Why are there so many Vortech MP40's for sale?

[paul_111]

I think they seem like a really good idea, but with all of the units I've seen on the for sale board, I'm starting to wonder why such a high turn over (pun intended) and if they're not all they appear to be.

Any thoughts?

[reefsafe]

I think that they are easy to sell and maintain a high resale so if you need extra cash its a quick option. I would also bet that a lot of vortechs are being sold new and therefore there are more available for sale on the second hand market. Just a thought. I love mine.

[maynardjames]

only way i would sell mine is if i lost my job & couldn`t pay the bills

[jordan3548]

Significant other finding the CC statement its either:uzi: or sell it then shes:love1:

[rbnice1]

Some dont like the noise that have. They need silent tanks.

XSome buy them thinking wave action is cool and realize they spent a lot of money and waves look good but really dont do as much for there tank as they thought.

Other reasons listed above are valid as well.

[lctoyota4x4man]

i have three of them but only use two right now. and yea there louder than most in tank pumps but the flow and adjust-ability is great !! i would never sell them. and i agree most forsale are brand new. just my thought

[Chi6488]

I really like the way mine works.

Question I have is how can an older generation be BNIB?? Someone paid a lot of money and not use the pump??

What about light bulbs?? How can someone tell if they were used or not?

[jubjub]

shrug seems like they are selling cause alot of people getting out of hobby cause the economy is so bad.... i've debated last night on taking my down for a while to help cope with the power bill

[Onedeadbob]

I think they seem like a really good idea, but with all of the units I've seen on the for sale board, I'm starting to wonder why such a high turn over (pun intended) and if they're not all they appear to be.

Any thoughts?

Sorry, very new to RC here. Where is the for sale board (is there one specific board)? I looked but didn't see one.
Thanks :)

[rbnice1]

You wont see it till you have 30 posts and have been a member for 90 days.

[Onedeadbob]

Thanks for quick reply!

[d0ughb0y]

I think that they are easy to sell and maintain a high resale so if you need extra cash its a quick option. I would also bet that a lot of vortechs are being sold new and therefore there are more available for sale on the second hand market. Just a thought. I love mine.

really?

I sold mine and it took a lot longer than I thought to sell it, lots of lookers and flakers.

some probably sell when the novelty wears off. I'm sure vortech owners had hours of fun playing around with all the different modes. some are selling now probably to get ahead of the third hand sellers where used price will probably go even lower. this is an item that has wear and tear and depreciates in value, not appreciate. it's not like you can buy one and flip it and sell at a profit.

[tkeracer619]

I sold 6 of them in 3 days when I needed cash. Easy as pie.

ATM the first vortech thread in the FS area is on the second page. I wouldn't really call that a lot of pumps being sold.

[Bouncer]

You wont see it till you have 30 posts and have been a member for 90 days.

50 Posts/90 Days! :sad1:

[shermdawg]

I would have to agree about not selling mine unless absolutely necessary. That being said, its a great item to have as they seem to hold their value and could be something sold quick.

[kam5512]

so i cant find the for sale post...i would love to buy some but cant find them...please help.... ive got over 50 posts and been a member for a bit now... would someone post a link for me please...

[kam5512]

52 post now...lol... thanks or if anyone has any for sale let me know...thanks...

[bluface]

I had two. Sold one. I didn't realize how amazing the flow was. I only use one on my 160 gal tank.

[ddevlin]

I recently sold 2 MP40w's. I only had them for about a week and couldn't take the loud ramping up and down the motor makes. Flow was ok but my tank is 7' long so the middle of the tank wasn't getting enough flow. I also didn't like the motor on the outside with the wire hanging on my tank that kids would love to grab. Any bump from the algae magnet when cleaning around it would nock the alignment off and it would chatter.

Tunze 6205's on a 7096 controller for me.

[kam5512]

so would someone please tell me or show me were i can go to buy some....

[HighlandReef]

so would someone please tell me or show me were i can go to buy some....

check the for sale section... if you want new check one the sponsors sites, most have them

[kam5512]

thats my problem...where is the sale section at?? i new so be kind...lol

[jenglish]

thats my problem...where is the sale section at?? i new so be kind...lol

It takes the software a little while to recognize the status change and allow you to see the for sale forums. Once it does they are the last set of forums before the sponsor forums for me but I hear it is different based on what browser you use.

[kam5512]

It takes the software a little while to recognize the status change and allow you to see the for sale forums. Once it does they are the last set of forums before the sponsor forums for me but I hear it is different based on what browser you use.

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR TELLING ME THAT!!! i have been trying to find that out for a bit now and you are the only one that has helped...thank you sir... it hard to find my way around this forum... my local forum is what im use to and this one is huge... thankyou again...

[jenglish]

No problem. You have to watch what you hear on the local forum :lmao: :wave:

[NY-Reefer]

30 posts here I come! who knows what kind of amazing deals i have been missing. :dance:

[psykobowler]

I will need 6 used mp40s in two months. I better ramp up my posts to get the sale forum.

[tkeracer619]

I will need 6 used mp40s in two months. I better ramp up my posts to get the sale forum.

If you are buying 6 at one time just get them new. I am sure some retailer would work with you on a price if your buying that many. They hold their value on the for sale forums so you wouldn't be saving much compared to buying 6 at a discount... maybe.

If you go new you can get the eco smart drivers as well. They are very cool.

[Bonvivant]

I wish I had access to the FS forum. I'm new to this site and I would like to get a deal on 2 MP40w's

[fsn77]

If you are buying 6 at one time just get them new. I am sure some retailer would work with you on a price if your buying that many. They hold their value on the for sale forums so you wouldn't be saving much compared to buying 6 at a discount... maybe.

If you go new you can get the eco smart drivers as well. They are very cool.


I agree... One of the local shops here offered a nice discount when a friend of mine asked about buying 6. I don't remember exactly how many are in a case (I remember it seeming a little odd -- for some reason 8 comes to mind), but he was told they'd work with him on the price since he would be buying most of the case himself. This particular store likes to keep 1 or 2 on the shelves, too, so they didn't mind the thought of him not buying a full case count.

[psykobowler]

I got mp40s for about $370 each new. I think the new vortech will be more. I have a 300 gallon tank and plan to put 4 at each end.

[psykobowler]

Whoa, I just purchased 2 old mp40w drivers for $100 to upgrade 2 mp20s that I have. Will need to get two ps.

[reefdude135]

I recently sold 2 MP40w's. I only had them for about a week and couldn't take the loud ramping up and down the motor makes..... Tunze 6205's on a 7096 controller for me.

+1. Tunze does seem to be a lot quieter...

[j-dizzle]

love mine and i think the noise is minimal

[Finn&Gils_cc]

I was wondering about the Sale Thread as well. I used to have a different username a couple years ago and it was on it then from the start and when i couldnt remember my login info i had to make a new one and i thought i was going crazy or something for not being able to find it, lol! Thanks for the info.

[tank o tang]

Alot of sponsors have 10% off everything sales, especially on holiday weekends. I picked my mp40w es vortecs up for $400 brand new from a retailer. IMO they aren't worth what people are asking used when you can catch a sale online.

[noobtothereef]

they are overpriced, just use a $40 koralia evolution...... and a reefkeeper for waves.... $3,$4,$500 for a powerhead is nuts...... i would paddle a boat oar in my tank for a month before i dropped $500 on a powerhead thats know to have issues....

[noobtothereef]

I got mp40s for about $370 each new. I think the new vortech will be more. I have a 300 gallon tank and plan to put 4 at each end.

$3200 for powerheads plus controllers?????? wow... thats insane..... for 8 little plastic chinese made pieces.....

[liz62]

they are overpriced, just use a $40 koralia evolution...... and a reefkeeper for waves.... $3,$4,$500 for a powerhead is nuts...... i would paddle a boat oar in my tank for a month before i dropped $500 on a powerhead thats know to have issues....

I agree - I have never used one but I have seen them in action and I think you can get the same flow with less expensive powerheads.
I have a dom. SPS tank and I use a wavemaker and 2 modded MJ1200 at opposite end of the tanks - works like a charm!

Another Fad IMO.

[sportzfish]

I really like the way mine works.

Question I have is how can an older generation be BNIB?? Someone paid a lot of money and not use the pump??

What about light bulbs?? How can someone tell if they were used or not?

Believe it or not people buy up equipment with the intention of setting their tanks up but never get around to it, due to lack of interest or change in direction. Gotta love it when you can get a BNIB for $330 shipped!

[jefathome]

To all you current owners, do you think that I'll be able to hear much noise from an MP40 that is going "in-wall"?

Obviously I don't need to worry about the cords on the outside of the tank, OR bumping it with a magnet since I'm never going to clean my side glass.

[ganjero]

You might, it all depends on the normal noise of your enviroment. I couldnt hear mine during the day, but in the middle of the night I could hear them from the stairway on the third floor (they were in the first floor).

To all you current owners, do you think that I'll be able to hear much noise from an MP40 that is going "in-wall"?

Obviously I don't need to worry about the cords on the outside of the tank, OR bumping it with a magnet since I'm never going to clean my side glass.

[Beaun]

I dont hear much noise from my MP40 and its in my living room. As long as they are not running at 100% all the time and as long as you dont have it on short pulse up to 100% they really dont make much noise. People who complain about the noise are either not set up right or are ramping them from 0 to 100% quickly. I run 100% reef crest mode and don't notice the noise. But I don't know about in wall, there maybe other issues at hand that I have never had experience with.

The only reason I got the MP40ES is because I won a chiller in an raffle and wanted to get something I would never buy with the money I got from selling it. I do think they are worth the money, IF you have the extra cash to spend. I have a koralia evolution and even with a wave timer, it doesn't even come close to being able to compare. Mine did have a problem with it after about a week, but ecotech sent me a new one and I got it the next day, sent mine back and they took it with no problems. Their customer service is really good if you ever get a problem.

[Demonic]

Mine make some noise when I set them to make some serious waves. I still havent tinkered around with them but I will with the next build in a couple of weeks. I recently switched from Tunze to Vortechs and both have their pros and cons. I would use either, but as far as having that wave in your tank without the wavebox, vortech hands down.

[maddog2002]

I have MP40W. I think the noise is the biggest issue for it. Other than that, it is very good pump.

[NyReefNoob]

mine are almost dead silent, but i also run on lagoon , at full speed though, if you dont align them perfect they will have a little noise and also good to take out and make sure the nut isnt loosening, i had always been a tunze guy and loved being able to aim them, but i am overall happy with the mp40'stunze = spend x amount to get pump, then have to buy a controller

[mushroom head]

I thought and thought about it,2 yrs.ago.Bit the bullet,been more than happy with 0 problems.I run in lagoon mode about 70% and my tank is in our living room.Just bought another one a month ago,at the sale price of 419 canadian.We don't get the deals that americans do,but i don't regret my purchases,worth every penny. IMOA

[rtparty]

they are overpriced, just use a $40 koralia evolution...... and a reefkeeper for waves.... $3,$4,$500 for a powerhead is nuts...... i would paddle a boat oar in my tank for a month before i dropped $500 on a powerhead thats know to have issues....

You are crazy if you think that a Koralia even comes close to a Vortech.

It is honestly like comparing apples and oranges. Does the Koralia move water? Yes but it isn't anything compared to a Vortech. I used Koralia's for years and thought they were all that. Then I got the new MP10w ES and the Koralia's are all great paper weights now. What took 3 or 4 Koralias is now 1 Vortech. I actually have room in my tank for corals instead of my gorgeous powerhead reef I had going before.

I do miss the black, bulky plastic look though :lol2:

[sleeperls]

I agree with what others are saying. Alot of tanks are cumming down due to the economy. On the other hand people want the newest gizmo available and thats the new es driver.

I love my mp20 on my 40br. I think it would be better overall to have two mp10's, but i like just having one pump for the whole tank. It really cleaned up my tank. Took place of two k2's and two mj 900's.

the wetsides have a few issues if you dont take care of them. Now that ecotech sells parts now everything is a nice cheap easy fix.

As far as the noise goes, once the wet side is set right and no vibration. At 75% on lagoon You can hear it if you get about a foot away from it. My skimmer and the water going down the pipes to the sump are louder and even they are not that loud.

My tank is in my living room.

[rogerwilco357]

i cannot see the forsale threads so i couldn't say ..man i have been wanting to buy some stuff but not enough post or time in yet. either way how much are they going for i need one .

[sjm817]

Roger, you have 52 posts. You should be able to see the selling forums.

[Daniel Reef]

i cannot see the forsale threads so i couldn't say ..man i have been wanting to buy some stuff but not enough post or time in yet. either way how much are they going for i need one .

You've been a member for more than 90 days and now have over 50 posts so you should be able to see the selling forum. You may want to log in and log out or close your browser so that you can see the forum.

[Dino]

His post in this thread was his 50th post from looking at his posts :D. In any case next time logs on should be able to see the transaction forums.

I don't have the MP40 but the MP10. I wouldn't trade it for anything, I was like many before I bought it - "Geeze, I'm going to spend almost $200 on a single powerhead?!!?" For me its been worth it though. Absolutely no trouble with it other than sometime I'm going to have to send it in. It has gotten nosier since I first got it and its definitely coming from the dry side.

[Northern Sensei]

Any thoughts on which is better the MP40w or the TUnze wavebox, it seems that there are many of the MP40's for sale, and the Tunze waveboxes are much harder to find.
I am in the market for ONE, so any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

[cubsare1]

Any thoughts on which is better the MP40w or the TUnze wavebox, it seems that there are many of the MP40's for sale, and the Tunze waveboxes are much harder to find.
I am in the market for ONE, so any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

I had a large size tunze wavebox in my 125, I could have waves crashing over the top of the tank on the opposite side with it (6ft) but the down side was it is VERY :eek2: large.
I never had a Mp40 so I cant help you there

[cham]

I put two MP40's on the rear wall of my tank. My rear wall is painted black so it hides the motor & the cords, by far the most inconspicuous power head I've ever owned. I also put some pieces of foam back there that surround the motor and its dead silent.

Beyond that, the flow pattern is unmatched IME. I've owned almost every power head from all price points and I feel like Vortech is the best I've owned.

But other tanks may have a better fit for Tunze's or something else. My problem was the fire hose blast type output, I spent countless hours trying to get the flow right.

If you don't have the budget for the more expensive pumps there are plenty of inexpensive ones that work just fine. Nothing wrong with that. But it's like going from a Chevy to a Mercedes, sure the Chevy works fine, but when you're driving a Mercedes you'll know the difference.

[liverup]

I would have to agree about not selling mine unless absolutely necessary. That being said, its a great item to have as they seem to hold their value and could be something sold quick.

They hold there value alot better than the tunze products, heck I had a hard time basically giving away some of my Tunze pumps!!

[Porcupinepuffer]

I also put some pieces of foam back there that surround the motor and its dead silent.


I can't believe I didn't even think of this idea. I'm one of the few who can't stand the loud noise of my vortech. I honestly believe some just have noisier bearings then others. Mine's just as noisy over a year later, as it was the first day I installed it. The revving up and down can be heard allover. I only have it at 70% max. I have it adjusted and lined up in it's sweetest spot. I'm a few days ago from changing the bearings in mine to see if it will help. (as there's a post in the DIY about changing the bearings). I will post my results there to see if I can get a bearing (pun intended) on why some are noisier then others.

Also, up here in ontario canada, our tax's recently jumped, thanks to our great politicians, (during an already slow economy) forcing many to sell their luxuries.

[cham]

I can't believe I didn't even think of this idea. I'm one of the few who can't stand the loud noise of my vortech. I honestly believe some just have noisier bearings then others. Mine's just as noisy over a year later, as it was the first day I installed it. The revving up and down can be heard allover. I only have it at 70% max. I have it adjusted and lined up in it's sweetest spot. I'm a few days ago from changing the bearings in mine to see if it will help. (as there's a post in the DIY about changing the bearings). I will post my results there to see if I can get a bearing (pun intended) on why some are noisier then others.

Also, up here in ontario canada, our tax's recently jumped, thanks to our great politicians, (during an already slow economy) forcing many to sell their luxuries.

If you look on Amazon they sell accoustical 2" foam (with the egg crate type cones on one side).

I cut those into 8" wide strips (the distance from my back glass to the wall) and sourronded the motors with them leaving small gaps at the bottom and top to vent warm air.

They have been running quietly for 6 months now and as long as I keep the wet sides clean its hard to tell that I even have power heads in my tank.

[cbatkinson]

would you recommend an MP 40 as the only pump in a 120G

[cbatkinson]

and how may of you with MP40's have had a problem with the pump breaking?

[polkiejoe]

been a member for years here... just need more posts :( looking for another MP40w

[gdm42001]

To all you current owners, do you think that I'll be able to hear much noise from an MP40 that is going "in-wall"?

Obviously I don't need to worry about the cords on the outside of the tank, OR bumping it with a magnet since I'm never going to clean my side glass.


I cannot hear mine until everything shuts down about 10:30 PM

[TOM BLEVINS]

They S#%K! Tunze and never look back.

wet sides develope a stick and then the hole thing spins and falls of and breaks your colonies!! gotta love it.

I would like to support the country and all but when the products not up to par, for get it with my investment in hand.

Tom

[juan319]

+1 with all

[cardiffgiant]

I used one for 6 months. I'm no stranger to putting a pile of cash into something that I like in this hobby, but the mp40 just didn't do it for me.

It was kind of neat, but my mixed reef responded better to the flow that I get from my modded 6025's and return pump. And that's what it's all about. If my system responded better to the mp40, I would have kept it. Heck, I probably would have bought another. Instead, I tried selling it on here with no takers and eventually sold it for $300 on a popular auction site (then paid $50 for shipping and fees). I ended up putting the cash right back into the tank.

I don't regret tying it.

Pros:
-Feature rich
-Variation in flow
-Minimal in tank profile

Cons:
-Reliability: My 2nd generation MP40W was not reliable (my driver fried, my wet side seized, and the electrical cord pulled loose on the dry side). THese problems didn't happen all at once mind you, so I had a 3 opportunities to switch back to my tunze 6025's while i was waiting for parts to arrive.
-Too much flow isolated in one area. I had grandures of going down to 1 powerhead in my 90, but that gave me too much flow on one end, and not enough on the other. I needed to dial it down and put a powehead on the other side.
-Noise. My beananimal overflow is extremely quiet. I could hear the mp40 ramping up and down if I use anything but lagoon mode.
-Side view. My tank is in a spot where I get a lot of use out of the side panes. I didn't like putting a powerhead in the middle of that, and putting a mp40 on the back wall of a 90 didn't seem like a good idea.
-Corals. This was a good pump for my SPS, but my zoas and LPS didn't do as well as they did with the 2 6025's.

[mchiareli]

How much are you guys selling the used units?

I would like one, but i can not pay for a new one right now.

[fcmatt]

i was soured with the mp40 due to jumping in very early when they came out.
i had issue after issue and eventually sold it on ebay saying the wet side needed work.
the magnet inside it had a coating that was worn through and would stick quite often.
should i even mention the driver box being dead on arrival, a wet side part that was part
of the shaft was replaced, and it was noticeably audible when ran at 100%.

now i see the pump has gone through a few generations and perhaps I will try it again
but the prices are still so high. i am happy with multiple smaller pumps at the moment
in my smaller tank.

I think a lot of these pumps are being sold because they are a hot item and therefore
many people own them. When they retire from the hobby it is one item that is actually
worth enough to be sold due to the high initial price and still being a popular choice.
You do not see people selling all the smaller items associated with tanks very often
because the effort to make 10-20 bucks per item is not worth many people's time.

[marioensf]

How much are you guys selling the used units?

I would like one, but i can not pay for a new one right now.


You can find them or about $300 + but shipping to Brasil might not make them that attractive.

[mchiareli]

You can find them or about $300 + but shipping to Brasil might not make them that attractive.

USPS is about $50, Fedex it's very expensive.

$300 sounds nice.

[marioensf]

The thing would be someone willing to ship to Brasil.

I think in the long run Tunze has an advantage; wearable parts from the manufacturer (Ecotech) are not cheap, just look at the wet sides ~$75.00 ? vs How much for a Tunze impeller?
Some others state having a soda can sized pump in the water vs the lower profile of the vortech (1/2 soda can in the water)

One of the big reasons of people selling their vortechs IMO is that upgrading to the newer ES model makes sense to sell the old and get a brand spanking new still with a year of warranty and the support.

[cham]

The thing would be someone willing to ship to Brasil.

I think in the long run Tunze has an advantage; wearable parts from the manufacturer (Ecotech) are not cheap, just look at the wet sides ~$75.00 ? vs How much for a Tunze impeller?
Some others state having a soda can sized pump in the water vs the lower profile of the vortech (1/2 soda can in the water)

One of the big reasons of people selling their vortechs IMO is that upgrading to the newer ES model makes sense to sell the old and get a brand spanking new still with a year of warranty and the support.

The wet sides aren't really considered a "wear item". There are some fifty cent washers inside the wet side that need replacing ever so often (about as often as an impeller I would guess) but there isn't a "scheduled replacement" of the wet side that I'm aware of.

As far as I know, in the maintenance arena, Echotech is well ahead of the pack. Their maintenance items are pennies.


Disclaimer: Let me say that I'm not pushing Ecotech or Tunze. I've owned both and I've dealt with customer service from both and I'll say that they are both great pumps with equally great customer service from both companies. I feel that there are applications where Tunze will be better and applications where Ecotech will be better. Hobbiests need to reseach what they are doing and make a choice.

[mchiareli]

The selling forums it's not visible to me, where is it supposed to be? After the sponsors?

[MMA]

I use both vortech and tunze. Both have their pluses and minuses.

[marioensf]

The selling forums it's not visible to me, where is it supposed to be? After the sponsors?

http://reefcentral.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=2

[crodger]

love mine would not sell it for anything

[andyvalk]

Anyone have an opinion on using an MP10 on 1/2" glass?

[kellerexpress]

I think the limit for an MP10 is 3/8" glass.

[SethTheWineGuy]

I am just putting together my 120 Reef and bought 3 brand new MP40wES's. I looked at a lot of different tanks with different pumps and there was really no comparison. By using 3 pumps in a tank that size I should be able to throttle down the motors to a relatively low noise level. I will post actual review results later when they're up and going.

[jmoney]

I don't get what issue everyone has with the noise...everyone must have some mouse ears or something. I use one on my 75 gallon, and used to run a tunze wavebox in there as well great flow, great undertow, don't think I could ever find a better combo.

[slakker187]

i am planning on running three on my 240g. i havent heard one in person so i am hoping they arent too loud. although i havnt heard the tunze either are they just as controllable as the vortechs or should i stay with my original plan?

[geaux xman]

at what % is the MP40 considerably quieter than running it at full blast?

i only have the mp10, but at about 75% it is fairly quiet. at 100%, the humming is very noticeable.

[reefsafe]

I have an mp10 on .5inch. I used double sided tape on the dry side and it works fine.

[neogenix]

Usually, in our local south texas reefing club they're the first things to sell when people tear down, and usually the first things to go up for sale when people need money.

[mordinad]

I have my MP40 running at maybe 80%, not noticeable. When I know the wife is out of town I put it at 100%. She hates the noise. Maybe will buy another one.

Hopefully next generation they figure out how to kill the noise.

[andyman]

sold mine for a pair of mp60. The mp60 has a better design on the wet side that is far superior and more reliable. On the flip side its double the cost.

[Da Saltwater DJ]

How much does a Mp 40 cost these days ??????

[dlp211]

How much does a Mp 40 cost these days ??????

You can get them as cheap as 375 brand new. You have to look and wait for the sales or know the right dealer. I just got two for 750 shipped to my door.

[Plato]

I think they seem like a really good idea, but with all of the units I've seen on the for sale board, I'm starting to wonder why such a high turn over (pun intended) and if they're not all they appear to be.

Any thoughts?

Because it help to pay for the MP60 upgrade.:crazy1:

[rtparty]

How much does a Mp 40 cost these days ??????

Whatever MAP pricing says they cost.

You have to be EXTREMELY careful buying them for cheaper than the MAP. If you get them from someone who isn't an authorized dealer, you will get no warranty from EcoTech.

Avoid buying them off ebay for sure. There are very few authorized dealers on ebay.

[Orcrone]

Whatever MAP pricing says they cost.

You have to be EXTREMELY careful buying them for cheaper than the MAP. If you get them from someone who isn't an authorized dealer, you will get no warranty from EcoTech.

Avoid buying them off ebay for sure. There are very few authorized dealers on ebay.

How about site sponsor vendors such as AquaCave and That Fish Place? They both offer percentage off coupons. I've purchased my Apex and my Vortechs from them.

[rtparty]

How about site sponsor vendors such as AquaCave and That Fish Place? They both offer percentage off coupons. I've purchased my Apex and my Vortechs from them.

They are both authorized dealers.

You can find coupons every now and then. I am just saying that on a whole you need to be careful. Just find out if they are an authorized dealer. I know of some authorized dealers that will sell you one pump for their cost. You have to keep it on the down low though, LOL.

[Orcrone]

They are both authorized dealers.

You can find coupons every now and then. I am just saying that on a whole you need to be careful. Just find out if they are an authorized dealer. I know of some authorized dealers that will sell you one pump for their cost. You have to keep it on the down low though, LOL.

Thanks. I figured they were authorized as I couldn't see non-authorized vendors being site sponsors.

[cboy]

I think maybe they are overhyped a bit.

When I 1st got my vortech I was disappointed casue everyone talks about how much flow they put out and best power head ever....

however i"m really happy with the lack of heat it puts into my tank.

[captnlars]

How well would they work with a Neptune controller on 72" 120g tank?

[metamorphis]

Doesn't hurt that you can use them for a year and then sell them for $25 less than you paid.

[PupPuP]

Would one MP10 be sufficient for my 2x2x2 cube or should I buy two? Maybe one MP40 instead? I really want to stop using my Koralias.

[chrishayes]

Would one MP10 be sufficient for my 2x2x2 cube or should I buy two? Maybe one MP40 instead? I really want to stop using my Koralias.

Funny, I found this thread while searching for a used mp40 to replace the under performing mp10 and mj1200 in my 45 cube. its just 6" shorter top to bottom than yours so I can tell you, one is not enough. Im sure hoping a mp40 will be good by itself. If you are interested I am going to sell my mp10 gen 2 once I get the 40. PM me if so.

[120reefermadnes]

Hey looking for some more flow in my 120 mixed reef, should I go with the mp40s or a wave box with my koralias or what?

[bpaw]

Its a great pump, alittle on the expensive side but worth it. Its an investment that can hold its value in case you ever decide to sell.

[tkeracer619]

:lol: this thread again!

Mp40s will provide better circulation then a wavebox and can make a good wave as well. The wavebox is great at making waves.

I would get the pumps.

[mathusala]

Wish I could find a mp60 for sale as that's my next purchase

[bif24701]

I am just putting together my 120 Reef and bought 3 brand new MP40wES's. I looked at a lot of different tanks with different pumps and there was really no comparison. By using 3 pumps in a tank that size I should be able to throttle down the motors to a relatively low noise level. I will post actual review results later when they're up and going.

Good call, I agree. At 80% you still get tremendous flow yet nothing audible.

[sirreal63]

Hey looking for some more flow in my 120 mixed reef, should I go with the mp40s or a wave box with my koralias or what?

IMHO it depends on your goals, if you truly want to move the entire water column back and forth, nothing works as well as the wave box, but like the Vortech, it isn't exactly quiet and the wave box still needs supplemental powerheads to work efficiently. You can use just the Vortech or Tunze to move the water and create a wave, but it isn't as efficient and you may not like the associated noise.

This is the only video I have seen that shows using all three methods. If I could tolerate the noise, I would use a wave box.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g4gqAYg27Jc

[Augustus]

So an mp40 is going for over 400$ on most of the mainstream online stores out there. Most of you guys are saying its to noisy and then defending it by saying just tone it down. So if you bought a Porsche and drove it over 3k rpm and the wheels started to rattle would you defend them too?

Before you tell me how great this thing is think about what 400$ or 450$ can buy you. For example the link below is to a gas engine 6.5HP high output water pump that will drain your swimming pool in ten minutes. AND its cheaper then live aquaria, bulk reef supply, some of the more well known online reefsites, sells a cheap plastic mp40.

http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053&R=202413255&catEntryId=202413255

And i'm sorry a cheap controller that lets you make it pulse and such does not come close to justifying the money. I've been in technology for 15 years and I can say with absolute certainty there are toasters at walmart under 100$ that have more code and processing power behind them. I've never looked at them in person but I would bet my next pay check its not hand crafted here in America either...

I haven't been in this hobby for very long but I have read thousands of posts and articles and between this, 100$ 3 polyp frags and some of the other stuff it makes me want to just call it quits and invest all the money in one of my other hobbies.

I'm really sorry for the rant but greed is ruining this country and I despise companys that rip people off.

[sirreal63]

Augustus, this hobby is gonna kick your butt, everything associated with it costs 10x to 50x more than the value of the product. Take kalkwasser as an example...15 bucks at the LFS for a small amount the size of a cold cream jar. Mrs. Wages Pickling Lime at the grocery store, 20x more for a couple of bucks, same product but it is not associated with the hobby, hence a realistic price. I won't defend Vortech's, they move a lot of water and do so in a great way, and if they were quiet I would have them, but they are not and my old Tunze's move just as broad of a pattern of water and I cannot hear them. Of course I had to change the shrouds on the Tunze's to get a broad flow, but it wasn't exactly hard or expensive. Tunze's are not inexpensive either, and the other "cheaper" pumps do not do the same thing. You do get some value with the higher end products, though it isn't always perceived as such initially.

[tkeracer619]

. So if you bought a Porsche and drove it over 3k rpm and the wheels started to rattle would you defend them too?

Horrible analogy. More like you buy a Porsche Carrera GT2 and complain that you can hear the engine. Buy a 1 series BMW next time.


Before you tell me how great this thing is think about what 400$ or 450$ can buy you. For example the link below is to a gas engine 6.5HP high output water pump that will drain your swimming pool in ten minutes. AND its cheaper then live aquaria, bulk reef supply, some of the more well known online reefsites, sells a cheap plastic mp40.


Your opinion is irrelevant based on this statement " I've never looked at them in person". Your ranting about something you have NEVER EVEN SEEN... :rolleye1:




And i'm sorry a cheap controller that lets you make it pulse and such does not come close to justifying the money. I've been in technology for 15 years and I can say with absolute certainty there are toasters at walmart under 100$ that have more code and processing power behind them.


You have been in "technology for 15 years" and still you have no clue what it takes to make a variable speed pump. That is pretty sorry indeed.


I haven't been in this hobby for very long

And I doubt you will be in the hobby for the long term as well.


I'm really sorry for the rant but greed is ruining this country and I despise companys that rip people off.
Greed? You mean being profitable in a niche market? Interesting perspective but I think your just ranting about something you know nothing about.

[mussel and hate]

I hear the frustration and to a degree I agree.

The Vortech pumps have equivalent sophistication to cheap radio control helicopters.

You can't really compare an MP40 to a gas powered utility pump. I may as well compare it to a windmill. They all pump water but they aren't at all interchangeable.

One sad thing about the reef hobby is that there is a perception amongst the reefers that price is equivalent to quality and utility. This is not at all the case. One might expect more than blind acceptance of a false equivalence fallacy from those engaged in what was once considered a somewhat scientific hobby.

Back on topic. The real reason you see lots of MP40s for sale: The one year warranty. Just flog that sucker for 85% retail after twelve months and buy another. Let some sucker believe he got a deal. Rinse and repeat.

I'll behave as though I have confidence in this product line just as soon as Ecotech does. That means at least a 36 month warranty in case any Ecotech people are paying attention.

[tkeracer619]

The Vortech pumps have equivalent sophistication to cheap radio control helicopters.


:lol: whats with the crappy comparisons? FWIW you couldn't be more wrong. They share nothing in common except they are circuits.

Find me a cheap helicopter with a brushless dc motor and I will gladly eat my words.


I'll behave as though I have confidence in this product line just as soon as Ecotech does. That means at least a 36 month warranty in case any Ecotech people are paying attention.
They built their company off the mp40. They have the best customer support of any company out there. They have helped me beyond the warranty period along with many others. Just because a product carries a 3 year warranty means nothing in regards to quality or confidence in the product.

[mussel and hate]

Lets see, brushless electric motor: check!

Wireless communication: check!

Servo control... wait Vortech doesnt have that...

http://www.xheli.com/2blhokirtfr.html

top of google I'm sure I could find you a cheaper one if I looked 2 or 3 hits deep. Start chewing.

[tkeracer619]

Lets see, brushless electric motor: check!

Wireless communication: check!

Servo control... wait Vortech doesnt have that...

http://www.xheli.com/2blhokirtfr.html

top of google I'm sure I could find you a cheaper one if I looked 2 or 3 hits deep. Start chewing.


Chew what? You linked a $170 RC Helicopter. Thats 7x what I paid for my "cheap radio controlled helicopter."

[mussel and hate]

They have the best customer support of any company out there. They have helped me beyond the warranty period along with many others. Just because a product carries a 3 year warranty means nothing in regards to quality or confidence in the product.


And yet my video card has a better warranty as does my sump pump and my counter top water boiller. If the product is so good and Ecotech stands behind their product why not offer a decent warranty?

[Allmost]

so were using helicoupters as pumps now ?

[tkeracer619]

And yet my video card has a better warranty as does my sump pump and my counter top water boiller. If the product is so good and Ecotech stands behind their product why not offer a decent warranty?

1 year is a decent warranty. Not the best but its decent. You act like the industry standard is pitiful.

so were using helicoupters as pumps now ?
No just comparing apples to celery :lol:

[mussel and hate]

hmmm... now youve got me thinking ;)

[nanojg]

The reason is very simple, they are easy to sell and retain their value. If you own a vortech and need some cash you can sell your vortech and get some cash...

[mussel and hate]

1 year is a decent warranty. Not the best but its decent. You act like the industry standard is pitiful.

One year warranty is pitiful... laughable?

You yourself claim Ecotech has helped you out despite your lapsed warranty coverage. What happened to quality? they've only been making these pumps for what, six years maybe?

I've got two Hagen Aquaclear 800s with over 20 years(!) of 24/7/365 operation. I have an Iwaki WMD20 with a similar number of hours of run time.

I found your cheap helo.

[mussel and hate]

so were using helicoupters as pumps now ?

We're comparing recreational consumer products incorporating similar components such as: Brushless DC electric motors with variable speed controllers and wireless control systems.

[tkeracer619]

One year warranty is pitiful... laughable?

You yourself claim Ecotech has helped you out despite your lapsed warranty coverage. What happened to quality? they've only been making these pumps for what, six years maybe?

I've got two Hagen Aquaclear 800s with over 20 years(!) of 24/7/365 operation. I have an Iwaki WMD20 with a similar number of hours of run time.

I found your cheap helo.

The pump they helped me out on is about 4-5 years old now. It was a simple $10 part. Quality is just fine.

Do your 20 year old pumps have magnetically coupled drives so the motor is on the outside? My guess is they are just a simple magnetic impeller with 1 moving part. Same with the iwaki.

[sirreal63]

so were using helicoupters as pumps now ?

You didn't get the memo?

[xcorallusx]

the wet sides go bad, and are expensive to replace, both "used" ones I bought had wet sides that needed to be replaced. be careful buying used

[mussel and hate]

The pump they helped me out on is about 4-5 years old now. It was a simple $10 part. Quality is just fine.

Do your 20 year old pumps have magnetically coupled drives so the motor is on the outside? My guess is they are just a simple magnetic impeller with 1 moving part. Same with the iwaki.

They are all magnetically coupled. The nature of the partition isn't germaine to the quesion of quality, reliability, warranty period or resale value.

Back on point:

As long as Ecotech maintains a unified base of high priced supply and demand for product remains, the market for newish used warrantyless pumps will equate to an eternal extended warranty plan for anyone with an Ebay account.

Addendum:

In my experience a waranty is a valuable part of any expensive consumer endurable purchase as it allows me to make demands upon the supplier as opposed to begging for help in case of unexpected failure.

If the product is as robust as you seem to believe then surely a three year warranty wouldn't cause the manufacturer to incur any significant expense, though it would providing assurance of reliability to a potential customer. If on the other hand there is a high failure rate beyond 12 months then I understand why the duration is so brief.

[tkeracer619]

the wet sides go bad, and are expensive to replace, both "used" ones I bought had wet sides that needed to be replaced. be careful buying used


I suppose the magnet could get damaged but in general if your wet side goes bad it requires a drive shaft, a bearing, and a new screw/nut for a total of $35. Not really that big of a deal. Most of the time just keeping them clean avoids any of this. I have wet sides that have gone 3+ years without a hitch.



Muscle you can go on and on about it but the truth is there is no other product on the market that can be compared to the vortech. We are talking two complete halves coupled by a magnet. This is where the wear happens on a Vortech unlike your pumps which have a coupling that is internal and secured in a single housing with much friendlier magnetic forces. Completely different ball game. Of course you know all of this already but continue to bring up irrelevant comparisons and continue to dismiss their quality simply based on the fact they don't offer a 3 year warranty. Many people have original 1st gen vortechs (including me) whirring happily away. Your making assumptions that are baseless.

What do you actually know of their quality? How many have you actually used? How long have you actually used them? I have around $3000 invested and many years of experience. To date cost of replacement parts is a whopping $10... Big freaking deal... FWIW I don't think they are overpriced or are really that expensive however I have found them as reliable as any other piece of equipment given the variables they have to deal with. I have fish that cost more then a Vortech...

One other thing you like to walk around with manufacturing and costs of goods. The market for aquarium pumps and RC toys is completely different. Your talking about a niche market vs one that appeals to the vast majority of males on the entire planet. Wonder what sells more?

[barjam]

Chew what? You linked a $170 RC Helicopter. Thats 7x what I paid for my "cheap radio controlled helicopter."

170 is a super cheap electric heli (a good one like the one I have will run closer to 500 dollars). What you bought was a helicopter toy that probably wasn't even radio controlled but IR controlled (junk). You can get a complete brushless setup for as low as 110. Who cares though brushless motors can be had for less than 10 dollars depending on application and the circuitry to drive them is trivial (pre built controllers can be had for around 10 dollars for small motors). Larger motors would, of course, be more expensive.

I bought a set of floor model mp-40s from the local fish store and returned them after two hours. I really wanted to like them as they look cool but they offered less/same flow than I already had with a couple of ghetto koriala 8s and they were gawd awful loud (I have an extremely quiet in wall tank). The wet side was pretty bad perhaps 180 dollars worth of new wet sides would help but even the motor was loud when oscillating up and down.

If your fish tank isn't super quiet they are pretty awesome though.

[Augustus]

To sirreal63

I totally understand spending more for quality. That's why I bought a new KTM instead of a Honda or Yamaha when I bought my last motorcycle. It just upsets me when something is overpriced because of marketing or hype. Just like those zoas, they are not more hardy or better in any way. Some goof ball gave them a silly name and they are cool color patterns so they charge 10-50 times what a normal frag costs. I hope you understand where I'm coming from.

To tkeracer619

Yes I do know how they work. The electronics that receive the signals from button pushes and feeds them into the processor to be handled by the few lines of code on a rom chip are about as complex as a digital calculator. Throw in a cheap motor, some plastic and a few other cheap parts and you have your mp40.

Honestly I'm not your enemy here. I'm only trying to point out that these things are way over priced. Not saying they don't move water, that the company is not friendly, etc. Only that you are not getting what you are paying for. Especially when everyone is complaining about how noisy they are...

Here is another example:

A nitro powered engine, ready to run, remote inlcuded , servos included (likely with brushless motors), etc for the same price as one single mp40 on bulkreefsupply.com. The starter that turns the nitro engine over to start it that comes with this kit probably has about he same motor in it as the mp40 and you are only using that to start the truck then throw it in your tool box...

http://www.hobbytron.com/TraxxasSlayerPro4WDNitroRTRShortCourseRCRaceTruck5907.html

If you can, in technical terms, explain to me how that little plastic pump is the equivelent or better then the RC car listed above that costs the same I will happily create a new thread endorsing the mp40 and admit to eating crow. Otherwise buyer beware and I'm done with this thread. Hope I didn't offend anyone in the process of venting my frustration.

[tkeracer619]

What you bought was a helicopter toy that probably wasn't even radio controlled but IR controlled (junk).

They are all toys. Some nicer then others. The one I got was junk but is RC not IR and I have since heavily modified it... Its a toy and will fly for about 18-20 minutes at a time. Stock it was lucky to get 4. I got it because its fun. Which is the point. I used to have some kyosho choppers and crashed them all the time. Might get another some day but I would rather buy another vortech.

[mussel and hate]

I have wet sides that have gone 3+ years without a hitch.

3 whole years!

Muscle you can go on and on about it

I'll try to be succinct.

but the truth is there is no other product on the market that can be compared to the vortech.

Both irrelevent and untrue, a twofer.

We are talking two complete halves coupled by a magnet. This is where the wear happens on a Vortech unlike your pumps which have a coupling that is internal and secured in a single housing with much friendlier magnetic forces. Completely different ball game.

Actually, no you ar wrong. The significant difference is that the two halfs of the Vortech are manually aligned, the magnetic forces are the same... unless these are from the bizzaro universe.

Of course you know all of this already but continue to bring up irrelevant comparisons and continue to dismiss their quality simply based on the fact they don't offer a 3 year warranty. Many people have original 1st gen vortechs (including me) whirring happily away. Your making assumptions that are baseless.

I in fact remonstrated against irrelevent comparisons, you've confused me with another poster. I have made no assumptions and I've attempted to support my claims any of which you have yet to refute in any sort of rational way.

What do you actually know of their quality? How many have you actually used? How long have you actually used them?

I'll assume that was rhetorical but in answer, in order: Only what I've read and seen, none and not at all.

I have around $3000 invested and many years of experience. To date cost of replacement parts is a whopping $10... Big freaking deal... FWIW I don't think they are overpriced or are really that expensive however I have found them as reliable as any other piece of equipment given the variables they have to deal with. I have fish that cost more then a Vortech...

Well big spender, I can see why Ecotech sends you free parts. In my 35 years of aquarium keeping I haven't spent half so much as you. Hell my first car was half that. Is this emotional regurgitation meant to persuade me that a twelve month warranty should be adequate?[/QUOTE]

One other thing you like to walk around with manufacturing and costs of goods. The market for aquarium pumps and RC toys is completely different. Your talking about a niche market vs one that appeals to the vast majority of males on the entire planet. Wonder what sells more?

I simply compared consumer products with similar components. If you care to explore economic theory you will see that it supports my contention regarding the cause of resale. That is my argument and one you seem unwilling to address.

Your emotional appeals while doubtless heartfelt aren't relevent or persuasive. Address my arguments.

[tkeracer619]

Honestly I'm not your enemy here.

Who said enemies :lol:. I'm not an "enemy" to anyone here but you are tossing out false info and poor comparisons which I am not afraid to go back and forth about since I have 100% more personal experience with the product you choose to bash.

I got what I paid for and it was worth every penny. Maybe you don't think so but again you have zero experience so I don't consider your opinion relevant in regards to that. I can see how I sound like a big jerk and thats fine with me because the things I am saying come from my experience. I know I can back it up and it drives me nuts when people get on public forums to bash products they don't own, never have owned, never will own, and have zero personal experience in.

[sirreal63]

Here is the one thing you will never see with a Vortech...
T-TRX5907
$720.99 now $446.95
On Sale!

As was stated it is a niche market, and it is currently protected under patents. For many of us it isn't the price that is objectionable, it is the noise. Any controllable powerhead will be more expensive, it is what it is. The cheaper ones that are controllable, like the Hydor, are even more flimsy and not built to last. While I do agree that the Vortech is priced higher than it should be, EcoTech has the right to charge what they want for it, they designed it, built it, tested it and market it. As long as people pony up the money for it, they really have no incentive to lower the price point.

Prior to EcoTech, if you wanted a controllable pump, you had to buy a Tunze, there really was no real alternative. The Vortech is at least another option that has some good features. They are not for every one, that is ok too. As far as the uber designer corals, those of us who have been around a little while don't buy them, at least not the designer name, we may get the same coral but have sense enough not to be ignorant with our money.

While I understand your frustration, I also understand why things are the way they are.

[mussel and hate]

Who said enemies :lol:. I'm not an "enemy" to anyone here but you are tossing out false info and poor comparisons which I am not afraid to go back and forth about since I have 100% more personal experience with the product you choose to bash.

I got what I paid for and it was worth every penny. Maybe you don't think so but again you have zero experience so I don't consider your opinion relevant in regards to that. I can see how I sound like a big jerk and thats fine with me because the things I am saying come from my experience. I know I can back it up and it drives me nuts when people get on public forums to bash products they don't own, never have owned, never will own, and have zero personal experience in.

By your logic a man can never know anything about a woman as he has never been one.

I've had a few pumps. I built my first electric motor when I was but nine years old. I have a basic grasp of the forces that dictate the behaviour of things. While I don't own a Vortech I know people that do. I have held, installed, examined and operated a Vortech MP40. Even had I not any of these experiences my arguments would still be valid.

I don't know if you're being intentionally obtuse or just trying to squirm out of an untenable position.

If these things are so damn good then why not offer a longer warranty period? People sell their Vortechs when the warranty expires just ahead of component failure and this is what stimulates active trading in used pumps.

[screamingibis]

30 posts to get to the for sale forum? I've read a go-zillion and only have ten posts. well, now 11.

[dadnjesse]

[QUOTE=mussel and hate;19794839]By your logic a man can never know anything about a woman as he has never been one.



And you think you know about woman from reading a book!

[tkeracer619]

I don't know if you're being intentionally obtuse or just trying to squirm out of an untenable position.




I laughed till I cried. The last response was not directed to you. I am at work trying to get an estimate to management by the end of today on how to spend a few million. I'll get to your posts when I feel like it and have the time.

Squirm? Not likely but nice try.

Can you stop with the warranty already? Trying to compare warranties to quality while not as far fetched as some of your other comparisons is still ridiculous. Also you clearly don't have a clue about the magnetic forces at play with the different pumps regardless of when you made your first motor. If your trying to posture my 3rd grade science fair project was a motor made from constructs, wire, and radio shack magnets. I am pretty sure I was 8 or 9. Big deal I didn't even win (some volcano did) so it clearly wasn't THAT amazing of a feat.

[SnowManSnow]

I like my mp40s I have 3 on my 120 and have no complaint other than the noise.

They are all out of warranty. 1 I even bought used, but CS has always provided me free parts when something goes wrong... which considering they run 24/7 isn't that often.

They are $$ yea.. .but I like um

[viggen]

My $70 RC Helicopter is actually quite impressive.... nice learner plus I get a big discount since a cousin owns a store

Vortech's are expensive probably due to them being a relatively low volume product. It would be interesting to see how many MP40's are purchased each year vs that RC car that's at about half off.

Had my MP60's for a few weeks now, replaced whatever the largest seio's are, very impressed.

Noise wise correct they are not silent however not many pumps are. I would say similar volume to the seio's. Presently the pumps are exposed to my living room with nothing to dampen the sound.

I have always thought it's amusing when people bash something they have never owned. Only go by what they read & have zero experience with the actual product, be it a $300-800 powerhead, $50,000 car or whatever.

O yea, I would say my pair of MP60's sound similar to what a iwaki20rlt/rlxt. Even though the iwaki pumps will run forever the more powerful iwaki's were always way to noisy for me. I just purchased another iwaki20 for h20 changes..... used all of them up to the 100.... Always thought they were overpriced for what I got.....

[tkeracer619]

3 whole years!
Yup my first generation broke down because the wet side design wasn't as good as the newer ones. All of the ones I purchased in the last 3 years have run without a problem.

Both irrelevent and untrue, a twofer.
How so? There is no other magnetically coupled propeller pump on the market. Not one.



Actually, no you ar wrong. The significant difference is that the two halfs of the Vortech are manually aligned, the magnetic forces are the same... unless these are from the bizzaro universe.

Manually aligned will always add more wear then an injection molded fixed alignment housing. And on your coupling there is a magnet that spins on the outside in the housing and the impeller is internal to it. The forces are inline with the shaft and cause no excess push or pull in any direction other then rotational. On a vortech the magnets are opposing causing 100% of the force to be applied to the bearing inside the wet side and the ball bearings in the dry side. Understand it or not you are wrong.



I in fact remonstrated against irrelevent comparisons, you've confused me with another poster. I have made no assumptions and I've attempted to support my claims any of which you have yet to refute in any sort of rational way.
What? You are the one claiming Ecotech has cheep products because they offer a warranty less then your liking (industry standard). I am being plenty rational.



I'll assume that was rhetorical but in answer, in order: Only what I've read and seen, none and not at all.
Just trying to point out that you have no experience to base your opinions on other then hearsay and I rest my case.



Well big spender, I can see why Ecotech sends you free parts. In my 35 years of aquarium keeping I haven't spent half so much as you. Hell my first car was half that. Is this emotional regurgitation meant to persuade me that a twelve month warranty should be adequate?
No its to show that I have experience where you are lacking and so anyone who happens to read this mess will understand that I actually use the product in question whereas you do not and never have. And yeah they gave me all those free parts ($10 worth) a few months out of warranty because of all the pumps I purchased from them in the future... are you high or just a troll?



I simply compared consumer products with similar components. If you care to explore economic theory you will see that it supports my contention regarding the cause of resale. That is my argument and one you seem unwilling to address.

Being in the manufacturing field I understand scale of economy in terms of products that are sold to few vs many. Your comparisons are similar to the point they run on electricity and operate under the same principles but far enough off to be completely irrelevant.



Your emotional appeals while doubtless heartfelt aren't relevent or persuasive. Address my arguments.
The emotion you think you hear is not me but the voice inside your head. I have addressed your arguments but you fail to read and comprehend.

Address what? The skitzo theory that the reason you see a lot of Vortechs for sale is because people are deviously swapping them out every year to get new ones under warranty. I'm not going to acknowledge it more then I just did because that is definitely from the bizzaro universe.

[mussel and hate]

Address what? The skitzo theory that the reason you see a lot of Vortechs for sale is because people are deviously swapping them out every year to get new ones under warranty. I'm not going to acknowledge it more then I just did because that is definitely from the bizzaro universe.

Did you just figure that out now?

Post 108, my first post in this thread. That which I contend on the subject of the thread "Why are there so many Vortech MP40's for sale?" ie. my argument that you seem so frightened of:


Back on topic. The real reason you see lots of MP40s for sale: The one year warranty. Just flog that sucker for 85% retail after twelve months and buy another. Let some sucker believe he got a deal. Rinse and repeat.

A statement I made that seems to have gotten you all riled up:

I'll behave as though I have confidence in this product line just as soon as Ecotech does. That means at least a 36 month warranty in case any Ecotech people are paying attention.

You may not like my theory. You may think it's schizophrenic. But you still haven't addressed the argument. Instead you sidestep the issue, and attribute statements to me that I did not make. A cowardly and deceptive tactic by the way.

What? You are the one claiming Ecotech has cheep products because they offer a warranty less then your liking (industry standard). I am being plenty rational.

Where have I made such a claim? Surely you can quote me if I did right?

Your attempts to dismiss my arguments because I don't own the product are ridiculous. The one doesn't predicate the other.

You need to understand what the words you use mean if your intent is to inform rather than merely insult, like rational and schizophrenic for instance.

You need to understand the concepts of the machine being discussed in order to grasp the significance of the comparisons being made. For one withBeing in the manufacturing field you seem to have some difficulty grasping how the brushless DC motor and wireless speed controller are common components to both designs. You don't think Ecotech makes those components do you?

Please don't take this as an insult I just don't know how else to put it. You are the one who isn't qualified to discuss this.

[Steve175]

You guys both have waaaayyyyy to much time on your hands.

For the record.

[Mike31154]

Why are there so many VorTech MP40Ws for sale? Holy moly, I dunno. I just sold a used one I purchased a while ago because I didn't really need two spares. I put the remaining spare I had into service on the back wall of my tank. So now I have 3 running on my system. First one is a Gen 1 which needed the wet side magnet replaced. Bad design, but EcoTech fixed it & the repair parts were only a few $$. The pump was out of warranty when that happened, no biggy. Since this minor hiccup, all my MP40s have been humming away 24/7 without a hitch, despite the fact that I'm often delinquent in cleaning them of algae, crud & such. For most products, warranties are highly overrated, try collecting on some of them. In my experience, when warranty was an issue, EcoTech delivered.

[alton]

Here is the one thing you will never see with a Vortech...
T-TRX5907
$720.99 now $446.95
On Sale!

As was stated it is a niche market, and it is currently protected under patents. For many of us it isn't the price that is objectionable, it is the noise. Any controllable powerhead will be more expensive, it is what it is. The cheaper ones that are controllable, like the Hydor, are even more flimsy and not built to last. While I do agree that the Vortech is priced higher than it should be, EcoTech has the right to charge what they want for it, they designed it, built it, tested it and market it. As long as people pony up the money for it, they really have no incentive to lower the price point.

Prior to EcoTech, if you wanted a controllable pump, you had to buy a Tunze, there really was no real alternative. The Vortech is at least another option that has some good features. They are not for every one, that is ok too. As far as the uber designer corals, those of us who have been around a little while don't buy them, at least not the designer name, we may get the same coral but have sense enough not to be ignorant with our money.

While I understand your frustration, I also understand why things are the way they are.

x2 I only have a MP10 but I love it

[nanojg]

You guys both have waaaayyyyy to much time on your hands.

For the record.

+1, wow

[rogster]

I think they seem like a really good idea, but with all of the units I've seen on the for sale board, I'm starting to wonder why such a high turn over (pun intended) and if they're not all they appear to be.

Any thoughts?

Because they are the most popular ? Mp10 too unrated, mp60 too expensive.
I guess most of the people has 60 and up sized tank.

[tkeracer619]

:lol: Somehow you think I am all worked up. I couldn't care less what you think.

Its not about you, its about a product you have never used but are quick to judge. Its called being a keyboard jockey laced with a bit of troll.

Did you just figure that out now?

Nope, seems just as loony then as it does now.

[viggen]

why are there so many Honda's for sale?

that's the real question :)

[bif24701]

Of all the money I have spent on my tank, and all the things I've bought, treaded, or sold my M,P40s are the greatest and easiest equipment I own. Not a fan of Radions, way over priced IMHO, but the Vortech I see the price well justified. With the MP40 I didn't need to purchase a chiller, controller or hide it. I show it off, people love looking at it.

[bif24701]

why are there so many Honda's for sale?

that's the real question :)

Same reasons as Vortechs, higher resale value. Meaning they are popular, reliable, and effective so anyone who breaks down their tank knows they'll get more money back from that product (% wise) than any other equipment. Period!

[A. Grandis]

Vortechs are expensive fun.
The selling of used ones is just one more fashion in this hobby, I would say.
Other fashions will come, like perhaps the selling of the " amazing ATB skimmers" ...

I like ATB skimmers and I like Vortech pumps!

Who knows why the fashions come by!?!

Grandis.

[aoeBombcat]

why are there so many Honda's for sale?

that's the real question :)

You mean used Honda!!!

[moondoggy4]

When I bought my Honda Civic it had a 36k mile warranty, the only thing that broke was the AC I drove it to over 230 K miles. My second Civic has over 250K miles and the distributor just went out and the AC is also broken not bad for a cheap warranty car they must not have faith in their product.

[najla]

why are there so many Honda's for sale?

that's the real question :)

ha ha ha

[ReLPSef]

In my opinion, if your MP40 is noisier than your overflow and skimmer, it's not aligned properly. Or your build was dead on.

[docstomper]

Please don't compare Ecotech MP10, 40, or 60's to anything with an analogy comparison to something that lasts with minimal maintenance... especially Honda.

These pumps need constant maint to keep them fresh and not costing $$. Wet sides... If I had a dollar for every time I have seen a post about needing a new Wet side I would have enough to afford a MP60.

However... The company is like Apple for reefing.. Bring out stylish design, a good strong product that has great user friendly capability and does its job and make it expensive for technology that is not advanced in theory at all... BOOM iMAC/EcoTech.

P.S. I am going to buy them truthfully, I need to keep putting my money into this hobby or else it gets boring.

[billwill]

Well I bought one used and sold it the same day. It was incredibly noisy as it ramped up. Not really noisy if left at one speed, but if I ran it like that it's a silly expensive powerhead. I played with it quite a bit. Everyone else I know that has them I've noticed the exact same sound, so I don't think that it's always an alignment issue. Very cool idea and design, but they are too loud for me.

[tkeracer619]

If I had a dollar for every time I have seen a post about needing a new Wet side I would have enough to afford a MP60.


I seriously doubt you can find 700 separate posts about failed wet sides. Your exaggeration is worse then the honda comparison.

What you have read and what I have experienced are not the same. You make it sound as if I have had to fix my wet sides every month or two. The earlier pumps were less reliable but the wet sides have been through several changes. If you keep your wet side clean you should have minimal maintenence costs. A new bearing, shaft, and screw/nut is $33. If it starts to get loose replace it before it completely wears out. Maybe once every 3 or 4 years. Big deal.

[tkeracer619]

Well I bought one used and sold it the same day. It was incredibly noisy as it ramped up. Not really noisy if left at one speed, but if I ran it like that it's a silly expensive powerhead. I played with it quite a bit. Everyone else I know that has them I've noticed the exact same sound, so I don't think that it's always an alignment issue. Very cool idea and design, but they are too loud for me.


That sucks and yes a noisy pump can be caused by a worn dry side that makes alignment nearly impossible but can be achieved on a single speed. If it was louder then the typical 100% speed whirring sound then you had bad bearings in the dry side or the pin spacer might not be correct.

If it was just the external motor making a whirring noise when at 100% you can turn them down to 90%. Still a ton of flow and quiet. If the noise is bothersome at less then 90% then either you are very sensitive to noise or something is worn or wearing out and needs to be addressed.

[hvacman250]

First off, I'm not a fan boy of anybody, but I'll put in my 2 cents.

I pay the premium for a Vortech because #1 the small profile inside the tank and #2 the intense flow they provide, in that order. I have used them in a conventional set-up (on a stand in a room) and now have them in an inwall 220.

They are not dead silent like an in tank powerhead, but cannot be heard over my skimmer. I'll trade some noise from a Vortech vs. the looks of a big, ugly powerhead in a tank.

I own 2x MP40WES and 1x MP60WES. One 40 is almost 2 years old and the others are one year old. I NEVER maintain them other than an occasional wipedown is a snail gets stuck. None of my 3 have ever broke down.

Ive owned 2 Koralia Evo 1400s. Would start backwards occasionally.
Owned a Tunze 6025. Bracket mount broke after a week.

The point I'm trying to make is Ive been more than pleased with my 3. Are they expensive? Yes. Are they overpriced IMO? Absolutely, but should a large magnet cleaner cost $80? Heck no. This is a hobby where you pay to play. I'll accept the cost to make my tank look as natural as possible.

As an onwer of an HVAC company Ive learned over the years sometimes you'll meet people that won't be happy with anything. They could find a pot of gold and ***** about how heavy it is. Also unreal expectations. They want a pump that pushes 7000 GPH, in a tiny profile, with crazy features, and want it to be dead silent. You gotta take the good with the bad.

[rtparty]

These pumps need constant maint to keep them fresh and not costing $$. Wet sides... If I had a dollar for every time I have seen a post about needing a new Wet side I would have enough to afford a MP60.

However... The company is like Apple for reefing.. Bring out stylish design, a good strong product that has great user friendly capability and does its job and make it expensive for technology that is not advanced in theory at all... BOOM iMAC/EcoTech.

I am going on 2 years with my MP10 and have never had a single issue. My wet side is in perfect condition still. I maybe pull it out once every 2 months and scrub it off with a toothbrush.

I like how you ask people not to make ridiculous comparisons and then you do so yourself. Apple just rebadges stuff and jacks the price up through the roof. Ecotech doesn't rebadge anything because there isn't another company that makes a pump like them. If the technology wasn't all that advanced, why did it take so long for a company to come out with a product like Ecotech did?

I am not saying Ecotech had any groundbreaking technology or space-age stuff but no one else thought to move the motor outside the tank like they did. Thus, it was pretty advanced when it came out.

[Saadatski]

hey it was recently in the news how Ecotech has a huge warehouse where they keep all of their customer's souls!!

kidding (maybe) but Ectotech is a pretty dandy company, quite professional, but at the same time stands by their product firmly, which every caring company does. However, their customer's stand by the product more than they do, and that definetly says something.

Clearly i did not post anything criticizing the product, because honestly i have never owned one. I noticed many people enjoy it, regardless of flaw (nothing in this universe we live in is perfect, everything abides by the simple law of entropy). I will be honest that these are expensive, which something that makes waves shouldn't be. I will give these a try when i start work next week and get the money, because the product is very intuitive and a great innovation in the aquarium industry.

Well there are also many different ways to add more flow in your tank if you are on a budget. Keeping an open aquascape definetly adds a DRASTIC amount of flow. If there is a spot my koralias missed, i simply stick my hand in the water and start a small wave which gets the VERY few dead spots i have.

Ill see how these vortechs work out after i buy them soon. I hope they are as good as they sound

[yerboy]

Please don't compare Ecotech MP10, 40, or 60's to anything with an analogy comparison to something that lasts with minimal maintenance... especially Honda.

These pumps need constant maint to keep them fresh and not costing $$. Wet sides... If I had a dollar for every time I have seen a post about needing a new Wet side I would have enough to afford a MP60.

However... The company is like Apple for reefing.. Bring out stylish design, a good strong product that has great user friendly capability and does its job and make it expensive for technology that is not advanced in theory at all... BOOM iMAC/EcoTech.

P.S. I am going to buy them truthfully, I need to keep putting my money into this hobby or else it gets boring.

i have had 2 mp-40 gen2 running nonstop for almost 2 years and all i have done is clean the wetside's grills from time to time.

[bretcummings]

Some folks upgrade to large vortech and don't need the smaller pumps anymore.

[sea witch1]

Found this thread when looking for a mp40....Wowsiers! Both informative and entertaining!

[rsg4]

why are there so many Honda's for sale?

that's the real question :)

Haha!..Because they don't make a good product like they did in the past. I see your in Ohio, you work for Honda too?

[redtop03]

By your logic a man can never know anything about a woman as he has never been one.



And you think you know about woman from reading a book!

I'm 45 years old,been married for 25 years and I still ain't figured out women...only thing I see similar in comparison to an aquarium is they are both expensive to upkeep :lmao:

I have an MP60,purchased used for about $100 less than new,it was still under warranty then but that has long since expired,over 2 years old now and still running like new....

motor noise is quickly drowned out by the sounds of crashing waves on the ends of the tank...a little exaggeration there of course :lmao:

I tried the Koralias and didn't like the looks or the fact that the magnet mounts were weak and using them on a wave maker made them more noisy than the Vortech when they did the clanging thing trying to restart,that was if they would even start in the correct direction...

I gave 'em away to get rid of 'em and tried the MJ1200s with the sureflow prop kits,much better looking IMO than the ugly Koralias but with the same issues other than the magnet mounts were better...

I do think the Vortech are a bit over priced but for what they do and how they look in the tank,nothing else compares...

as for warranties,I've never had anything that didn't last past the warranty or had anything serviced with a warranty except my car,most things I just fix myself,the fact that the Vortech pumps can be fixed by just about anybody with some mechanical skills makes them worth more to me...

except for when I clean the wet side,my MP60 runs continuously 24/7 even during a power outage with the battery back up,and has been doing so faithfully for over 2 years

I can't always be here when we have a power outage to connect the generator,so having a battery back up pump to keep my tank alive is a priceless option for me...

I plan to add a 2nd MP60 in the future and eliminate my closed loop system,which uses about 10 times more power and moves less water,which,by the way,also cost more that the MP60 and has about 18 feet of ugly 1.5" PVC on the outside of my tank

[reefsafe]

"'m 45 years old,been married for 25 years and I still ain't figured out women...only thing I see similar in comparison to an aquarium is they are both expensive to upkeep "

LMAO

[Luxo]

I am going on 2 years with my MP10 and have never had a single issue. My wet side is in perfect condition still. I maybe pull it out once every 2 months and scrub it off with a toothbrush.

I like how you ask people not to make ridiculous comparisons and then you do so yourself. Apple just rebadges stuff and jacks the price up through the roof. Ecotech doesn't rebadge anything because there isn't another company that makes a pump like them. If the technology wasn't all that advanced, why did it take so long for a company to come out with a product like Ecotech did?

I am not saying Ecotech had any groundbreaking technology or space-age stuff but no one else thought to move the motor outside the tank like they did. Thus, it was pretty advanced when it came out.
Ryan,
They have a patent on this that is why!
Frankly not sure how they even got the patent the same design of magnetic coupling is used in many different industries but let's face it Orbitec got a patent for LED light!
Someone did challenge them a while back, not sure what came out of it!
There are very few inventions in this hobby and the major ones are quickly copied since the inventor cannot afford to get a proper patent because of the costs and size of the industry!
They quickly forgotten and the mainstream of Aquarium companies keep on using someone else’s idea.
Example: Who came up with Bubble-Plates for skimmers? If they could have patented the skimmer market would have been way different now!
This is rather sad and that is why we had a good run from early 90s to early 2000 but past 10 years mainly the same product rebadged, remarketed…………. No one wants to put money in R&D since they see no future in it. We do have big companies like Hagen and Central Pets they can afford to change the hobby if they want to but not a penny from those guys in R&D, just plastic injection, new box and profit!
Is Ecotech manufacturing these in-house? Like literally doing the stators, rotor.. Assembly....?
I doubt that, I think it's the exact same as Apple, they designed a successful MARKETABLE unit and everything is outsourced! Maybe they assemble it I but have no Idea how this is worked with Vortech.
I wouldn't say Apple is rebadging! They did the design and Interface...
These days no one is making anything anymore! It's all the same; very few companies in our hobby actually make their own products. Most are Chinese a few German companies and maybe a couple from here!
I work for Siemens and many items except the super Hi-Tec is outsourced but we do our own R&D.
Cheers,
Dave

[aquariumclowner]

My vortech mp40 is running close to 4 years. I did have to send in the unit at about 3 months since the wet side kept dropping. Customer service was great and pump has been running since.

[E.intheC]

If you look on Amazon they sell accoustical 2" foam (with the egg crate type cones on one side).

I cut those into 8" wide strips (the distance from my back glass to the wall) and sourronded the motors with them leaving small gaps at the bottom and top to vent warm air.

They have been running quietly for 6 months now and as long as I keep the wet sides clean its hard to tell that I even have power heads in my tank.

I know this post is from a LONG time ago but I've never heard of anyone doing this. Did you run into any heat issues? Has anyone else tried anything similar?

[a240reef]

some of us are getting out of the hobby

[chunk78]

how do you get to the for sale section of RC?

[sirreal63]

90 days of membership and 50 meaningful posts before you can see the for sale areas.

[ganjero]

how do you get to the for sale section of RC?

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1746459

[flyingphish]

My MP40's are the greatest thing since sliced bread.

Vortech FTW!

[xbobdog]

I just put a mp-40 in. I can't appreciate much noise. Seem to work very well. I cant put it on high because it blasts all of the sand out of the corner that it is in. (120 gal)

[eb2292]

Just put a couple bids on an MP40w on eBay.. after reading this thread I'm pretty sure it'll beat the heck out of my two Koralias on the Hydor wave timer. I'm sure nothing the MP40's do is as bad as the clicking the Koralias make when switching on and off... and the real estate they take up in the tank.

[mypepper]

My MP40's are the greatest thing since sliced bread.

Vortech FTW!

Flyingphish is so write on his comment. I've owned my MP40 for five months, and it's the number one single best purchase I have made in the past 45 years of maintaining salt water aquariums. I'm now waiting for the Reeflink controller that can control my MP40 within the next few months.

The next biggie / quality purchase I made, was purchasing my LED lighting.

How I love this hobby,
Randy

[stevenson22]

like others I like mine

[havasuviking1]

What would be a fair price for a MP 40 es used? Looking for one.