Large tanks and necessay equipment

[hvacman250]

Is there a thread, a book, or info anywhere stating what equipment is necessay for reef tanks of 300 gallons or larger?

My dream for the past 10 years has been to have a big, in-wall tank. With our new house and some disposable income (finally at the age of 34 :) ), its time to make this a reality.

I have narrowed it down to a 96 L x 36 W x 24-30 H. Somewhere in the neighborhood of 350 gallons.

I have been reading all the threads in this (large tank) forum, and everybody seems to do it different.


So...does anybody have a successful reef tank over 250 gallons that doesnt have all the bells and whistles? Things like Liter Meter 3s, waveboxes, Sea Swirls, Calc reactors, auto water change, 55 gallon mixing barrels, etc. Some of these things I dont even know what they are:hmm4:


Some things I do know:
Lighting will be LED
I will have a massive skimmer
Will bring over my RKL package/and upgrade to RKE
Will reuse my media reactor
Multiple powerheads on a controller vs. closed loop (Tunze or Vortech)

[palmer373]

heater, LR, LS, fish and corals. thats all you 'need' that you dont have, done....

[dave.m]

There are lots of books, but none too recent. The hobby moves too fast for books. Best to keep an eye on what goes on here and in magazines like Coral Magazine, Advanced Aquarist On-line, Aquarium Fish.

Here's a few books to consider, and this is only off the top of my head:

Ultimate Marine Aquariums - M. Paletta
The Reef Aquarium, Vols. 1-3 - Delbeek & Sprung
The Modern Coral Reef Aquarium Vols. 1-4 - Fossa & Nilsen

I see that Fossa & Nilsen are in the throws of updating their 4-volume opus. It never ends.

Dave.M

[maik1]

Start SMALL! The bigger the tank the more money you WILL loose! Get your feet wet first. Get all the equipment for a large tank, but practice for a year on a smaller scale.
Sorry, but that's my opinion.

Maik1

[the_rider]

Hi,

I think for a big tank, other than the basics that you will obviously need : heater, skimmer etc etc You will need to ensure that humidity won't be a problem, so either a dehumidifier or a air exchanger or etc. Also it will be useful to run a couple of independant outlet on their own 20Amp fuse. Also, for a tank that big, a fishroom with some space to work around and a quanrantine system will be a good add. For sure, sky the limit so it really depend on how complex you want your system to be and how much time/space/money you want to invest but dehumidifier, outlets will be primordial IMO and a sink in the fish room or near the tank so that cleaning, dumping water, RO/DI will be as close as possible from the tank. since you have an RKE, it will control your ATO as well ?

That would be the first thing I would add to my planning. :)

Keep us posted on your planning!

Alex B

[hvacman250]

Start SMALL! The bigger the tank the more money you WILL loose! Get your feet wet first. Get all the equipment for a large tank, but practice for a year on a smaller scale.
Sorry, but that's my opinion.

Maik1

I have a 40 BR and a 10 gallon currently.

Hi,

I think for a big tank, other than the basics that you will obviously need : heater, skimmer etc etc You will need to ensure that humidity won't be a problem, so either a dehumidifier or a air exchanger or etc. Also it will be useful to run a couple of independant outlet on their own 20Amp fuse. Also, for a tank that big, a fishroom with some space to work around and a quanrantine system will be a good add. For sure, sky the limit so it really depend on how complex you want your system to be and how much time/space/money you want to invest but dehumidifier, outlets will be primordial IMO and a sink in the fish room or near the tank so that cleaning, dumping water, RO/DI will be as close as possible from the tank. since you have an RKE, it will control your ATO as well ?

That would be the first thing I would add to my planning. :)

Keep us posted on your planning!

Alex B

Thanks for your input.

I have all that stuff covered. I was mainly trying to focus my questions on the complex (or complex to me) equipment.

My 100 gallon tank is a breeze to maintain currently. I dont want to step up to a 350 gallon and it become a tedious chore that sucks the fun out of this hobby I love...unless I spend $5000, add on a fish room and automate it.

[sarmo]

the best addition i have added is my dosing pumps. i use to add calcium chloride and ALK mix each day but levels always strayed and i had to physically be there or have a neighbor do it for me. now i set the dose and walk away. i use two 35gallon trash cans with dissolved calcium and ALK and add to them as needed.
my current issues seem to revolve around flow. it seems like i need more or atleast more random flow. i had powerheads but replaced them with a closed loop due to heat issues and i didn't like seeing them in the tank. now my closed loop is only 7000gph and is not turbulent enough. long story but if you use power heads find a way to hide them by making your view window smaller than the tank or something. also plan on more flow than you think you need!!!

good luck

[kmu]

A controller even a simple one like the reef keeper lite to control temperature on the heaters, chillers, turn off halides when too hot, turn on fans when too hot...

And a auto top off unit like the elos osmocontroller or tunze osmolator.

[TJQ]

My situation is similar to yours in terms of age, tank size, and being a large reef tank newbie. I think you have more experience than me though.

I would highly suggest reading The Reef Aquarium Vol. 3, which is the best book I've read so far and goes into a lot of detail in terms of equipment and processes. (It's fairly up to date)

For my currently being built 96x24x30 a fish room wasn't an option, and I wanted to keep things as simple as possible. Here are my choices:

The Core:
Good skimmer - Vertex 300 Alpha
Good Flow - MP60s x 2 (powerheads are easy for newbies like me)
Good lights - MH+T5 (Sifiligoi 48" Stealth x 2)


Water Quality:

RO/DI: You have to start with good, pure water to minimize problems.

Auto Top Off:
In a big tank water is going to evaporate, which causes your level of salinity to rise. This is bad, and you want to keep it stable. You can either keep filling it up every day with RO/DI, or you can setup an Auto Top off. It could be as simple as line from your RO to a float valve in the sump, which stops the flow once the water hits a certain level. For my system I will have a fresh water tank in the basement that is first filled with RO water. Then a line from the FW tank will go up to the sump, and using an auto top off pump it will increase the water level as needed.

Water Changes:
Changing out water in a big tank is much more time consuming and difficult due to the volume. You could do it with buckets, but I think it would be too much of a pain.

For my system I will be doing a continuous water change system with Litermeter pumps. I do not have a fish room, and I could only run small tubing from where my tank is to the basement. This system basically takes a small amount of water from the sump multiple times to the day and pumps it into the basement floor drain. It is replenished by another pump taking fresh salter water from a mixing tank in the basement.

Alkalinity / Calcium / Magnesium
For me I think the easiest is just using a dosing pump that will handle all three using the two-part system.

Nitrate / Phosphate
For me I felt the easiest way to remove it would using Bio Pellets, which seemed easy enough. Pellets in a chamber that needed to be changed out every x months.

That`s my basic setup, time will tell if I made the right choices.

300 G Tank
75G Sump
Vertex 300 skimmer
MP60 x 2
Reeflo dart gold
MH+t5 lights
Vertex UF20 Reactor x 2
Dosing Pumps (Vertex Libra when they come out)
Litermeter ATO Pump (new FW)
Litermeter Pump (removes old water)
Litermeter Water Exchange Module (pumps in new SW)
75 Gallon Salt Water Tank Plastic
75 Gallon Fresh Water Tank Plastic
Lots of jon guest tubing+fittings
Pumps + plumbing to move water from SW to FW tank and mix it
Vertex 100 GPD RODI unit (connected to FW tank)
55G QT (from an old FW tank, haven`t figured out the equipment yet)

Not the cheapest hobby, let me tell you. :)

[hvacman250]

TJQ, now we are getting somewhere. Great post.

Let me give a little history since alot of people are preaching to the choir :) :

-My 100 gallon has 70x turnover, so I know about flow (I will ask questions at the end)
-I already use a RKL with SL1 (temp and pH probe) and 3 PC4s running MyReef
-I run GFO and carbon in a media reactor
-I have a 4 stage RODI filter. My incoming TDS is 34 ppm :) Lucky!
-New tank will get 3 20 amp outlets run to it
-New tank will be powered with LEDs
-I have a ATO w/ double float switch
-Skimmer will be an Alpha 300 cone
-I top off with Kalk (34 gallon Brute)
-Water changes are easy (I mix 34 gal -Brute can- of Aqua Vitro salt. Siphon out of the main tank as a pump brings water from the Brute into the sump. Never take the system off line.

I guess the answers I am looking for are:

PHs vs. closed loop. I was planning on 4 Tunze 6105 on a controller. With 2 returns and 4 Tunzes, I think I will have enough flow. Maybe? No? Should I do a closed loop? I see people on both sides of the fence.

BTW, I have changed 100% to a 72 x 30 x 30. 225 gallon. My original dimensions would have looked weird and been crowded in the available space.

Do you think I will need a chiller? My 100 gallon needs a heater year round. House stays 73 in summer and 68 in winter. Remember, lights are LEDS and I will have a fan blowing across the sump. Only head added should be pumps/powerheads.

With a 225 gallon reef, I 2 part dosing silly/expensive, or is a calcium reactor standard practice?More questions later...

[sabodish]

i had the same size tank a few years ago (96x36wx24t) and i didnt have anything fancy. i had a large skimmer, ca reactor, large return pump and 2 sea swirls...no heaters, no fancy water change system, dosers or anything...it ran like a top for the 5 years it was up.

[hpfunk]

Treat it as a bigger version of what you have, know, and like. The tank sizes you are considering are not so big that they would require anything custom or crazy.
*I run a 180display with a 120 ref/sump and 100gal frag tank
*a cal reactor because dosing sucks
*phosphate and carbon reactors
*Two skimmers
*Two ECOTECH marine Power heads (they talk to each other)

The most important part of my tank and any tank I build in the future is the EQUIPMENT ROOM. :reading: Maybe it is just me but wires hanging every where and stands that have been splashed by saltwater for years are extremely distracting, taking away from the main display tank. My current tank is pushed all the way up to the wall, every thing is plumbed to the utility room on the other side of the wall. The tank has zero wires going into the main tank. (the ref. is another story). The utility room sees all the action for maintenance. For the auto top off I have an RODI plumbed direct to a float valve. (I have done this on both of my tanks over the years and haven't had a problem)

If you can take care of a 100 gal then there should be no problem with a 300gal. :fish2:
Good luck, keep us posted

[Fish4Me2]

I can speak a bit to your powerhead question. I have a new 205 G (72x30x24). I planned on having 4 6105 powerheads, along with the two returns. After placing them in the tank, I am amazed by how little flow there is. There is not enough to keep the detritus from settling on the floor of the tank. I'll be upgrading to 6205s down the road.

For me, a closed loop opened the possibility of bulkhead failure, and that was too complex. Also, if one Tunze fails, the tank isn't without most of it's flow. If the closed loop pump needs to be serviced, then the major source of water movement is gone. Once again, that wasn't something I wanted to risk.

[khaosinc]

I never found a good book, but I winged it and had a nice large system..

1st, make sure you have the ventalation for a large system. I ended up having to rip out walls due to mold

You don't need a lot of the fancy stuff, but they are nice. The RKE is nice due to the huge amount of plugs you can have on it for just about everything. and with large water volumn you can get away with much more lacsidasial maintence..

[aquainas]

Nice build you got planned!
I would definitely recommend you employ a calcium reactor to assist in maintaining alk, ca and mg. Consider the cost of dosing pumps/controller, mag sulfate/chloride, calcium hydroxide, sodium bicarbonate, storage space for the dry as well as premixed stuff, time spent mixing and cleaning. For most this is not a big deal, but for me it just didn't make sense when I got to the half liter per day range, and I was not even half way stocked yet.
However success can be had through either method, I'm sure others would agree.

[spooda420]

OP: I just completed my 250g tank thats an in wall as you mentioned... my motto go big or go home.

what i would have done differently seal the exposed wood with a water sealer, it gets real humid in my rish room... mine is in the basement and its impossible to vent outside, so i have yet to install something.

i would have done something enclosed for my makeup water and the fresh rodi.

sump and pump placement might have been remote. in a different area of the basement where water changes and top off would have been easier.