Chiton's man-cave with 260g build

[chiton]

After 21 years of keeping various sized salt water tanks I needed a break! In March 2010 we decided to relocate to a new home. Instead of moving my 54 corner reef and 85 FOWLR cube I decided to sell both complete systems with all inhabitants for a much needed break from the hobby, and to make the pending move less work. A few pics of the tanks that were sold.

~85 cube
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/85_Cube.jpg
54 corner in 2004
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/54_Initial_Setup.jpg
54 corner in 2010
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/54_close_up.JPG

Before the tang police get on me, I tried for years to get him out (he was 6 yrs old when I sold the tank), but was not prepared to dismantle the tank to get him. It was a mistake and I've learned my lesson.

In Jan of this year we decided to finish off ~1500 ft2 of the basement in our new home…and so my break was over. Hmm…what shall my next reef tank look like! Ultimately I wanted a tank large enough I could scuba dive in to clean, but then reality set in :lmao:. I decided on an in-wall tank viewable from both long sides separating my planned gym and living/entertainment rooms. The tank had to fit between 2 support poles ~8 ft apart, so final custom tank dimensions were set at 84”L x 24”W x 30”H, or ~262 gallons. This would allow ~5” on either side of the tank to run plumbing and electrical to and from the hood.

At the time of this initial post, Aug 9, 2011, the new tank is completely done and running. I’m at the point of slowly adding corals and building up the livestock. The initial few wks after completion of the tank enclosure brought a small fire, massive humidity and heat in the sump area causing the wood of the tank enclosure to bend, and 10 degree daily water temperature swings. All fixable problems, but before we get to all this craziness, let’s start from the beginning and I’ll take you through the build!

http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/BasementSchematic.jpg

Shopping List
1) 84”L x 24”W x 30”H custom built Miracles Aquariums, Toronto. Low iron glass long panels. Drilled at top of each side (dual overflow). ¾” glass, eurobraced
2) Eshopps Rs-300 36”x14”x16” Acrylic Sump
3) TruVu Platinum Basic Sump 75 (Refugium)
4) 4x Ultra U12-40629 Power Strip with 7 Individual Switches
5) 2x Blueline 40X HD External pumps (1270 gph at 0ft ea)
6) Reef Dynamics INS300 Protein Skimmer
7) Jabsco Rversible Mini Puppy Pump, 18620 Series (for moving water to and from tank area)
8) 3x IceCap 400 watt ICE-PAC-400-MH, + 3x 400W 14K Hamiltons
9) 8x 96Watt Bright Kits, AH Supply, + 4x combo compact bulbs + 4x actinic compact bulbs
10) PAR38 Reflector 19 Watt/5100K bulb (refugium light)
11) Turbo Twist 12x UV Sterilizer – 500 gallon – 36W
12) Maxi-Jet 3000 Utility Pump 775 gph (UV & Chiller)
13) Mini Jet 606 Pump (top-off)
14) AutoTopoff DS05 Double Switch controller
15) 2x Nexus LED D12SL-12WL 120mm White LED Case Fans + 2x 12 VDC 300 mA AC adapters + 2x 6.5” white RH-4002-06.5-WH speaker covers
16) Magna Float-500XL (man, that’s a powerful magnet, but what required for ¾” glass)

Not on Original Shopping list, but needed for final set-up
1) JBJ 1/3 HP Inline Arctica Chiller
2) 2x Nexus D12SL-12WM Case fans + 2x 12 VDC 300 mA AC adapters + 2x 6.5” white RH-4002-06.5-WH speaker covers

[chiton]

The house was built in 2002 and I managed to track down the original builder to complete the basement. He built the tank framing per my specifications.
It’s Jan 25 and the framing wood has arrived. Things are about to get under way! Luckily they could do the entire basement without having to move my Universal Centurion Gym…but the carpet people had loads of fun!

http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/BeforeConstruction1.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/BeforeConstruction2.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/BeforeConstruction3.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/BeforeConstruction4.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/BeforeConstruction5.jpg

[chiton]

Here are some pics of the framing. There will be access to the sump area and lighting on the gym side of the tank, but no access on the other side. Both sides of the tank will also be accessible at the top and bottom, but not viewable. My acrylic sump just makes it in and out, by dumb luck, but I put it in there before they framed just in case. Electrical is just getting underway. The tank will have 2 designated circuits + an outlet from the generator panel. The generator panel will run a heater, both return pumps and the auto-top off. Ethernet is also being run to the tank for a future Neptune controller, or something similar. You’ll also notice the white 1” PEX tubing hanging down from the ceiling. The unfinished part of the basement will house 2x 35 gallon trashcans for CaOH make-up water and water changes. My RO/DI water system is also in this area with ~100 gallons of pressurized tanks, also hooked into the house refrigerator. The Jabsco Reversible Mini pump will be under the tank and move water to and from the tank, septic system and trashcans via this 1” PEX. One requirement for this tank was absolutely no carrying buckets of water around!

http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Framing1.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Framing2.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Framing3.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Framing4.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Framing5.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Framing6.jpg

[chiton]

Drywall and some more electrical work

http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Drywall1.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Drywall2.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Drywall3.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Drywall4.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Drywall5.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Drywall6.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Drywall7.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Drywall8.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Drywall9.jpg

[chiton]

It’s March 6 and the contractor is just about done. Drop ceiling is in and the walls are ready to be painted. General lighting for the basement is not done, and the fish tank enclosure will be the very last thing completed via a subcontractor. The tank construction is about complete at Miracles, so it’s time to wire the lights. I decided to go with a CF & MH setup (8x 96W CF and 3x 400W MH), primarily because I’ve had good luck with these and they are familir. I did look at LED but decided this technology is changing too fast and the price is still just too high for me (although I’m sure they pay themselves off quickly in power savings)! I also did not like the dimensions available on the T5 HO and VHO bulbs, as they would not allow me to put them end to end with minimal wasted space on an 84” long tank. This setup will give me just under 2000W of lighting, or ~7.3 W per gallon, which will hopefully suffice for any future tank inhabitants I want to keep. I prefer the look of a mixed reef vs the sps dominated tanks, but that’s my mood of recent years, and is very susceptible to change. The outer MH’s will be on 1 timer. The CF’s will be grouped as 4 per timer, and the refugium light will get the 4th timer. This is easily changed by adding more timers if I wish to do so in the future. Unfortunately there will be no room for MH reflectors, so as with my old tank, I lined the entire canopy enclosure with ultra-thick Aluminum foil to reflect as much light as possible. A special thank you to this foil, because it very well may have saved my house from burning down when I finally fired up the MH after the final enclosure was assembled! More on that later…

http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Lighting1.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Lighting2.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Lighting3.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Lighting4.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Almost_Finished1.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Almost_Finished2.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Almost_Finished3.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Almost_Finished4.jpg

[david00061]

looks like a cool build.

[chiton]

It definitely took longer than expected, but the tank finally arrived via freight to Manchester, NH. I had the crate fork-lifted onto my 5’x8’ trailer. The tank itself weighs ~700 lbs. With the crate it was ~900lbs. I hired fully insured Piano movers to install the tank (not me in the pic). We walked the tank around the house on the trailer up to the double doors to the basement. In retrospect, the tank was man-handled way more than I would have preferred, and the dolly used to move it was way undersized. But, no issues until it was put on the stand. My first oops! I did not take into account the ~1/2 of Styrofoam Miracles recommended I put under the tank. One would think Styrofoam would compress with ~700 lbs on it, but it didn’t. Even after filling the tank later on, the Styrofoam still didn’t noticeably compress. There is an inverted 2x6 beam at the top of the tank used to support the drywall, and top of wall in general (opposite side of the gym). I had to cut 1/2” off the beam to allow the tank to slide in underneath. Other than this, the tank fit as planned and most importantly, is perfectly level. Miracles did a wonderful job constructing the tank. I highly recommend their work!

http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/TankMove1jpg.jpg

http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/TankMove2.jpg

http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/TankMove3.jpg

[chiton]

It’s April 18 and I’ve just about finalized the plumbing. The tank is being filled via the reversible Mini Puppy pump in 35 gallon increments, with 35 ppt saltwater (reef crystals + RO/DI water). I searched long and hard for a reversible pump. The Jabsco I purchased is used for moving fuel between tanks in boats/ships. Although it is made of brass and really noisy, it only sees use during water changes or re-fills of the make-up reservoir. It takes ~8 minutes to pump in and out 35 gallons of water at ~8ft head. The trash cans are ~25 ft away in the unfinished section of the basement (on the other size of the bathroom wall in the above schematic).
This time around with plumbing I’ve made sure I can isolate the return pumps and modify flow with cut-off valves. Quick connects were also used for easy pump removal and maintenance. I learned from my last tank that not having a back-up pump can lead to disaster, so I’m utilizing 2 this time. The front goes to the left side of tank (when viewing from gym) and the back pump goes to the right. Both split into 2 nozzles for a total of 4 return sprays (one in each corner of the tank, flowing towards the center). The right overflow pipes down the side and tees off to the refugium, then on to the far left of the main sump. The left overflow is a straight shot down to the main sump. The refugium is connected to the right side of the sump and flows directly into the middle sump chamber. The overflow plumbing required slight bends to avoid the 2x6 right and left support legs at either end of the tank stand, but this bend also helped in reducing the ‘water down a drain’ noise. The right side of the tank (again, viewed from gym) has 4 pipes consisting (from left to right in the pic below) PEX up to ceiling and over to unfinished basement area, PEX out of tank down to Jabsco Mini Puppy reversible pump, return, and overflow. I painted all plumbing and wood black on both sides because at the time I was uncertain if this would be viewable or not (it turns out no, the sides appear as mirrors when looking into either long panel, so no piping or wires are viewable, and all the painting was a waste of time.

http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Plumbing1.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Plumbing2.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Plumbing3.jpg
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http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Plumbing7.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Plumbing8jpg.jpg

[Ducati 911]

Wow that is awesome! More Pics!!!!

[chiton]

These pics were taken in early June. To date I have not run the MH’s for more than ~10min to make sure they are working/wired correctly. The tank has been up and running with CF’s for over a month with ~300 lbs of live rock. The rock was added shortly after the Reef Dynamics Skimmer arrived. It’s a tight fit in the sump with the skimmer and Maxi-Jet 3000, but manageable. Approximately a wk before these pics were taken the water parameters settled and I added a few fish; 2 clowns, 1 purple tang, 3 yellow tangs, 1 green wrasse, 1 flame angel and 1 coral beauty (all are thriving and in good health today, even with the massive water temp swings discussed later on). Low iron glass is unbelievable! I went to visit Miracles before I ordered the tank and was impressed by their facility, and they quickly sold me on the low-iron glass and top side small overflow look. Because you cannot see the glass it looks like water is simply floating in the middle of the room.
For several wks the carpenter and I discussed the enclosure. How thick, what is the best wood for high humidity and heat longevity, maximum access to sump and hood area, where too put doors, is there such a thing as ALL stainless door hinges, how to provide access to the sides, and where to put the hood fans. Final measurements were taken several wks ago and fabrication is underway!

http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Running1.jpg

http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Running2.jpg

http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Running3.jpg

Here are pics of the unfinished part of the basement where saturated CaOH make-up water and fresh salt water are pumped directly into the tank, or into the top-off waste bucket to the right of the refugium.


http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Unfinished.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Unfinished2.jpg

After running with no enclosure, and CF’s only, the tank is going through ~12 gallons of make-up water per wk. The 13 gallon top-off trashcan is only giving me ~1 wk walk-away. Not long enough for business trips or vacations, so the first tweak of the sump design is to top mount the reversible pump and find the biggest darn trashcan that will fit in the available space. The basement temperature seems to be holding at 68-71 deg F and the tank has only a 1-2 degree swing from 78-80 with full CF’s for 8-10 hrs. But this is with no enclosure and moderate outside temperatures. AC was not ducted to the basement, and heat during our long NH winters will be maintained by a 30,000 BTU gas stove.

http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/ReversiblePumpMove1.jpg

http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/ReversiblePumpMove2.jpg

[chiton]

It’s June 24 and the enclosure arrived today in 3 main pieces, plus 10 doors. The wood is solid ¾” hard rock maple with stainless hinges. Although a beautiful wood to stain, it will be painting white to match the basement trim.

http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/enclosure1.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Enclosure2.jpg

[chiton]

It’s July 2nd and the enclosure is painted and ready for assembly. Also note I managed to find a 25 gallon sturdy trashcan to put under the tank for make-up water, which should provide close to 2 wks before having to pump more CaOH top-off water in from the larger trashcans located in the unfinished basement area.

http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Assembly1.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Assembly2.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Assembly3.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Assembly4.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Assembly5.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Assembly6.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Assembly7.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Assembly8.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Assembly9.jpg

[chiton]

Its July 4 weekend and the man-cave is complete…or so I thought! I’ve never had a tank that was totally enclosed on all 4 slides top and bottom, and for this reason I encountered some MAJOR heat and humidity issues.
1) The 2 cooling fans on the hood are not keeping up. About all they are good for is preventing condensation and providing moon light. With a 6 hr MH cycle and a 12 hr CF’s cycle the tank is climbing from 79 degrees in the morning to 90 degrees at 8pm!!!! The basement is also being heated to ~72 degrees by the tank, or it could be the 90+ temperature outside. Since there is no AC in the basement I leave one of the double doors open to the unfinished part of the basement for cooling the finished area when the outdoor temperature is >85 degrees.
Solution = 1/3 HP chiller! Didn’t really plan for this piece of equipment, but after running it for 3wks now, I love it!
2) Within 3 days of the enclosure installation all 3 bottom doors warped outward over 1.5” from the frame in the middle! With the amount of water circulation (humidity), ballast and refugium lighting heat, let’s just say conditions underneath the tank with the doors closed were ‘wicked’ as a New Englander would say.
Solution = Paint the inside of all doors with 6 coats of polyurethane and install 2 cooling fans on the bottom right side door into the sump area. After 3 days the warped wood straightened out and conditions stabilized in the sump area.

http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Chiller_Fan.jpg

3) The Fire! I have a new appreciation for 400 W Metal Halides and the intense heat they produce. Circled in red is a plastic screw clip that I used to mount outdoor 14 gauge wire running the middle MH light. Notice how close it is to the side MH bulb! It’s actually about 3 inches away, but that was apparently close enough to melt the clip! So on July 26 I opened the hood to feed the fish and noticed there was black soot everywhere. I then saw bar wires dangling on the left MH bulb and actually contacting each other still sparking…and all the lights were still running!!!. What apparently happened is that plastic clip melted and the wire fell down just enough to touch the left most MH bulb, the plastic coating on the wire burned ~1 ft of the wire bare before luckily burning itself out. I’m pretty sure the aluminum foil covering the wood canopy top prevented the fire from getting out of control. Needless to say I’ve been peeking in the hood ~4 times a day since!
Solution = re-route new wire around the left MH bulb and under the CF’s to the middle MH mogul, and affix this wire to the tank top with ultra thick metal staples.

http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/LightingClip.jpg

[chiton]

So it’s now Aug 10, and present day (same day as this post). No issues with the tank since. My budget was $10K, and without detailed accounting, I came pretty close…but that’s with the minimal stocking you see today. Hopefully this setup will provide many years of family enjoyment…job willing, because there is no way I’m moving this setup. I thought having a fish tank to look at while working out in the basement would be motivational, but it turns out I do more staring at the tank than actually working out now. I’m very happy with how things turned out, especially considering all the unknowns going in. So what remains is stocking the tank. Here are some recent pics. I’ll of course provide updated as things progress.

http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Aug1.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Aug2.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Aug3.jpg
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http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Aug6.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Aug7.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Aug8.jpg

[PokerReefer]

I love builds like this. Complete dedication to a tank. What are your stocking plans ?

[Toddrtrex]

Do you plan on using any reflectors for the MHs?

[tnias]

Great build, looks great!!

For future projects consider using Mahoghany wood, its moisture resistant and wine cabinet manufacturer's use it in their chilled cabinets at 56 degrees and 50% humidity. I used stainless steel hinges on my cabinet but the salt is still working its magic.

[RuffsReef]

I like your idea about the overflow! Anymore into on it?

http://7.hidemyass.com/ip-1/encoded/Oi8vaG9tZS5jb21jYXN0Lm5ldC9-YmNwYXR0ZXJzL1BpY3R1cmVzMi9QbHVtYmluZzhqcGcuanBn

Hard to see but do you have one on each side?

[chiton]

Do you plan on using any reflectors for the MHs?

I may tweak the lighting in the coming years. I REALLY like how LED is coming along and reducing the lighting heat output would be nice. Unfortunately there is only 4" width available for a MH reflector. Most I've seen would consume at least 2 rows of CF's. I'm on the look-out for small ones if you know of any.

[chiton]

Great build, looks great!!

For future projects consider using Mahoghany wood, its moisture resistant and wine cabinet manufacturer's use it in their chilled cabinets at 56 degrees and 50% humidity. I used stainless steel hinges on my cabinet but the salt is still working its magic.

Agreed! I've not been impressed with Maple humidity resistance. My carpenter was trying to talk me into marine plywood.

[psteeleb]

looking great

tagging along

[chiton]

I like your idea about the overflow! Anymore into on it?

http://7.hidemyass.com/ip-1/encoded/Oi8vaG9tZS5jb21jYXN0Lm5ldC9-YmNwYXR0ZXJzL1BpY3R1cmVzMi9QbHVtYmluZzhqcGcuanBn

Hard to see but do you have one on each side?

There are 2 identical overflows on each side, and plumped straight down each side. I believe each overflow, if I remember correctly, is rated for ~1700 gph flow. I've got my pumps turned down a bit to combat micro-bubbles, and with only a ~6 ft head I figure each overflow is seeing ~800-900 gph. Here are some better pics.

Right Overflow
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Right_overflow.jpg

Right Side of tank, outside of overflow
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Outside_rt_overflow.jpg

Left Overflow
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Left_overflow.jpg

Left side of tank, outside overflow
http://home.comcast.net/~bcpatters/Pictures2/Outside_left_overflow.jpg

[jok3rqnk]

the tank is a beauty great job....

[Indiana Reefin]

Very nice!!

[bigfish520]

Awesome man, do your yellow tangs school? It looks like it in your pics.

[websiteworld]

With rising energy costs, I don't understand why people don't just pay the money and do LED. Pay now, or pay later.

[djk83]

Nice build.

[droth335]

Very nice! We are planning to build a new house in the next year and my wife has requested we turn our 210 mixed reef into a FOWLRHC (fish only with live rock and hardy coral :-) for the basement and set up a LARGER reef tank on the main level....hopefully we can act quickly before she regains her senses (I can only assume mild brain trauma?). Would love to do a built in like you've done! Thanks for sharing.

[chiton]

Thanks for all the comments

Awesome man, do your yellow tangs school? It looks like it in your pics.

The tangs definitely school together with the 3 yellows typically following the purple around. Oddly enough, all the fish actually school together. In past smaller tanks dwarf angels and wrasses were typically loaners and indifferent to other fish and each other, but not in this tank. I'm of course associated with food now, so wherever I am in the basement the fish are as close to me as possible.

[chiton]

With rising energy costs, I don't understand why people don't just pay the money and do LED. Pay now, or pay later.

I will probably switch one day. I've been saying this about Christmas lights for 4 yrs too. So to go all LED would probably run me $5000 for the lights minimum. I spent $1K. Not researching this too much it looks like the power savings is ~50%, per what manufacturers are quoting. My lighting + chiller appears to be costing me ~$75 extra a month, so let's say LED would save me $38 per month. So roughly it would take me 9 yrs to re-coop the extra cost. I say still not worth it...yet.

[kv2wr1]

That's a nice tank and a nice finished basement. Good job!:thumbsup:

[DustinB]

Nice setup, looks great!

Do you expect to have any issues from the copper in your brass fittings?

[chiton]

Nice setup, looks great!

Do you expect to have any issues from the copper in your brass fittings?

Thanks for the comment! Not too concerned. The only brass used is on the reversible pump, which is only being used every other wk for water changes and top-off replenishment, so it's not seeing consistent flow to and from the tank. Everything else is PVC or PEX.

[aecasasus]

Awesome build!!!! :thumbsup:

[azjohnny]

Nice job on the cave and tank. I am looking at getting a INS 300 for a FOWLR......how are you liking and what is the footprint of the skimmer? I am trying to get an idea if I have room in my sump

I did notice you have the same sump I have

[chiton]

Can't say enough good things about the INS 300. Well built, I don't have to continually tinker with air intake like I have with other brands, and the cup is very easy to take on and off. Kind of hard to give you exact dimensions because it's down in my sump, but I'd make sure you have 16L x 11w x25h inches of space.
Chiton

[Whitelight]

Nice build. I really like your aquascaping. It gives me some ideas. Especially the arch in the middle.

[anbosu]

I will probably switch one day. I've been saying this about Christmas lights for 4 yrs too. So to go all LED would probably run me $5000 for the lights minimum. I spent $1K. Not researching this too much it looks like the power savings is ~50%, per what manufacturers are quoting. My lighting + chiller appears to be costing me ~$75 extra a month, so let's say LED would save me $38 per month. So roughly it would take me 9 yrs to re-coop the extra cost. I say still not worth it...yet.

You need to factor in bulb replacement costs as well, it's not just about the power. I agree it gets expensive very quickly on the large tanks though.