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View Full Version : Is this pinched mental 12" Squamosa?


docsky
08/25/2009, 09:28 AM
I bought this clam back in july and it has look this way ever since i put it in my tank! I bought it
based off of photos and it was in a bucket already when i picked it up so i don't know how it looked in the tank i got it from. Since adding it one other Squamosa has taken a turn for the worse along with my two Crocea.

I also have 2 Maxima and a Derasa that look fine? Any ideas! My clams were all doing great... some close to 3 years now, then i ad the giant Sq and now i don't know whats going on.

The moorish does not nip, no other nippers either. I check and have no snails. Is this PM. should i FW dip him. I had to loose this big guy!
http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/158316sq2.jpg http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/158316sq1.jpg

Ohiomom
08/25/2009, 09:45 AM
People are going to need more info about your tank..lighting, water parameters, calcium levels..and the list goes on...:)

docsky
08/25/2009, 11:16 AM
150 mixed reef mostly zoa's and sps and 7 clams 200g total
Cal 450-480
ph 7-8
salinity 1.025
3 250W DE MH phoenix 14k for light
tanks been set up 3 years
i don't run any media like gfo or carbon

Is that enough info to get started?
side note coral and fish look healthy

sahin
08/25/2009, 03:37 PM
Looking at the larger photo, I am almost certain the clam is exhibiting PMD especially looking at the right side of the clams mantle.

I ad a Deresa clam abot 6 years ago that had the PMD. After a couple tries with FW dips the clam fuly recovered.

To say for certain based on photos alone, I would need to see a clearer/sharper photo. Search the clam forum. Me and Minh discussed PMD years ago and then again recently. If YOU decide to do a FW dip, there are old threads that explain how.

OrionN
08/25/2009, 07:10 PM
We certainly discussed this disease why back in 2002. I posted this back then and copy it here:

I was asked why I think this is a disease by PM. I though that I post the answer here so I don't have to keep on write the same thing over and over.

I keep clams for a while now and can see when they are not well. I fought with this disease for over 1 year. There are many reasons for a clam to retract their mantles. There must be other disease out there that bother clams, and will cause their mantles to retracted. However, the mantle retraction due to Pinched Mantle Disease (PMD) is unique. The following are what I consider specific characteristics for PMD:

1. There is no visible cause of irritation to the mantle of the clam.
2. The retraction is at the same place day after day and spreading to adjacent part of the mantle. In tank that is heavy infested with the disease, a clam can have several area on the mantel that retracted at the same time.
3. This is a slow infection. Larger, healthier clams can last for months. Weaker clams can succumb to this disease in days to weeks.
4. The retraction is less in AM and worst in PM. There is often mucus threats in the area of the retracted mantles.
5. The spread of the disease is often proximity. Nearer clams get infected much quicker than clams farther away.
6. Early infection can be asymptomatic.

This disease can be easily treat with fresh water dip for 30 minutes (maybe less) I have never try to dip for less time. Treatment is (much) more effective if the clam is remove and place in a new, disease free tank (100% effective if the clam is put in a new tank). Treatment can be effective if treat and return to the same tank if all clams are treat at the same time. This is likely due to the fact that early infection is asymptomatic and the pathogen seem to be obligate to live on clam with short host free period (This is my guess)
Goodluck to everybody with this disease in their tank.

Minh

__________________

coral_lagoon
08/25/2009, 07:56 PM
Is PMD some kind of bacterial infection? Or is it viral?

Jay03GT
08/25/2009, 09:16 PM
My own experience with PM, with alot of research on what used to be the old clamsdirect forum led me to just add alot of carbon, alot of carbon. I run it in a reactor like most use for phosban, I pack it almost full. It has worked in every case but one. I have one larger Crocea, approaching 5" now, a Maxima that is 3.5", and I added 3 small maxima's that were <1.5". When I added the small ones is when I had trouble with PM, one of the small ones displayed this issue, and my Crocea started showing signs of it shortly after. Carbon cured my Crocea, and it never spread to any of the other clams. The small one never recovered no matter what I tried, fresh water dips, nothing helped. But it has been about 9 months and I still have the other 2 small ones that are growing quite well now.

So based on my experiences, I'd recommend packing as much carbon into a reactor as you can, well rinsed in RO water carbon. Give it a week and see if it helps. Only then would I go to the stressful step of a freshwater dip.

One last thing, for anyone that used phosban. Rinse it well, very well. I had a problem with PM on my Crocea every time I changed my phosban out, it was a small problem that went away after a week of so. I started rinsing my phosban better. Previously I would add the phosban and use agallon container of RO water with a maxijet and hose to rinse the reactor. Now I use 2-3 gallons in a bucket the same way, before the water always came out clear, but I still had issues. Now with the extra water to flush the reactor I no longer have that issue.

Jay03GT
08/25/2009, 09:18 PM
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15594195#post15594195 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by coral_lagoon
Is PMD some kind of bacterial infection? Or is it viral?

I don't think it has been determined. It has been known to spread from clam to clam, and there was a study ongoing attempting to discover this. I'll see if I can find anything out since I last looked for it.

OrionN
08/25/2009, 09:24 PM
From my observations on how it transmit, how the disease progress in larger clams and how it is response to FWD, my guess is that it is most likely an unicellular external parasite, likely a protozoa.

coral_lagoon
08/25/2009, 09:34 PM
If thats the case. Then wouldn't it be beneficial to run a UV sterilizer, or perhaps even Ozone?

Outerbank
09/04/2009, 01:13 PM
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15594759#post15594759 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by OrionN
From my observations on how it transmit, how the disease progress in larger clams and how it is response to FWD, my guess is that it is most likely an unicellular external parasite, likely a protozoa.

Mihn, we should take some scrapings and look at them under a microscope.

Scott

ludiNano
09/09/2009, 07:39 PM
wouldnt you have to scrap the mantle then?