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View Full Version : reef crystals is a scam!!


jayb12
02/06/2010, 04:24 PM
what gives? started buying this salt because its cheaper then seachem however when i mix my 55 gallon jug it uses 3/4 of the bucket! im lucky if i get 100 gallons out of a supposid 160 gallon bucket!

mixing salt at 75 degree's to 1.025!

anyone else have this problem?

graveyardworm
02/06/2010, 04:28 PM
How are you measuring the salinity? Check on the bucket and see what they use for salinity reference. Usually its lower than 1.025 which would help to explain a bit, but to only get 100g out of a 160g bucket is quite a bit off.

jbird69
02/06/2010, 04:31 PM
Most salts are rated to be mixed to 1.023. Thats not enough af a difference to get the results your seeing so I would double check calibration of your refractometer.

BTW I doubt the mods are gonna be to thrilled with the thread title...

SDguy
02/06/2010, 04:33 PM
I would SO quadruple check everything before starting a thread like this.

Sk8r
02/06/2010, 04:37 PM
The ordinary proportion is 1/2 cup of salt mix per gallon; to mix 100 gallons of salt water would take 50 cups of salt. That is a fair amount of salt. If each cup of salt weighs 10 oz, (I'm figuring the average weight of plain table salt, just for a ballpark) 50 cups of salt weighs a very ballpark 500 oz, or somewhere over 31 lbs. I can about lift a salt bucket, which puts its average weight somewhere near 50 lbs. That would mean it should be able to, indeed, mix about 160 gallons of saltwater. Do crosscheck your refractometer. Miscalibration can do a major fatal lot of damage and cost you hundreds of dollars. Be sure of that instrument, above all things.

lougotzz
02/06/2010, 05:03 PM
Reef crystals refrences to 1.021 SG, I just bought some yesterday at the store, although I do like seachem myself.

jayb12
02/06/2010, 05:52 PM
i used reef crystals years ago and i swear it was measured to 1.025 at 160 gal bucket.

now i see where my extra salt is going.

however, yes i think reef crystals now is a scam more then ever. they boast a bucket will net 160 gallons, but who on earth runs a reef tank at 1.021!!!
small print is shady shady!

lougotzz
02/06/2010, 06:50 PM
i used reef crystals years ago and i swear it was measured to 1.025 at 160 gal bucket.

now i see where my extra salt is going.

however, yes i think reef crystals now is a scam more then ever. they boast a bucket will net 160 gallons, but who on earth runs a reef tank at 1.021!!!
small print is shady shady!

no....a scam would be they tell you it makes 160 gallons with a SG of 1.025 The box tells you clearly that it makes a sg of 1.021. Im looking at the box now, its pretty much right in front of my face.

Octoshark
02/06/2010, 06:55 PM
no....a scam would be they tell you it makes 160 gallons with a SG of 1.025 The box tells you clearly that it makes a sg of 1.021. Im looking at the box now, its pretty much right in front of my face.

lol, thats true ;)

Shady? Yes...

Scam? No...

Jeff
02/06/2010, 07:00 PM
no....a scam would be they tell you it makes 160 gallons with a SG of 1.025 The box tells you clearly that it makes a sg of 1.021. Im looking at the box now, its pretty much right in front of my face.
True but the fact that it's called "Reef" Crystals, not "Fish Only" Crystals tells me that they think natural "Reefs" have a specific gravity of 1.021 or they have found a way to rip us off. Either way, I don't like their salt for other reasons. I've always said the best thing about Reef Crystals is the bucket it comes in.

jayb12
02/06/2010, 07:11 PM
True but the fact that it's called "Reef" Crystals, not "Fish Only" Crystals tells me that they think natural "Reefs" have a specific gravity of 1.021 or they have found a way to rip us off.

my thoughts exactly. dont call if reef crystals and say it makes 160 gallons for your reef tank when it clearly will not.

so in reality. making a bucket of this stuff roughly only gets you 100 gallons of actual 1.025 reef water.

that to me is a shady marketing ploy.

jayb12
02/06/2010, 07:13 PM
no....a scam would be they tell you it makes 160 gallons with a SG of 1.025 The box tells you clearly that it makes a sg of 1.021. Im looking at the box now, its pretty much right in front of my face.

show me a reef that runs on 1.021 water like they suggest.

graveyardworm
02/07/2010, 06:50 AM
FWIW most of the salt manufacturers list their SG specs at below what we consider proper reef salinity. Its not a scam its a conspiracy. :uzi:

Neuticle
02/07/2010, 07:19 AM
IMO, it's no different than Lays telling you a serving size is 8 chips, show me the skeleton that eats 8 chips with their sandwich :)

stanlalee
02/07/2010, 07:30 AM
lol, thats true ;)

Shady? Yes...

Scam? No...

its been a long industry standard and they dont change it for good reason.
If tommorow all the 5g buckets of reef crystals had and were advertised 100g salt mix for $45 while everybody else is still usng the widely accepted standard and has 150 or 160g stamped and advertised on their bucket reef crystal would instantly start losing sales especially from new hobbyist walking into a store not knowing its just like everybody else. then there would be that group of current users who cant rationalize and feel like they've been getting deceived all this time like when ford dropped their then 225hp V8s to 215 with no changes due to different SAE standards and some people just cant get it.

SleepyJ
02/07/2010, 07:36 AM
Have you considered writing Spectrum Brands to give them your feedback? Posting here doesn't do a whole lot except maybe make you feel better. Writing the actual company gives them valuable information which may lead to a change in process.

Yogre
02/07/2010, 07:36 AM
I've always had to use more than 1/2 cup to get 1.026 salinity with Reef Crystals... usually about 0.6 cups per gallon.

I doubt they believe that reefs run at 1.021, I think they just want to make more money from us. :rollface: Irritates me, I do like truth in advertising, but that seems to be a bit of a rarity these days.

I'm thinking of changing salts, mostly because of the vitamin issue; no way to know what they degrade into when in a storage tank.

P.S. as stanalee said above, they're not going to change their labeling practice if everyone else does it, no one is going to take a self-inflicted head wound in these economic times.

graveyardworm
02/07/2010, 08:20 AM
You may find that change is coming. Some of the newer brands I believe are labeling their salts to mix at 1.025-1.026. Perhaps someone using the Brightwell or other newer stuff can chime in to verify.

Okay went to the basement to see what can come up with various salts.

New IO 200g box 60lbs - the label says " Recommended Specific Gravity Range: 1.020 - 1.024 at 77F

Note: 1.5lbs of Instant Ocean is formulated to create 5 gallons of saltwater at a specific gravity of 1.022."

I can verify that I get roughly 180g's @ 1.025



Older 150g box 43lbs 8 oz - the label says " Fill aquarium with water at 75F (28C). Add sufficient Crystal Seas Marinemix to bring hydrometer reading to 1.021 to 1.025. About 1lb of Crystal Sea makes 4 gallons."

This box is roughly 1.5 to 2 years old, and I dont recall how much it mixed at 1.025.



Older Bucket Tropic Marin Pro Reef, not sure how much the bucket weighed, the labels says 55 lb for ca. 200g US gallons. I'm assuming the bucket weighed 55lb, and claims to make 200g's

Mixing instructions: " At a temperature of 73-77F/23 - 25C, the specific gravity of the salt water should range from 1.022 - 1.025.

All three are pretty vague.

stanlalee
02/07/2010, 08:26 AM
almost every other "reef" salt uses the same standard as their regular salt so if your going to be mad at the standard be mad at the standard and stop isolating reef crystals.

and for all of you talking about getting ripped off oh please (I'm sure you are but it has nothing to do with specific gravity). you are paying for the amount of salt received not a specific gravity hence at DFS a 5g bucket of reef crystals is $2 more than a 5g bucket of IO. what are you suggestng a 35% decrease in the price of reef crystals because you need to mix it at 1.025 even though you are getting the exact same amount of (fortified) product?

davew0670
02/07/2010, 08:51 AM
seachem reef salt bag makes "50 gallons at 1.021." hmmm

jayb12
02/07/2010, 08:58 AM
almost every other "reef" salt uses the same standard as their regular salt so if your going to be mad at the standard be mad at the standard and stop isolating reef crystals.

and for all of you talking about getting ripped off oh please (I'm sure you are but it has nothing to do with specific gravity). you are paying for the amount of salt received not a specific gravity hence at DFS a 5g bucket of reef crystals is $2 more than a 5g bucket of IO. what are you suggestng a 35% decrease in the price of reef crystals because you need to mix it at 1.025 even though you are getting the exact same amount of (fortified) product?

what i was paying for was 160 gallons of reef grade water. not 100 gallons. thats almost half of what they claim for their "reef" mix

shred5
02/07/2010, 09:12 AM
What are you using to check the salinity and have you checked that it is acurate? I have over the years seen salt be different from bucket to bucket, Salt can get old too.

Dave
Polzin

otrlynn
02/07/2010, 09:13 AM
I've always had to use more than 1/2 cup to get 1.026 salinity with Reef Crystals... usually about 0.6 cups per gallon.



This was my experience as well. I would have said a semi-heaping half cup of salt per gallon when mixed up to 1.025 s.g. I used a half cup measure, but just did not level the top off as you would when measuring a half-cup of flour for a recipe. Prior to this I used Seachem Reef salt and it seemed spot-on at a level half cup per gallon at 1.025. I am currently using Brightwell and it takes just a tad under a half cup to mix a gallon to 1.025

I still don't see though how a box/bucket of Reef Crystals intended to make 160 gallons would make only 100 gallons!

TRITON1
02/07/2010, 09:14 AM
what i was paying for was 160 gallons of reef grade water. not 100 gallons. thats almost half of what they claim for their "reef" mix

No, Ill have to agree with the above. Your paying for the salt. If your logic is correct they should charge you more for running a quarantine tank at hyposalinity because you could make more water with the same amount of salt.
Now and days bucket size and bag size just give you an idea of what size container of salt, its up to the user to adjust how much they use to get the sg they want.
At the end of the day this arguement could go round and round. :spin3::spin3::spin3:

fasteddie99
02/07/2010, 09:33 AM
I can see both sides...Its all in how its worded, and interpreted...Just like a law. A defense attny will see a law written to mean one thing, when the prosecution will interpret it another.

"reef crystals", when used for your "reef" tank should be measured accordingly and the ratio displayed on the bucket. And if it is intended for a "reef" tank, the ammount the entire bucket makes should be adjusted accordingly as well.

However, in their defence, it DOES state that the quantity is based on an sg of 1.021.

I simply just accepted the fact that what written on the side of the bucket is not accurate for "my" use and I know that the entire bucket does not in fact make 160 gallons, but closer to 100.

It might make us feel better if it was call FOWLR crystals, then the writing would be accurate. :rollface:

Chris27
02/07/2010, 09:44 AM
What was used to measure the salinity? Was it calibrated?

eyebedam
02/07/2010, 09:47 AM
The only thing I find weird is on the 200 gal mix boxes why does RC weigh 3lbs less than IO? They both claim to make the same amount of salt water but the total weight of RC is less. Anywho the product still works fine IMO but I'm gonna try Brightwells salt next.

Chris27
02/07/2010, 10:06 AM
The only thing I find weird is on the 200 gal mix boxes why does RC weigh 3lbs less than IO? They both claim to make the same amount of salt water but the total weight of RC is less. Anywho the product still works fine IMO but I'm gonna try Brightwells salt next.

Good Luck - I have a funny suspicion you'll be switching back.:rollface:

jbird69
02/07/2010, 10:42 AM
The vast majority of people keeping saltwater aquariums are keeping fish only. When youre on RC its easy to think everybody has a reef tank, this simply isnt true. The sg standard these salt companies are suggesting are fine for fish only aquariums. If a company comes out with a salt that is "reef specific", you can bet they will charge accordingly...and then some, assuming us reefers have deeper pockets. REEF CRYSTALS is just a cool marketing name for salt, its not reef specific.

tektite
02/07/2010, 11:18 AM
You can always look into seachem's new salinity salt - each bucket makes 225 gal @ 1.026. Each batch is independently tested by a lab and the results are printed on each bucket. The buckets more expensive than most but if you do the math on how much saltwater you can make its not that bad.

My bucket has:

pH 8.5
alk 3.8 meq/l
cal 417
mag 1370
stron 8.6

shred5
02/07/2010, 11:21 AM
The vast majority of people keeping saltwater aquariums are keeping fish only. When youre on RC its easy to think everybody has a reef tank, this simply isnt true. The sg standard these salt companies are suggesting are fine for fish only aquariums. If a company comes out with a salt that is "reef specific", you can bet they will charge accordingly...and then some, assuming us reefers have deeper pockets. REEF CRYSTALS is just a cool marketing name for salt, its not reef specific.

I do not know about that.. IO is marketed toward the fish side and reef crystals is toward the reef side. Reef crystals is Instant ocean with higher calcium levels. But we used to keep reefs at a lower salinity than we do now and reef crystals has been around a long time.

Dave
Polzin

graveyardworm
02/07/2010, 11:28 AM
Instant Ocean has reformulated. $35 bucks for a 200gallon box that mixes out to 180 gallons at 1.025. I am not complaining. Not sure why anyone is still using Reef Crystals. They are both made by the same company.

mscarpena
02/07/2010, 11:31 AM
If you dont like the salt dont buy it again. It's as simple as that. I bought RC for years, but have switched to corallife because I think it is a better salt. Both salts worked well for me, but my tank is more stable with corallife and I add less supplements. Also when you think about it salt is very cheap compared to the other things we buy. I am not saying that the fine print is upstanding, but all sorts of companies do it. Candy bars instead of the price going up they just keep getting smaller and smaller.

SDguy
02/07/2010, 11:31 AM
Instant Ocean has reformulated. $35 bucks for a 200gallon box that mixes out to 180 gallons at 1.025. I am not complaining. Not sure why anyone is still using Reef Crystals. They are both made by the same company.

Oooo, where'd you find it for $35? I need to get some! :)

dan223
02/07/2010, 11:31 AM
yeah its pretty lame that they sell a product labled with specs that are not inline with the intended use of the product, definately misleading. Red Sea and Red Sea coral pro are listed the same way.

graveyardworm
02/07/2010, 11:38 AM
Oooo, where'd you find it for $35? I need to get some! :)

LFS sells it for that price everyday. Shipping would probably hurt.

reefscape15
02/07/2010, 11:39 AM
I can't honestly believe that the mods didn't lock this out when they saw the title. Anyways..........I agree if you aren't happy with the product, don't buy it. I started with Reef Crystals, then switched to Coralife mostly for the free shirt in the bucket :). But I was much happier with the results from Coralife than Reef Crystals. I just bought another bucket of Reef Crystals cause I was in the middle of making water up and ran out of salt. RC was all the LFS had, but once this bucket is gone, I'm going back to Coralife. I do understand your b!t€h about the subject but there's really nothing you will be able to do about it other than use something else.

SDguy
02/07/2010, 11:40 AM
LFS sells it for that price everyday. Shipping would probably hurt.

You have a good LFS!

graveyardworm
02/07/2010, 11:41 AM
yeah its pretty lame that they sell a product labled with specs that are not inline with the intended use of the product, definately misleading. Red Sea and Red Sea coral pro are listed the same way.

Many people intend to use it in different ways. Sort of one size fits all. If they made a seperate salt for each purpose then a brand like Instant Ocean would probably cost as much as TM Pro. Its fortunate they havent specialized all of it. Be thankful and appreciative.

lougotzz
02/07/2010, 12:09 PM
True but the fact that it's called "Reef" Crystals, not "Fish Only" Crystals tells me that they think natural "Reefs" have a specific gravity of 1.021 or they have found a way to rip us off. Either way, I don't like their salt for other reasons. I've always said the best thing about Reef Crystals is the bucket it comes in.

I dont buy that. Ive seen reefs with a sg of 1.021. You can always dose a little mag and cal. Still not a scam as far as im concerned.

d0ughb0y
02/07/2010, 12:25 PM
I mix in a 5 gallon bucket and always use 3 cups of reef crystals to get 1.026.
I agree the label "reef" then using 1.021 as basis is self contradictory and misleading.

but based on the 3 cups instead of 2.5 cups, I think one bucket should yield 133 gallons and not 100 gallons Were you really mixing 4 cups every 5 gallons to get 1.026? if so then you probably got a bad batch or the bucket you got is reduced. I know the local LFS here opens the buckets and takes some salt from each bucket for their own use and still sells them as new unused and full Thats the problem with unsealed packaging.

d0ughb0y
02/07/2010, 12:29 PM
I have seen other brand (red sea if I remember correctly), use 1.021 to calculate the yield, but use 1.026 to calculate the trace mineral contents to make the number appear higher. now that is a scam.

ChrisKirkland
02/07/2010, 12:33 PM
Have you considered writing Spectrum Brands to give them your feedback? Posting here doesn't do a whole lot except maybe make you feel better. Writing the actual company gives them valuable information which may lead to a change in process.

THe company is no longer spectrum, its United Pet Group.

JMalone81
02/07/2010, 12:59 PM
I can't honestly believe that the mods didn't lock this out when they saw the title. Anyways..........I agree if you aren't happy with the product, don't buy it. I started with Reef Crystals, then switched to Coralife mostly for the free shirt in the bucket :). But I was much happier with the results from Coralife than Reef Crystals. I just bought another bucket of Reef Crystals cause I was in the middle of making water up and ran out of salt. RC was all the LFS had, but once this bucket is gone, I'm going back to Coralife. I do understand your b!t€h about the subject but there's really nothing you will be able to do about it other than use something else.

+1 I don't see the scam? Most people read before they use a product.

jbird69
02/07/2010, 01:18 PM
If your giving up on reef crystals, get coralife. Its the best major brand salt for reefs. :) :)

stubby 58
02/07/2010, 01:30 PM
I was always under the impression that all salts where figured on a sg of 1.021 and at that sg that is how many gal you will get ie 50, 150 or 200 . May be wrong I do not know , but thats what I always took it as . I use Coralife and mix 3 cups per 5 gal o get 1.026 , if I mix 2 1/2 cups it gives me 1.021 . JMT

stubby

polyppetey
02/07/2010, 01:34 PM
You should read the label before buying, it clearly states 1.4 lbs makes 5 gallons at 1.021. To get to a target of 1.026 I need 1.7 lbs. After stating that Other salt mixes differ in the weight needed to get to the targeted SG. I THINK IO is 1.5 lb. to get to 1.021

BTW for everything reefers do I am still suprised people still use measuring cups and not a good scale.

Yogre
02/07/2010, 01:40 PM
THe company is no longer spectrum, its United Pet Group.

FWIW, United Pet Group is owned by Spectrum Brands. Spectrum Brands is in Chapter 11. Where that'll end up nobody knows.

Haksar
02/07/2010, 01:41 PM
We use Marinium and IO but very few hobbyist and LFS here use RC.But recently an LFS has started selling RC here but this thread will make me think twice before changing.

speedo2wet
02/07/2010, 02:00 PM
im kinda happy with the brand red sea salt mix that I use (i don't use the red sea reef crystals) and I'm running two reefs with excellent growth. plus my sg is usually kept from the 1.023-1.024 mark. I use just about 12 lbs of salt for every water change that I make. everyone seems to be happy.

qn5reef
02/07/2010, 02:02 PM
+1 there is nothing scam about it, just read the label.

You should read the label before buying, it clearly states 1.4 lbs makes 5 gallons at 1.021. To get to a target of 1.026 I need 1.7 lbs. After stating that Other salt mixes differ in the weight needed to get to the targeted SG. I THINK IO is 1.5 lb. to get to 1.021

BTW for everything reefers do I am still suprised people still use measuring cups and not a good scale.

maynardjames
02/07/2010, 03:05 PM
+1 there is nothing scam about it, just read the label.

+2

lordofthereef
02/07/2010, 04:14 PM
what gives? started buying this salt because its cheaper then seachem however when i mix my 55 gallon jug it uses 3/4 of the bucket! im lucky if i get 100 gallons out of a supposid 160 gallon bucket!

mixing salt at 75 degree's to 1.025!

anyone else have this problem?

I can tell you that you either measured incorrectly or you simply got a bad batch (the latter is unlikely, but I personally cannot rule it out). Either way, something is amiss. Either way I wouldn't go calling the company a scam. Clearly everyone using reef crystals out there isn't an imbecile who simply hasn't noticed that they are using much more salt than they should be. This seems to be a specific issue with you...

jayb12
02/07/2010, 04:19 PM
well when you mix up 60 gallons of salt a week, that extra 50 or so gallons really hurts the wallet on the salt budget!

after 3 buckets i had enough. i wont buy reef crystals again because in reality im paying 75 bucks for a bucket that nets me 100 or so gallons. thats pretty expensive stuff!

graveyardworm
02/07/2010, 04:51 PM
Somehow your logic has become skewed. Regardless of what the label says you are getting what you are paying for, a certain amount of salt by weight. To get to the higher SG requires more salt, you would have to pay for that salt, or pay the same for a bucket that makes less gallons per the label.

lordofthereef
02/07/2010, 05:25 PM
well when you mix up 60 gallons of salt a week, that extra 50 or so gallons really hurts the wallet on the salt budget!

after 3 buckets i had enough. i wont buy reef crystals again because in reality im paying 75 bucks for a bucket that nets me 100 or so gallons. thats pretty expensive stuff!

I think the point we are trying to get across is that being 50 gallons off on a 160 gallon bucket is way more than it frankly should be... Your difference is about 30% when it should be about 10-15%

Jeff
02/07/2010, 05:37 PM
I think the point we are trying to get across is that being 50 gallons off on a 160 gallon bucket is way more than it frankly should be... Your difference is about 30% when it should be about 10-15%
I agree. I understand their marketing strategy, but that is too far off from reality. It makes it as expensive as the good salt brands and doesn't deliver the same results in my opinion.

stanlalee
02/07/2010, 06:20 PM
now we are going from if reef crystals is a rip off to what salt we like.

Bottom line in order to be a rip off by definition you must be paying an uncompetitive price for a like product. itis not grossly more expensive or cheaper than ANY reef specific salt on the market (yes I did the math and all are within a range of about 2.2-2.7gallons per $1)

redsea pro and seachem reef salt, probably the second and third most readily available and common reef salts on the market use the same 1.023 or less standard for marking their salts.

some of you are making my case on why it would be just plain stupid for reef crystals to change their label. if you cant decifer reef crystals isn't a rip off because of its labeling even though its the same amount of salt as IO for $2-5 more and no more expensive or mislabeled than its main competitors imagine what the same people will think when they go to the store or online and see 150-160g buckets of seachem reef and redsea coral pro for $45-50 and 100g buckets of reef crystals for the same price. the only other option would be to put more salt in and jack up the price. then you'll be complaining on the price hike on 160g buckets or how expensive RC has become using the same non abstract reasoning.

but yep all you reef crystal users are getting bamboozled!

graveyardworm
02/07/2010, 06:59 PM
The OP still hasnt indicated how they are measuring salinity. Also if its being measured with a swing arm hydro or floating hydro temp could be a factor especially this time of year in Canada.

How are you measuring the salinity and what is the temp of the mixing barrell at the time of measurement?

radicaltimes
02/07/2010, 06:59 PM
I only have a 120 gallon Reef system, The Reef Crystals salt is the cheapest part of the aquarium. I weight mine out at 1.6 pounds for 5 gallons.

JMalone81
02/07/2010, 07:41 PM
well when you mix up 60 gallons of salt a week, that extra 50 or so gallons really hurts the wallet on the salt budget!

after 3 buckets i had enough. i wont buy reef crystals again because in reality im paying 75 bucks for a bucket that nets me 100 or so gallons. thats pretty expensive stuff!

Hey go to drsfoster its $50 a bucket. I have used rc for a few years and I'm still looking for this scam you are talking about.

luther1200
02/07/2010, 08:22 PM
You might want to check your salinity. RC is one of, if not the most common salt on the market. They would not have gained that high standard if yourt claims were even remotely true.

luther1200
02/07/2010, 08:30 PM
well when you mix up 60 gallons of salt a week, that extra 50 or so gallons really hurts the wallet on the salt budget!

after 3 buckets i had enough. i wont buy reef crystals again because in reality im paying 75 bucks for a bucket that nets me 100 or so gallons. thats pretty expensive stuff!

On your fist post it was 50 gallons for 3/4 of a bucket. So how did it change to 100 gallons per bucket. Is that last 1/4 of bucket magical salt? Maybe RC got it from the guy that sold Jack his beans. And why are you paying 75$ for a bucket of RC, its around 45$-50$. If somebody is selling it for that price, you have no one but yourself to blaim for paying that high price.

stevek480
02/07/2010, 08:42 PM
You can also buy the 200 gallon box for $50.

JMalone81
02/07/2010, 08:56 PM
On your fist post it was 50 gallons for 3/4 of a bucket. So how did it change to 100 gallons per bucket. Is that last 1/4 of bucket magical salt? Maybe RC got it from the guy that sold Jack his beans. And why are you paying 75$ for a bucket of RC, its around 45$-50$. If somebody is selling it for that price, you have no one but yourself to blaim for paying that high price.

I was thinking the same thing. Lol

graveyardworm
02/07/2010, 09:08 PM
Canada, exchange rates, additional shipping costs to get it there.

kc350twin
02/07/2010, 09:21 PM
In my opinion I buy a salt for it's element levels and reliability. Not for how much it makes.

It is not a secret that almost all the salt companies list their Parameters and mixing amounts in the 1.021-1.023 range or whatever Salinity level they want. Yes I think they should have a graph that shows you the expected amounts for different salinity levels.

My 0.02
Kc3

burtonpj48
02/07/2010, 09:46 PM
[QUOTE=d0ughb0y;16540551]I mix in a 5 gallon bucket and always use 3 cups of reef crystals to get 1.026.

That is alot more salt to mix a 5 gallon bucket. I use h20cean about 2 1/8 cup for a little more than a 5 gallon bucket. i use the h20cean bucket to mix my salt, its a little taller than ur average 5 gallon bucket, and its mixed at 1.025. I was considering switching to reef crystal because the lfs that i purchase my salt from is discontinuing h20cean, im glad i read this thread.

luther1200
02/07/2010, 10:02 PM
Canada, exchange rates, additional shipping costs to get it there.

If thats why it costs what it does, than wouldn't it be a moot point as those things would be true for any salt? And in respect to each other RC would still be less expensive than others.

The_Codfather
02/07/2010, 10:19 PM
show me a reef that runs on 1.021 water like they suggest.
Sure that's not for the ICK mix?:jester:

lordofthereef
02/07/2010, 10:40 PM
The OP still hasnt indicated how they are measuring salinity. Also if its being measured with a swing arm hydro or floating hydro temp could be a factor especially this time of year in Canada.

How are you measuring the salinity and what is the temp of the mixing barrell at the time of measurement?

He did mention the water temp was 75 degrees.

graveyardworm
02/07/2010, 10:44 PM
I was just reviewing the thread and saw that, my bad. Still wondering how he's measuring salinity. I'm also starting to wonder was the bucket sealed? Possibly someone scooped a bit off the top and recovered the bucket?

luther1200
02/08/2010, 02:56 PM
. I'm also starting to wonder was the bucket sealed? Possibly someone scooped a bit off the top and recovered the bucket?

That would be the one thing that would make any sense.

d0ughb0y
02/08/2010, 03:13 PM
[QUOTE=d0ughb0y;16540551]I mix in a 5 gallon bucket and always use 3 cups of reef crystals to get 1.026.

That is alot more salt to mix a 5 gallon bucket. I use h20cean about 2 1/8 cup for a little more than a 5 gallon bucket. i use the h20cean bucket to mix my salt, its a little taller than ur average 5 gallon bucket, and its mixed at 1.025. I was considering switching to reef crystal because the lfs that i purchase my salt from is discontinuing h20cean, im glad i read this thread.

well we are talking about reef crystals here, and the recommended mix is 1/2 cup per gallon and I do get 1.021 if I put 2.5 cups to mix 5 gallons. I just need to adjust it to 3 cups to get 1.026.

so the plausible explanation is either SG reading is incorrect, or the LFS scooped out some salt for the yield to be 100 gallons instead of 133 gallons at 1.026.

FWIW, I never measured the actual yield of a bucket of RC, but on 3 buckets, I have weighed the new bucket and sure the weight was exactly as labeled. On a bucket of Seachem I bought from LFS, the weight was less than the label so I am assuming that is why the LFS hastily picked that particular bucket for me when I bought one.

dudley moray
02/08/2010, 04:08 PM
if you think thats bad check out the ingredients of a magnesium supplement for 20$ for a 500 ml can then go to the grocery store and check the ingredients of eppsom salt for 3$ a 5 lb bag Reef crystals is not a scam it does exactly what it says you should try big als they are 10 bucks cheaper btw!

Rybren
02/08/2010, 04:30 PM
$75 for the bucket is way out of line for RC, even for those of us who are north of the 49th. I paid $70 for the 200 gal box just before Christmas and then $45 for the same sized box at a post-Christmas sale.

FWIW, I generally use just under 3 cups to mix up a 5 gal pail to 35ppt.

The thing I find odd, is that the instructions tell you to mix 1/2 cup per gallon with no indication of what the salinity will be. But they also state how much wieght will produce 1.021. Seems to me that since most people use a volume measurement, that they should tell you what salinity that volume will produce.

mano84
02/08/2010, 05:33 PM
I think that the scary part in this thread is that you all refer to the salt buckets as a 160 gallon bucket or a 200 gallon box. I've never heard or seen anyone (before reading this thread) referring it to anything other than a 25 kilogram bucket or whatever the amount is.

Don't get me wrong I think that it's great if it says on the bucket about how much saltwater it will produce so that I'll get a general idea of the amount but when I buy it I still buy 25 kilograms of salt (or ~55 pounds if you prefer that).

eyebedam
02/08/2010, 05:40 PM
I think that the scary part in this thread is that you all refer to the salt buckets as a 160 gallon bucket or a 200 gallon box. I've never heard or seen anyone (before reading this thread) referring it to anything other than a 25 kilogram bucket or whatever the amount is.

Don't get me wrong I think that it's great if it says on the bucket about how much saltwater it will produce so that I'll get a general idea of the amount but when I buy it I still buy 25 kilograms of salt (or ~55 pounds if you prefer that).

Maybe that's because your in Sweden & most of these post are from here in the US

jhawkor
02/08/2010, 05:47 PM
I would SO quadruple check everything before starting a thread like this.

Agreed. Calling Reef Crystals a scam is quite a claim.

Metal Man 1221
02/08/2010, 06:23 PM
im sorry i didnt read every ones comments so im sorry if this has been said
but the point here that needs to be understood is that on every salt mix container it gives an apropriate SG, i.e. i use oceanic, because it has higher Mg and Ca but on the back it says (NOTE:recommended specific gravity is 1.021-1.024 for marine fish....) and its basicly the same on every other container, the reason "Reef Cryistals" is called such, is because of the higher amount of supplements, reef crystals has a higher Alk and Ca levels than most salt mixes its for tanks with stony corals that take up a lot of the above supplements.

so im sorry to say but no, reef crystals is not ripping you off, and with all do respect its your fault for not reading the directions well enough

speedo2wet
02/08/2010, 06:31 PM
I agree... Listen, the question is: can you make 160 gallons at the sg 1.021 or so that is stated on the label???

eric@tampa
02/08/2010, 06:50 PM
User error I think,didn't do his homework.jmo

evsalty
02/08/2010, 06:54 PM
I made 25g's last week with RC at 35ppt @78* and I know I did not use 1/4 of the bucket. I do agree that you have to use a little bit more then 1/2 cup per gallon to get there but to loose 60g's I just don't buy that.

tarpon12
02/08/2010, 08:45 PM
Im not your friend, buddy! Im not your buddy, guy! Im not your guy, friend!

burtonpj48
02/08/2010, 08:58 PM
[QUOTE=Rybren;16548452]$75 for the bucket is way out of line for RC, even for those of us who are north of the 49th. I paid $70 for the 200 gal box just before Christmas and then $45 for the same sized box at a post-Christmas sale.

The cheapest i have seen reef crystal is 55 dollars canadian, in our city another shop is is 60, and most i have seen it is 75. I just dont understand why there is such a big difference in price. What im really concerned about, if using reef crystal, how much do u have to spend on dosing elements.

graveyardworm
02/08/2010, 09:05 PM
http://moviesmedia.ign.com/movies/image/article/701/701605/south-park-recap-cartoon-wars-part-2-20060413114421438-000.jpg

Metal Man 1221
02/08/2010, 09:35 PM
http://moviesmedia.ign.com/movies/image/article/701/701605/south-park-recap-cartoon-wars-part-2-20060413114421438-000.jpg

LMAO!!

[QUOTE=Rybren;16548452]$75 for the bucket is way out of line for RC, even for those of us who are north of the 49th. I paid $70 for the 200 gal box just before Christmas and then $45 for the same sized box at a post-Christmas sale.

The cheapest i have seen reef crystal is 55 dollars canadian, in our city another shop is is 60, and most i have seen it is 75. I just dont understand why there is such a big difference in price. What im really concerned about, if using reef crystal, how much do u have to spend on dosing elements.

actually with reef crystals i wouldnt dose any thing, the reason its more pricey than other salts is because its more aboundant with trace elements and vital supplents that other salt mixes

Nanook
02/08/2010, 10:00 PM
That's a wrap!!