PDA

View Full Version : tank cooling idea. Would it work?


d1greenfish
06/16/2010, 10:44 AM
I live in an apartment without ac and during the summer temps can sometimes hit 100 degrees. I'm a poor college student and don't have the money for a chiller, nor do i have the time to stay home and switch out ice bottles all day. What i do have is $5 for a cheap ice cooler and ice machine. So my idea is basically to set up a closed loop into the cooler. The tubing would coil several times in the cooler, then back out to the tank. I'm sure somebody has thought of this before and was wondering if anyone knows whether it would work or not. I have about 40gal total water volume. Thanks!

also if this would work, what kind of tubing should be used inside the cooler that won't insulate the water passing through too much?

jtrasap
06/16/2010, 11:47 AM
Maybe a cheap window AC unit would be a better investment....8-)

reefbat
06/16/2010, 12:01 PM
Sounds like it would do the job cheaply but you'd probably want to give it a test run a time or two before trusting it while your away to see just about how long it will effectively cool. I would think just the standard vinyl tubing would be fine since your going to be coiling it several times in the cooler, mabye even put layers of ice between each coil.

LeGaCYWinZ
06/16/2010, 12:02 PM
Maybe a cheap window AC unit would be a better investment....8-)

I know(at least at my school) most landlords won't permit window AC or space heaters, so it may be out of the question for him. However if you can have one, I would say this is the way to go.

B-Willz
06/16/2010, 12:08 PM
I have heard of this but never seen it in action. They used refridgerator water line tubing, it was like 30 ft of tubing, it comes in a small coil so you can fit all of it in a small cooler. Put a small pump on one side from the sump and let pour pack into the sump.

GKill
06/16/2010, 12:25 PM
It will be good to hear your results. You are basically going to cool your water the way a water dispenser on a refrigerator works, so the idea is sound. I agree with the previous person that thought you should do a test run to see how long the ice will work and how consistant it is.

dcombs44
06/16/2010, 12:29 PM
I've heard of doing this with a mini fridge. Drilled holes in the side of the fridge and siliconed around the holes. The amount of tubing in the fridge was ridiculous, but I believe the result was good.

beeper man
06/16/2010, 12:36 PM
You can find this setup on you tube, and you will get a better heat tranfer if you coil the tubing in a tub of water in the cooler.

amr952
06/16/2010, 12:39 PM
I've heard of doing this with a mini fridge. Drilled holes in the side of the fridge and siliconed around the holes. The amount of tubing in the fridge was ridiculous, but I believe the result was good.

That is an interesting idea. I would assume it would probably contribute to more wear but it would work for a while.

Jakef150
06/16/2010, 12:42 PM
Windowless ac ????

Levito
06/16/2010, 12:47 PM
Windowless ac ????

Those are very expensive. And all AC units have heat output that has to go somewhere.
<meta **********="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8">

cpl40475
06/16/2010, 12:47 PM
For the tubing MAKE SURE you use a plastic type. RO/DI Tubing will work for this. Another way is to just try a cpl of small fans blowing across the tank and sump if you have a sump.
WHat size tank are we talking about? Some more details on setup will give ppl more info on how to help you achieve the goals your trying to reach.

reefvilla
06/16/2010, 12:48 PM
I live in an apartment without ac and during the summer temps can sometimes hit 100 degrees.

Why in the world would they make an apartment,townhouse or anything else WITHOUT AC!!!???? Especially if it gets up to 100 degrees!!!:hmm4:

I would die! We keep our house at 67* and I love it!

amr952
06/16/2010, 12:51 PM
Why in the world would they make an apartment,townhouse or anything else WITHOUT AC!!!???? Especially if it gets up to 100 degrees!!!:hmm4:

I would die! We keep our house at 67* and I love it!

When I was a student and lived on campus I also did not have A/C and it got in the high 90's :(

But now my wife keeps the house at 68 and sometimes tries to freeze me out :spin2:

dcombs44
06/16/2010, 12:54 PM
Why in the world would they make an apartment,townhouse or anything else WITHOUT AC!!!???? Especially if it gets up to 100 degrees!!!:hmm4:

I would die! We keep our house at 67* and I love it!

This is pretty common in and around college campuses.

The largest state university in Illinois (U of I) has non-A/C dorms and temps in August and early Sept can and do frequently hit mid 90s. It's miserable, but pretty common.

reefbat
06/16/2010, 12:55 PM
This is pretty common in and around college campuses.

The largest state university in Illinois (U of I) has non-A/C dorms and temps in August and early Sept can and do frequently hit mid 90s. It's miserable, but pretty common.

Probably not a bad thing in the co-ed dorms :celeb1:

dcombs44
06/16/2010, 01:03 PM
Probably not a bad thing in the co-ed dorms :celeb1:

More heat does = less clothing doesn't it. :spin2:

Sanagy
06/16/2010, 01:17 PM
would need metal tubing to get good heat transfer.

I believe titanium tubing is available, and is the only really saltwater safe metal.

d1greenfish
06/16/2010, 01:52 PM
Legacy hit the nail on the head, my lease prohibits ac units and space heaters. Even if i could get ac (for my benefit as well as tank's) I don't have the cash for it at this time.

Cpl- It is a 20l DT and a 20 upstream fuge w/o a sump. I will be running fans, but from what i read, they are only good for a drop of a few degrees.

Considering i havn't cycled my tank yet, i think i'll give it a try and post my results. Just thought of a bonus, the cooler would be a good place to stash a few beers to have handy to relax and watch the tank.

thelittlereef
06/16/2010, 02:24 PM
I think to get the temp to be steady would be tuff? I'd try to make on out of a dehumidifier would work beter.

Paul B
06/16/2010, 02:33 PM
I have done this when I had a sea urchin collection business and I would keep them at about 45 degrees. I used a water cooler, the ones with a five gallon container on it. I did not use the container but the small sump where the container fits, you could use your ice cooler. The way I did this I would not do in my reef because I used copper coils that I covered in fiberglass resin. Urchins are very sensitive to copper and I never lost one but I would only use titanium in a reef. I ran the cooler with some water in the small sump. There was a small powerhead in the sump that sent cold water through the copper tubing in the urchin tank. It cooled it to 40 degrees but the tank was styrofoam.
It worked for years.

d1greenfish
06/17/2010, 11:58 AM
I'm wondering if I would get better heat transfer if I had the water pass through several small glass bottles instead of coiled tubing in the cooler.

lordofthereef
06/17/2010, 12:44 PM
I have heard of people doing this with great success. Your limiting factor would be the tubing you use. If you go with plastic, it isn't going to conduct heat much. If you go with titanium, you are going to spend out the butt and it wouldn't be worth it for you (compared to just getting the "real" thing). Another thing to consider is if you are cooling it off from 100 degrees, your refrigerator will probably be working 24/7. As has been mentioned above, I would go with a room AC unit. Here where it has been 90+ degrees and 80%+ humidity daily it is costing roughly $30 a month to cool the 10x15 room the tank is in and keeping the tank cooled as well. The added bonus, of course, is the fact that the room is comfortably cooled as well!

EDIT: just read your lease prohibits AC units. Bummer!

amr952
06/17/2010, 12:49 PM
Maybe:

http://saltaquarium.about.com/od/diychillerplans/ss/sbsdiychiller.htm

This was basically said above but this gives you instructions on how to implement.

chimmike
06/17/2010, 12:53 PM
you'll need a TON of coils in there to cool the tank down the approx. 20* from ambient (if you said it gets to 100*), and the fridge will likely run constantly, so the power bill is gonna go up as it's going to act like a chiller. Might shorten the life span of the fridge considerably as they're not made to run like chillers are.

crills
06/17/2010, 12:58 PM
Ya thats what I am hearing.
I can only put one more thing in then Im done till I get a bigger tank.

agentgreen
06/17/2010, 01:08 PM
BTW, this same setup is called a jockey box in the beer drinkin' world. Makes it so you don't have to keep the keg of beer cold. You have a standard cooler, 50' or more of metal tubing coiled up in the cooler, and then a tap. I have one of these and can assure you it works well in cooling down a 75 degree keg :)

Check it:

http://www.beveragefactory.com/draftbeer/jockey/CB281R.shtml

http://www.kegworks.com/product.php?productid=20981&source=base

d1greenfish
06/17/2010, 01:18 PM
I actually won't be using a mini fridge, but an ice cooler filled with ice. I do have a dorm fridge, but i think my roommate would be ****ed if i used the extra beer fridge for my tank. =P

rcpauff
06/17/2010, 03:16 PM
google wort chillers for ideas this is basically what you are trying to accomplish

lordofthereef
06/17/2010, 03:41 PM
I actually won't be using a mini fridge, but an ice cooler filled with ice. I do have a dorm fridge, but i think my roommate would be ****ed if i used the extra beer fridge for my tank. =P

Well in that case I think your ice is gonna melt pretty damn fast in a 100 degree room! In any case, the point is that, unless you are getting free ice someplace, filling an icechest daily (or more) with ice is going to run the electrical bill up as well.

sedor
06/17/2010, 03:43 PM
Where do you live a third world prison!?! No AC and not allowed to have a portable window unit sounds like unjust cruelty to me. I would fight to be able to use a window unit and go that route.

My guess it that by the time you got the mini fridge DIY cooler actually working properly you would have spent as much as you would have on either a window unit or a used chiller. For 40G the cost of a chiller won't be to much. I came across a used one in my LFS a couple weeks ago for under $100.

pweissma
06/17/2010, 03:57 PM
Those diy chiller ideas sound like fun. On the hottest days you might also consider reducing the need to cool your tank water by insulating the sides of your tank with blankets. Heat is transfered into the tank through the glass. Sufficiently reduce the heat transfer, cool your tank with fans, and you may be fine. You can look at your fish later. At least they'll be alive. ;-) Best of luck!

FearTheTerps
06/17/2010, 06:44 PM
i think the heat transfer thru the coil is going to be the limiting factor if you do go with the plastic tubing, i would get the largest diameter you can with the thinest wall.

However i have another idea that may work i think. Instead of using a coil of tubing in the cooler, what about using a reservoir of some sorts inside the cooler. This would give you a larger amount of water to be cooled, while that at first might seem counter productive, in the long run once you got the water cooled down it should help it stay cool. I would say use a large plastic water jug, or even a small rubbermaid container. Use a pump with a very low flow, as the longer the water is in the reservoir the better it will be cooled down

An added tip, add some salt (regular table salt or rock salt) to the ice, that will help it stay a few degrees cooler then just regualr ice water. Same principle as making ice cream.

d1greenfish
06/17/2010, 08:20 PM
My building has a free ice machine about 8 feet from my front door, which is what gave me the idea in the first place. The 100 degree weather only lasts a week or two between july and august. I'm just trying to plan ahead to avoid any panicked knee jerk reactions when it does hits.

I was also toying with the idea of not hooking up the 20gal refugium until after the hot weather. The trade off would be the system being less stable, but cooling 20 gallons of water would be easier than cooling 40.

pweissma- never thought of insulating the ENTIRE tank once cool, that would help.

By the way, thanks to everyone for their input and ideas. =)

lordofthereef
06/17/2010, 08:25 PM
Well if the ice is free, and you can grab a free cooler, why not just give it a try. I mean really, what the heck have you got to lose? I second what others have said about no AC and not being allowed one... I feel like there has got to be some sort of law against that :D