About ready to throw in the towel..

[fishgate]

On my umpteenth cyano outbreak. No end in site for sky-high nitrates. Vodka dosing seems to be doing nothing. After 9 months I still have massive amounts of algae and cyano. This morning the entire tank looks purple from the latest cyano outbreak. If it weren't for the livestock, I'd break this tank down today.

[sponger0]

Need more info. Such as water parameters, if your running a phosphate reactors and what you have tried to battle the cyano

[littlec984]

Need to know water parameters, how much u feeding, how long u keeping your lights on? Are you running GFO??

[FirstContact]

I would run some SeaChem Purigen immediately. Won't solve whatever is causing the problem, but it will clean up your cyano bacteria.

[Sk8r]

Have you tried the 3-day lights-out method? If you have a very good skimmer and an absolute blackout, this usually gets it within 3 months, 3 tries. If you have cyano that doesn't die off in the dark, something is very strange.

[Sk8r]

Re nitrates---do you have a sponge or filter medium anywhere in this tank setup? That's usually the reason. And what and how much are you feeding? And is this setup with ro/di?

[fishgate]

All RO/DI (tests 0 nitrates), feeding a few flakes/pellets every other day or so. 1 giant filter bag for the sump, cleaned weekly. Tried lights out once no help at all. All reg water levels nominal. Nitrates >80ppm. Phosphates .5+. Running phosphate pellets in a bag just thrown in the sump as I can't fit a reactor anywhere. Also have a bag of nitrate pellets and a bag of charcoal.

I do run the lights a lot, was going to try cutting them down to 6 hours a day. 4x39 watt T5 running about 12 hours a day now plus a plant light in the sump for a ball of algae.

[Cloudburst2000]

TDS of your RO/DI water? I see that you tested it for nitrates, but have you tested it for TDS? Is it possible that you have high TDS in your water leading to some of your problems?

And on the feeding issue, how many is a 'few flakes/pellets'?

And the T5s running for 12hrs is likely a big part of your problem. Cut that down significantly.

Also, when you did lights out on your tank, did you make sure that NO lights (not even lights from the room) could penetrate into the tank? It takes more than just turning the tank light off. You have to make sure no light gets in. It needs to be a complete black-out. Even small amounts of light seeping in can keep the algae alive.

[ajcanale]

With nutrient levels that high it is going to take a while to fix. You likely have high organic nutrient levels bound to your live rock. Possibly an explanation to why there is cyano growing all over it. Even if you were to do something drastic like 100% water changes you would see those levels rise back, and a return of nusance algae.

Phosphate and nitrate pellets in a bag are going to do you little to no good. It just doesn't work that way. Water has to flow through the media, not around it. Since you dont have room in sump, there are HOB models of reactors available (Via Aqua).

For the time being I would remove the "1 giant filter bag for the sump." Doesn't sound like its helping you very much, and might be contributing to the problem. Feed lightly and perform 20% (at least) water changes weekly until your levels are in check. Provided that you are removing (water changes) more nutrients than you are putting in (feeding livestock) your levels will eventually decrease.

Also, I really don't see how Seachem Purigen could possibly clean up the cyano.

[Sk8r]

I agree with the advice given. CYano is usually a light issue far more than nutrient, but high nutrients don't help. Sunlight should be 8 hours or less, blue lights up to 10 as a twilight and color correction. Check the things suggested. And if absolutely all else fails you may have to go a round with Chemiclean---I don't like to suggest that, and fix all other issues first. The sudden dieoff in using Chemiclean can crash a tank if your skimmer isn't up to pulling the dieoff out fast enough; and it will impact your microlife---cost me a fortune in pods for my mandy the time I used it. But of all problems a tank can have cyano is one of the most fixable. Don't get discouraged: just start being sure your water is as good as you think, ditch anything that traps debris and waste; shield your tank from all daylight; ---I'm not familiar with your lights, but light spectrum can profoundly affect this. Cyano loves cloudy sunlight, slanted sunlight, or sunlight of a slightly skewed spectrum. It eats light. Bigtime.

[reefergeorge]

The cyano could be from the vodka dosing. If it were my tank, I would stop dosing everything, remove the bags of stuff, and treat for three days with chemi-clean, and lights off.

The algae will take time and weekly water changes, but the cyano should be quick.

[Reefmedic79]

How old are the bulbs in your light fixture? Also, is there any natural sunlight reaching the tank at all?

[divinedragon13]

can try new ats simple and might help did with my cyano in my tank.
just need air pump a 4inch air stone and 4x3 screen tied to air stone.
place in sump by side with cfl flood light shinning though the side.

[acabgd]

At nitrates > 80ppm I don't see why you would wonder - it is massive. Cut your feeding to a minimum, ditch the big filter bag, stop dosing vodka and whatever else you're dosing and male a complete blackout for three days.

[hollister]

Try removing the lid. If there is one. This would help speed up the gas exchange.

[fishgate]

Bulbs are brand new (in my sig line). TDS is 0. I have a screen top and lose ~1 gallon/day to evap. Feeding is very minimal. No more frozen, just pellets and flakes. And just a few of those. (small pinch)

I will remove the filter bag/sock along with all the dosing bags floating in the sump. It does pick up a lot of stuff primarily a ton of algae as I attempt to remove it with a tooth brush and it goes out the overflow into the sump bag. I can clean it on Saturday and by the following Saturday the tank has a ton algae again (grows 2-3" in a week). When you smell my water, it smells like those bottles of phyto-feast.

The tank is perpendicular to a window that gets full sun almost directly facing where the sun rises. I have blinds on the windows but they still allow the slats of light through.

I have been meaning to move the UV filter to this tank and will do it today.

[Cloudburst2000]

The tank getting that much sun is probably a big reason why you have algae issues. My brother-in-law had a similar issue with the biocube in their bedroom. No matter where he placed the tank, it got sunlight due to a fairly large skylight in the room. The tank mostly got sun when they were at work so he ended up fashioning a shield made of cardboard to place around the tank when they were at work. The shield kept the tank from getting direct sunlight and really helped clear up some of his algae issues.

[Cloudburst2000]

Of course, your extremely high nitrates aren't helping anything. You really need to figure out where the high nitrates are originating from. Also, I didn't see that you listed a refugium in your sig. Are you running a fuge? If not, I would suggest adding one to your sump with chaeto in it. As the chaeto grows, it will pull nutrients out of the water column. Everytime you remove some of the chaeto, you are removing some of the nutrients that are bound up in the chaeto. And I don't know if you have the capability of running one, but look into turf algae scrubbers. They are also great at removing nutrients from the water.

[fishgate]

I have a ball of something in my sump. Not sure what it is but the LFS said it would help remove nitrates. It is a 6" diameter ball of algae that has very coarse strands. I don't have a fuge per-se but I do have a 20 gallon 2 chamber sump that I use as a fuge.

http://imagehost.calabro.us/images/aquarium/saltwater/algae1.JPG
http://imagehost.calabro.us/images/aquarium/saltwater/algae2.JPG
http://imagehost.calabro.us/images/aquarium/saltwater/algae3.JPG
http://imagehost.calabro.us/images/aquarium/saltwater/algae4.JPG

[ajcanale]

That is Chaetomorpha... it will compete with the hair algae and cyano to absorb nutrients, should help in the long-run. Not an easy fix solution by any means though. You might want to consider a more powerful bulb, or lowering it at least, by the looks of the pictures the lighting is rather dim. Considering Chaeto loves light....More light = Faster Growth = More nutrients absorbed.

[Reeferz412]

Do you have adequate flow? I'm pretty stumped, all I could think of is nutrients trapped within your rock and insufficient flow.

[Sk8r]

Cyano only needs 3 things to live ---odd spectrum sunlight, a lot of it; carbon (the vodka); and water. It can use other nutrients, but the core of the problem will be to remove one (or two!) of those elements.

[littlec984]

Stop dosing the vodka, try to find a way to shield your tank from the sun light, and start to take out the extra media to help pinpoint the nitrate problem

[fishgate]

I started to dose vodka to help this chronic problem. I'll continue that as the write-up on vodka makes sense. I don't think the vodka is contributing as I have only been doing it for 2 weeks.

But I did close the blinds all the way in the room and they will remain that way. And I added my "big" UV filter. I am also only going to run the lights for 6 hours a day. And just 2 of the 4 T5s. And I am going to change 20% per week of the water to see if that helps (instead of 10%). I have two buckets conditioning now.

Also I have had the UV filter on 4 just a day but I swear the Frogspawn already is looking better.

[ihavtats29]

I have found when things are not doing well in my tank stop everything you are doing and revert to the basics . stop dosing run a reactor with a mix of phosban and carbon and weekly 20% water changes . you are not going to see a change overnight. kill your lights completely for 3 days and only run them for 4-6 hrs and keep changing your water weekly and replace you phosban when it starts changing to a yellowish rusty color. over time you nitrates will fall and the cyano and algae will go away.

[w16227]

Have you tested for ALK?

In my tank - one of the sure signs that the kalk reactor has run low is the appearance of cyano.

I do not believe that they are directly related (not like higher alk levels remove nitrates and prevent cyano_) - but there are definitely some multiple level affects going on in all of our tanks. For me - low ALK = bad coral health = the corals MIGHT not be filtering out what they used to = more available nitrates for the cyano and bad algae.

[salty55]

It sounds like you need a larger diversity of bacteria. The vodka will only feed the existing bacteria. This (monoculture) of bacteria is likely why you cannot get a drop in nitrates and phoshates.
i would suggest using a product like microbactor 7 or prodibio to geg the bacteria balance in check. Just think of like a septic tank on your house, it also needs bacteria to work and disolve waste, and the occasional use of a bacteria product like rid-ex makes sure the bacteria are numrous enough to get the job done!

[IridescentLily]

Don't throw in the towel. I have had a cyano problem for three months. Didn't have any for the first 10 months. THEN i changed out my bulb from a 12k coralvue 150w to a Phoenix 14k 150w. The light was MUCH brighter, and much bluer. So my trachyphyllia started bleaching.
So we added a screen cover to diffuse the light for the tracyphyllia.
My trachyphyllia stopped bleaching, and began growing larger.
Then shortly after came the cyano. It only appears (every day) on the two top rocks.
So as Sk8tr said, odd colored, diffused lighting, was what started it. And nutrients (building up my rocks) kept it going.
I had read about adding more water circulation so i moved the output nozzle about 2", pointing the flow at those two rocks.
Now i only have cyano on one rock. :)

Also, nutrient-wise, i read here about blowing the rocks off with a plastic turkey baster. The first time i did that i could-not-believe-the-amount-of-crap that came flying out all over the tank. The cyano got less and less each time i blew my rocks off. It took about three months, and now cyano remains only on the one rock, and the rest of the rocks are clean with coralline growth showing up now.

[jerseygurl]

OMG I would love to work on your tank, I love a good challenge!

Okay, lets get serious here, time to go nuclear. Set up a quick QT using NOTHING from your tank. Just Dr. Tims One and Only it. Move your livestock out and NUKE THAT TANK. Use some Red Slime Algae Killer and NUKE away! Run it until it's all dead. Get youself a GFO/Carbon Reactor, gotta get rid of those phosphates stored up in your rocks and sand. Turn the lights out and let it all die. Scrub your LR, clean your sand, everything then put in nice new water and keep that GFO/Carbon fresh and running.

Good luck I'm rooting for you!

[fishgate]

OMG I would love to work on your tank, I love a good challenge!

Okay, lets get serious here, time to go nuclear. Set up a quick QT using NOTHING from your tank. Just Dr. Tims One and Only it. Move your livestock out and NUKE THAT TANK. Use some Red Slime Algae Killer and NUKE away! Run it until it's all dead. Get youself a GFO/Carbon Reactor, gotta get rid of those phosphates stored up in your rocks and sand. Turn the lights out and let it all die. Scrub your LR, clean your sand, everything then put in nice new water and keep that GFO/Carbon fresh and running.

Good luck I'm rooting for you!

You read my mind! My 29g QT tank is being started tonight as a holding tank. I am hoping for a quick cycle. I do think as well that the ONLY way I am going to recover is to totally nuke the tank. As bad as the cyano is, it isn't 1/10 as bad as the algae.

However, I had hoped to just move the corals out and leave the fish in, but with as much algae as I have, just the dieoff alone could kill everything. But I am going to run my fluval canister in it for mechanical filtration to get rid of everything floating around. I think massive overfeeding for the first 4-5 months that I had the tank running has resulted in an enormous buildup of nitrates and phosphates. I was feeding 2-3x per day and probably feeding 5x as much as they needed at each feeding.

Once I move out the coral, I was going to start with the turkey baster and blast away and let my sump and the fluval pick up as much as possible.

btw: My frogspawn popped another head today. So the original 4 heads is down to one. I found 2 of the popped heads and they are in glasses in the tank and one is lost.

I am afraid to move the livestock out because I don't think I can keep the QT tank healthy for the month or so it is going to take to nuke everything and re-cycle and get it all back to usable unless it is fully cycled. So not sure - once I get the QT tank up and running I'll see how long it takes to get a cycle. I have plenty of rock in the sump to seed it with so I am hoping it can get going quickly.

[jerseygurl]

Just order some Dr. Tims (order it direct from them) and throw it in, along with the LR you sould be ready in no time.

Good luck!

[BigCountry74]

OMG I would love to work on your tank, I love a good challenge!

Okay, lets get serious here, time to go nuclear. Set up a quick QT using NOTHING from your tank. Just Dr. Tims One and Only it. Move your livestock out and NUKE THAT TANK. Use some Red Slime Algae Killer and NUKE away! Run it until it's all dead. Get youself a GFO/Carbon Reactor, gotta get rid of those phosphates stored up in your rocks and sand. Turn the lights out and let it all die. Scrub your LR, clean your sand, everything then put in nice new water and keep that GFO/Carbon fresh and running.

Good luck I'm rooting for you!

x2

When you set the tank back up, replace that chaeto with a good algae scrubber. They are cheap and easy to make and will work for you I think. Grow all that algae down in the sump/fuge and keep it out of the DT for next time :D

[Reeferz412]

x2

When you set the tank back up, replace that chaeto with a good algae scrubber. They are cheap and easy to make and will work for you I think. Grow all that algae down in the sump/fuge and keep it out of the DT for next time :D

+3 I helped build one for my buddy's 125, great learning experience and its working! Gonna ditch the skimmer in a month or so on his. I plan on building one for my next tank.