worth the 200 dollar each price tag?

[smoke15]

what kind of clownfish do these look like to you guys? Worth the 200 dollars each price tag? Just asking for opinions! They are to me . They are the snocasso's that I am getting from Donni ( I love all her clowns) !!!

( click picture to see video of them)

http://s85.photobucket.com/albums/k56/MrsDoni/FOR%20SALE/3-11-09%20ship%20date/?action=view&current=Set2-twosnowcassos.flv

[gioNVA]

Yes! Doni's snowcassos are great. I had to sell/give up a lot of stuff to get them but they are totally worth it. Lots of personality and my kids love them. Before, they totally ignored the tank but now they look at the tank to check out what the clownfish are doing.

I told my wife that they could talk hence the higher price tag :D

[Magga Pie]

They are nice but not worth $200 IMO to some they are I just dont have $400 to buy a pair of clowns that are still babies. Nontheless to each their own and they are a beautiful pair. Looking foward to seeing the development as they get older.

[SALT WATER CRAZ]

My opinion on them is that they are not worth $200 especially being that small. My self I would never give that much for a clown thats nothing more than a mutt. The same goes for naked clowns. But I guess its all in the eye of the beholder.

[NeptunesGhost]

With Doni's clowns, you'll get really healthy fish. (not a voice of experience, I read about what she went through to make sure her fish are extremely healthy) If she wasn't selling them, then you would think she would have lowered the price by now. So, apparently to some people, this price isn't a problem.

Very nice clowns smoke15 :thumbsup:

[tpdpercula]

To much white makes fish look unhealthy "albino" just my 2 cents

[a4twenty]

$400 for a pair of clowns, i'd pass but wont mind looking at pics of yours :)

[smoke15]

pics are in the link above a4twenty

[massman]

Snowcassos?

What a load of marketing hype.
Two ugly looking clowns with mutant parents, deliberately being bred to pass on this mutant gene, so Mrs Doni whoever the heck she is can make a buck.

Kinda like a traveling circus owner having the bearded lady sleep with the world's shortest man so the offspring can continue to make him money.

Rubbish

[Guygettnby]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14582691#post14582691 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by massman
Snowcassos?

What a load of marketing hype.
Two ugly looking clowns with mutant parents, deliberately being bred to pass on this mutant gene, so Mrs Doni whoever the heck she is can make a buck.

Kinda like a traveling circus owner having the bearded lady sleep with the world's shortest man so the offspring can continue to make him money.

Rubbish

im sorry i couldnt help myself ROFLOL :lol: that would be a site too see!!

[Haddonisreef]

Only worth what someone will pay for it!

[Lmecher]

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. They are cute fish, I prefer my clowns with more black than white, but thats just my opinion. If you think they are worth it go for it. These fish are becoming more popular and I appreciate their different look.
Thank for sharing the video, looking forward to seeing more. :)

[a4twenty]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14581231#post14581231 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by smoke15
pics are in the link above a4twenty

need a password, i subscribed to your thread, so i can catch the updates when you get them. :)

[JamesJR]

I wouldn't pay it. If I were to spend 400 bucks on clownfish I would look into some of the rarer, natural varieties.

[jesterns2]

I wish I could buy a pair of clowns that expensive but my Fiance would leave me LOL! Thats ok I almost had my LFS get me two ocellaris Clowns that were $500 a piece, LOL glad I caught that mistake before it happened

[hawgdawg]

Picassos are by far the most beautiful clowns in my opinion. Now thru selective breeding, odd balls like picassos are available to the everyday hobbyist, I'm thankful these fish are being sold and everyone can have a chance to get one. you think 400 bucks is a lot, then check the macculochs for sale on live aquaria. Massman, you sound very ****ed off, whats the deal?

[massman]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14589960#post14589960 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by hawgdawg
Massman, you sound very ****ed off, whats the deal?

Mate,
I'm not ****ed off at all.
Being a collector, I see all of the creations in the wild, as the powers to be have made them.

I just think that occasionally the hobby tends to lose its way and gets engulfed in the marketing hype.

I think mutations and the like are rare in the wild because its not meant to be, and must be a reason for it.

So I have mixed emotions about deliberately breeding animals for their mutations.
We are only privy to the external appearance of these fish. We do not know what else is different in these animals.

But each to their own. Mrs Doni now has an income, based on profiteering from this selective breeding, and marketing hype.

[hawgdawg]

Being a collector, I assume you don't get too many picassos, if any at all. I'm sure you understand the whole supply and demand thing. Picassos are the new clownfish craze and I see no problem in capitalizing on it.
Nothing wrong with selectively breeding for diffrent desirable traits (or mutations as you call it), it's done all the time. Look at most of the dogs around, they look nothing like wolves or coyotes.
By the way, i would much rather buy a mutant inbred farm raised clownfish than take one from the wild just for my own amusement (or in your case, to make a buck!)

[massman]

hawgdawg,
You're missing the point.
I'm not saying wild caught is better.
I have over 10000 captive bred clowns as well.
I am totally for captive breeding, and actively do it myself.

This is not a debate over the merits of CB vs WC, so relax. If you are so staunch in your views then I hope you don't keep any wild caught animals at all, lest that makes you a hypocrite.

I have seen only a couple of "picassos" in many years of diving. Never thought anything much of them.

The OP was asking to comment on the validity of paying $200 per fish, and wanted opinions, so mine was just that.

FYI the McCullochs clowns are expensive because they are only found around Lord Howe Island, the whole island is a world heritage area, and is fully protected.
So they are so expensive, because they have either been poached, or they are one of the few that were collected before the area became closed to fishing.

[smoke15]

Massman sounds like an "angry" breeder with ten thousand clowns kinda jealous of Doni's success. I am pretty sure if you bred a 200 dollar clown fish you would sell it as well.

[TheOtherReefer]

I have a grade A pair from Doni. I received them at 4 months old with no black what so ever. Now at 6 months old the black is really starting to fill in. The fish are very healthy and active. They dont have any genetic "deformities" just a genetic mutation. She does her part in culling the fry that have these deformities although she could easily sell them to make an extra buck. All in all what we are paying for is the "rarity" of these fish. If every LFS carried them they would be no different that any other percula.

For anyone who thinks that selectively breeding an animal for its genetic mutation is wrong or unethical the first place they should turn to is dog breeders etc.. Almost every breed of dog available has been selectively bred generation after generation to achieve the desired end. There are thousands of breeds of dogs that only exist because of this process. Just as hawgdawg said.

These fish did not have their DNA changed in any way. They are a natural occuring phenomena. The fact that two can be matched and mated shows how "normal" these fish actually are. The chance that these two fish will meet in the wild is rare, we are just helping them out ;)

If I had 400 dollars to drop on a pair I would in a heartbeat, but I opted for a grade A pair that are awesome.

my 2 cents

cheers

[massman]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14591259#post14591259 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by smoke15
Massman sounds like an "angry" breeder with ten thousand clowns kinda jealous of Doni's success. I am pretty sure if you bred a 200 dollar clown fish you would sell it as well.
I'm not angry just expressing an opinion. Sheesh!
I'm certainly not jealous. I breed latz, black ocellaris and coral sea melanopus ie no white stripe.

Cheers

[SlukBunWalla]

I love clowns. LOVE. And I would DEFINITELY pay top dollar for a natural, healthy looking pair of very rare clowns...as opposed to an unnatural looking morph of a very common clown. To me the snowflakes and piccassos look like genetic freaks...rather than a beautiful morph.

But this is completely subjective. In my store we had a green BTA that had the most blobby, gnarled tentacles I've seen on an anemone. It looked like it had been through a garbage disposal. It was VERY healthy and growing...it just happened to grow this way for one reason or another. To me it was uglier than a mud fence. But one day a customer say it and his eyes lit up. He made us an offer, snatched it up and ran out as if he had just stolen from us a great treasure.

Different strokes for different folks. If they're worth $200 to you, and they will make your reefer gland tingle with glee, go for it. You do this for you, right? If you're doing it because you'll be the cool kid with freak clowns, it hardly seems worth it...

[hawgdawg]

massman,

I might have missed the point, but re-read your post and tell me if you didn't sound like an angry jealous guy. If by "marketing ploy" you mean giving names like snowcasso to certain fish, I might agree wih you, I'm not a fan of that either. but you have to admit, it is a brillant marketing "strategy" when it works. the bottom line is that as long as there strong demand and little supply, price will be high. I'm sure you know what your latz and maccs go for here, lots of money. But they are some of the uggliest clowns I've ever seen.

I guess the whole point is that beauty is in the eye (and pocket) of the beholder.

By the way, is the coral sea melanopus with no white stripe you talk of the ephippium?

and yes, I am a hipocrit, But if given a choice between wild caught or farm raised, i'll take farm raised all the way. and no, I do not have an aquarium at home with wild caught fish for my own entertainement. My mutant inbred dog does that!

[hottuna]

I wouldnt pay 29 cents for those freakish looking misfits....

[massman]

Hawgdawg
Fair enough mate I can see how you took my post. All I wanted to say is that I feel they are overpriced for what they are. I think of late the hobby has been inundated with marketing terms. There was another thread on RC discussing this issue especially with respect to corals.

The coral sea melanopus is not an epphipium. It is a true melanopus but has the geographical variation of having no white stripe.

I also agree with you that the mccullochs and lat clowns are not particularly attractive clowns. Rarity makes a difference though.

Imagine if gem and black tangs were common they would have nowhere near the desirability they have now. The good ole yellow tang leaves them for dead appearence wise IMO.

Anyway it's all good. Difference is always good.

[Arati]

what do you mean you breed latz? I havent heard of anyone raising Latz fry. I sure would like to see some pics of that and hear how u are doing it, these guys are hard!!@! to get through meta!

OK I do know of 1 guy in europe, but he only has like 5 make it to juvys

[hawgdawg]

Fair enough massman. I wish they were cheaper too, I happen to be one of the people who find them really attractive. i would love to see a pic of the melanopus with no stripe, personally I've never seen it before. Maybe a google search will turn up something.

[Ian]

To each his own guys, no need to argue. If you don't like them, simply don't buy them. Doni is great to deal with and her clowns are very healthy and beautiful. She gets plenty of plain ol' percs through breeding and only a few come out as picassos and even fewer are her 'snowcassos', named for the excessive white markings.

Hawgdawg and Massman, you're entitled to your poinions but no need to clutter this thread with an argument that no one will 'win'....

Id buy those in a heartbeat, don't let these guys make you second guess your decision.

[jaypainter24]

anyone have info on how to contact Doni or her website?

[Phyxius]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14595569#post14595569 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by jaypainter24
anyone have info on how to contact Doni or her website?

PM sent

[tommyb]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14595569#post14595569 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by jaypainter24
anyone have info on how to contact Doni or her website?

Same here. I have done a few searches but have come up empty. Thanks.

[tommyb]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14709993#post14709993 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by tommyb
Same here. I have done a few searches but have come up empty. Thanks.

Never mind. I found it, Thanks.

[smoke15]

For what its worth. I started this thread, and DID NOT buy those 400 dollar fish. I have these and am happy with them, and their price tag was significantly less. I too found it hard to pay that price for such "young fish". I know of a few people now, whos clowns from Doni did not make it. These are not fish you can just throw into your display tank very easily. They almost need their own dedicated tank till they can grow up some. The risk seems to high for the price. Now if they where like a year old, strong and established, that may be another story!


http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f299/mardesmith/DSC_0053.jpg

[heap]

i'm not sure what my opinion is, but i hold it firmly, and it has far reaching implications.

/am i doing it right?

[Elan L.]

[QUOTE]<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14711023#post14711023 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by smoke15
[B]For what its worth. I started this thread, and DID NOT buy those 400 dollar fish. I have these and am happy with them, and their price tag was significantly less. I too found it hard to pay that price for such "young fish". I know of a few people now, whos clowns from Doni did not make it. These are not fish you can just throw into your display tank very easily. They almost need their own dedicated tank till they can grow up some. The risk seems to high for the price.


Of course! These fish are only about 1'' so it makes sense not to put them in the display. Mrs. Doni mentions this many times on her site. I just got my grade A pair and i love them! Right now they are in my 20g frag tank with a koralia 1 and a hob skimmer (no overflow boxes).

[TheOtherReefer]

thats how we roll!! right Elan!!

lol just joking but Donis clowns are first class. I have oredered 2 grade A pairs, and am completely sold on the quality.

[smoke15]

Elan and other reefer
You prove my point further. Neither of you who have chimed in to "praise" Doni dropped the 400 dollars for the snocasso's. You both ONLY bought the "cheap ones".
250 dollars for one inch of fish is steep!

[smoke15]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14711641#post14711641 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by heap
i'm not sure what my opinion is, but i hold it firmly, and it has far reaching implications.

/am i doing it right?

WHAT???? are you talking about?

[Elan L.]

yea but imagine what they will look like in 1 year. I see what you meen with the snowacassos. Personally there is too much white for me, but for someone who want a snowflake then, this is the best you can get and the price is lower than where i have seen oher picassos.

[smatter]

[QUOTE]<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14582691#post14582691 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by massman
Snowcassos?

What a load of marketing hype.
Two ugly looking clowns with mutant parents, deliberately being bred to pass on this mutant gene, so Mrs Doni whoever the heck she is can make a buck.

Kinda like a traveling circus owner having the bearded lady sleep with the world's shortest man so the offspring can continue to make him money.

Rubbish [/QUOTE

Bravo!

[Elan L.]

Its kinda like modern art. For some people, it makes them puke, and others would pay millions to have.

[forddna]

I can understand why some people wouldn't like them, but what makes them worth less for being babies? I would much rather buy a baby and watch it grow and develop, especially knowing where it came from.

I have a Grade A and a Snowcasso from Doni, purchased 2 months apart, and I'm hooked on purchasing babies. I had no issues putting babies right into my 220g tank.

Here's a baby pic of my Snowcasso. My hands are very small. I wear a size 4.5 wedding ring.


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v704/forddna/Fishies/220g/SnowcassoHand1-6-09.jpg

[TheOtherReefer]

smoke15

The argument here is that a percula is not worth more than $20 dollars no matter what the pattern. $250 or $450 for a pair makes no difference, its still a lot more than $20 dollsrs for a percula. If I had $450 to spend on a snowcasso pair I would once I found a nice pattern.

There have been several grade A's for sale that I would not spend $20 dollars on because I did not like the pattern. It's just one of those things.

In the end to each his own.

For what it's worth...I have been reefing for almost 17 years now. I have built a LFS and managed one for more than 2 years while I was studying at the university. I have kept every single type of fish and/or coral available to the hobbyist. This is a very special opportunity to own and raise a fish I have never had the chance to care for. Clowns, Tangs and Dottybacks are my favoritte fish. To be able to enjoy them in a different matter is new to me and keeps me excited about the hobby. I understand all the different points of view. This is my point of view and I look forward to seeing the fish develop and mature. If I am wrong I apologize, but it makes me happy. In the end I think that is what this hobby is all about. It can make each hobbyist happy in their own way,

cheers

[1geo]

Aqua Connection sells them for $129 each or $299 a pair. And this is for 1.5 to 2 inch stock. I have bought from them before and they have great stock. 1geo

[forddna]

Those are Picassos, which Doni sells for $50-100. I do like the ORA patterns, though.

[Sugar Magnolia]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14711641#post14711641 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by heap
i'm not sure what my opinion is, but i hold it firmly, and it has far reaching implications.

/am i doing it right?
OMG! :lol: Thanks for lightening up the thread.

I've never been a fan of the clown mutations. I prefer the standard or misbars. I have a misbar.

[FadeToGrey]

I think Picassos are very pretty fish, and I can see where $400 for a pair of 'Snowcassos' would be worth it to the right person. Personally I agree with several posters that I prefer the Picassos with a bit less white then the 'Snowcassos", but they are still lovely. (Then again, I think Anglers are adorable... so take t as you will!)

[decent37]

cant wait for all white clown fish those will be weird

[heap]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14714978#post14714978 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by smoke15
WHAT???? are you talking about?

exactly.

[rkelman]

I think they are very cool. I love Doni's fish. If people pay her $400 a pair good for her. It can be hard to imagine but her investment in her setup / electricity and food would surprise many. She does a great job and has a great setup. Her fish are very healthy from what I've seen. With that being said I am a breeder and I wouldn't sell a fish that small. I grow mine out to 1 1/4" from nose to the base of the tail (not the end)

BTW the pair you got are very nice as well.

[Ian]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14714924#post14714924 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by TheOtherReefer
lol just joking but Donis clowns are first class. I have oredered 2 grade A pairs, and am completely sold on the quality.

Agreed 100%! Ive been very happy both times Ive bought from Doni :D

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14714970#post14714970 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by smoke15
Elan and other reefer
You prove my point further. Neither of you who have chimed in to "praise" Doni dropped the 400 dollars for the snocasso's. You both ONLY bought the "cheap ones".
250 dollars for one inch of fish is steep!

How can you turn around and bash them for being happy with Donis fish, you're the one that started the thread in the first place :rolleyes: You couldn't even make a decision on your own, don't flame those that did take the leap and are happy in the end.

I have a pair from Doni, 2 pairs of ORA grade A's, a pair of snowflakes and 2 pairs of Onyx x snowflakes and the ones from Doni are def my faves. Some of the nicest picassos Ive EVER seen :eek1: If I liked the snowcassos she had at the time, Id have bought them. I don't think you can even compare Donis to ORAs, Donis are a much nicer and personable fish.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14720743#post14720743 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by forddna

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v704/forddna/Fishies/220g/SnowcassoHand1-6-09.jpg

Beautiful specimen you have there Forddna, If I could, Id buy 2 like that right now if they were avaliable!!

Anyone want to buy a pair of ORA grade A's? :lol:

[MedicalZoa]

those clowns are UGLY! sorry but all the jagged white looks really bad, even normal picasso's look werid, i prefer a reg sligt curve fully bard clownfish. there are expensive because they are rare, you cant say these fish look good. the best clown is a RODS ONYX PERCULA end of story. the snowflake, naked (look like a goldfish) and picasso clowns are there worst clowns out there and worth about 10-15$! :lol: :lol:

[colorfan45]

To each his own. Everyone likes something different thats what makes this site so neat. You dont have to se the same threads about the same old fish. Glad to see all these nice different fish.

[Jabol75]

There were days when people paid $50-$100 for one polyp pf purple death palys...:)

[Elan L.]

of course the price will go down when they become more available. I would have these over an Onyx any day! Pics dont help, and thats not what they will look like in 1-2 years.

[Dave Harms]

I don't see how "mutant" clowns are any different than what goes on in the snake breeding hobby... something cool comes up and people selectively breed for it. At first they are expensive, then they become cheaper. It's all good!

[forddna]

.

[TheOtherReefer]

All dogs are mutants of some sort. Wolves and wild dogs are the only biologically normal dogs. All the thousands of other breeds are genetic mutants bred for their "abnormality." Picassos are the same. They are a naturally occurring fish in nature. Blame evolution for their existence because picassos do occur in the wild. We are just now fortunate enough to own them.

Just restating what has been said

[colorfan45]

some dudes like fat chicks:)

[Ian]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14733499#post14733499 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by colorfan45
some dudes like fat chicks:)

:lol: Good point Jackson :lol: To each his/her own...

[smoke15]

How can you turn around and bash them for being happy with Donis wreath, you're the one that started the thread in the first place :rolleyes: You couldn't even make a decision on your own, don't flame those that did take the leap and are happy in the end.


Iam Bro! The post was not about her 100 dollar grade A wreath. It was asking about paying 450 dollars for her snocasso's. I was not bashing them at all for being happy with their grade A wreath. I was commenting on the fact that neither of them myself included paid 450 dollars for two clownwreath. I did decide, and it was a NO on 450 dollars for two VERY young clownwreath.
Please understand the thread before you bash me.

[Pudding Billy]

Who is this Doni person? and how do you go about shopping for these ridiculously expensive fish?

[forddna]

Why would you want to shop for them if you feel they are "ridiculously expensive?"

[AcroporAddict]

www.donisreef.com Mods-please delete if not appropriate.
Dave

[dwestUSF]

I would prefer to spend $200 on a AC'ed fish that has a better chance of living in captivity than less money on a WC fish that may or may not survive shipping. This is the price we pay for be a little more responsible.

[nickbme06]

Nice looking clowns!

[this is me]

Hhahahahaa

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14733499#post14733499 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by colorfan45
some dudes like fat chicks:)

[Jflip2002]

Thats good news to hear Donni's clowns are nice. IVe been really contemplating getting a pair, but I Didnt want to be stuck with a wasted $400, especially for clowns, lol.

Ian, do you have pics of the ORA pair? I may be interested =)

[DeathWish302]

You guys can keep your clown anomalies and I'll take all your unwanted 'regular' fish. I guess I'm like the guy that collects all the unwanted cats/dogs only I collect the clowns. Besides, who would pay $200 for an albino oscar. Give me a break....they're like 1/3 more than the cost of a non-albino specimen.

For me, there is only ONE clown that would fetch any amount of Benjamins and that is Amphiprion Omanensis (Oman Clown). That caudal fin is breath-taking and color pattern pops to my eyes. Will I ever find one.....NO, Would I spend $1000+ if I did.......yes (as the wallet groans).

How many people would say I was a fool for buying that 'ugly' brown turd of a clown.....ALOT!

Opinions are like......clowns, everyone has their own favorite.

[Jflip2002]

Yep, to each their own.... I was happy just finding my half naked clowns yesterday, lol. I think people just love clownfish, and are looking for something a little different than what everyone else has.

[DeathWish302]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=14772413#post14772413 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Jflip2002
Yep, to each their own.... I was happy just finding my half naked clowns yesterday, lol. I think people just love clownfish, and are looking for something a little different than what everyone else has.

Rightly stated..... How many Oman clown's have you seen in captivity?
Long live the Sultan. Hehe

[TheOtherReefer]

Doni just recently had her first snowcasso spawn. If all goes well the price might be going down in the near future once all the immediate demand is satisfied. I dont see snowcassos going for 200 each for that long. In a couple years the price will probably be half of what it is now.

I am not sure if the arguement of some of the posters is the fact that the fish are snowcasso varients or that they are more expensive than regular perculas.

Interesting that this thread is already 3 pages long.

[smoke15]

My argument is definitely that the Snocasso's cost 2-4 times as much as the other picasso's