PDA

View Full Version : Can someone help me understand the temp programming?


fmelindy
11/20/2009, 06:02 AM
I am probably just an idiot, but I can't understand the temp programming. I have it set to turn my halides off when the temp gets above 82 but when it does the temp probe is constantly swinging between 81.9 and 82.1 and turning the halides on and off continuously. I can't imagine that it's good for the ballasts and/or bulbs and it's also really annoying! How do I fix that? Thanks in advance fo your help.

Paradiddle7
11/20/2009, 09:42 AM
Exactly my point as to why it would be nice to develop better software.

You will find instructions here:
http://www.aquatronica.it/pdf_download/eng/ISACQ110C-0_ENG.pdf

Look on page 45.

Basically you need to specify the Min(Delta) and Max(Delta). Think of it as a buffer zone or some padding. The controller won't do what you are telling it until the temp reaches your Reference Temp + Max(Delta) for the upper line, and Ref Temp - Min(Delta) for the lower line.

You also have to understand "Program Priority" which is on Page 22. Since the Temperature program has a higher priority than a Program Timer (which normally controls your lights), your temperature program lower bar settings will NOT relinquish control of your lights to your lights normal program timer until the temp in your tank has reached the Ref Temp - Min(Delta).

I hope this makes sense. It's something that everyone has to learn when they first get the controller.

If I could write pc software for the controller, we could make the programming a lot more clear PLUS, we could give you a virtual tank, so you could starting changing tank params and see which plugs would be turning off and on based on programs.

RobbyG
11/23/2009, 12:39 PM
Exactly my point as to why it would be nice to develop better software.

You will find instructions here:
http://www.aquatronica.it/pdf_download/eng/ISACQ110C-0_ENG.pdf

Look on page 45.

Basically you need to specify the Min(Delta) and Max(Delta). Think of it as a buffer zone or some padding. The controller won't do what you are telling it until the temp reaches your Reference Temp + Max(Delta) for the upper line, and Ref Temp - Min(Delta) for the lower line.

You also have to understand "Program Priority" which is on Page 22. Since the Temperature program has a higher priority than a Program Timer (which normally controls your lights), your temperature program lower bar settings will NOT relinquish control of your lights to your lights normal program timer until the temp in your tank has reached the Ref Temp - Min(Delta).

I hope this makes sense. It's something that everyone has to learn when they first get the controller.

If I could write pc software for the controller, we could make the programming a lot more clear PLUS, we could give you a virtual tank, so you could starting changing tank params and see which plugs would be turning off and on based on programs.

Paradiddle I am trying to understand why your saying this! All you need to do is set the Delta's (it's clear as day in the manual) How is new software going to fix the fact that he did not have large enough deltas set????
I get your point that the software could be a little more user friendly and maybe not require one to read the manual'; maybe I am old school but I like reading the manuals and to me after reading the manual it's all very easy and it's pretty good as is.

Even if you did a new PC interface, most people only use it now and then it would mainly be useful for people who have PC's hooked up 24/7 and thats very few people.

BTW don't get me wrong, I would love to see a new Aquatronia in 2010 with color LCD display and a whole bunch of new add-ons but I have seen first hand the Hit that the Aquarium industry has taken since the economy crashed and I don't think it's realistic in this environment to expect that new products will be coming out until the economic picture looks brighter.

Paradiddle7
11/23/2009, 01:40 PM
Making the temp programs could be a lot more intuitive. I haven't even put more than 30 seconds thought into it but imagine just a few simple things like:

1. A natural expression builder that generates text as you play with the reference temp and the delta's. "Plug 6 ("Heaters") will turn OFF when the temperature in your tank Equals or Exceeds 82.1F".

2. A test mode (virtual), where you change the temp in your virtual tank and watch the plug states change based on your programming.

It may not be practical to add this type of functionality to the controller itself but I'm sure within 5 years, the software on the controller itself will be more robust as well. I prefer to use the PC to program my controller. It's much faster and easier IMO.

The other thing that the AT PC software is NOT good at is showing you how each program affects other programs, based on parameters and priority. A virtual tank would really be useful in that regard.

These type of features would excite me if i was doing research and about to make a purchasing decision again.

RobbyG
11/23/2009, 02:34 PM
I hear you, the virtual aquarium would be pretty cool, it's a good plan but not sure if it will be feasible if your waiting on Aquatronica. Your best bet might be just to build a simulator based on the way you observe the units operation. After all it’s not the space shuttle :) its fairly basic compared to many other things out there.

If you look at what Aquatronica was competing against 5 years ago, the Neptune systems where like Tube Radios and they where building an Ipod. Now 5 years later the others are still trying to catch up and duplicate what Aquatronica did a long time ago. My feeling is that they believe the competition has not caught up yet so they might not feel pressured. Keep in mind that America is only a small part of there sales, it’s really Europe were they do huge sales and so the demand over there will most likely dictate what they do.

fmelindy
11/23/2009, 02:51 PM
I agree that it should have been a little more obvious to me, but unfortunately I got mine used and didn't have a manual! (yes, I also the manual is online for browsing, but I just hate browsing electronic documents - and please don't say "just print it off", not even I am that stupid, I just don't have a printer!)

Paradiddle7
11/23/2009, 03:08 PM
Yeah. The virtual tank would be pretty easy to program but without 100% KNOWING that you are running the simulator with the same settings that are in your controller, it just seems like it would be a HUGE PITA supporting the app. Do you know how many people will email all ****ed off saying that the simulator doesn't work because they had everything setup and the simulator said one thing but the AT controller did another? It's just a disaster waiting to happen. Again, all AT has to do is provide a function on the pc software to let us export the settings to xml or some other readable format. Then everyone programs their AT using the pc software or their controller, and then uses the pc software to export their settings to a file that the simulator can read. Then play with the simulator and make changes as necessary.

It would really be a cool feature and would provide a LOT of value for the user. Without an export function, users would have to program the settings manually on the virtual controller, and that means that I would have to duplicate the interface on the controller itself or the pc software, or both and that's just a horrible waste of time.

ik2vov
11/23/2009, 04:06 PM
Paradiddle7,
the only way you can export or receive data is using the Ethernet module.
Aquatronica will NOT give the possibility to "read" the data that comes from the controller to the PC and back, these are crypted and the reason have been given many times.
I'm pretty shure there is the possibility to do better then what Aquatronica did with the controller user interface and with the PC software, possibly in the future Aquatronica will make a better PC program, but now this is the program we have to use.

Bye

P.S. sorry fmelindy I was off topic..... if you steel need help for the temperature program, it' really (for me) simple, you have a value that you like to keep, you have a delta min and a delta max, this are the values between you like the heater or refrigerator/fan have to work..... for example if you like to keep the tank at 25° with an histeresys (delta) of 0,5°, you can set for the refrigerator:
Value: 25°
Delta min = 0
Delta max = 0,5
Plug = select the plug from the higher row

Bye

Paradiddle7
11/24/2009, 10:41 PM
ik2vov: I'm not talking about reading data from the controller. You know how you can use the PC software to "save" your settings to a file (for backup or whatever) and then you can reimport those settings into the controller? If we could read that file format, then once you set your controller settings (using either the pc software or the controller) we could import those settings into a virtual tank program, so we could see how our AT will work with changing tank params etc...

fmelindy
12/13/2009, 04:25 PM
I have to say, I still don't get it.... or at least I can't get it to do what I want. I'm embarassed to admit it, actually, because it sounds so intuitive. But anyway, I still have the same problem. I have the temp reference set at 81 and the delta max at 1.0 and the delta min at 1.0. With that, I have specified the metal halides to go out when the temp reaches the correct temp, which I'm assuming is the reference plus the delta max. It does that just fine, but then it just keeps switching on and off every few minutes, despite the fact that it hasn't reached the specified low temp (reference minus delta min, right?) What am I doing wrong? It's gotten to the point where the only purpose of the temp sensor is to actually monitor the temp (!haha!), and I don't seem to be able to do any temp-based programming at all. Anybody have any ideas?

Paradiddle7
12/13/2009, 08:53 PM
In your temp program, what did you specify to do with the upper and lower plug bars, specifically with the plug controlling your lights?

fmelindy
12/14/2009, 03:03 AM
on the upper bar, I indicated the metal halides should go off above the reference + delta max. I left the bottom bar alone (default program).