Turnover and gph

[Drewbaby]

Can anyone help me figure out how much flow I need in a 180 with a mixture of sps, lps, and some softies. Roughly how many times do I need to turn over the volume in the tank to eliminate dead spots? Is there a formula

[nanojg]

Every tank is different, but I think about 60x turnover/hour normally works for me.

[beckerjm]

Every tank is different, but I think about 60x turnover/hour normally works for me.

Wow. That's the 1st I've heard a number that high. I thought 40 times/hr was good for SPS - and less than that for LPS and definitely less for softies. ???????

[njudson]

Some people do well with tons of flow but I think you would be fine with significantly less than 60x /hour in a mixed reef.

[nanojg]

Softies can handle a ton of flow IMO, I do have to carefully place some of the lower flow LPS (frogspawn, hammer, etc.)

[Drewbaby]

Ok so I'm looking for 40 or 60 times turnover rate?

On a 180 thats 7200 to 10800 pgh? That's sounds a liitle high to me. I'm thinkg my return pump is rated for 2100gph before head and 1460gph after. So basically I would have to get a few koralia 5's or 6's does that sound right? I'm still trying to figure out proper flow and turnover

[nanojg]

i have 3200 on my 58 gallon, not counting my return pump, seems good to me. Thats too much of a return pump imo, how big is your sump?

[Drewbaby]

My sump is a megaflow 4. Not sure of the exact capacity. But my return pump also gets redirected through my fuge so I'm not getting exactly 1400 gph in tank return, but it is a little much. Got the pump on sale and paid less than what my lfs pays wholesale for it so Im makng due.

Does anyone have any suggestions for powerheads in a 180 to get around 10000gph?

[nanojg]

That depends largely on your budget

[Drewbaby]

Well I'm saving up to get what will work best because I'm tired of buying temporary equipment and it not being efficient long term so right now I'm just taking suggestions

[nanojg]

I love my vortech, 3 mp40's would be great, but expensive

[teesquare]

I just love seeing threads like this....:rollface:
For nearly 30 years I have seen folks use arbitrary numbers to decsribe what they think the maximum flow or turnover rate is...
How about this thought instead:

As much as your corals can handle?

Couple of giudelines tho...

1. Soft corals, LPS and leathers do not tend to like direct high rate of flow.

2. SPS corals overall like more flow.

3. Avoid "hard point" flow. Look for ways to distribute the force of the water over a larger area. Comparison - old style powerheads with small diameter discharge, versus Tunze, or Vortech style with a much broader flow pattern are much better.

The same is true with return pumps. Look at higher flow rates, with wider flow distribution.

In my own tank (250g display) I am using 3 Vortechs, and A Barracuda for the return pump . I also have a Hammerhead running two OM-4s - so there are 8 holes in the tank for the closed loop.
Bottom line...LOTS of flow.
Build thread:
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1762906

Lots of pictures...
T

[Drewbaby]

I know there's no set number you can put on flow or gph because each system is completly different. I was just looking for some guidance from a more knowledgable source. Basically I'm trying to plan ahead lol with the best results later

[AaronReeph]

On my tank, I only have the return pump cycle about 5x the volume of my tank. I have pumps and filters and skimmers and refugia in my sump and IMO a flow of around 5x tank volume is good to maximize performance of all those things. I'm not sure how much my refugium would like it if I ran 2000 gph through it.

In the display tank on the other hand, thats a totally different story. And I agree with posters above who say wide/broad flow like tunze vortech and koralia. Also random flow.

But there's no need to get a huge return pump with a huge current draw to try to meet most of your display turnover rate. This can be done much more effectively and economically with power heads (or a really well though out closed loop if you choose)

[teesquare]

Aaron - not to dis-agee, just to discuss:

A large external pump *may* be more efficient than a smaller pump which would still need multiple powerheads in the tank.
Let me explain-

Suppose you are plumbing to a basement, for a sump location there, and the display is on the main floor above.
If you have a basement, then you can also likely separate the refugium from the main sump via a couple of ball valves. This could make for a larger, more effective refugium, and allow a higher flow rate thru the main sump.
If one chooses a pump such as a Sequence/Reeflo Barracuda ( or comparable low amp draw pump)- you would have plenty of flow, higher turnover, on pump, and likely be at about the same electric consumption as a multi-powerhead, smaller pump configuration. As well, internal pumps/powerheads contribute more to heat int he tank, so that may require fans at least - or chilling if more than fans can effectively deal with.

OP - there is no one "right" way...much depends on your particular needs/desires. This needs to take into acct. your plumbing scenario, and what type of tank you intend to set up. Lots of choices, and plenty of good ones!

T

[AaronReeph]

Yep, T is absolutely right.... when I was explaining my scenario I assumed the system was for a sump setup similar to my own, and with goals similar to my own but (as has been demonstrated) there are limitless possibilities! Which means lots of decisions to make :)

[teesquare]

But - that is a lot of the fun in this hobby! Making the choices, studying different approaches...
Enjoy the trip. It is not just the destination that is the goal.

T

[Drewbaby]

Lol thanks for the advice. I guess I was just hoping for a more direct path to the finish but thinking back to my 55 trial and error played a big part in it's success. I suppose all good things are learned the hard way.

I'll take you advice and kind words with me on this journey lol

[teesquare]

Most welcome! I hope I do not come across to harsh. I wonder sometimes if how I write is too "direct"...Not my intent to be like that at all.

Best of Luck on your new tank set up!

T

[sjm817]

You can get some very high flow with very low wattage from powerheads. You cant match that with return pumps.

Hydor K8 just as an example. 3250 GPH @ 18W. 2 of them would give you 36x turnover @ 36W.

[tkeracer619]

My mixed reef has 57x turnover. I want more.

[Drewbaby]

T your not too direct. I'd rather have a straight answer than a run around

Ok well I guess I'll shoot for around 60x turnover and see how that goes.

Would it be better to use 3 hydor k8's or maybe more of the smaller koralias? I'm wondering if the 3 would eliminate all dead spots or if I would need more than 3 sources of flow to keep minimal dead spots. I might just be overthinking it. Let me know