater tanks for 13 years among those have been reefs , FOWLR , and seahorses. trust me i have have expirence , and yes my fathers tank has a vlamingi in it and i help with the tank. i know what healthy looks like and this isnt exactly on par with it. what he needs to do is try and find out why they look this way and how he can improve their unsightly condition.

[myerst2]

Lisa that is my display!!! No that is the reef at the Riverhead NY Aquarium a few towns away from me. I believe it is still the largest captive reef in the US. 10,000 gallons. Amazing massive coral colonies and the healthiest monster fish you could ask for. Just amazing. The curator and reef keeper in Joe Yuiolo, (sorry probably massacred his last name) I watched this display from the beginning 5-6 years ago. Simply amazing. By the way some of those vlamingi's are almost 20" T

[LisaD]

That is an amazing display. I'll be visiting my family in NJ over the holidays, maybe I can get away for a day trip to this place. Most of the large public aquarium fish displays I've seen have fake reefs.

How close are you to Cold Spring Harbor? In my former position, with a science education company, I used to go to Cold Spring Harbor Laboratory every year, had a collaboration with the Dolan DNA Learning Center.

[jmccown]

That pic was taken literally when the lights first came on, so they do look a little pale. Their coloration is perfectly normal after they're more awake and active.

[Snail-po]

ok, by the way i do realize i was harsh. we all have right to express our own opinions, just because mine and somone eleses doesnt match isnt bad, sorry. lets just agree to disagree and you know what , at least the tangs are living a long time. your doing good jmccown, not perfect, but good none the less.

[saltyguy51]

wow and wow again, nice people!!!

[LisaD]

ok, by the way i do realize i was harsh. we all have right to express our own opinions, just because mine and somone eleses doesnt match isnt bad, sorry.

no one said you can't disagree with someone else. sorry, you are kind of rude.

[Gary Majchrzak]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13997341#post13997341 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by LisaD
have you ever kept these fish? how long have you been keeping saltwater fish? how do you know how to assess fish health?
I'll be happy to answer your questions, DamnPepShrimp and Lisa. I care for Vlamingii Tangs. I have 15 years experience with marine fishes and I'm brave enough (foolish enough?) to post here.
Look at the eye and around the gills of the bottom fish, the discoloration on the bodies and the torn fins. It appears their bellies are pinched. These specimens are in poor shape and the smaller (bottom) fish is obviously catching the worst of it. To the trained eye these signs scream for immediate corrective action. These two fish are roughly half their adult size.
I would expect someone with experience keeping large, healthy (adult/sub-adult) Vlamingii Tangs to react similarly to Snail-po and myself. (Any other Bravehearts out there?) I've taken flak in the past for my position on Vlamingii Tangs and time has proven me right in each case. Why bother any more... it's just a fish, right?
All of the people I know of that have Vlamingii Tangs alive in their home aquarium have had them less than two years (ie: small juvenile size). Problems invariably arise when (if!) this species grows large on them.
It's sad to see these fish get too big for their owners aquarium and go up for grabs (cheap. search the livestock forums).
It is kind of kewl to see how big folks can grow 'em in their home aquariums, though- this species is tough as nails.

[Snail-po]

well put gary, very well put. i feel very similar on that aspect of the fish. as you can see from my last post i kind of gave up on fighting over these two's health, but if you want to keep trying then i support you:)

[Dadof4]

Damn! Remind me to never post anything but the simplest questions anywhere on Reef Central. If these are the type of responses a person gets, I want no part. You are rude, plain and simple. Constructive criticism goes much farther than a blunt attack.

[DamnPepShrimp]

The discoloring can be from the lights, that seems within reason. But the tattered fins is from something you might want to look into.

[jnc914]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13999521#post13999521 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Dadof4
Damn! Remind me to never post anything but the simplest questions anywhere on Reef Central. If these are the type of responses a person gets, I want no part. You are rude, plain and simple. Constructive criticism goes much farther than a blunt attack.

:rolleyes:

Gary's response was far from abrasive or offensive. Have you ever been on other forum sites? This is by far the friendliest site I have ever been associated with. People are way too sensitive and PC nowadays. Chill out.

Here is the Vlamingii I had in my 180. I had to give him away when he reached the 7" mark.

http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o79/jnc914/DSC00062.jpg

http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o79/jnc914/DSC00061.jpg

http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o79/jnc914/DSC00038.jpg

[Gary Majchrzak]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13999523#post13999523 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by DamnPepShrimp
The discoloring can be from the lights, that seems within reason. But the tattered fins is from something you might want to look into. Vlamingii can change color on a whim. The discoloration I'm referring to are the darker areas that look like bruises.
The tattered fins, bruises and scratched eye might even be a result of the lights- do they turn on suddenly and startle the fish? Is a nightlight run at night?

[LisaD]

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by LisaD
have you ever kept these fish? how long have you been keeping saltwater fish? how do you know how to assess fish health?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


I wasn't directing that question at you, Gary.

[ccampbell57]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13998198#post13998198 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Snail-po
ok, by the way i do realize i was harsh. we all have right to express our own opinions, just because mine and somone eleses doesnt match isnt bad, sorry. lets just agree to disagree and you know what , at least the tangs are living a long time. your doing good jmccown, not perfect, but good none the less.

:rolleye1: here we go again

[jmccown]

Gary I just read that you think their bellies are pinched, lol. That's funny. These fish are nearly 2" thick each. Not malnourished by any means my good friend.

[billsreef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=13997891#post13997891 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by myerst2
Lisa that is my display!!! No that is the reef at the Riverhead NY Aquarium a few towns away from me. I believe it is still the largest captive reef in the US. 10,000 gallons. Amazing massive coral colonies and the healthiest monster fish you could ask for. Just amazing. The curator and reef keeper in Joe Yuiolo, (sorry probably massacred his last name) I watched this display from the beginning 5-6 years ago. Simply amazing. By the way some of those vlamingi's are almost 20" T

Tim,

I'm sure Joe will forgive you for butchering his name, but not for getting the size of his reef tank wrong :D It's 20,000 gallons ;)

Lisa,

Atlantis Marine World is about 45 minutes or so east of Cold Spring Harbor in Riverhead. If you do make it out this way, be sure and let me know.

[myerst2]

Hi Bill. I will never never get his name correct. I believe there are a couple of frags of mine that I donated over 5 years ago and needless to say they are monster colonies now:). Joe Y:) has done an amazing job as the corals are huge and healthy and amount of fish in that display is hard to believe. I asked Lisa the same and hopefully we can all meet. Happy holidays all. T

[LisaD]

Is Todd Gardner still at Atlantis Marine World? If I can get my family to set me loose, or come along, I'll be out there. Best days are the 28th or 29th. It may not happen, I only get out to NJ (where ALL my family lives) about once a year for a few days, so it's hard to find time over the holidays.

Sorry to digress, but are you guys going to MACNA in Atlantic City next September? If I can get away from work, I'll try to be there.

[jmccown]

Here is another pic from last night. I don't see anything wrong with this picture.

http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o45/jmccown1/IMG_0012.jpg

[billsreef]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14000986#post14000986 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by LisaD
Is Todd Gardner still at Atlantis Marine World? If I can get my family to set me loose, or come along, I'll be out there. Best days are the 28th or 29th. It may not happen, I only get out to NJ (where ALL my family lives) about once a year for a few days, so it's hard to find time over the holidays.

Sorry to digress, but are you guys going to MACNA in Atlantic City next September? If I can get away from work, I'll try to be there.

Todd is still there and breeding fish like a madman :lol: Unfortunately I won't be around those days :(

As for MACNA, it's plenty close enough, but also the same weekend as my wedding anniversary. Not to sure I'll get my wife to let me loose for that. I miss quite a few MACNA's due to that :(

[jmccown]

and another. The first two pictures were when the lights first came on. They usually cram themselves in the rocks to sleep, so the pale discoloration is due to the lights just coming on early in the morning and the other marks are probably because they sleep in the rock work. These fish are pictures of health. I do not see how anyone can say they look skinny or that I do not take care of my fish.

Another from last night. Sorry for the crappy pics just got a new cam and haven't quite figured it out yet.

http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o45/jmccown1/IMG_0024.jpg

[jmccown]

Full tank shot.

http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o45/jmccown1/IMG_0007.jpg

[kirkaz]

Love your tank J-Mc....Been some good info on this thread too, nothing wrong with a little controversy.:D

Curious how that Starfish is still alive....No interest from the Triggers or Wrasses in him?

[anbosu]

My first thought when I saw the coloration was that they looked like the lights had just been turned on.

Any idea who is nipping on their fins?

[Grouperhead]

Awesome tank jmc! How big is that annularis? All the fish look very fat and healthy :D

[Snail-po]

excuse me jmc but arent you a little worried about overstocking? you have some big fish that are only going to get bigger. are you planning an upgrade, if so then when and how large?

[anbosu]

I think he/she mentioned on the first page of the thread that there were plans to upgrade to a 700-800 gallon system.

[techigirl78]

Wow, those are some big fish. I do agree with the others that the first pics looked like their fins were nipped. I had a blenny that kept nipping my blue tang like that until I removed it. Otherwise, I think they are really nice looking fish. Does your clown trigger behave well with the other fish? I always loved them, but wouldn't want to try one in my smaller tanks.

[badbrady06]

aside from a few rips on the fins i would say these fish look very healthy. most fish do change their color when the lights go out, look alot lighter and you see different markings on them. this very evident when the lights are just turned back on. looks like the fish got startled by just that, would also explain why the fins are spread out (flexed). mybe jmccown could post some pics of them after the lights have been on for a while and the fish have settled some. imo i would think they would do better long term in a tank at least 3ft wide by 8ft long.

[ccampbell57]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14001898#post14001898 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Snail-po
excuse me jmc but arent you a little worried about overstocking? you have some big fish that are only going to get bigger. are you planning an upgrade, if so then when and how large?

Snail-Po - did you read his reply on the first page that says he will be upgrading to a 7-800g tank?

Quick question for you...what is the stocklist in your tank?

[Snail-po]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14002481#post14002481 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by anbosu
I think he/she mentioned on the first page of the thread that there were plans to upgrade to a 700-800 gallon system.

oh , yes i guess i missed that sorry.

[badbrady06]

sorry bout that posted b4 i saw the pics. very healthy looking fish imho.

[1ucky]

Your fish look great! My Vlamingi has the same blotches when I first turn on the lights....

[WuHT]

snail-po only keeps one snail in a 65 gallon aquarium because he doens't believe in raping the oceans like you uncaring ingrates.


But seriously... there's not many reasons why you'd be interested unless you wanted something to pick on , ccampbell :)

[flameangel88]

Give it a rest...what's wrong with the tank? It looks nice to me and if it was upto me I would have a few more fish in there. :)

A pair of Xhatch would be nice. :rollface:

[saltyguy51]

Jmc dont worry about the beating, maybe most of us can learn how __not__ to talk to people when we are trying to get a point across, its always easier to tell someone what to do rather than show them, have fun with your fish

[Gary Majchrzak]

who's hiding in the rock stack behind the clown trigger?
http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o45/jmccown1/IMG_0007.jpg

[jmccown]

Hey Gary, that's my new Goldenheart Trigger. Check out my other thread for more details on that one.

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1536138

[reefergeorge]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14005346#post14005346 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by WuHT
snail-po only keeps one snail in a 65 gallon aquarium because he doens't believe in raping the oceans like you uncaring ingrates.


But seriously... there's not many reasons why you'd be interested unless you wanted something to pick on , ccampbell :)
I hear he has a hippo tang in his 65. :eek2:

I wish you were closer. I would have to come check them out in person. ;)

[Snail-po]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14005346#post14005346 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by WuHT
snail-po only keeps one snail in a 65 gallon aquarium because he doens't believe in raping the oceans like you uncaring ingrates.



Yes and his name is seymour! no just kidding:) my stocklist is a orange line cardinal , 2 allardi clownfish , and 1 lawnmower blenny, and of course my fair share of snails:)

[Hogfish77]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14005408#post14005408 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by flameangel88
Give it a rest...what's wrong with the tank? It looks nice to me and if it was upto me I would have a few more fish in there. :)

A pair of Xhatch would be nice. :rollface:
haha I know! Damn nice BIG tank to me. :D

[FishGuy5]

Nice tank-beautiful specimens! I agree: X-Hatches would be real nice in there too!

[reef / aholic]

They look fine too me.... Not mine but here is a nice looking Vlamingii...

http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/139055_webpict046912.JPG

[jmccown]

Thanks to everyone who's helped restore my integrity here on RC, lol. I guess those were bad shots and I didn't elaborate in my first post that the pic was when the lights first came on. Turned into a good post nonetheless.

[flameangel88]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14011919#post14011919 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by jmccown
Thanks to everyone who's helped restore my integrity here on RC, lol. I guess those were bad shots and I didn't elaborate in my first post that the pic was when the lights first came on. Turned into a good post nonetheless.

You didn't need any help--a good picture is all you needed. Next time if there's any white spots don't post it otherwise it will look like ich. It's easy to jump the conclusion and the bandwagon fills even faster.

[ChrisKirkland]

Where in kentucky are you??? Nice tank... Interesting thread though...

[jmccown]

I live in Pike County...Belfry.

[danorth]

How did I miss this action! Shoot, I can take a pic of my emp angel with funny coloration, or the blue line where it is as if it was in a black and white film.....the whole tank looks healthy jmc!

As far as missing fins, in an aggressive tank, bites happen.

[Grouperhead]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14013357#post14013357 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by danorth
As far as missing fins, in an aggressive tank, bites happen.

Truer words may never have been spoken on RC