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clittrell
03/26/2010, 08:42 PM
After much info on treating ich I set up a hospital tank, a 29 gallon tank and moved all my fish there. I have had the tank at .5ppm of cupramine for 21 days tomorrow. It seems to be going well. The 6 fish, 3 tangs 2 cardinals and a diamond goby had not show any spots after the first few days. The problem in the Hippo Tang is showing spots again and is flashing. All the fish are eating and seem to be OK. Is it normal for the spots to return while you are treating with cupramine? Should I just continue to maintain the level until the spots go away?

RegalAngel
03/27/2010, 08:30 AM
Cupramine (ie Copper) will NOT killy the Ich parasite on the fish. It only kills the parasite in the free swimming stage when hatched from the cyst that falls off the fish.

This free swimming stage can take up to 28 days once the parasite drops off the fish.

You therefore, need to have the proper strenght of copper in the tank for at least 28 days once all spots on the fish are gone.

I hope you are testing for copper to make sure it is at 0.5ppm.

http://www.fishvet.com/no-ich_faqs.htm

"What is the life cycle of this parasite?

The life cycle of Cryptocaryon can be conveniently divided into four basic stages. Susceptible marine fish become infected with the active free-swimming stage, called the tomite.

The free swimming tomite has less than 12 hours to find and invade a host fish otherwise it will exhaust its energy reserves and die.

If an invasion is successful, the tomite penetrates below the skin and transforms into the parasitic stage which is known as a trophont. The trophont actively feeds on the fish's tissues, twisting and rotating as it does so. It grows rapidly, doubling in size approximately every 24 hours. By 48 hours, the parasitic trophont is just visible to the naked eye, appearing as a small white spot on the fish. By the third or fourth day of infection, the trophont has attained 3 to 5 millimeters in length and about this time it exits from the fish and drops down to the substrate.

Within a few hours the trophont has firmly attached to the substrate, forming a thick walled cyst. The cyst, known as a tomont, is the reproductive stage which will eventually give rise to between 100 and 300 infective tomites, thereby completing the life cycle.

Of course, not all tomites are successful in locating and infecting a host, even under ideal conditions only about 5 - 10% succeed. Nevertheless, within a closed environment, Cryptocaryon can increase in numbers by approximately tenfold every six to eight days. This enormous reproductive potential explains the sometimes rapid build-up of infection levels in any closed system."

Recty
03/27/2010, 01:09 PM
I'd be willing to bet you arent keeping the level at .5, I've used cupramine multiple times and never in all my times with it has any ich been visible on a fish after a week of treatment.

Seachem support recommends 3 weeks minimal treatment with cupramine and a lot of people go for 4 weeks.

I would treat for at least 2 weeks more than the last time you saw ich on a fish, so if your blue tang is still showing ich I'd keep treating for at least another 2 weeks, because it's obviously still in the tank which means your other fish could have it too. Fish can have ich in their gills and you never even see it.

clittrell
03/27/2010, 08:55 PM
Thanks for the info. I test with seachem and salifert test kit. I think they both read about .5 but it depends on how you hold it with the light. I will run the reference test with seachem Sunday.


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clittrell
03/29/2010, 09:57 PM
Thanks again for the info. I tested Sunday and it was atleast .4. I did an 8 gallon water change added 2ml and tested again and got a solid .5. I also have to say that seachem is great! Here is the response to an email they sent me.

Thanks.

"To be honest, it is normal for the spots to re-appear during treatment, even become worse at times. The Ich parasite goes though a life cycle in which they will fall off of their victims, forming a cyst at which time they proliferate exponentially. During this period the medication does not effect them. They release from this form as free swimming tomites any where from 3-28 days depending on temperature. It is during this free swimming stage that they become susceptible to medication such as Cupramine. I would recommend extending your treatment to a month or even a little longer to ensure that you have eliminated them in all stages of their life cycle. I hope this information was helpful and please let us know if you need any further assistance. Good luck and have a great day!
Seachem Support"

tangzzz
03/29/2010, 10:06 PM
I also had no problems with cupramine. It is best to test at least daily to make sure the concentration is at .5. The concentration declines with time and it is best to catch it and add what is needed to keep at at .5 for the whole 14 days. Since ick reappeared, extend it another 14 days, making sure the concentration stays at .5