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View Full Version : How much turn over to keep O2 up during power outage


slow_leak
10/15/2009, 11:52 AM
I am asking this in chemistry section as I didn't want a equipment vendor answer.

During emergency power outage what is the minimum tank turn over require to maintain O2 levels until power returns assuming temperature is OK??

I know it is open ended question.

I was considering a solution of DC backup that would power 12V @ 20 amps for 30 hours with 2100 gph on a 140 gallon tank or 15X. I would think this would be plenty. Vortech has lower output but potential to run longer on same battery.

Anyone know this??

Billybeau1
10/15/2009, 12:10 PM
I don't know that there is a pat answer for this. Much depends on tank load (the amount of fish) using O<sub>2</sub> in the water column.

I have a 550 watt generator in my garage for such emergencies. If power is going to be out for awhile, I fire up the generator and plug in my fish tank, refrigerator, freezer, sump pump and, of course, the television. :D

That said, your first choice looks reasonable, as long as the cost is not outrages. I think my generator cost me about 600 bucks and serves a dual purpose. I have never used a battery backup so I can not comment on its effectiveness. :)

slow_leak
10/15/2009, 12:19 PM
600 for a generator is cheap. I do have a generator but not much use if you don't get back very quickly. I lost everything (nice) because I wasn't around to push a ground fault after a storm. I didn't know it tripped and neighbor was clueless and didn't bother to leave a message. Had about 8 years of growth in a growout display. I don't frag and frag like everybody else.

I'm leaning toward a solution that would intentionally use the same battery as my old Jeep so I have a use for that as well. I'm also half leaning toward puppy instead too

Boomer
10/15/2009, 12:58 PM
Have you looked at things like a UPS (Unlimited Power Supply)

APC
http://www.apc.com/index.cfm

bertoni
10/15/2009, 01:14 PM
15x should be enough to maintain oxygenation in most systems. If the setup can do that, the tank likely will be fine.

The UPS units can work, too, but I've never seen a good model of how long they'll work with aquarium equipment. They're mostly designed for electronics workloads.

BrassMonkey
10/15/2009, 01:26 PM
a big deep cycle battery and a trickle charger? i believe the vortec automatically pulls from the battery when losing power.

slow_leak
10/15/2009, 01:37 PM
For 169 usd that Vortech charges you for the upgrade you can buy your own 12V car battery with 50 amp hour instead of 18 rated amp hours and a trickle charger and come out cheaper. CCA(cold cranking amps) / 20 estimates Ah(amp hours)

MPW40 draws at 0.6 aH for its battery to actually last 30hrs (enough meaningful flow??)
Tunze 6105 draws at 1.7 aH (20 watts) and lasts 30hrs with 1000 cca battery (2100 gph)

I'll look at life of 110 A/C inverter on Car battery. Thanks, Ive assumed it would be short lived but since I learned about amp hours I'll check again. That would be the cheapest way to go

slow_leak
10/15/2009, 01:54 PM
Thanks BOOMER!!!

instead of UPC

DC car battery with 80watt continous inverter to run an old A/C Tunze stream might make more sense. If I could get at least 12 hours out of it. I don't understand power consumption of inverters yet. Atleast if I bought 1000 cca battery I could use that on a Jeep in future.

Mike31154
10/15/2009, 11:10 PM
Careful with battery selection. A 'car' battery is not best solution for deep discharge. Marine/deep cycle is preferred for the application you are looking at.

slow_leak
10/16/2009, 04:56 AM
One I selected was called Deep Cycle but I'll look into it more.

To make a AC pump a back up an APC is required. Pump life is rather dismal in most cases on any reasonably priced UPS for low watt extended life as UPS are designed to give time to shut down work on PC's. Spending close to 2 hundred will give less than 4 hours life if that after inverter wears down battery.

Hooking an AC pump to a deep cycle battery requires an inverter, trickle charger, and relay switch before the battery to prevent constant inverter use.

Selling old equipment including old AC stream pump will pay for upgrade to what will actually work best 'I think'. I'm getting Tunze 6105 and their relay switch 6105.50. I will see if my old Jeep has a deep cycle option as it will need replacement in a year or two anyway.

Randy Holmes-Farley
10/16/2009, 04:58 AM
I use a huge industrial vehicle battery from Sears (actually, two of them). You can search through their catalog and see that it has more deep cycle capacity even than their deep cycle marine batteries.

It is very heavy, so it is a bear to get inside.

slow_leak
10/16/2009, 07:17 AM
Do you know name or model as it doesn't appear on website?

sjm817
10/16/2009, 10:16 AM
If you are going to use Vortechs, a 24VDC battery setup would be nice since you could run @ full power.

Randy Holmes-Farley
10/16/2009, 11:59 AM
Do you know name or model as it doesn't appear on website?

You might ask at the local sears automotive. I recall that they did not list them online. I don't see the exact one now. The most recent purchase is a Die Hard 20761. It has 1000 CCA and 295 amp-hour RC.

The only similar ones I see online are really pricey, like this one:

http://www.apexbattery.com/8g4d-gel-rv-battery-group-4d--12v-210ah-rv-batteries.html

or

http://www.apexbattery.com/8g8d-gel-rv-battery-group-8d--12v-265ah-rv-batteries.html

slow_leak
10/16/2009, 12:18 PM
I looked today and saw batteries over 1000 cca had 100-300 aH ratings. Costs are 250 to 1000 currently too. I'll ask about your model # -Thanks!

Looks like a market opportunity for people selling improved solar batteries as costs are absurd right now. So much so that I was put off at considering Solar power for next few years. DieHard Marine Battery, Platinum PM-1 - Group Size 31M (with exchange) on hold with company discount

They are suppose to be based on military specs. Not bad for current prices.

slow_leak
10/19/2009, 11:33 AM
Industrial Die Hard no longer available at sears, or they didn't want to order it.

I sold all other parts to get Tunze 6105, 6105.50 switch and 100 aH deep cycle battery so It should last two and half days at 12 volts. I'll look in solar another time. A shame something bad happened to make me ready for next time.