Internal overflow build

[shovelrider]

I will be building an internal overflow with two drain holes for a Herbie style(1 elbow up and one elbow down). My question is: Should I use acrylic or glass for the box? I do not want teeth on the box and my tank is glass. What is the best way to go about this?

I will post pics when I get started.

[james3370]

me personally, I'd say do the overflow kit from glass-holes.com as they only take up a small amount of valuable room in the tank. you can have them make you a custom size overflow big enough for any variation drain system....just everything as far as the drains will be external an leave more room in the tank. they are some of the best people to deal with & always go above & beyond for their customers

btw....they have everything you need as far as the bulkheads & glass drill bits too

[CliftonArbogast]

I would use glass, you will get better adhesion of glass on glass with silicone.

[james3370]

glass is good, but then ya have to think about how to "tint" the glass so the drains/bulkheads aren't seen.....whereas glass-holes overflow is black plexi & is held in place by the bulkhead mounting thru it.

just my http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v501/james3370/mid%202010%20and%20earlier/smileys/2cents.gif

[jackde]

I used 1/4" acrylic from home depot, glued together with weldon. Used ge silicone for plastic to attach to the tank and it hasen't fallen off yet. After a couple of months can't see through it.

[shovelrider]

jackde, do you have any pictures?

[jackde]

http://i1069.photobucket.com/albums/u464/johndemitruk/Tank%20plumbing%20pics/overflowreturn.jpg
http://i1069.photobucket.com/albums/u464/johndemitruk/Tank%20plumbing%20pics/overflowbox.jpg
http://i1069.photobucket.com/albums/u464/johndemitruk/Tank%20plumbing%20pics/pipesoutback.jpg

[shovelrider]

Wow, that's a really nice job!
What did you use to make the teeth?
Did the bond between the glass and acrylic seem strong? Have you drained the tank below the box yet, and have some water supported in there?
What purpose does the T serve in the drain lines?

Thanks for the pics!

[shovelrider]

Oh, I think that you have water in the box in the pictures!
Am I mistaken?

[shovelrider]

Did home depot cut it for you?
What brand did you use?

[super_steve85]

Do you have access to black acrylic? If so, use that. I siliconed my black acrylic overflow covers to my glass tank using the stuff that came from Glass Cages (great silicone, btw). It's been holding fine for over a year now.

[jackde]

The teeth I made with a router and a dovetail jig. Most reefers don't like them, claim they slow down flow or surface skimming. I do know they cause my large turbos to turn around and not end up in the overflow.

The bond is fine. I think I would break the plastic before I could pull it off. Don't know if Home Depot would cut or not, I used my table saw. For something as miner as an overflow I don't think brand would be to important. Not like a tank that has to be strong. After I did it I thought I should have looked for black or smoked but I don't clean the back glass and now you can't see in it.

The drain was a Durso style to begin with but just made a little to much noise. swiched the caps and made it a Herbie, and silent it is. Also the caps can be removed to clean the pipes if needed.

Think I got all your questions. If not ask again.

[shovelrider]

Thanks for all the info! You really helped me out.

[SpinyReef]

glass is good, but then ya have to think about how to "tint" the glass so the drains/bulkheads aren't seen.....whereas glass-holes overflow is black plexi & is held in place by the bulkhead mounting thru it.

just my http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v501/james3370/mid%202010%20and%20earlier/smileys/2cents.gif

I have a glass overflow. Tank has been set-up for a month and we can barely see the standpipes already because of the algae/coraline build-up. Unless you plan on cleaning your back pannel, I don't think that'll be an issue

[shovelrider]

Spiny, do you have pictures?

I have decided to go with black acrylic if I can find it around town and if not, I'll probably go with glass. Purely an availability decision. My acrylic-to-glass skepticism has been laid to rest and I feel comfortable either way now.

I will be picking up another bulkhead today and hopefully the material for the box after work. Since my tank is a 45 tall I will go with the Herbie system. Before the end of the day I will need to settle on the box's dimensions. I plan on installing the box this weekend.

Anyone have tips/tricks on building the box before I get started?

[jackde]

I would make your box as long as possible for the best surface skimming. Wish I had made mine longer but it works fine for my tank size.

[shovelrider]

Well I'll be using a Mag7 return pump with about a 3 1/2 foot head. So would s long overflow be useful with lower flow in a smaller tank? I think I need at least 3 1/2 inches from the back of the tank to the front panel of the box to fit in elbows for the Herbie. If I did a coast2coast, I think it would block light on the rear of my tank.

I was thinking of a box like: 6''W x 4''D x 5''T in the right rear with the return in the left rear.

[jackde]

Mine is 12" wide, 4" deep and 9"tall to top of fingers. Could have made it shorter but thought I needed a strainer which I could do without. Would have to measure but depth maybe smaller if useing a street elbow and slip bulkhead. I used threaded. My rock work sits in front of box and I only need the top and front lite.
http://i1069.photobucket.com/albums/u464/johndemitruk/Tank%20rock%20pics/canopymod004.jpg
Old pic but shows what I did.

[shovelrider]

I drilled the tank this morning. The first hole chipped on the outside of the tank! I tried using an old drill and the chuck wobbled. Scratched the glass up and a big chip. I was able to use a different drill for hole #2 and it came out nice. I installed the bulkheads and filled the tank and no leaks though. Hopefully after the overflow is covered in coraline I will not notice the chip and forget about it.

I'll be installing the box this week, and then I'll be able to run the plumbing:)

This is the picture of the chip in the middle of the bulkheads.

[shovelrider]

I had the glass cut yesterday and started building the overflow. I had them bevel the edges slightly so I wont cut myself while cleaning the tank and whatnot. The bevels made it difficult to put together because they where done by hand and where not perfect. I will silicone the inside tonight and tomorrow night I will attach the box to the tank.

[jackde]

Looks like progress is being made. Looking at the last picture I think I would add to that center brace as posted above.

[shovelrider]

Last night I siliconed the box to the tank! It went pretty smoothly... Hardest part was getting a bead inside the box with the brace in the way, but I had just enough room to get it done. I could use some work on my silicone skills though. I squared the box up and figured if the stand or floor was not level I would try to shim the stand to get the water level... level. I plan on mocking up the plumbing tonight and maybe even glue it in if everything works out.

[shovelrider]

I am starting on the plumbing. I also just put in an order for a BRS RO/DI!
Wont be long now. :D

[jackde]

Lookin good!!!!!!!!!!

[shovelrider]

double post

[shovelrider]

I have started the mockup of the drain lines. I thought maybe a two into on for ease of plumbing. The ball valve is on the main drain(full siphon) and the two pipes connect after the ball valve. I thought if a clog was going to happen it would be before or at the valve and then the back up drain would still have flow.

Let me know if there are any real issues with this set up or if anyone is running a similar set up.

[nbelohlav]

you should run your emergency drain separate and without any valve... i idea behind an emergency drain is that if the main drain gets clogged the emergency takes over. if you keep it like it is now and it clogs your emergency drain may not do as good. i would run just a pipe from the emergency bulk head to the sump with nothing on it. if you hadnt it already drilled it i would say you should have gone with a 1.5" bulkhead and pipe for your emergency drain, its alot harder to clog that. i did that with mine when i added my emergency drain and couldnt be happier. HTH

[shovelrider]

Yeah, its already drilled. I think i will stop by lowes today and get some unions and other fittings to run the pipes individually. My problem is room in the sump. for now I have only enough room for a 10g footprint in my stand. I am trying to figure out how to modify it so i can fit a 20g long, its going to be tricky.

[jackde]

I agree with keeping the emergency separate. Make sure your valve is located where it is easy to get to, it will take some very fine adjustment at first. For total silence you need to run drain about 1" below the water line. This pipe can be made adjustable.

[shovelrider]

good call jackde. I didn't even think about making it adjustable.

[shovelrider]

So I went with the dual drains and I think it came out well. I also painted the bottom and back of the tank with acrylic paint and I like how it turned out. I used a small roller to apply the paint and a little brush to get into the tight areas.

I am trying to decide if I want to put egg crate on the bottom to protect the glass from the rocks. I have used deep sand beds in the past so it wasn't an issue, but this time I will be using a relatively shallow bed.

I am also waiting on the ro/di unit to arrive so I can start making the water.

While doing the water/leak test I noticed my Mag7 return pump was noisy. I noticed the cover where the impeller sits in to center up was halfway gone, and when I inspected the inside bottom of the pump, I saw the centering hole was now oval. So it's time for a new pump after 41/2 years of dependable service. I will probably order another Mag7 today.

[shovelrider]

:D RO/DI arrived this week. Started making water and it is faster than I expected. About 3g an hour with 4:1/waste:good at 50 psi and only about 100TDS going into the filter. I am impressed with the speed BRS shipped this and in the quality of the product. I would recommend BRS for RO/DI kits.

[shovelrider]

I put sand and water in the tank last night and I just placed an order for 50 lbs of Marco Rocks. Should be here in a couple of days. :bounce1:

[super_steve85]

So close!

Is Marco Rock live or base rock? Did you use live sand?

[nbelohlav]

Sweet! its looking good... whats your GPH on your RO/DI?

[shovelrider]

The rock I bought was the Key largo dry rock. I used the sand from the tank before the move, but by now its dead... I washed it twice, once with tap to get the junk out and then again with RO/DI right before I put it in the tank.

I still have what was my 10g fuge housing live rock, a single pajama, some mushrooms and zoes/palys. It has grown algae since I used tap water for a few months before I got the RO/DI. I want to get the 10g completely free of algae befor adding it to the DT, so I have decided to put the pajama in the DT after it cycles and then dose the 10g with H202 to exterminate all algae before adding the live rock to the DT.

I will post pic's of the 10g this evening.

My RO/DI is a 75gpd = 3+ gph. I highly recommend Bulk Reef Supply for RODI's. Mine came in 3 days and was leak free right out the box. I flushed it, and then was making water in no time. All parts/filters are top quality. A++

[nbelohlav]

yeah i need to get a 75 gallon membrane and restrictor cause the 100 gpd that i have now takes for ever @55-60 psi...

[shovelrider]

This is what I saved from my last set up. I started dosing with H202 last night. Lets see if it works as described!

The first picture is what the 10g looked like before I had to use tap water.

[shovelrider]

nbelohlav, I would recommend Filmtec for the membrane. Do you have a pressure gauge or TDS meter on your ro/di so you can tell if the other filters are bad/good?

[shovelrider]

I decided to move the old fuge inside and did a 100% water change after I scrubbed all the algae off the rocks with a toothbrush. Once I am certain that the rocks have no algae left on them I will put all this in the DT. My dry rock is due to arrive Tuesday and once those go in the DT I will start lighting the tank and probably fire up the skimmer.

Here are some pics in the mean time.

[shovelrider]

Tried to reload pics.
1st = just after the move and before I used tap water.
2nd = after I used tap water for a while
3rd = temp set up while I get perams right so I can add the live rock after the DT cycles
4th = to compare to the 2nd pic. This is after I scrubbed the algae off the rocks with toothbrush and did a 100% water change with ro/di saltwater.

[nbelohlav]

nbelohlav, I would recommend Filmtec for the membrane. Do you have a pressure gauge or TDS meter on your ro/di so you can tell if the other filters are bad/good?

yeah i have both and i know the filters are good cause they are new but the membrane is the one that the previous owner had with it so it might be time to get a new 75 gallon one...

[shovelrider]

From what I understand the 75GPD has the best rejection rate.

[shovelrider]

:beer: My rocks arrived today! I'll take pictures tonight of the rocks right out the box, and also when I stack them. Now I can really get the cycle in the tank going. I need to get my lights and hood together now.

[shovelrider]

Here is the rock unpacking, the layout, and what I got done last night!

195892 The rock was packed tight!

195893 Just so you can see the size/shape of the rocks.

195894 The current configuration.

195895 The rubble that was left

195898 Just to compare to a LFS rock.

[shovelrider]

So I added some 5 year old live rock and a bottle of Bio-Spira from Instant Ocean. I thought I would try this snake oil to see what happens. It supposedly adds the bacteria that naturally inhabit your tank when cycling. This bottle just speeds up the process. So because the bacteria are added in at one time you need something to produce waste for the bacteria to eat so they don't die off. I added some snails and hermits to do this and ghost feed my tank. I will monitor the ammonia, nitrite and nitrate levels and post results to see if this product works or not.
Here are some new pics of the set up with the live rock added!

196531

196532

196533

[super_steve85]

Looks like you've got the overflow dialed in nicely. The rock config should look nice once it becomes "live."

[shovelrider]

Thanks, I put all the live rock up top just so the coraline will spread over the dry rock. I need to get a razor to scrape the live rock and hopefully seed the other rocks. Then I will mix in the Fiji rock with the Marco Rocks.

[shovelrider]

I recently got a Tyree green polyp toadstool and my tank is cycling along nicely.

197781
197782

[shovelrider]

So the tank has been up and running for a while now and so far so good. I am taking it extremely slow this time. I waited on coraline to form and signs of pods before adding more livestock. I have been having issued with my Coralife dual timer. I have had 2 now that will not keep semi-accurate time between the two timers. One falls behind the other by hours in a matter of days!
I'm trying to resolve this now with the company... If nothing else I will go back to the multi-cheepo timer set up that has worked fine in the past for me.

I will post updated Pics tonight.

[shovelrider]

New pics!
219193

219194

219196

219197

219198

[shovelrider]

Update: Tank is still doing good.
I'm moving slowly but the rocks are looking nice. I noticed the coralline is growing on the underside of the rock work so the stuff may be more of a low light coralline. But then again, it is all over my power heads.

[jeffmit]

Nice job on this setup! I like the DIY overflow!

How are you running your return? It looks like you have 1 drain and 1 emergency drain. Sorry, I can't see how you did your return line.

Great idea :)

[shovelrider]

My return is just a tube running up and over the edge of the tank with a return u-tube for direction.

[lancer22386]

:D RO/DI arrived this week. Started making water and it is faster than I expected. About 3g an hour with 4:1/waste:good at 50 psi and only about 100TDS going into the filter. I am impressed with the speed BRS shipped this and in the quality of the product. I would recommend BRS for RO/DI kits.

+1

<a href=http://s63.photobucket.com/albums/h134/focusturbo22386/?action=view&current=IMG_20130402_030936-1.jpg target=_blank><img src=http://i63.photobucket.com/albums/h134/focusturbo22386/IMG_20130402_030936-1.jpg border=0 alt=></a>:beer:

[lancer22386]

Update: Tank is still doing good.
I'm moving slowly but the rocks are looking nice. I noticed the coralline is growing on the underside of the rock work so the stuff may be more of a low light coralline. But then again, it is all over my power heads.how do you get coralline to grow? I never had a reef tank only fish only, I want to go reef. I got 100 lbs of live rock with none on it I did get a turbo sail with some one it in and been using purple up

[shovelrider]

You have to "seed" the tank with a rock that has coralline on it. Coralline spreads by spores released into water column. To speed the process up you can scrape the coralline with a razor and let the scrapings settle into your other rocks.

[shovelrider]

Purple Up works but slowly. You would be better off with a two part additive like B-Ionic. But, you have to do water tests to see if your parameters are right for optimum growth.

[HillbillyYoda]

This is what I've been looking for. My tank dimensions are a little uncommon. With the tank being 12" wide and 12" deep, a glass overflow is a little tricky for me. Shovelrider - that's a great job. I went to Lowe's today and bought a large sheet of glass, only problem I'm coming up with is the thickness. I may have to double the glass with silicone to give it enough support. I bought a glass cutter there too. Any suggestions as to what the dimensions should be??

[HillbillyYoda]

...http://imageshack.us/a/img33/2377/33gal48x12x12.jpg

[reefermad619]

Make the dimensions whatever you need them to be. I'd say at least enough room to get in there to put elbows in. If you bought a sheet of glass from lowes, it probably 1/8" thick. Which is really only used for picture frames. You can use it for the overflow with no problems. Most of the weight will be supported by the water inside the tank. If going external overflow, I'd use 1/4". The prob with 1/8" glass is that it break easily. So as long as you careful you should be good.

[shovelrider]

HillbillyYoda, Thanks for the complement. How tall is the tank? I also agree with reefermad that the glass from Lowes is probably fragile, but if your careful you will be fine.
Tip - after cutting the glass to size, sand the edges a little so you don't get cut.

As for the size of the overflow, it is really about the size of the pipes that matter if flow is a concern. Otherwise, the longer the overflow weir, the better. It is up to you though, you will have to adjust the size for what you think looks good compared to function.
Good luck with the build!