which do you think fiji indonesia or vanuatu collect fish better?

[twelvejewelz]

which of these place do you think have better fish collecting practices fiji ,indonesia, or vanuatu ? Im wondering where the better of the multibar angelfish are coming out of and being collected and where the somewhat questionable ones are coming from? I read something about it a while ago and cant find the article i read. Thanks in advance and all opinions and facts are welcome :)

[JHemdal]

I would always pick Fiji over Indonesia due to cyanide use in the latter country, but I don't have enough knowledge of collecting in Vanuatu to have an opinion on that one.

Jay

[snorvich]

My first choice would always be Australia. Fiji and Vanautu would be tied for second.

[inselaffe]

is that your multibar in your avatar?

[Robka]

My first choice would always be Australia. Fiji and Vanautu would be tied for second.

I agree with Australia and would add Hawaii as a co#1. From what I've read and observed it seems like those 2 locations have the best collection practices:)

[twelvejewelz]

is that your multibar in your avatar?

yea it is its the smaller of my pair.
Im looking to get another pair for my girlfriends tank and just wanted to know where the best specimens would be coming from as ive had good luck with mine it helps to have even better luck lol . Thanks everyone :)

[klepto]

I would always pick Fiji over Indonesia due to cyanide use in the latter country, but I don't have enough knowledge of collecting in Vanuatu to have an opinion on that one.

Jay
Is it fair to say that some of the Indo collectors use sustainable practices? Or is this still not the case for the vast majority? I have heard that cyanide is still being used in Indonesia, but I'm curious about what other factors make Indonesian livestock such a poor option. Also, could you direct me to some good reading about this issue?

This is directed mostly at Jay and Steve, but feel free to add your thoughts.

Thanks.

-Jake

[LKGRenegade22]

I know you are directly asking about a multibar but I have a LFS that deals with Vanuatu alot and almost all of the wrasses I have gotten from him came from Vanuatu and have excellent colors and are very healthy.

I love my Australian fish too though.

[twelvejewelz]

I know you are directly asking about a multibar but I have a LFS that deals with Vanuatu alot and almost all of the wrasses I have gotten from him came from Vanuatu and have excellent colors and are very healthy.

I love my Australian fish too though.

It dosnt necessarily have to pertain to the multibar angel. Its nice for us as hobbyists to know where any type of healthy fish are coming from! I wouldnt want to support any collectors still using cyanide by buying their dirty fish anyway.

[klepto]

Its nice for us as hobbyists to know where any type of healthy fish are coming from! I wouldnt want to support any collectors still using cyanide by buying their dirty fish anyway.
I agree. This topic isn't discussed enough.

[29reef]

I agree. This topic isn't discussed enough.

I believe it's because most of the time it's difficult to find where a fish came from, unless your getting the fish directly. Fish are easily mixed together on their way to retail stores. Unless it's a higher dollar or an endemic species it can be hard to know for sure. IMO

[snorvich]

Well, usually the LFS knows where the fish came from; sometimes they may even tell you!!

[Cantonesefish]

Well, usually the LFS knows where the fish came from; sometimes they may even tell you!!

Usually when I ask their response is "uhh... maybe indo.... or.. uhh... somewhere in the pacific...."

And how many people bought yellow bellied regal angels labeled as "red sea"? ;)

Straight from collector or places like LADD are your only sure bet.

[snorvich]

Usually when I ask their response is "uhh... maybe indo.... or.. uhh... somewhere in the pacific...."

And how many people bought yellow bellied regal angels labeled as "red sea"? ;)

Straight from collector or places like LADD are your only sure bet.

LADD is a sure thing. But often the LFS can find out if they are motived to do so. Not just the average person in the store, but the one who orders.

[Swim]

At this point and time, Vanautu.

[Outerbank]

LADD have several difficult species coming from Vanautu. I bought a Vanautu regal angel last December from LADD and it is doing very well.

[29reef]

LADD is a sure thing. But often the LFS can find out if they are motived to do so. Not just the average person in the store, but the one who orders.

If the lfs orders from QM there's a good chance the invoice will reflect 95%(or better) accurate. I can't say the same for others. If the lfs is importing then it would be much easier and more accurate. This is my experience. Some places don't label their fish as good as others.

[twelvejewelz]

Now are we saying that the other places do not use cyanide at all or that its just less of a chance that you will get a fish that was captured with cyanide at these places? Id bet hawaii and aus do not use it at all but what about all of the other places? Why do they use the cyanide wouldnt those nets the use to drop around themselves be easier i dont understand why this is still even practiced?

[Sheol]

I don't know how many LFS actually are motivated to find out how their fish are caught. In Hot Springs, Ar Pet Co. had a bad reputation but I've seen others in the chain that have Net caught only or CB.. I would think a dedicated SW store would care enough to ask how their suppliers get the fish. That is, assuming said suppliers are also honest.
I'll go with Fiji, Australia, & Hawaii as the safest areas as far as collection practices. I hate losing fish! :(

Matthew

[Korrine]

If the lfs orders from QM there's a good chance the invoice will reflect 95%(or better) accurate. I can't say the same for others. If the lfs is importing then it would be much easier and more accurate. This is my experience. Some places don't label their fish as good as others.


ok you lost me. Who's QM? I think I just found it...Quality Marine?

Is it better to buy MAC certified fish?

[klepto]

ok you lost me. Who's QM? I think I just found it...Quality Marine?
Is it better to buy MAC certified fish?
Yes, QM: Quality Marine

I'm not an expert on this by any means, but a friend of mine lives in Bali and is a well seasoned diver/ reef photographer. He has told me that the MAC certification is not perfect.. but in general he strongly recommended going the MAC route. Essentially, the standards are higher and the detrimental impacts to the reef are minimized. ie. no cyanide. This is coming from someone who sees the impact of the hobby and improper collection methods first hand.
Some species are not available through MAC certified vendors and many hobbyists simply buy the fish that catches their eye or they just pick a species. I think its great you are asking this and giving it some thought. Opting for sustainably collected livestock is a good option all around. :thumbsup:

[klepto]

Why do they use the cyanide wouldnt those nets the use to drop around themselves be easier i dont understand why this is still even practiced?

I hear your point.. but thats almost like asking.. Why do people still smoke cigarettes? People will be people. Where there is a profit to be made, there will be someone with a shortcut, ignorant of the entire picture.

[Korrine]

He has told me that the MAC certification is not perfect.. but in general he strongly recommended going the MAC route. Essentially, the standards are higher and the detrimental impacts to the reef are minimized. ie. no cyanide.

Thanks. I think this certification stuff might be new territory for me. Don't remember reading about it w/in the last couple years, anyway.

If a fish is certified will it have a paper or something that comes with it? How will I know if it is or if a lfs is just telling me that a fish is certified?

[klepto]

Check out the website. It will answer your questions better than I will..
http://www.aquariumcouncil.org/
My LFS is a certified retailer.. I think you will have to take the word of the LFS for the most part.

I haven't seen anything like documentation for fishes- although there is such a thing as CITES documentation for some banned species.

[Korrine]

Thanks :)