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Rhizo
03/29/2010, 01:29 AM
Thank you Rod for breeding such nice onyx clowns. :thumbsup: They are tricky to photograph at 1cm big, I tried. Feeding Rod's Food six times a day, and they have gotten super fat :D. I don't recommend you feed this much without a proper nutrient export. Enjoy :beer:

In case somebody asks where to get them, Jeremy at Premium Aquatics ordered over 25 clowns from Rod.

<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/36945650@N07/4472011301/" title="resize1 by Joe (Rhizo), on Flickr"><img src="http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2693/4472011301_09cc98dc3e_o.jpg" width="600" height="450" alt="resize1" /></a>

<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/36945650@N07/4472790632/" title="resize2 by Joe (Rhizo), on Flickr"><img src="http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2776/4472790632_79e7347b0c_o.jpg" width="600" height="450" alt="resize2" /></a>

<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/36945650@N07/4472790394/" title="resize3 by Joe (Rhizo), on Flickr"><img src="http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4021/4472790394_7a0a1271db_o.jpg" width="600" height="450" alt="resize3" /></a>

WDLV
03/29/2010, 09:57 AM
Good for you! Happy reefing.

ILLiDaN
03/30/2010, 11:02 PM
sweet lookin clowns

hawgdawg
03/31/2010, 07:31 AM
Where are the Onyx?

jonnybravo22
03/31/2010, 07:50 AM
apparently he's not going to be selling them anymore so good for you to get part of the last batch; (check the message at premium aquatics in livestock section)

jasony816
03/31/2010, 08:43 AM
so if premium aquatics is not selling them anymore, who is?

deangelr
03/31/2010, 09:18 AM
nice photos

arioch
03/31/2010, 10:24 AM
Is Rod's getting out of that business completely now, then? At least, in quantities for retail stores.

There are several other reputable dealers around, I got a pair of juveniles from Mitch (kerusso316 on here).

You can always buy the C-Quest ones for like $150-200.

t4zalews
03/31/2010, 06:47 PM
Kinda what mine looked like when I bought mine about 8 months ago...
Then-->
http://i626.photobucket.com/albums/tt350/t4zalews/IMG_0362.jpg

Now-->
http://i626.photobucket.com/albums/tt350/t4zalews/IMG_0230-1.jpg

I got them from premium aquatics as well...they first took to a rose bubble and had very little black...now host in a sebae, havent gone full onyx yet tho...i hope they do

clowns101
03/31/2010, 06:53 PM
Is Rod's getting out of that business completely now, then? At least, in quantities for retail stores.

There are several other reputable dealers around, I got a pair of juveniles from Mitch (kerusso316 on here).

You can always buy the C-Quest ones for like $150-200.

The fish from C-quest arent $150-$200!Thats actully like 7.5-10 times higher than wholesale!

Mitch has got great fish!I still need to get some!

Scoobers
03/31/2010, 07:12 PM
LMAO I have C-Quest onyx and they were no where near $150-$200.

JJ Ocean
03/31/2010, 09:56 PM
I'm starting to rear my onyx clown's eggs again. The parents are very nice and have produced equivalent offspring (small shot in my avatar). I'll post some pics in another thread, so as not to hijack this one. If you're in or near Atlanta, I'll have some in the near future.

PayasoDelMar
04/01/2010, 12:48 AM
i just got some too! its amazing how dark they are at such a size

[QUOTE=PayasoDelMar;16864845]http://i761.photobucket.com/albums/xx255/johnatan2007/DSC01222.jpg

Rhizo
04/01/2010, 04:00 AM
LMAO I have C-Quest onyx and they were no where near $150-$200.

Do you have a birth certificate? C-Quest clowns with authentication are $150~200. Yes, I do mean the clown comes with a piece of paper. :)

Rhizo
04/01/2010, 04:02 AM
The fish from C-quest arent $150-$200!Thats actully like 7.5-10 times higher than wholesale!

Mitch has got great fish!I still need to get some!

Read my post before this. Authenticated C-Quest clowns are that price.

PayasoDelMar
04/01/2010, 08:34 AM
Do you have a birth certificate? C-Quest clowns with authentication are $150~200. Yes, I do mean the clown comes with a piece of paper. :)


This is true

WDLV
04/01/2010, 08:50 AM
Do you have a birth certificate? C-Quest clowns with authentication are $150~200. Yes, I do mean the clown comes with a piece of paper. :)
I didn't realize we were there yet. Next we'll have our own version of the AKC. Maybe the American Aquarium Club. We'll hold conventions that rival the Westminster. We can call it MACNA or something like that! :lmao:

bues0022
04/01/2010, 08:55 AM
Why would a "new" Cquest Onyx have to come with papers, and why does it command a price nearly 4 times higher than other breeders? The Onyx line originated with Bill Addison, so any onyx you see out there is very likely (one-way-or-another) linked back to Bill Addison and Cquest.

Papers? for a fish? Really? This isn't AKC, we aren't "showing" our clowns and winning prizes. I think the papers bit is just a gimmick to have the public perceive something of a higher value than what it actually is. So, if Rod, Mitch, Joe, Matt, Doni, etc start giving out papers for their fish they can charge $200 per fish?

BTW, where do you go about this purchase process to get a fish with papers. I want to authenticate this information.

clowns101
04/01/2010, 10:19 AM
Talked with a C-quest worker and asked:

"Do C-quest clowns come with a paper saying they are a authentication clowns from C-quest."

Response:

"No,our clownfish do not come with any sort of papers accept a invoice from us.We do not give clownfish pappers of any sort.If this is really happening someone else is buying our fish and giving them a paper!"

Right from C-quest!

And bues0022 is right.As I have stated in other post regarding Onyx clowns,they all come from C-quest/Bill Addisons line!The Onyx from SA,however arent C-quest line as the pair that they did have was a wild caught pair with the coloration of Onyx clownfish!

And I will state that the Onyx clowns from other breeders will more than likly use C-quest's blood line for their fish!

WDLV
04/01/2010, 11:15 AM
This could become quite a long sidebar... but if you look at typical Solomon island percs they often look just like Bill Addison's fishs' blood line. In fact I would venture to say that's where Bill Addison's fish originated. The idea of someone wanting to pay more for an "authentic" fish from a particular blood line is not a new concept nor is it likely to change any more than the desire of many of us to possess a "Limited Edition" corals. I have had some corals that looked identical that I got for far less than their flavor of the month coral counterparts and they looked great. I've also got in some really nice looking SI percs and sold those off for $10-$20 ea. Nobody would know the difference to look at them. As far as I am concerned, "Onyx" is to melanistic perculas as "Ping Pong" is to table tennis.
That said, I like to have bragging rights just as much as the next person (see my avitar) and I'm no less a clown nut than any of you who love the designer perculas.

The female is WC, the male was a CB SI perc.
http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e92/walterlaroque/4-2009/4-22-2009009.jpg
A little older... That's a 6" flower pot for reference. They were still quite young.
http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e92/walterlaroque/1-2009/Jan200940.jpg

SI perc Babies.
http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e92/walterlaroque/1-2009/Jan200937.jpg

bues0022
04/01/2010, 12:06 PM
The prolem with what you just stated is that nearly all onyx percs raised and sold on the US originate from cquest and Bill Addison. Rods parents orignially came from Bill, so did mitch's, and through breeding so did many others. I could say I have "true cquest onyx" fish because I got mine from Mitch and can trace lineage back to cquest. Don't you see, the lineage thing in onyx is moot because they all (nearly) originate from the same place. As far as corals go, I think the lineage thing is BS anyway, so that arguement holds no value in any respect IMO.

Rhizo
04/01/2010, 12:08 PM
Talked with a C-quest worker

Go figure.... N E who yes the clown did come with papers. I don't own the clown, but it was signed and dated. The clown turned out a super onyx. Very similar to Rod's Male in a female version... Maybe C-Quest does not do this to the public? The person I know has strong clown fish connections, beyond what most breeders have.

Yes all clowns have the gene. If you look at one onyx to another, they wont all be the same. Water quality and nutrition play a huge role.

I dont see why I have to argue about your ignorance? I'm not even a clown breeder. :lol:

WDLV
04/01/2010, 12:21 PM
The prolem with what you just stated is that nearly all onyx percs raised and sold on the US originate from cquest and Bill Addison. Rods parents orignially came from Bill, so did mitch's, and through breeding so did many others. I could say I have "true cquest onyx" fish because I got mine from Mitch and can trace lineage back to cquest. Don't you see, the lineage thing in onyx is moot because they all (nearly) originate from the same place. As far as corals go, I think the lineage thing is BS anyway, so that arguement holds no value in any respect IMO.

I'm not sure how you can say that they all originate from the same place (Bill Addison's Pair) when I just showed you what was part of a batch of several hundred that had nothing to do with the "Onyx" line of fish and yes... I sold every one of them.
The only difference between those and the "Onyx" line is that the "Onyx" have been inbred longer so as to show a propensity to the melanistic trait in their offspring.
So, maybe you'll see 80% of an "onyx" batch showing melanistic qualities versus say 60% of a run of the mill SI perc spawn.

Also, I'm not so sure water quality has so much to do with the darkening of the fish so much as it impacts mis-barring whether it be desirable (Picasso/Snowflake) or undesirable (half-bars).

traveller7
04/01/2010, 01:31 PM
If you dig through the archives on RC, you can find so much detail on coining the term Onyx and their chain of custody Bill, to Morgan and Rod, and beyond it is scary.

After a few years of consideration, my take: "Onyx" is like "Wyoming White" a trade name originally put on specifically related fish, but "onyx" has taken on a much wider use in the hobby. Onyx was like Band-Aid, and has become bandaid in general use. I would personally use Onyx to describe the fish from Bill's line, and SI/PNG/onyxlike for others. I don't get bugged by folks calling anything Onyx, but I do ask for lineage when they do :)

Don't expect to solve or conclusively end debate here, just state your point, agree to disagree if necessary, and move along.

fwiw: Not the oldest of the oldies, but a goodie:
http://archive.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=352358&highlight=onyx

fwiw2: One of Rod's oldest posts with onyx:
http://archive.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13599&highlight=onyx

PayasoDelMar
04/01/2010, 01:35 PM
Althought they might have all originated or gotten C-Quest bloodline somewhere along the line, each breeder's fish is unique to its own. C-quest are usually super onyx and have slender bodies with more of a pointy head. Rod's have those Stuby bodies and are usually pretty orange. Then ORA's have stuby faces and are pretty yellow, at first

Blues0022, if you think the lineage thing is nothing but shananagins, you are very very mistaken. The fish you got from mitch ( the ones in your avatar i assume) compare nothing to the ones that come directly from C-quest. They are nice fish but lack the onyx that the C-quest have.

WDLV, nice clowns, both the SI percs and the Thielleis

JJ Ocean
04/01/2010, 04:03 PM
“Onyx” to me has nothing to do with lineage, but more to do with the specific coloration of certain percs. Very debatable, but the general definition I go by is the domination of black in the body in between the 1st/2nd stripes and in between the 2nd/3rd stripes. The front dorsal fin being all black is an added confirmation of “onyx” designation.

It seems like some tie “onyx” to lineage (who they got them from), but the “onyx” collection source or origination is more accurate – mainly PNG (SI as well). Just like yellow bellied regal tangs vs. regal tang - the difference is original collection source. Mine were WC from PNG 7 years ago. Doesn’t make them any better, but it is a stretch to say most of the “onyx” out there are from a few folks. The amount of fish being imported through the trade is significant. To be honest, I would have preferred to source them as captive breed due to acclimation and not removing wild reef specimens, but I didn’t know a source at the time.

WDLV
04/01/2010, 05:20 PM
fwiw: Not the oldest of the oldies, but a goodie:
http://archive.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=352358&highlight=onyx
Good thread.


WDLV, nice clowns, both the SI percs and the Thielleis
Thanks! I promise to spread them around if they spawn for me.

PayasoDelMar
04/01/2010, 09:08 PM
It seems like some tie “onyx” to lineage (who they got them from), but the “onyx” collection source or origination is more accurate – mainly PNG (SI as well). Just like yellow bellied regal tangs vs. regal tang - the difference is original collection source. Mine were WC from PNG 7 years ago. Doesn’t make them any better, but it is a stretch to say most of the “onyx” out there are from a few folks. The amount of fish being imported through the trade is significant. To be honest, I would have preferred to source them as captive breed due to acclimation and not removing wild reef specimens, but I didn’t know a source at the time.


I think it ties into lineage because the amount of black that will develop has a lot to do with the genetics of the parents. Since you are rearing your clowns and they are "onyx" its safe to assume they will produce offspring with equivalent amounts of black on their bodies. At least thats how i see it.

PayasoDelMar
04/01/2010, 09:10 PM
Thanks! I promise to spread them around if they spawn for me.

Hurray for tank raised clowns! those especially! :thumbsup:

JJ Ocean
04/01/2010, 09:29 PM
Agree on the genetics. I was really referring to the comment on the size of the gene pool in the post below.

The onyx population within the hobby is significantly larger than Bill Addison & Cquest's sales and subsequent breeding. A healthy population of WC onyx have been coming in for the last decade. Nothing against their fish - they look great. The general population and genetics is just larger than that.

As I've mentioned before, I'm a big sponsor of captive bred clowns & they've done a great job in that regard.

Why would a "new" Cquest Onyx have to come with papers, and why does it command a price nearly 4 times higher than other breeders? The Onyx line originated with Bill Addison, so any onyx you see out there is very likely (one-way-or-another) linked back to Bill Addison and Cquest.

Papers? for a fish? Really? This isn't AKC, we aren't "showing" our clowns and winning prizes. I think the papers bit is just a gimmick to have the public perceive something of a higher value than what it actually is. So, if Rod, Mitch, Joe, Matt, Doni, etc start giving out papers for their fish they can charge $200 per fish?

BTW, where do you go about this purchase process to get a fish with papers. I want to authenticate this information.

traveller7
04/01/2010, 10:21 PM
Let's get the thread back on track with the original posters fish, if they are from Rod, they have a well documented tie back to the fish originally named "Onyx." That is not in dispute.

Enjoy your fish Rhizo :)

PayasoDelMar
04/01/2010, 10:30 PM
I believe they are F4s of the original C-Quest pair too