What should I expect from an online vender? Pairing up jawfish...

[JaneG]

Hello all,
I purchased a pair of yellowhead jawfish online from a vendor but have a little problem: one of them showed up DOA. They were shipped nicely - no complaint there (although the package smelled, obviously because a dead fish was sitting in there for a while). The vendor apologized and is being very responsible, offering a refund, store credit, or that they will ship another pair...for $40 (the standard shipping cost). I'm probably clueless, but I thought a lot of the time that the vendor pays for shipping costs on DOA replacements? I was intending to breed these fish, thus I purchased a mated pair. However, now I have a problem because I have only one and this is a nano tank (20g, 20g sump). I have no idea how well a trio would do in a tank this size - it probably wouldn't be good. I hate to say it, but I probably would have been better off having both of them die :(

To be honest, I was really hoping for a pair and practically set on it. It would really stink to receive another shipment, pay $40 (gee, this is mindbogglingly expensive to me), and have the possibility of one or both dying again. Even if they both showed up, I would have to deal with the possibility of aggression or just have to return the one I am stuck with (which I feel responsible for). I could also order a single jawfish - however, there is no way to sex these fish, which could be disasterous or perfect (they pair up OR I'm out of my store credit, spending it on the fish, and have to deal with bringing one to my LFS).

I understand this probably isn't standard. However, I feel like my case is special. I paid a premium - more than buying 2 individually - to receive a confirmed pair...I could go to my LFS, buy 2 fish, hope they pair up, and not have to pay anything for shipping (plus I'd have the same chance of success if I bought one from them again, thus I feel like my $40 was wasted). I think I'm honestly biased, though, and probably sound a little bit bashing (but I am more than satisfied with my order). I'm wondering what...
1. What should I do about these fish? @_@
2. Is this policy fair in my case? I'm probably too used to Liveaquaria's refund policy...lol

Jane

[JaneG]

Any thoughts? I read somewhere that with Yellowheads that the size may be indicative of sex. The one that died is a little larger - perhaps I should just order a single, large jawfish?

[snorvich]

Which vendor? How were they packed (2 bags I assume)? Were they sent priority overnight FEDEX?

[barbouri02]

I dont have any advice but Im sorry about your DOA. Sucks.

[JaneG]

Which vendor? How were they packed (2 bags I assume)? Were they sent priority overnight FEDEX?
They were packaged together but I don't think I should say the vendor yet as they've had great customer service and I don't want to tarnish their rep :fish1: Packaged together...the water was a little green and smelled bad but I think that it had a chemical in it to make them feel more comfortable. It was packaged nicely though. Priority overnight fedex and the body doesn't look strange other than turned backside up, slightly bent...I think it was stressed. Thank you barbouri02! :)

[organism]

It's very normal for vendors to charge an extra shipping fee since one of your fish did arrive ok, so technically they paid for and successfully shipped a fish. It's pretty rare for a vendor to re-send a DOA and eat the shipping fees, and honestly imo it's a very impolite thing to demand. As far as paying a premium for a confirmed pair, unfortunately when shipping live animals you've got to give leeway for these kinds of things to happen.

They're offering you a great deal though, shipping fedex costs more than $40 so they're still eating a good bit of the costs. Sounds like a fair policy.

+1 to liveaquaria being amazing though :)

[snorvich]

It was not liveaquaria. They never pack two fish in one bag. That is not good practice.

[JaneG]

It was not liveaquaria. They never pack two fish in one bag. That is not good practice.

Struck me as a little odd too...
Do you think it would be fair to offer to split the shipping? Or perhaps free shipping if I bought some coral, too? :confused: I don't know if it's worth it to buy another pair with all the shipping because there is the risk of it happening again :(

[Psirex]

Just ask the the next pair be shipped in separate bags but same container/box... Sell the odd man out... Figure that they are eating the cost of another mated pair but you just pay for shipping (which i assume is less than paying for the mated pair AND shipping) JMO

[organism]

It was not liveaquaria. They never pack two fish in one bag. That is not good practice.

My bad, I should've been a bit clearer that I was agreeing with the first post about liveaquaria being awesome and setting the bar so high. I know they're not the ones being referred to, because LA would've taken care of things and this thread wouldn't be here :)

But backing up a bit because I must have missed something: they packed 2 fish in one bag? That's a HUGE mistake on their part, it could very well have lived if they hadn't screwed that one up. Actually I don't know of any collection station, wholesaler, or retailer in the entire industry that would do something that colossally stupid.

imo they for sure owe you a re-ship on that one.

[JaneG]

My bad, I should've been a bit clearer that I was agreeing with the first post about liveaquaria being awesome and setting the bar so high. I know they're not the ones being referred to, because LA would've taken care of things and this thread wouldn't be here :)

But backing up a bit because I must have missed something: they packed 2 fish in one bag? That's a HUGE mistake on their part, it could very well have lived if they hadn't screwed that one up. Actually I don't know of any collection station, wholesaler, or retailer in the entire industry that would do something that colossally stupid.

imo they for sure owe you a re-ship on that one.

I didn't directly call them out on their shipping price in my last email, but they responded by saying that somehow we'll make it work out. I was thinking that, again, maybe if I order some more coral that they'd be willing to offer free shipping (and jawfish bagged separately)? I feel kind of awkward about asking. However, I can see how they *should* have been bagged separately, seeing as I saw my LFS get in an order of 10 sexy shrimp and each was individually bagged (!!). Do you think I should offer that or just pay the $40? I know it sounds like I'm whining over only $40 but I'm a high school student making my money with a small business...I only get a little bit at a time to spend (I do have an emergency fund, though). :confused:

[Korrine]

This is not an emergency :) Save it for when you REALLY need it :)

Sorry a fish died :( Let us know how it turns out.

[reefjunkie42]

no offense but if you dont know all fish should be in separate bags you may want to explore another hobby... As for the jawfish, just trade it to a LFS for store credit.

[JaneG]

This is not an emergency :) Save it for when you REALLY need it :)

Sorry a fish died :( Let us know how it turns out.
Thanks! I meant by the emergency part that basically I am able to spend money if I *have* to in case anyone thinks from my post that I couldn't afford an emergency in general...I didn't want to sound irresponsible, I guess.

no offense but if you dont know all fish should be in separate bags you may want to explore another hobby... As for the jawfish, just trade it to a LFS for store credit.
Wow, a little harsh (I'm probably sensitive though). I do know that it is a bad idea, though. I understand how the entire shipping process works, however, sometimes even "big pooping" (for lack of a better term, lol) fish can be packaged in a similar sized package. That being said, I *am* at a disadvantage. I live literally on the opposite side of the country from them so it probably took longer than average. Do you guys think the ammonia killed the fish? I was guessing it was just shipping stress. Perhaps that changes things? :thumbdown

I wish I could just take the jawfish back but I don't think I can for a couple reasons:
I feel a bit responsible and don't want it to go to a bad home
I don't know if there is any sliver that it might work out having 3 as the only fish in the tank?
It would be stressful for a newly established fish to be moved from his burrow...again

I'm not getting a lot from my research on here other than that they can be territorial so it isn't the best idea. However, very few people seem to try? I think I'm going to go check with my trusted LFS tomorrow and ask for some advice as I think he'd have a lot of experience with shipping "standard practices" and DOA (and jawfish actually). I think I'll get his opinion on what I should do before I send a response to the vendor, just to be extra safe :spin2: Thanks for the help everyone!!

[alton]

If it is the place I get mine from they are shipped in a plastic bottle that makes it very easy to acclimate to your tank. I have received two pairs from this company and both acclimated very well. Another person in my club received 4 pairs the same way and did very well. Those who are saying the shipper doesn't know what they are doing need to chill and get a job. As we ship fish all over the world you are going to have loses, that is the nature of the hobby. FYI I have two Pearly Jawfish in my 29 for a year that are not paired and they get along okay. They are not like there cousins the blue spots.

[Gotcha!]

#1) Have them ship you a new maited pair. The shipping of the 2 fish in one bag was a no no. If you feel comfortable still dealing with the company then just have them send you out another pair and ask them to make sure they are double bagged, insulated and not in the same bag.

#2) Take the one you have now to an area LFS and see if they will give you a slight credit toward something you need in the future as another posted above. I do not think it would be a wise idea to put 3 in a nano tank with the new pair and the odd man out yet it may be possible I think it would be somewhat stressful.

Good luck. Jawfish are IMO, one of the most enjoyble tank marvels out there.

Good Luck.

[Korrine]

FYI I have two Pearly Jawfish in my 29 for a year that are not paired and they get along okay. They are not like there cousins the blue spots.

Speaking of that, we have a trio in 29g bio cube where I volunteer. They haven't been together long, though. Just since March or April, but all are full grown at roughly 4". I have never witnessed any aggression at all and once in awhile they share burrows with eachother.

[alton]

Poor Quality but here is a picture of my two PJ's here at work. The one to the right has his home just behind the frogspawn.

[Gotcha!]

I wish I could just throw in another BSJ into my 90 gallon and have them be as peaceful as all your yellowheaded Jawfish are.

Jawfish are the most amazing fish to me. I can spend endless hours watching them build and rebuild their tunnels and homes, and watching them cover their home at night and uncover it in the morning. Its amazing that once in a system for a while and used to the lighting they cover their home before lights out almost to the exact time every night, etc.

Amazing fish.

Hope it all works out for you.

If anyone knows how to tell the sex of a BSJ I would love to figure out a way to introduce a second into my 90 gallon

[reefjunkie42]

I think youll be ok , ask a reputible LFS they are worth their weight in gold