Ozone Advice - Do I need It? Will it work?

[oxx155]

I currently have
450 Gallon Reef (Acrylic) w/ 180g Refugium, 180g Sump, 75g other tank, all connected in the system.
ASM G-6 Skimmer modified with recirculating Sedra 9000's (3 with screen mod) and a ReeFlo Orca 250 Pro modified with 10" neck and larger cup.
114 Watt UV Sterilizer (2 57 watt AquaUV)
2 Chamber Geo Calcium Reactor
I run about 10 pounds of Carbon in flow through chambers
I have about 700 pounds of live rock and 800 pounds of live sand between all the tanks

I am trying to do as much filtration as I can and provide the cleanest conditions I can for my reef (pretty well stocked, borderline heavy). The only thing I can think I am missing is Ozone, but I don't know anything about it and was wondering if its worth it (I have read it can be very dangerous).

What are your thoughts? - With my system as it is would it help? Do the benefits out weigh the dangers? How do I set it up and properly use it?

Or are there other forms of filtration I am missing?

Thanks

[fancyfish]

I have used ozone in the past and recently took this off my system as my skimmer was working poorly. I mesh modded my skimmer and in my opinion my tank is much healthier now than in the past with the ozone. I kept the orp monitor and today my orp is 380. I have seen it higher at 400 without the ozone.
I will not go back to using ozone. i guess it becomes a matter of personal preference. I would do a search on ozone as you will find a ton of information to help with your decision.

[hairyman1]

Ozone kills bateria, fungi, algae and other organic compounds (such as those that yellow the water) that come in contact with the ozone in the reaction chamber (typically a skimmer reaction chamber) through oxidation. The resultant killed compounds can then be further reduced? by a properly functioning biological filter or that's the theory anyway. Ultraviolet light does many of the same things except remove yellowing compounds. Carbon obviously removes various kinds of organic/inorganic compounds, but falls short of purifing the water like ozone and ultraviolet light can do. I can't see a logical reason to use all 3 systems and as a side note ozone was frequently recommended in conjunction with protein skimming in the recent past when most skimmers were airstone or venturi driven. This was said to improve the function of the skimmer. Now with many reefers using aspirating style skimmers like needle/pin/mesh wheel skimmers the comments I have read said that skimmer output decreased when hooked up to ozone. Curious. Ozone is popular in europe especially Germany where it is used not only for aquariums, but to sterilize drinking water and even in air filters! Nearly all public aquariums here and abroad use ozone with protein skimmers so perhaps they know something we don't. When confused I need a drink so I will leave you to ponder what I've rambled on about.

[jdeveaux]

I use ozone and swear by it. You really need to use it in combination with a really good skimmer or Ozone reactor to make it work efficiently. I have my ozone controlled by my ACIII to turn off once the ORP hits 425 and what I find is that the Ozone only really turns on after water changes to raise the orp back to optimal levels.

Mine is feeding directly into my ORCA 250 skimmer with the air supplied through an Air Dryer. (http://www.redseafish.com/Prod171.asp)

I also suggest reading some of the literature written by Randy Holmes-farley (http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-12/rhf/feature/index.php)

There are lots of great articles from him available on-line.

Also be sure and get a decent reliable Ozone Generator. I tried the Red Sea units and they really are not worth the money. I now use the Poseidon from Ozotech (http://www.bulkreefsupply.com/Ozotech-ozone/c70/p338/Ozotech-Poseidon-Ozone-Generator-200mg/hr-(Variable-Output)/product_info.html).

Happy holidays,

[areze]

waiting on my poseidon to pair up with an ozone reactor for my tank.

Ive heard it can reduce the skimmer efficiency, but Ive heard that that is because the ozone breaks down some things so that they can be consumed by bacteria, which reduces the load on the skimmer.

[jdeveaux]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14017276#post14017276 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by areze
waiting on my poseidon to pair up with an ozone reactor for my tank.

Ive heard it can reduce the skimmer efficiency, but Ive heard that that is because the ozone breaks down some things so that they can be consumed by bacteria, which reduces the load on the skimmer.

Here is the article I was orgionally looking for Ozone and the Reef Aquarium (http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-03/rhf/index.php).

The ozone does break down impurities so it makes logical sense that you would see a reduction in the gunk pulled by your skimmer.

[areze]

should maybe mention, no personal experience, but one guy suggested that if you run ozone to your skimmer, you could be putting a restriction on the venturi, which obviously reduces air injected and skimmer output as a result. his solution was to T off after the ozone injector so it could freely draw in air. I dont think thats always the case for skimmer output being reduced, but something to watch out for anyway.

[jdeveaux]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14017390#post14017390 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by areze
should maybe mention, no personal experience, but one guy suggested that if you run ozone to your skimmer, you could be putting a restriction on the venturi, which obviously reduces air injected and skimmer output as a result. his solution was to T off after the ozone injector so it could freely draw in air. I dont think thats always the case for skimmer output being reduced, but something to watch out for anyway.

Mine is on a T connector. Especially since the Ozone is only one when needed.

[oxx155]

When confused I need a drink so I will leave you to ponder what I've rambled on about.

Been there, done that, still confused.


Say I got Ozone. I would assume the best would be to get an Ozone Generator, Air Dryer, Air Pump, and ORP Monitor/Controller.
What are everyones recommendations?

And, since I have 3 air sources for my ASM G-6 (3 Sedra 9000's), could I run the ozone to just one of those air sources?

Last Question - Would it be best to have the water coming out of the skimmer run through a sock or bucket of carbon?

Thanks

[oxx155]

Thanks everyone for the help.
Since I have so much filtration as it is, the only benefit I see of Ozone is clearer water, but I have always felt I had clear water as it is. So, the cons outweigh the benefits at this time.

Thans Again

[bergzy]

on a different note:

i have used ozone on the past with ok success.

the water was pretty clear and i could get the orp up past 405mv.

i have been lucky as i never had any ich etc.

a different twist was when i started using zeovit (or other bacteria driven systems).

i call water with ozone 'clear'.

but i saw a difference when using zeovit...the water became 'transparent' for the lack of a better word...literally in three days or so.

i have since stopped using ozone and my corals have never looked better 'until' i decided that i was smarter than nature and decided to use some gfo for the heck of it (this upset the biological balance and sent my tank into chaos which is slowly recovering :().

a word of caution is that zeo works better than any mechanical/electrical device. in order to use it, i suggest that one is able to have the ability to adjust parameters to zeo specs and keep it there.

with any bacteria driven system. one can not use uv and ozone because this kills the beneficial bacteria that drive the whole system. also, you will no be able to grow macro in your refugium because the nutrients are so low. but, is this a bad thing?;)

if you decide to try zeo, i sould suggest that youvisit their dedicated forum, read lots and ask a ton of questions as it is a very different way to reef.

not saying to not use ozone...just mentioning a different way which yielded me results that were better than ozone use etc.

[tufacody]

Start with an ORP probe. Aside from the health of your animals, I find that your ORP is the best measure of water quality. If you are hitting 350+ you probably don't need it. But then again, if your animals are healthy and your tank looks great, why consider it anyway?

I run an Ozotech Poseidon through my skimmer. The air is sucked in from the collection cup, so I just drilled a hole in the cup and feed the ozone into it, and let the venturi suck it from there. The ozone is controlled by my AC3.

I thought my water was clear, and then I hooked up ozone. Wow, what a difference. I agree with previous poster, that once I hit my target ORP the tank tends to stay there and ozone doesn't come on much. I consider it just another safety system.

[chachijoe75]

Just a word of caution...

You have to make sure you have proper charcoal placed where your skimmer discharges and also add more if air comes out of the skimmer into the atmosphere. Ozone can be dangerous IF is not used properly. I know many reefers that have great looking tanks and the attribute it to Ozone. In my case, I had an Ozone generator for about 2 months and decided to remove it because I could still smell it in the same room where my daughters play and many publications say that if you can sense it...then it is above the levels humans could potentially tolerate.

[tufacody]

agreed

[reef_doug]

I would only consider it if the sump/skimmer werre outside. You would need an ORP monitor or controller to turn off the generator before it becomes unsafe for the fish.

Not nearly the same, I decided to go the ZEOvit path instead.

[areze]

I plan on pumping the air line outside. not messing with it being in the house.

same reason im using a ozone reactor, skimmer was too much trouble to run all that water through the carbon and all that air as well. the ozone reactor will only get maybe 100gph, and <1cf/min of air. unlike the skimmer. much easier to manage that kind of volume then to try and filter everything going through a big ol euroreef.

[tufacody]

Nothing wrong with this logic, but unless your tank is really unhealthy, the ozone really doesn't come on all that much once the target is hit.

[DaveMorris]

If you run ozone and zeovit, prodibio, or vodka, are you counter-acting the two; ozone and bacteria? I know there is a huge difference between Zeovit and dosing vodka, but if I dose vodka, should I not be using ozone? Or if I went to using Zeovit (never gonna happen) would I not want to use ozone on that tank either? I never thought of the way the two things would interract with each other.

[areze]

trouble I have with zeovit is the cost... its an ongoing cost, and if you have a sizable volume of water, its just not reasonable to dose it.

100g, sure, why not, but when you get 500g of system volume, the costs are astronomical, and you have to start using renewable equipment, calcium reactors, ozone, big skimmers. you cant do 25% water changes a week, dose 10 different things, ect ect. got to streamline.

Im hoping I dont need to use ozone often at all. 1 time costs are key for big tanks though IMO.

[bergzy]

having been on zeo almost three years, i find the cost reasonable given the results. imo, a reef tank IS an ongoing cost. whether it be food, electricity, worn out equipment, equipment upgrade, light bulb replacement, carbon, kalk, supplements, salt, rodi, shipping costs for whatever, gas for your car to go to lfs', wear and tear on your car...is all i could think of at the moment.

zeo initial costs can be considered expensive, esp for a large tank, but once established, it costs me about 50 cents a day or about $15 a month which is cheaper in electrical cost for me here (socal edison rate) than the electricity used by my ca reactor recirc pump ($18).

the beauty of oregon electrical rates is that is it probably about ten times less than the top tier rates (which my reef tank runs at) of socal edison.

my 350g system has about 250g of adjusted water volume. a 780g system? yeah, probably about 500g. zeo cost then? about $30 a month or less by my usage after induction.

when i used rowaphos along with carbon to clean my water, i am guessing that i was spending more than $30 a month 'not' including the electricity used to light my fuge for 18 hours per day.

i mentioned zeo for clear water but there are a lot more benefits than just clear water. i love my coral color that i got with zeo. growth was decent as well.

zeo might be overkill for a fo tank but for a sps reef tank...i love it.

the most expensive thing i found with starting zeo was the WAYYYYY overpriced zeo reactor. i built my 7.5L external reactor for about $20. it is crude and unaesthetic but i think a couple of companies may have copied my container within a container design to have a jam free design.

to throw in a little non-zeo biasness, hopefully, i also run a skimmerless 110g non-zeo tank. it houses lps, ric's, nem's and a boatload of clams! that's about as far away from zeo i can think of:D

reefing is an expensive hobby. and big tank reefs are big time expensive to maintain, that's fer shure! :)