Questions about Resiliconing/Leak-proof tank

[Samcorp]

Hi everyone. I have a 90 gallon tank I bought used and I have been hearing many stories about "leaks" and "future-leaks."

So a few questions:

A) The tank (according to the tag on the bottom) was made in 1995. This tank was used for salt water according to the owner who sold it to me.

B) The seams still look factory sealed and professionally done, but the back left seam seems a bit scratched up, although it does not seem like something to worry over.... (?)

C) I've also read that some people have issues with water dripping out of their overflows because the "o ring" that comes with the bulkhead will "not last forever." How do I counter this? I want to make sure my bulkhead does not leak as this 90 gallon tank is on CARPET. The bulkhead also has thread tape on it and 2 o rings on both sides. Do I also need to use a wrench to tighten this bulkhead? Will it be necessary?

D) Same as the bulkhead on the overflow, I have another one on the sump which I am using to serve as a "Cap" for the hole that the previous owner drilled. This "Cap" has a rubber gasket or "washer" type of circular rubber that I cut out which I put on both sides and then tightened it. Do I need to use a wrench to tighten this (Its on an acrylic sump) or is it okay? I already tested it and it does not leak.


I really don't want to resilicone the tank, however, if I have to, then I guess I have no choice. I have NOT done a leak test yet but honestly I would rather get it right from the beginning.

ALSO: The stand that came with the tank is one of them older stands made of particle board. It is factory glossy black painted on the outside and the inside has simply 4 walls of particle board and a "top frame" which sits on the 4 walls. I was nervous about the strength of this stand originally because the bottom board (rectangular piece) was warped really badly. So I brought this to a woodshop and I was told to put 4 corner "braces" type of thing; their a strip of wood that run across each corner, somewhat small. I also took out the whole bottom and added a much better piece of wood which was then glued to the frame. Finally, I added corner braces to the top so that the walls don't change angles (past 90 degrees).

Sorry that this message is so bulky, but, is this stand pretty much safe for at this point for the 90 gallon tank? I worry a lot because this is my first salt water tank (and reef) and I really cannot mess anything up. Getting salt water on the carpet alone is bad enough, but with a huge tank collapsing on the floor is a whole other situation.


Thanks,


Sam

[fish2009]

Let me try and answer your questions in order.

I have seen tanks in use for over 10 years without issue. I would be very concerned if any of the seams look damaged. Certainly give this tank a complete water test before installing it. As far as resealing the tank. I would consider doing that for a system that is going in a basement or garage where you have easy cleanup but 90 gallons is alot of water.

As far as bulkheads go, these are hand tight fittings. Using a wrench can lead to a disaster in a fast hurry. That being said, I have been known to pull out the pipe wrenches for careful turn.

Your o-rings can generate leaks but we are talking about several years if at all. When installing new bulkheads I use just a dab of vaseline on the o-ring to ensure it seats in place withought getting stretched or kinked.

As far as your stand goes, look for swelling of the particle board. This will happen when the wood gets wet. I try to avoid these stands as they make me a bit nervous also but if the integrity of the work is ok then you will probably be alright. Again, I would suggest setting it up outside and give it a bit of pressure in different directions to see how the stand holds up. If it collapses at least you are not cleaning water up from your carpet for the next week. (just wood and glass from the yard).

[Samcorp]

Thanks for answering my questions. With the wooden stand, my teacher in my woodshop at school "reinforced it" and believes that its strong enough. When I brought it back it felt VERY sturdy, infact, I was unable to even "shake" the walls without the whole stand being shaken.
The o-rings are from the overflow that came with it, which is, I would guess, around 10 years old. Would they still be suitable for my operation? I did however buy a new bulkhead at Home depot, just not the o-rings.
Also, the new piece of wood that was put as the "bottom piece" is bare, along with everything else inside the stand (nothing is painted on the inside). Because of this I feel that I probably won't get water on the walls as I am quite careful, but the bottom piece of wood may get splashed with some water. Therefore I decided that I will put a black "trash bag" on the bottom and hopefully if any water splashes on it I will simply wipe it off.

Will this work?

[Samcorp]

bump

[Samcorp]

Bump, again...

[fsn77]

I would suggest painting the inside of the stand. No matter how careful you try to be, you will get water on the walls / bottom. I paint the inside of all my stands with 3 coats of exterior latex paint and have not had any problems. I use white, as it tends to make things a little bit easier to see under there compared to something dark that doesn't reflect light as much.

The part of the silicone that's providing the seal is at the actual joint where the pieces of glass meet. The little bit that flares out on each side of the joint is not where the seal gets its strength. If the outside edges of the glass aren't chipped / cracked and the silicone where the pieces of glass meet is still in good shape, the tank should not leak. If the thin flared out film of silicone in the corners is only a little less than ideal, the bond between the pieces of glass should not be damaged. You'll have to inspect it closely to verify. Every tank should get a leak test before being set up, especially one that's used and more than 5 years old.

When setting up any used tank, the cost of replacing all the bulkhead fittings and o-rings is minimal compared to the headaches of cleaning up the mess that results from one that failed.

[serpentman]

Like FSN said, the silicone bead on the inside of the glass is more or less to protect the seal between the glass and is not structural. I have had tanks where this is completely gone after years of scraping coralline, etc. with no leaks.

I would make sure to leak test any new tank prior to use. One trick is to set the new tank on newspaper and fill it, taking care not to wet the paper. The paper visibly darkens when any absorbing moisture and will show leaks.

Definitely replace the bulkheads. Small amt of money and will save headaches.

[Samcorp]

What I mean by the bulkheads is do I have to replace the O-rings? I already replaced the bulkheads (at homedepot) but I feel like using the o-rings again couldn't hurt. What do you guys think? Also, I did a leak test in the house and luckily the tank seems in VERY good shape still. No water leaked and everything is pretty stable.

Could a small warp in the wall of the stand result in any possible danger? I noticed that the front left wall began to warp a tiny bit about 1/4" away from the corner brace and this worried me. The whole stand structure was reinforced by my teacher and I so it currently is at least, strong enough to hold the tank.

[Samcorp]

Also, do you guys know if flushing salt water down a toilet is dangerous for any of the pipes?

[fsn77]

Yes, it's a good idea to replace the o-rings. Considering they are the part actually creating the seal between the fitting and the glass, it's definitely wise to replace them. Only one is required per bulkhead fitting -- between the flange and the glass (not between the nut and the glass).

If the drain pipes in your place are metal, there could be issues if you're not running good amounts of freshwater down the pipes after putting the saltwater down them, but should really only create a problem if the saltwater is pooling somewhere in the metal pipes (such as in a drain trap). Our house has metal drain pipes and I simply flush the toilet a couple of times after I pour the saltwater in that toilet to help dilute it. It's also a toilet we use regularly, so it gets flushed 3 - 5 times per day anyway.

[Samcorp]

Okay. Regarding the o-rings, why would it be necessary to replace them? I just don't want to spend another trip to home depot (5th or 6th one already) just to get some rubber rings..

[fsn77]

With age and exposure to saltwater, they will "dry out" and may come become stiff, brittle / less pliable, and/or shrink, potentially causing a leak because they no longer form a proper seal. While not made from the same material, think of how poorly suction cups perform in a marine tank over time.

[Samcorp]

What about the use of thread tape in the bulkhead fittings? Does this help? Currently my overflow is not leaking with the o-rings plus thread tape I used. Sorry to sound so picky, but I really want to resist going back to HD just to get rings, as right now I am finishing off the plumbing and taking it apart again would simply be annoying.

[sikpupy]

Stop being a student, or, start being a student and listen to the teachers.

Get new o-rings, pronto! I have been to home depot 20+ times for my setup, sucks but man up!

If your worried about the silicone, do what I did. Buy two tubes of tank silicone and just go over the silicone thats in there after you scrub the glass around it spotless. The seal will reseal any flaking silicone that may/would have leaked if there was a leak and you still have the original bond holding everything together.

You have threads? Teflon helps. Use it or have leaks like I do for being hard headed.

Walls on the stand do not matter, its where the tank sits on the bracing thats important.


Now, "get er done!".

[Samcorp]

Sikpupy, I read that if I put a layer of silicone over the existing silicone it will simply fall off because it does not stick well.

After filling the tank for a leak test it seems to be in quite good condition, I don't see any bowing within the glass and the silicone seems sturdy. Now that there is water in the tank I can see much more clearly if the silicone seams are damaged and the only part that I thought could be somewhat damaged is the back-left corner, however, its not "Actually damaged." The side, not the important silicone portion between the glass panels, has a very tiny portion of silicone that seems to be pushed a tiny bit from general wear. However, the seam is not at all damaged and the part that's pushed is very minimal. Sorry about how bulky this message is, its very hard to explain this without a picture. The main idea is the seam seems in good condition and there are really technically no/very little damage to the silicone.

Regarding the stand, the walls seem to be holding up the four sides because (this stand is older) the portion where the tank sits on is almost essentially them walls.

The bowing of the wall of the stand seems not very important, as only one of the walls are bowing a bit,however, after I drain the tank I will do one more check on the stand and possibly drill some "braces" on the bottom portion of the stand. I however, doubt it will be necessary because of how sturdy it is already (since I reinforced it).

Home depot does sell o-rings, right? :)