Any hope for my fish?

[pammy]

Hey all. I bought a Bartletts Anthias a week ago. He did fine the first couple of days. He was active, and ate really well. I know I know....no QT. He disappeared on the 3rd day. I suspected my Sally Lightfoot that is getting quite large (I've been trying to catch the Sally to give him away, even though I haven't seen him attack any fish). The Anthias was really close to the Sally a bunch of times, which was scaring me, but I never saw the Sally lunge at him. The only other fish I have are a pair of Ocellaris clowns, and a Splendid goby/ tiger pistol shrimp pair. The clowns are still young and very peaceful. Never saw them bother the other fish. Then the Anthias re-appeared the next day. Day after that, the Anthias disappeard again, for two days this time. Again, I thought for sure he was dead, but the following day, I saw him laying on his side (during the day) in a hole under the liverock on the sand bed. I could only see his tail fin (which looked fine), and could tell he was alive, but not well since he appeard to be laying on his side. Then all of a sudden, my Tiger Pistol Shrimp went after him twice, and grabbed him by the tail. And here I was suspecting the Sally. I thought pistol shrimps were peaceful? I don't know if the shrimp was just trying to get an easy meal because the fish was on his way out. I thought for sure by the morning, I'd find the anthias dad. I didn't see him in the morning, but I came home from work yesterday to find the Anthias free floating in the current. He was getting whipped all around the tank. I could tell all of his fans , including his tail, were badly damaged. His body appeared fine, and I don't see any bone sticking out where the fins were. There's a tiny bit of fins left, but very little. I didn't know if the most humane thing to do was to put him in water in the freezer, but then I thought, what if he was just attacked and it's just his fins that are damaged? I know that fins can re-grow, so I didn't want to just stick him in the freezer without giving him a chance. I was able to catch him quickly with my hand, and I placed him in a large fish trap that I put in the tank. I figured either he'd have a chance to recover, or die peacefully without getting chased by the Sally and Pistol Shrimp. His fins are bad enough that he can't seem to right himself. He stayed pretty much upside down on the bottom of the fish trap for hours last night before I went to bed. I thought surely by this morning he'd be dead. Surprise again, he was still alive this morning. He was now at the top of the fish trap, instead of lying down on the bottom of the trap. I take that as a small positive side, since he has to have a little use of his fins now to stay off the bottom. Still upside down, but still breathing. I have a fish cam on my tank, and now, 5 hours later, I can see that the Anthias is still alive, and still upside down at the top of the fish trap. He is occassionally moving around. So, any chance for this poor Anthias? I tried to feed him last night but he didn't eat anything. I'll try again tonight. I'm a little concerned that he's not getting any oxygen in the fish trap, because there aren't any holes in it, just a small slit where the door closes. I slipped an airline tube in the trap and hooked it up to a small battery operated airpump, but that just caused the trap door to open and the fish floated out. Do you think he's getting any oxygen in that fish trap? I would think he must be getting some or he'd be dead by now. Considering that this Anthias couldn't swim yesterday, and was just floating all around the tank, and the day before he was laying down on his side in a hole under the rock (on the sandbed).....I would think , that maybe the Sally isn't a monster and didn't cause this damage, because he could have gotten himself a nice easy meal by now. How do I know if this is tail rot, or damange from the Sally or the pistol shrimp? Anyone have a fish in this rough of shape that survived? I'm going to try to get a breeders box tonight or something like the "Acclimate" that I can keep the fish separated from everyone else, but that will allow water to flow through it. Or....would I be better off moving the Anthias to a 5 gallon bucket with a heater and a powerhead in it?

Thanks, Pam

[sunfish11]

I think your anthias is toast at this point, but you never know. I have seen some amazing recoveries. They can grow all their fins back. Not eating is never a good sign though.

I would set up a small hospital tank rather than a 5 gallon bucket. Since the tank wont be cycled you will have to change water every day to control the amonia. Use some type of filter media that has an established bacteria population from your big tank to help process waste. I have used a cheap little bowfront tank from Walmart for this before. You need to inspect the fish closely for diseases or other issues and treat accordingly. Anthias are known for bacterial issues as well as all the other standard fish diseases so treatment may be necessary.

In all likelyhood your pistol and crab are after an easy meal since the fish is obviously on it's way out. I seriously doubt they would attack a healthy fish.

Check with the disease forum for more help and get pictures.

Lisa

[pammy]

Thanks Lisa. I took a picture last night. Haven't looked at it yet. I doubt it will show much, other than the fin damage. I don't see any spots, or growths or anything on his body. His body looks fine. Just looks like he was attacked and his fins are a real mess. I'm just surprised he's been hanging on this long. Can't quite tell in the fish cam if he's still alive, or just floating. He is moving around in there, so if he's dead, that means there is flow moving through the fish trap. I can see he is still upside down. :(
Pam

[michellejy]

The symptoms sound like an internal parasite with the fin damage being secondary from an attack. I had a filamented flasher who came in with internal parasites and had very similar behavior to what you are describing. I think if I had caught it earlier and treated earlier, he would have made it. Unfortunately, I thought it was something else until after I had removed the poor dead fish and noticed the clear poop in the tank. :(

[pammy]

What's the best thing to use to treat parasites, and can I treat in the display tank? What are the normal outward signs of parasites? I can see in the cam, that he's definitely still alive. The tank lights are on now, and I can see him flapping one fin, or what's left of it. It looks like he's trying to turn himself rightside up. He's at the top of the fish trap, left side facing up now. (For the past 24 hours, he was upside down). He sure a fighter!!
Go fishy Go !!!


<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14215119#post14215119 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by michellejy
The symptoms sound like an internal parasite with the fin damage being secondary from an attack. I had a filamented flasher who came in with internal parasites and had very similar behavior to what you are describing. I think if I had caught it earlier and treated earlier, he would have made it. Unfortunately, I thought it was something else until after I had removed the poor dead fish and noticed the clear poop in the tank. :(

[michellejy]

My fish was gasping for air, hanging out on his side, swimming weird, and had clear poo. Clear poo was the sign I wish I had caught first because I spent a lot of time looking for something wrong with the water based on his behavior when it was actually a parasite.

Prazipro should treat it, BUT I don't know if it's safe to use in the display tank. My fish was in quarantine when he got sick and died.

[macreefster]

a pistol shrimps blast can be quite lethal, but i'd be surprised if it could kill an anthias. there was a youtube clip showing a pistol shrimp blasting another shrimp with the sonic wave its popping claw produces.

i have six bartlets in my 70, i know most would say my tank is too small for that, but they my are very active during the day and eat ravenously. i think yours had some kind of internal parasite or infection prior to you getting it and it was predated upon after it was nearly dead. sorry to hear its doing so badly, but i would recommend buying a group of bartletts and quaranteeing them next time. try to get one male and the rest females if you can.

[pammy]

Well I got home tonight and the Anthias is still alive. Still upside down. :( I tried to feed him some garlic and selecon soaked mysis, but he didn't go after it. I can't believe he's hanging on this long. I bought a breeders box tonight and put him in there with a piece of rock where he could hide if he wanted to. At least with the breeders box I know he'll get enough oxygen (wasn't so sure with the fish trap I had him in) I'm not giving up on him yet.
Here's a picture of him.

http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa157/matsis1234/BatteredBartlettAnthias1-21-09.jpg

[pammy]

The Anthias is STILL alive this morning, and still upside down. He's looking really really thin now though, and not eating, so as much as I hate to do this, I think I need to end his misery tonight and put him to sleep in the freezer. :( Funny how you can care about what happens to a little fish, but I know we all do.
Thanks to everyone that took the time to comment.
Pam

[michellejy]

I'm sorry about your fish. :(

At least you know you did what you could.