150 gallon bad boy stocking?

[akdylpcikles]

I am getting a 150 gallon tank. All I know is that I really want a dog face puffer. would this stock list work?
dog face puffer
moray eel
niger trigger
pink tailed trigger
some type of tang
blue spotted stingray

[Adam S]

i dont think stingrays will work because the eel, puffer and triggers would tear it up i would think.

[akdylpcikles]

oh what about a panther grouper too?

[Adam S]

Panther groupers get huge and are pretty messy

[akdylpcikles]

to big for a 150?

[Adam S]

well they can get up to 20 inches but mostly it is the waste it makes. http://www.aquaticcommunity.com/Groupers/Panther.php

[akdylpcikles]

so no on the panther grouper.

[Crabber]

No to the panther grouper. The niger trigger will eventually get to be and possibly aggressive for your tank. As stated the stingray wont work as well. What type of eel and tang? You have some good options, just have to find the right combination, what are the tank dimensions?

[akdylpcikles]

the tank is custom made its 72" 22" by 24" tall. its about 165 gallons. I will have a 50 gallon sump for it. im going to get a snowflake eel. Im not sure on what type of tang? any opinions? Allso could I add another puffer? maybe a porc or another dogface?

[Stuart60611]

the tank is custom made its 72" 22" by 24" tall. its about 165 gallons. I will have a 50 gallon sump for it. im going to get a snowflake eel. Im not sure on what type of tang? any opinions? Allso could I add another puffer? maybe a porc or another dogface?

Your tank is too small for a porcupine puffer. You can have a dogface puffer and a toby puffer if you desire to have two puffers, but that is pretty much it as far as puffers. Two dogface puffers will not work, and they will fight. Puffers can do some serious damage with their beaks so it is definitely something you want to avoid. Note that the snowflake eel has been known to go after smaller fish and particularlly puffers, especially dogface puffers. As such, you may not want to have a snowflake eel and puffers. As far as tangs, you have a bunch of options, including a kole, tomini, yellow, purple, convict, and other similar sized tangs. However, note that some of these tangs are very aggressive, and if you stock one of the more aggressive tangs you may need to match it with fish who are also equallly aggressive. Your tank is too small for either a niger or pinktail trigger long term. There are several triggers which would be suitable for your size tank with tankmates, including the saragassum, blue throat, and Indian trigger (note this is my favorite trigger for tanks of approximately your size and is from the same genus as the pinktail, except it stays much smaller and is more peaceful, but otherwise looks and acts very much like a pinktail).

[akdylpcikles]

why is my tank to small for a porcupine puffer? I herd they only get 9-12 inches. what about a box fish? sorry if my stocking sounds stupid im just throughing out ideas

[Stuart60611]

why is my tank to small for a porcupine puffer? I herd they only get 9-12 inches. what about a box fish? sorry if my stocking sounds stupid im just throughing out ideas

No problem. You are doing the right thing by carefully researching your stocking selections BEFORE you purchase fish. As far as the porcupine, they get up to 18 inches, and this issue was recently discussed in the below thread (particularlly page 2). A boxfish can work, but you need to house very passive tankmates which would not include triggers, large puffers, tangs, and the like.

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1922817

[BuckeyeTodd]

Most will tell you the porucpine is going to outgrow that tank, and it very well may...but, back in the day before I read forums and relied on lfs for knowledge I kept a porcupine in a 125 for five years with another large puffer. After four years the stars and stripes puffer started getting aggressive towards the porcupine and had to be removed. So I think the two can be housed together, at least for a significant amount of time. You will have algae issues though, since the porcupine will eat the snails and the two puffers will produce large quantities of waste

[akdylpcikles]

I have herd that pink tails only get like 12-15 inches? is this not correct?

[akdylpcikles]

ohhhh and I dont want a moray eel I want a snowflake. haha

[akdylpcikles]

new list
dog face puffer
snowflake eel
sargassum trigger
pink tailed trigger
maybe a tang


what about an emperor angel?

[MedicalZoa]

[QUOTE=Stuart60611;17836892]Your tank is too small for a porcupine puffer. You can have a dogface puffer and a toby puffer if you desire to have two puffers, but that is pretty much it as far as puffers. Two dogface puffers will not work, and they will fight. Puffers can do some serious damage with their beaks so it is definitely something you want to avoid.

this is not true, i have to dogface puffers in a 175g and they dont bother eachother at all. i have also kept a dogface and an arothron meleagris which i ended up having problems with. i have also kept a dogface with a toby with no problems.

[Crabber]

The new list seems fine, might because little aggression with the two triggers but you should be ok. The emperor angel will outgrow your tank. A chaetodontoplus angel would work well like a bluespot.

[akdylpcikles]

what size tank does an emperor angel need? could I get a baby and see how it does? BEcause my family likes the babys colors. so maybe when it gets big trade it?

[Stuart60611]

new list
dog face puffer
snowflake eel
sargassum trigger
pink tailed trigger
maybe a tang


what about an emperor angel?

Both the pinktai trigger and emperor angel need a larger tank. I have housed a pinktail trigger in nearly the same water volume, as has LisaD. Both of us had to get rid of our pinktails wthin 1 year or so b/c of aggression. The emperor needs a tank of nearly double in volume (not quite). You can have a tang, but you will be limited to the smaller species. Also, I would avoid the more aggressive tangs in light of your other livestock choices. Also, snowflakes have been known in particular to go after dogface puffers. For some reason, eels, even the ones who often do not go after fish, seem to like to attack dogface puffers. There are a bunch of people here who have experienced this. You could get an emperor and keep it in your 150 for a bit and then trade or sell it. I never recommend this b/c sometimes things do not work out in terms of finding the fish a new home. I am a firm believer that you should only buy a fish when you have a system up and runing which will be adequate to house the fish for its entire life.

[Stuart60611]

this is not true, i have to dogface puffers in a 175g and they dont bother eachother at all.

There was a thread here a while back (see below) where people who kept two dogface puffers together had some major aggression problems even though the two dogface puffers seemed to get along at first. One day the two dogface puffers decided to go at it. The problem is that dogfaces with their beaks can do some serious damage real fast.

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1511726&highlight=dogface

[MedicalZoa]

[QUOTE=Stuart60611;17842289]Also, snowflakes have been known in particular to go after dogface puffers. For some reason, eels, even the ones who often do not go after fish, seem to like to attack dogface puffers. There are a bunch of people here who have experienced this.QUOTE]


i think this is because people do not feed there eels enough, and dont realize that eels are almost blind and when the smeel food and see a big blurry puffer floating there they prob think its food and will take a bit. i have medium snowflake and 2 foot white mouth moray and none of them bother any of my fish because i feed sooo heavy. there are occasions where they attack fish but a snow flake has pebble teeth and a small mouth and can really do anything to a fish (unless a small slow moving fish).

[Stuart60611]

i think this is because people do not feed there eels enough, and dont realize that eels are almost blind and when the smeel food and see a big blurry puffer floating there they prob think its food and will take a bit. i have medium snowflake and 2 foot white mouth moray and none of them bother any of my fish because i feed sooo heavy. there are occasions where they attack fish but a snow flake has pebble teeth and a small mouth and can really do anything to a fish (unless a small slow moving fish).


I think with dogface puffers it goes beyond merely feeding the eels enough. Eels who are well fed sometimes decide to try to eat dogface puffers for unknown reasons. I also disagree that eels do not do any serious damage to the dogface puffers during such attacks. You are correct that usually the dogface is too large (in particular too wide) for the eel to injest the puffer. But I also know of several such incidents where the dogface later died from injuries it sustained from an eel attack.

[Crabber]

I've never heard of a snowflake acting a puffer. I can't imagine it doing so unless the puffer is a baby. I have a much larger and more aggressive eel then a snowflake and he only eats damsels or very small fish, doesn't eat any puffers, triggers, wrasses tangs or angels he's been housed with.

To the original poster, if you want a snowflake eel and dogface puffer, go for it. It you feel uncomfortable about it, add the puffer first and eel last.

Were forgetting that every fish is different, just because people have heard of this eel eating that fish or some crazy extreme circumstance does not qualify it as the norm.

[akdylpcikles]

what type of big angel could I keep? not like dwarves like a smaller large angel. if that makes Sense. haha

[Crabber]

A chaetodontoplus angel would work well like a bluespot.

Also genicanthus angels will work. I'd say all holocanthus and pomocanthus would be out long term, except maybe a majestic, they are one of the smallest pomocanthus angels. The only problem with most chaetodontoplus angels is that they aren't for the novice aquarist.

[akdylpcikles]

so i have been mistaken. I don't want an emperor angel. The one I want is an annularis angel. would this one work?

[akdylpcikles]

what is a blue spot angel? scientific name please? are you talking about a blue face angel?

[namxas]

there are occasions where they attack fish but a snow flake has pebble teeth and a small mouth and can really do anything to a fish (unless a small slow moving fish).

Someone must have forgotten to tell the SFE I kept for like 15 years...it ate several fish, killed a few that were too big for it (including a puffer), and I still have scars where it bit me...TWICE.

That being said, an Arothron puffer (S&S) I had decided the eel was tasty and took several bites out of its back (the puffer was 86'd).

[Crabber]

Chaetodontoplus caeruleopunctatus is the bluespot angel, not blueface which is pomocanthus just like the annularis, both will eventually outgrow your tank.

The only SFE I had was very docile, infact so docile I had to rehome him. My current dragon moray is a lot more aggressive and has eaten fish and bitten me before.

[akdylpcikles]

what about this?

Dog face puffer
2 engineer gobies
sargassum trigger
flame angel
tang and could I do some type of grouper?


just measured the tank is actually 164.52 gallons

[akdylpcikles]

If I had a really good skimmer and did big water changes could I keep a panther grouper?

[akdylpcikles]

new list

dog face puffer
2 engineer gobies
flame angel
regal angel
tang or panther grouper
Good not good? suggestions please!

[WuHT]

I suggest asfur angel. I suspect (because it reaches it's adult colours super early like the majestic) that it actually doesn't grow to become huge like the other pomacanthus.. and the fact that i've never seen a foot+ one in pictures/videos/person.

[akdylpcikles]

new list!!!

dog face puffer
snowflake eel
regal angel
Type of trigger (suggestions?)
tang or grouper (suggestions?)

Please help. thanks guys.

[akdylpcikles]

ok soo I really want a cortez stingray. Iam going to work my stock list around it. So no large angels or triggers. I will still do a dog face. but if Something happens I have plans worked out with my lfs. heres the plan

dog face puffer
cortez stingray
flame angel (is this ok)
engineer goby?
would a grouper be ok?

[Stuart60611]

In all honesty, I think the problem you are having in finalizing your stock list is you are looking at this process from the wrong perspective. When you already have a tank (as you do), you cannot approach stocking from the perspective of what you want to keep but instead from what your existing system can suitably support. You need to stop focusing your attention on the larger fish, like large triggers, angels, groupers, and stingrays which are plainly not going to work out long term in your system. Instead, your system is limited in terms of housing a community of aggressive to semi-aggressive fish to those fish which are medium sized (12 or less inches max), like the smallest of triggers, medium sized angels, the smaller tangs, medium sized wrasses, and simliarly sized fish. Finally, I would add that I think it is fair from what I gather from your postings that you do not have vast experience keeping marine fish. If so and if it were me, I would not push things to the limit while I was still gaining experience. You want to enjoy your system and not suffer a lot of headaches and losses.

[akdylpcikles]

yes I know some of this stuff wont work. I'm just shooting out ideas

[Stuart60611]

yes I know some of this stuff wont work. I'm just shooting out ideas

Thinking carefully about things is good, but try to focus your thoughts on fish who max out at no greater than 12 inches, and this process will be much more productive.

[akdylpcikles]

what if I just grow out the cortez ray to about 9/10 inches. My lfs is setting up a stingray tank. its gona be awesome! so Could I grow it up for them? then give it to them?

[Stuart60611]

what if I just grow out the cortez ray to about 9/10 inches. My lfs is setting up a stingray tank. its gona be awesome! so Could I grow it up for them? then give it to them?


Terrible idea on so many levels. First, stingrays are challenging animals to keep. I have been in this hobby for a short while, and I am not sure I am comfortable attempting to keep one. Second, stingrays have all kinds of special needs. They need much larger tanks than what you have. Also, they need particularlly shaped tanks so that they have adequate room to move about. Furthermore, they need tanks which cannot have much in them other than certain grade sand. Most other fish will not find this environment appropriate. Puting a stingray in an inappropriate tank with inappropriate tankmates is certain to cause death to the stingray, his tankmates, or both. What will you do if the LFS changes its mind or goes out of business?

[akdylpcikles]

jeez you guys make it so hard to pick out a list :spin2: jk So I wont do a stingray. So if you guys were in my shoes what would you put in my tank?

[Stuart60611]

Ok, I will take a stab and based on your quieries, try to pick some suitable fish I think you would like.

Trigger: BlueThroat, Saragassum, or Indian (notice the or:inlove:)
Dogface Puffer
One Spot Foxface (herbivore and detrivore to tighty up)
Wrasse: Tusk, Pinkface Wrasse, or Bluehead Wrasse
Flame Angel or Flame Hawk
Yellow Tail Damsel (adds color, movement, little bioload, and eats small bits of leftover food).

[akdylpcikles]

ok new list :) thanks for all those species. I really like them

dogface puffer
bluehead wrasse
flame angel
blue thought trigger (pair?)
instead of a fox face what about a tang. I would like a tang that looks like a naso or something like that. I know it would get to big for my tank
And what about a majestic angelfish? I hear they only get 10 inches?
what about an ell or bottom dweller? Me and my dad really want an eel. but im open for suggestions!

[Stuart60611]

I would not do a pair of bluethroats, any large angel, or an eel. No room for the pair or large angel, and eel will be hard to feed with the other aggressive eaters and may pick on or be picked on by the the other fish. As far as a tang, you can substitue a smaller tang for the foxface, like a kole, yellow, convict,scopas, or tomini. Stay away from a powder brown or powder blue b/c they are very aggressive and disease prone.

[akdylpcikles]

what about 1 or 2 engineer gobies?

[akdylpcikles]

bump

[Stuart60611]

I am not sure the gobies would get along with the other fish, particularly the dogface. Dogfaces like to nip and patrol the substrate which may not work out with the engineer. The part I most dislike about keeping an engineer is that they require deep sandbeds. This can be a serious problem in a fowlr because you have no inverts to keep the sand clean. Your tank can very quickly turn into a very ugly algae pit. As such, I highly recommend against engineer gobies in a fowlr.