Is it possible to convert PC ballast for T5????

[kttran_2005]

Hi All,

I got two PC light systems not currently use. Does anybody know that I can use these ballast for t5 bulbs? Is it possible to convert to use t5 bulbs? Please let me know. I really appreciate that.

Thanks,
Ken

[Pescado Amigo]

I am 99% sure you'll be fine. PC's are just florescent tubes that are bent. You'll be fine as long as the are similar wattage.

[uncleof6]

Well the 1% rule strikes again, T5 lamps are very different from PC lamps. T5 lamps and ballasts, are application specific. A ballast is a current limiting device. The incorrect ballast, does not provide the proper current limits, for T5 spec lamps, they do not provide the correct starting environment for T5 lamps, and End of Life circuitry (if it is present at all) does not work properly. Improper ballasts cause higher temperatures, and wear and tear on the lamps themselves (filaments)-- which for quality lamps, are not cheap. The best performance with T5 is with quality lamps, and proper ballasts. The bottom line is, you really cannot build a good T5 setup, with parts you just have lying around. That is why T5 fixtures cost a few bucks more than other fixtures. :)

Jim

[Nexenn]

Fulham ballasts are what run my PCs in my hood and I know that the same exact ballast will run T5s. Fulham even says it on their website and I've seen hood manufactures use the same fulham ballast I'm using for my PCs on T5 hoods.

[uncleof6]

Yes they do use them, but they are not proper T5 ballasts. Did not say they would not run them, said it is an improper ballast for T5 spec lamps. Since the current specs would take too long to explain, to keep it simple-- workhorse ballasts are for instant start lamps. T5 calls for a programmed start which is a time/filament temperature relationship. Instant start ballasts, cook the filaments, shortening the lamps useful life. Several manufacturers do not use correct T5 ballasts in their T5 fixtures. They do not cost as much as T5 ballasts, so it is a "you get what you pay for" thing. There is a big difference between "working" and working right. :)

Regards,

Jim

[syrinx]

PC bulbs are T-5s

[iLLwiLL]

I used a 96w PC ballast to push a single 80w T5 lamp with no problems I could see. I had 2 workhorse 7's running 4 lamps, and 2 96w PC ballasts running the last 2 over my old 125, never visually noticed any different color from one ballast to the other with the same lamp.

~Will.

[kimber45]

PC bulbs are T-5s

huh? :beer:

[kttran_2005]

Thanks for all replies. I really appreciate that. What do you have to do in order to use T5? Any diagram for rewiring? picture?

[noobtothereef]

[violation]

[syrinx]

T-5 relates to bulb diameter- nothing else. PC bulbs are T-5. The ballast usually will work.

[noobtothereef]

an f32t8 ballast will work also, use a 4 bulb for 2 54watt t5's

[Nexenn]

T-5 relates to bulb diameter- nothing else. PC bulbs are T-5. The ballast usually will work.

What about the bulb firing up methods that a previous poster brought to our attention? does that not differentiate the two bulbs if size does not?

[kttran_2005]

Thanks everybody. Back to my question, how do you rewire from 4 pins to 2 pins sockets? I am not a electric guy so sorry for a dump question. Any picture? Thanks in advance.

[Pescado Amigo]

you should be able to google a wiring diagram pretty easy.

[syrinx]

What about the bulb firing up methods that a previous poster brought to our attention? does that not differentiate the two bulbs if size does not?

He may well be right- I haven`t looked at schematics- only know its done. It could shorten life- I would consult the bulb manufacturer. Main point is-the question is straight bulbs vs shaped bulbs- both T-5s-and their ballasts. The proponents of T5s try to distance themselves from PCs- because the only thing that makes a T5 more efficient is proper reflectors.

[uncleof6]

There are many areas within the aquarium pursuit, that are packed full of misinformation-- and tainted by opinion. Lighting is perhaps one of the biggest areas for misinformation. Whether you want to use MH, T12, T8, T5, PC, or LED is not an issue, when discussing the proper matching of components. Like I mentioned in my second post: There is a difference between "working" and working right. There is no opinion in this, it simply is.

T5 is a fairly recent invention. Ballasts had to be designed to run them to the lamps specifications. That right there, disproves that PC lamps and T5 lamps are the same (diameter wise they are, 5/8".) Also T5 lamps are the first fluorescent lamps that run ONLY on electronic ballasts.

OP: to run the lamps correctly, for the best efficiency, economy, longevity and ~output~, specific T5 ballasts, are the answer. The best, unbiased information available on lighting systems, components and operating characteristics, is to be found outside the aquarium industry-- such as Phillips Advance, and Orsam Sylvania. There are also a "few" articles online, that go into details as to why "T5" lamps are not the same as other fluorescent lamps. Ultimately though, it is your decision what ballast/lamp combination you use.

Regards,

Jim

[Pescado Amigo]

T5's are certainly not new. I am aware of T5's in the industry at least 7 years ago. I don't know if the 1% rule applies or not, but I have't seen anything yet that proves that it does. The most popular VHO ballast (icecap 440 & 660) are used by Icecap to power T5 lamps, kits, retros. They didn't see a need to change ballast for there lamps, and I trust them.

MY .02 worth.

[uncleof6]

The 660 ballast was designed to run T12 vho lamps, years before T5 lamps existed. No modifications to the ballast have been made since day one. It is an instant start, ballast. T5 spec lamps, call for programmed start. The 660 overdrives the lamps. These two things, show that it is not a ballast designed to run T5 spec lamps, and the lamps suffer because of it. What I am stating is very specific. They are facts, and are not opinionated or ambiguous.

If it is opinion that is wanted: I would not waste my money on an IceCap 660 or the (according to advertising) modified UVL "T5" lamps (which would mean they are no longer T5 spec lamps,) because it is absolutely unnecessary to overdrive the lamps to begin with. As far as IceCap goes, they were supposedly doing a study on the affects of overdriving T5 spec lamps-- they never published the results. Giving a reason, would be purely speculative.

T5 VHO, is a specification that does not exist. Very much like the aquarium industry confused Mh systems by misusing the term "HQI", which is a Metal Halide lamp. Halogen Quartz Iodide, differentiating it from a Mercury Vapor lamp. HQI is also a branding of Orsam/Sylvania.

Again, research the topic outside the aquarium industry, where the motivation is not saving a few dollars, or making a profit. I don't know, Advance ICN-2S54 T5 ballast ~ $40. IceCap 660 ballast: ~$150. Hummmmm.....

Regards,

Jim

[marioensf]

Jim I thank you for clearing that; clear as water; I just had the experience of installing 4 T5 on an Icecap 660; one of the bulbs blew the filaments so will most likely go the correct T5 dedicated ballast.
IMO if someone has the spare parts to experiment then why not? I would and I have both T5 and PC ballasts; if the later ones are just collecting dust might as well play a little DIY.

Ktran: T5's are also four pin, two at each end.

[kttran_2005]

WOW! thank you so much for all the clarification responses. The reason I posted this question because I don't want to waste 2 my PC sets. I tried to sell them cheap $30 (old) and $50 (new) but nobody wanted. I did some researches about using T5 for SPS and I really want to convert all my light systems to one systems. I don't want too many ballasts taking spaces. I am currently running MH for my tank. Anyway, I am going to sell all my light systems (MH and PCs) and go with T5 set. Thank you so much for all the responses and please keep posting. Someone else might interested to do the convertion. It's good thread anyway.

[Pescado Amigo]

Uncle,
Ice Cap makes 100% of their income from the aquarium industry. ULV makes a large percent of their income in the aquarium industry. Osram, Advance etc are so big that they do not even recognize the aquarium industy as a part of their business. When ULV makes lamps with a larger filiment, or Ice Cap makes a ballast that over drives these lamps it is all with purpose. The purpose is to create PAR suitable to sustain coral. The engineers at the Osram, Advance and others could not begin to tell you what suitable PAR for SPS coral is. (rightfullly so. Not because they are not intellegent, but because it is not what they are paid to do.) Ice cap, ULV and a host of others make thier living producing lights for the Coral keeping industry. I trust that they spend more than a moment on R&D. As for the original question, can Kttran use a Custom Sea Life compact Florescent ballast to fire T5 lamps, the answer is still yes. Is it the optimum ballast I don't know. And neither doe sany one else. because we don't know what ballst Custom Sea Life used to begin with. But, we do know, that it will fire the lamps safely.

[uncleof6]

http://i655.photobucket.com/albums/uu274/uncleof6/sheepaid.gif http://i655.photobucket.com/albums/uu274/uncleof6/eat.gif

[marioensf]

CSL ballasts I have a couple of them that died on me so I performed surgery, inside each case a Workhorse 3 ballast...

[captsluggo]

Uncle,
Ice Cap makes 100% of their income from the aquarium industry. ULV makes a large percent of their income in the aquarium industry. Osram, Advance etc are so big that they do not even recognize the aquarium industy as a part of their business. When ULV makes lamps with a larger filiment, or Ice Cap makes a ballast that over drives these lamps it is all with purpose. The purpose is to create PAR suitable to sustain coral. The engineers at the Osram, Advance and others could not begin to tell you what suitable PAR for SPS coral is. (rightfullly so. Not because they are not intellegent, but because it is not what they are paid to do.) Ice cap, ULV and a host of others make thier living producing lights for the Coral keeping industry. I trust that they spend more than a moment on R&D. As for the original question, can Kttran use a Custom Sea Life compact Florescent ballast to fire T5 lamps, the answer is still yes. Is it the optimum ballast I don't know. And neither doe sany one else. because we don't know what ballst Custom Sea Life used to begin with. But, we do know, that it will fire the lamps safely.

Pescado, you're making some incorrect assumptions here. As previously noted, IceCap did not make a ballast to overdrive a certain bulb "with purpose", these ballasts predate even the thought of T5HO by many years. It is just one of many bulb/ballast mismatches that MIGHT have a decent outcome.
"Ice cap, UVL and a host of others" make a living selling stuff, no more, no less. Time spent on R&D cuts into profit, you trust without real evidence.
"Suitable PAR to sustain coral" estimates are wildly variable. Reefkeepers tend to want higher PAR and Kelvin than what is measured on natural reefs. Natural levels are certainly sustainable.
The CSL ballast that the OP asks about is known, it's a WH 3. "Is it the optimum ballast", NO NO NO, not even close. Will it fire a T5HO, which wattage?, maybe it will, try it if you like, as I don't think it will be much of a hazard, just poor performance.
There are not many actual manufacturing facilities of ballasts and bulbs, but rather a lot of made to specs and even more rebranding, relabeling, and counterfitting going on.
Believe what you want. The information that uncleof6 has posted here is easily obtainable and verifiable from many sources. The Sheep and Kool-Aid analogy is quite appropriate and actually gentle.

[kimber45]

Advance ICN-2S54 T5 ballast

Regards,

Jim

i'm far from an expert but after reading everything i could on t5ho for a couple months i ended up going with the advance centium(icn) ballasts for my build. i'm not against overdriving i just didn't feel it was needed in my 18" deep tank.

[The Grim Reefer]

For the purpose of converting your ballast look at your PC lamp as a T5 that has been folded in half. So on a flat 4 pin type connector the two wires on the left would go to one end of the T5 and the other two go to the other end. On the square pin type I don't know but I would assume it would be the same way, left side pins to one end, right side to the other. (((((I am not guaranteeing that will work)))))) If it is a Workhorse ballast www.fulham.com will have diagrams but the basic rule would be is there is one yellow wire and multiple red wires coming off the output side of the ballast. The yellow wire will be ran to one end of the lamp(s) using a jumper to connect each pin and ONE red to the other end of each lamp using a jumper to make a connection to each pin as well. Extra red wires should be capped. Running a red wire to each pin at one end can overdrive the lamp. Not recommended.

As far as the rest never assume the ballasts will work. If it is indeed a workhorse inside it will fire a T5, not as good as a real T5 ballast but hey, a new ballast rates like an 8 on the six pack scale so if it blows your lamp early on you can drown your sorrows.

Ice Cap and UVL/URI got started in the tanning bed industry as far I know. Ice Cap made a change to their ballasts specifically to accommodate the use of T5's but I don't know if that was for function or reliability.

The Ice Caps are "Smart" ballasts meaning they can sense what is going on inside a lamp as far as resistance verses current flow so they wont "over-overdrive" (trademark TGR :) ) the lamps. They also use the programmed starting the T5 lamps are designed to be started with. I can make a Workhorse ballast overdrive a T5 higher than the Ice Cap. I wouldn't recommend it because that ballasts has no over current protection. What happens is that as lamps age the internal resistance tends to decrease. At some point the ballast will start pushing so much current you can get to the point where end caps, wires or even the ballast can be damaged. A standard T5 ballast and even a few of Fullham's PC specific ballasts had "end of life" protection like the Ice Cap but as far as I know none of the Workhorses we tend to see (3, 5, 7 and 8) have that. With a healthy lamp less than a couple years old it probably isn't an issue but if you get a bad lamp or have a short somewhere in your system something is going to fry. It's just a trade off.

[syrinx]

Grim reefer with all the facts- not just selected ones! The T-5 koolaid is diluted.

[marioensf]

Just mounted two T5 lamps using the stock ballast on a Coralife 36" fixture

http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg197/marioensf/Aquariums/0303001844.jpg

http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg197/marioensf/Aquariums/0303001844a.jpg