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octoman2707
03/09/2011, 10:40 PM
okay So I have 56 gallon tall aquarium , with a 20 gallon sump I bought , Plus return pumps , and a 30$ protein skimmer (I modified it so it had 2 wooden airstones)
I have only sand and water in the top tank , what should I use filtration wise?
someone told me DSB, refugium and the protein skimmer would be enough filtration for the octo will it be?, and if so can anyone help me come up with a proper sump/refugium setup
(sorry for drawing pictures wont upload,, pics too big)
and for the fug setup I was thinking DBS or mud (I dont know whats the difference) and either live rock or macroalgae or both??
sorry for the seriously uninformed questions

karsseboom
03/10/2011, 01:39 AM
there is a section for octopus on this forum..fyi

Sugar Magnolia
03/10/2011, 07:42 AM
[welcome]

I requested a move to the Cephalopod forum for you.

dc
03/10/2011, 07:46 AM
[moved]...

octoman2707
03/10/2011, 10:38 AM
well its more about the filtration than the octopus

Allmost
03/10/2011, 10:44 AM
you will need to filter water biologically. meaning you will need bacteria to convert ammonia into nitrite, nitrite to nitrate which is less toxic to fish, therefore your first filtration material is Live rock.
you will need at least 50 lbs.

now you have taken care of toxics ... ammonia ! but you are left with nitrate (no3) which will fuel up algae growth ! how to remove it ? there are different ways, one is a skimmer , it will remove organics before they can break down to ammonia and .... another is DSB, the anerobatic bacteria within the Deep sand will take up O2 from NO3, leaving nitrogen gas. third method is a macro algae fuge. you place algae in fuge, with light, it grows taking up no3 and po4, and you trim it back, removing the no3 and po4 from the system.

I would make sump 3 sections, skimmer, return, and then a fuge with some LR and alot of cheato with some light over it.


HTH

octoman2707
03/10/2011, 11:12 AM
Does DbS need light ? I could have some egg crate or something so the live rock isnt in the sand , thus not causing dead spots but wont the rocks and cheato block the light to the sand?

Lmecher
03/10/2011, 09:34 PM
Why wouldn't you want the live rock in the sand? Why would the sand need light? If you leave space behind the rock, so it is not up against the walls, you'll be fine. If you experience dead spots most of us have good luck with karolias. Some octopuses will even use them to help shed suckers.
All the filtration you need is live rock. A good skimmer is a must. An overflow is a good place to catch floating debris, with octopus you get a lot of sucker sheds.
A deep sand bed is not a good idea in an octopus tank, they will sometimes dig in order to create a den under your rock work, I'd rethink that.

octoman2707
03/10/2011, 09:56 PM
no no ... the DBS is in the refugium and the live rock will be in both , and its okay for it to be piled up from the DBS or would under those rocks cause no oxygen zones (dangerous),
so since I don't need marcoalgae because as you said ,live rock should be enough, Should I place my liverock suspended (with eggcrate or etc) above the DBS to allow the sand to get water flow?

Lmecher
03/10/2011, 10:25 PM
A deep sand bed dose not need light, as far as I understood. It should never be disturbed, isn't it all a dead zone? Fine sand and or mud? I put rock right on top.
Macroalgae is not considered filtration, it uses nitrate, pulling it from your system. I use cheato and light it 24/7

octoman2707
03/10/2011, 11:03 PM
So ... Main tank: 60 pounds of livesand with live rock and decorations [] Refugium: 6" of live sand with live rock ontop , and a return pump and a protein skimmer section.
Now this is bagged live sand and live rock from a LFS that has had it cured for a while
should I need to add any critters to achieve a good ecosystem?
and this is all that is needed for the octopus (plus charcoal bag for inking)??

++
no or not many hermit crabs and no carnivorous snails , right?

Lmecher
03/15/2011, 06:36 PM
What kind of experience do you actually have keeping SW aquariums?
I am just trying to get a handle on where you are at here.

Main tank I keep some snails and hermits and (wait till tank is cycled for snails) snails. They need to be replenished occasionally, but keeps the octopus occupied. I only purchase when they are on sale since they may end up on the menu. I have Nassarius snails to keep the sand bed stirred. Brittle and serpent stars are considered safe with octopuses, they are good scavengers. Stay away from green brittles, they are bad news. I along with several others keep peppermint shrimp with our octopuses. I am not sure if the shrimp are just too fast or if maybe they just taste bad but mine don't get eaten and are fun to watch.
Low sting soft corals are fine if you'd like to include some, softies such as mushrooms, leathers and xenias.
You are going to have to build up your bioload so your tank can support an octopus. They produce a lot of waste. Do you have other tanks? Maybe a couple fish that could be removed before you get your octopus? You could purchase live cycling bacteria, I prefer to do it the natural way but in a pinch I have used this with good results.

In your fuge, some snails are a good addition to take care of excess algae, but wait till you have some before adding. You will want cheato and light.

octoman2707
03/21/2011, 11:25 AM
Ive had a 14 gallon SW for a while but had to scrap it no fish or LR in it anymore but i have a damsel fish in the display to cycle and I added bateria and i will move it the the 14 gallon.
and should a have skimmer/fuge/return or skimmer/return/fuge My setup can handle 600gph
the problem is im not seeing the worms that usally appear in a sand bed .

SwiftysReef
03/25/2011, 11:29 PM
I might be a little slow but wouldn't macro algae be natures filtration system. It does take nitrate and phosphates and alot of other impurities out of the water. I even heard of people using only macroalgae over protein skimming with success. I wouldn't worry about the worms they will come in time im sure. I set my sump skimmer/return/refugium just so my fuge could get more of the proteins out of the water I had it set up the other way first but I think my protein skimmer did too good of a job cuz my caulerpia wasn't doing so hot until now. Now its starting to take off.

octoman2707
03/29/2011, 08:08 PM
Okay here is a pretty terrible visual of my setup ,,
56g > overflow\ > 5 g with protein skimmer > 5 g with media > refugium >return
dosing pump>14 g nano> nano overflow >/

so water goes from overflow to bucket with protein skimmer then to another bucket with media the media bucket then has water go into the refugium then the return pump

dosing/siphon pump takes water from overflow and puts it in 14g nano then nano had overflow to 5 g protein or 5g media (havent decided yet.
questions, comments?

Octoman
04/10/2011, 07:54 PM
There has been mention of keeping nitrates under control, but I don't think it has been stressed enough how important this is for octopuses. Nitrates will interfere with the oxygen transport in their blood and can be deadly at high enough levels. So, not only do you need effective ways to control nitrates, you need to monitor them regularly with a good test kit. I test once a week and maintain my levels below 20ppm with water changes as needed.

octoman2707
04/11/2011, 11:25 AM
thats why I have the Liverock and DSB and Macroalgae

Octoman
04/22/2011, 06:43 AM
All are ample ways of controlling nitrates, but can be problematic at first. DSB's and live rock both take quite a bit of time (6 mos - year) to develop a strong colony of nitrate reducing bacteria, they develop much slower than ammonia and nitrite bacteria. Macro can help, but it can be difficult to maintain consistent growth. That's why I was recommending that you have a regular testing schedule to be sure you are keeping nitrates down to suitable levels.

octoman2707
04/24/2011, 07:48 PM
Ok water changes are best im guessing

deathy17
05/15/2011, 05:18 PM
how do you seal the top?

octoman2707
08/24/2011, 09:19 PM
glass panels with weights