Skimmer died 3 weeks ago, tank looks better?

[Dave Harms]

The Sedra bubble-wheel pump in my Warner Marine H1 skimmer died three weeks ago. The skimmer is now dried out on a shelf in my snake room....

Since then, my corals have perked up, my cyano is disappearing and the film algae on my glass is dying.

I'm pretty sure I will not be putting a skimmer back on my tank, would you?

I am upgrading my Penguin 200 to a Penguin 350 (takes 2 of the same cartridges as the 200), it has shipped already, should be here soon.

My corals are shrooms, xenia, anthellia, zoas and leather. Fish - Randal's shrimp goby and a domino.

[Dave Harms]

Picture from just now:

http://www.wax32.com/reef/2012May27_1154.jpg

Looks like crap I know, but this is BETTER than it was 3 weeks ago lol. Normally light from outside isn't shining into the tank, my wife is washing the curtains.

[Dave Harms]

Picture from my wife's iPhone:

http://www.wax32.com/reef/2012May27_1.jpg

Used the magnet on the dying film algae on the glass, so there was a lot of crap floating around in the pic!

[Reefmedic79]

The corals you listed tend to do better with higher nutrients in the water. A tank your size can get away without a skimmer and things should be fine.

[gmate]

Softies and LPS like dirty water. No surprise here. As long as you keep up with regular water changes, you'll be golden. Enjoy!

[Palting]

Looks good!! Yup, your tank should do fine without a skimmer since it's mostly softies.

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I wouldn't be convinced that the cyano effect relates to the skimmer. More often, people see a decline in cyano when first adding a skimmer or increasing skimmer capacity, presumably because cyano can consume organics directly. :)

[Playa-1]

I think the skimmers ability to help with gas exchange is a good reason to run it. If the tank does better with higher nutrients then just dial the skimmer back a bit.

[Dave Harms]

Thanks for the responses guys. I had the skimmer cup as high as it would go (very dry skim). I don't think I could dial it back any more.

I do 2 gallon water changes almost every week... sometimes I miss a week if I don't get a chance to get to the LFS. The cyano thing is what really has me confused. It is almost totally gone now.

I am running 4 bulbs of T5 maybe 5 inches off the surface of the water, the tank is only 12" deep. I am interested in building a canopy to raise the lights instead of leaving them on the standard legs. How high would you go, considering the corals I like to keep? I was thinking about about trying to raise them about five inches. Sound like a good idea?

[Dave Harms]

I think the skimmers ability to help with gas exchange is a good reason to run it. If the tank does better with higher nutrients then just dial the skimmer back a bit.

That's the main reason I wanted to run a skimmer... I have such high surface agitation from the mp10 and the return from the penguin I think I'll be ok there.

[Dave Harms]

Also I should mention: I have a hell of a time keeping a clean up crew alive in this tank. Numerous peppermint shrimp, blood shrimp, cleaner shrimp, Astrea snails, hermits etc, have all met their doom. These seems to be a problem I need to look at fixing? I do have a bullseye pistol shrimp that has been in the tank about a year, doing well even though he could care less about my Randal's goby.

[Agu]

Not to be rude but I see a lot of green in that tank, hair algae? If that's an accurate observation I suggest yo repair your skimmer and upgrade your maintenance schedule. That hair algae will grow to be more invasive without a skimmer.

If I'm wrong please accept my apology in advance.

[tkeracer619]

I would agree with Agu and believe you have a phosphate issue as well.

[Dave Harms]

Yep, I have a lot of algae, but it used to be way worse! I do have a phosphate issue. I am running two little fishes bio pellets. I'm not sure if they are doing any good. The only change I have observed is the improvement in the overall tank, including corals perking up, algae dying, cyano disappearing since the skimmer died.

Don't worry I don't take anything as being rude, I'm here asking for help, I know the tank has issues!

Here is a picture of how the tank used to look, March of 2011. I am trying to figure out what has gone wrong...

http://www.wax32.com/nano/2011Mar31_15.jpg

See how thick and lush it used to be? I had corraline all over the glass and rock...

[Dave Harms]

These mushrooms have all but went away...

Before:

http://www.wax32.com/nano/2011Mar31_17.jpg

After:

http://www.wax32.com/reef/2012May21_1140.jpg

[Dave Harms]

I guess one change I did make between March of last year, and now, is I removed some live rock... I thought I had too much jammed in there.

Maybe now I don't have enough biological filtration?

[sponger0]

I see a severe phosphate/nutrient problem if you have that much green algae. JMO.

[Dave Harms]

I see a severe phosphate/nutrient problem if you have that much green algae. JMO.

Yes, and I am trying to figure out why? I starve my fish, I WAS running a skimmer rated for way more tank, I run bio pellets and carbon, I do regular 20% water changes.

What else is there?

[sponger0]

Could be leaching from the rock.

[xCry0x]

You are running bio pellets without a skimmer?

You understand how bio-pellets work right?

With a tank that size and with -only- softies in the tank you really do not need a skimmer or bio pellets. You would benefit from a phosphate sponge until your rocks stop leaching.

-edit-

saw in your signature you have a phosban reactor with bio-pellets. Switch those out for phosban to reduce your phosphates. If you are not skimming running bio-pellets could/should be an impending disaster because bio-pellets are supposed to be used in conjunction with heavy skimming.

[tmz]

I don't know what your inorganic phosphate, nitrogen and organic carbon nutrient levels are from your post but they're likely all high and contributing to the nuisance algae and cyano while giving at least some of your corals a high time. No corals I know of like truly "dirty water" ;some tolerate higher nutrient( phosphate, nitrogen and organic carbon) but there is a limit . Most do very well with low to moderately low nutrients,ime.

The skimmer and gac( granulated organic carbon) export some organics removing organic carbon including the bacteria ( some sourced perhaps to excess by the pellets) and the nitrogen and phosphorous they hold.

Adding pellets or another organic carbon source without a means to export they're organic products isn't beneficial ,imo.

I'd use some gfo or another PO4 exporter ,continue water changes ,remove as much nuisance algae as you can. It can take weeks or a month or more for PO4 leaching from rock and substrate previously exposed to high levels to stop leaching. But if you consistently keep the water around it at low PO4 it will stop.

[Dave Harms]

You are running bio pellets without a skimmer?

You understand how bio-pellets work right?

With a tank that size and with -only- softies in the tank you really do not need a skimmer or bio pellets. You would benefit from a phosphate sponge until your rocks stop leaching.

-edit-

saw in your signature you have a phosban reactor with bio-pellets. Switch those out for phosban to reduce your phosphates. If you are not skimming running bio-pellets could/should be an impending disaster because bio-pellets are supposed to be used in conjunction with heavy skimming.

Doh! I totally forgot about the instructions to skim with the pellets. I'll swap to GFO in the reactor, thanks for that head's up!

[Dave Harms]

I don't know what your inorganic phosphate, nitrogen and organic carbon nutrient levels are from your post but they're likely all high and contributing to the nuisance algae and cyano while giving at least some of your corals a high time. No corals I know of like truly "dirty water" ;some tolerate higher nutrient( phosphate, nitrogen and organic carbon) but there is a limit . Most do very well with low to moderately low nutrients,ime.

The skimmer and gac( granulated organic carbon) export some organics removing organic carbon including the bacteria ( some sourced perhaps to excess by the pellets) and the nitrogen and phosphorous they hold.

Adding pellets or another organic carbon source without a means to export they're organic products isn't beneficial ,imo.

I'd use some gfo or another PO4 exporter ,continue water changes ,remove as much nuisance algae as you can. It can take weeks or a month or more for PO4 leaching from rock and substrate previously exposed to high levels to stop leaching. But if you consistently keep the water around it at low PO4 it will stop.

Thanks, that sounds like the plan. Gonna switch over to GFO today and up the water changes until things get much better!

[Dave Harms]

OK, pellets gone. GFO in.

I went with 2 tablespoons to start. Figuring 12 gallon tank - space for rocks and sand. I have MAX 10 gallons of water. I went on the safe side and figured 8 gallons, so 2 tablespoons. I marked 8 weeks on the calendar and will go to 3 tablespoons, then 8 weeks after that 4 tablespoons which should be my max. I don't want to kill my xenia!

Thanks for all the help guys.

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

FWIW, I would not always assume that a skimmer is needed with pellets, but you need something to consume the bacteria, such as a very large cryptic zone with sponges or some such thing. :)

[Dave Harms]

That makes sense Randy.

[greech]

I realize that the nutrients need to be there for the GHA to grow but the first pics show a lot of sunlight hitting that tank. I would have to think that has something to do with it. Does the tank heat up during the day?

Nice looking tank. Hope you get it figured out.

[tmz]

Heat might be an issue but sunlight is great ,imo. My tanks get it fom large windows and a skylight.

[breakdanc3]

nice hair algae .. if u had an algae filter u might be able to relocate all that hairyness onto a nice waterfall sheet. u can clear off from time to time. I somewhat believe that algae may be keeping your system stable. Don't expect this to last .. algae grows great at first .. consumes bad nutrients . it doubles in size . grows grows.. then when the algae is at its highest population . its nutrient demand has increased 10x and now, thickness gives way to poor light penetration. all bad nutrients have been consumed.. and boom algae die off . then boom .. coral die off .. floating fish ect.. (over the course of a couple weeks maybe)

this happened with my non-skimmer, algae filter only setup .. i had show quality tank for couple months . i was never able to successfully remove the algae cuz i had it growing in the back chambers with a light all cramped and then the algae collected behind the sheet and in the bio-balls and sponges and it died off . i only removed the sheet to clean it like 2 times . that didn't help. but my CORALS have never LOOKED SO GOOD as they did and my tank as ALGAE FREE when i had that light growing algae in the back chamber. . i just failed to remove the algae properly and on a schedule . .it died off .

if you're not going to use a skimmer i suggest trying an algae filter .. that way u can prevent algae die-off . and probably still have the nicest tank you've had.

[Dave Harms]

Picture from just now:

http://www.wax32.com/reef/2012May27_1154.jpg



Looks like crap I know, but this is BETTER than it was 3 weeks ago lol. Normally light from outside isn't shining into the tank, my wife is washing the curtains.

[Dave Harms]

The tank ranges from 77 - 80.

I must admit, that when I had grape caulerpa growing in the tank it looked AWESOME! I was just thinking about adding some kind of macro to do some nutrient export.

This is as tall as that algae gets. The only time I have had tall hair algae was when I first set the tank up with rocks that were from my larger tank that hurricane katrina killed. It took a domino a week to clear it out.

I am getting way less algae growth on the glass right now. Usually I have to wipe the glass every day. Now I can go a few days.