mineralized top soil

[fishguy194]

what type of substrates have people used to successfully keep Turtle Grass? I was thinking about setting up a sea grass tank using mineralized top soil as I have used this for my FW planted tanks with great success.

[Plantbrain]

How close are you to sea?
Already pre mineralized, bring a shovel/bucket and prepare to get muddy at low tide near a clean spot.

Filter flith/mulm works well when added to marls/arag etc.

You need time, say 8 weeks before you add the plants to the sediments after they are in the tank and the tank has been running etc. Allow the bacterial to settle in first.....then add the grass.


Most grasses will do fine without enriched sediments also if you dose the water column, think about how all macro algae get their ferts.......still, a little will not hurt, I would. It'll be low in N typically if the area is pristine(might be tough to find that in Maryland area). So take that into account.

I'd not use potting soils etc........
I'd also wait longer before adding the plants.

Regards,
Tom Barr

[MatthewAD]

Edit for clarification, would like further knowledge in no way intended as a flame:

What's the intended benefit of waiting to add plants?

"Bacterial settling?"

I am thinking plants and nutrients and light = growth, wouldn't plants help establish balance quicker than all the nutrients hanging out without the plants?

[fishguy194]

Well, in MD areas which grow seagrasses are protected because they're endangered around here. Plus, it's at least a 3 hour drive. I wouldn't use potting soil, just plain top soil that has been rinsed way too many times for any sane person to put up with.

@MatthewAD: Turtle grass is dependent upon bacteria in the soil to break down nutrients so they can be absorbed through the roots. The plants cannot absorb them directly. It's simply easier to acclimate them to captive surroundings if the substrate is ready to accept them. Unlike FW plants and algae which can absorb nutrients directly from the water column.

[fishguy194]

Also, I thought there used to be a forum dedicated to marine plants and macro algae's. I cannot recall the address... am I hallucinating this?

[3D-Reef]

what type of substrates have people used to successfully keep Turtle Grass? I was thinking about setting up a sea grass tank using mineralized top soil as I have used this for my FW planted tanks with great success.

I had that same question a few years back and I started digging into all the free studies on substrates that I could find.What I found,taken from different studies that had 300-500+ shoots per M2,was that 80% is fine araggonite,20% Mg-calcite.DOM (used sand?)at 4%,of that,DOC's were .5%-2.6%DW (2.6% is just this side of being eutrophic,causing sufide production above the level at which the grass can handle).

In araggonite only substrates the grass is Phosphate limited.
In substrates with >25% 'top soil' mixed in,the grasses are N limited.The bacteria out compete the grass for ammonium supply.Top soils contain ~5% iron which is a limiting factor in CaC03 sand.

I took down My 29g this past weekend in order to set up a 75g in it's place.For the substrate,that I have on order,I will use ~80%CaC03,~20% Mg-calcite (Seachem's graycoast),1-20oz box of laterite,~1% used sand,and I may throw in a pound or two of mud,just for kicks and giggles.I haven't decided yet on the mud,although,it is a good source for iron and phosphate.

On the expermental side,and in no way am I recommending for others too try,I'm thinking about useing a few bio-pellets to try too 'kick start' hetrotrophic denitrifing bacteria,since there will be limited N & P in the substrate.Otherwise,it's best to wait for a few months before planting to let the bacteria too settle in,like Tom said.
Eventhough the bacteria are important,the plants are able in adsorbing nutrients from the watercolumn and the substrate equally.It just comes at a cost too the plant.The plants have to break down N03 back too ammonium,their prefered form of N,before they can up-take it.To do this they have to use carb's that have been stored up in the roots/rihzomes in order for this process to occur.
Turtlegrass looses it's roots when transplanted and it takes 1-2 months too regrow them.To regrow the roots,the grass has to rely on the stored nutrients(carb's and AA's).Single shoots don't really stand a chance <30%.Where as rihzomes with mutiple shoots,two or more,have a much better outcome ~80%.
So,if You get a chance to talk too the vender before purchase,be sure to ask for plants that have at least two shoots per rihzome,and if possible,more.

FWIW-Your not hallucinating.:twitch:The forum Your talking about (MPT) has shut down due to lack of intrest.It was just too slow over there.:sad2: