Need Plumbing Advice - Herbie or Durso with Emergency

[Patrick Cox]

I am building a new 75G aquarium. Dimensions are 36x24x20. The tank will be rimless with an external glass overflow box. The external overflow box will be drilled with 2 1" drains in the bottom and then I will have two 3/4" returns into the back of the tank. Down below I will be running a roughly 20G water volume sump and refugium. The drain water will dump into a filter sock in the skimmer section and then I will feed my fuge by splitting my return.

I have attached a drawing of the tank dimensions. One error in the drawing is that the 17" dimension and the 4.5" dimension of the overflow box are internal dimensions.

My question is regarding the best way to plumb this tank. I was thinking either a Herbie setup with a gate valve below the main drain or just a durso with an emergency drain. My one concern with the Herbie is that I have read a lot about the need to adjust the valve below the main drain due to a fluctuating water level in the overflow box. In my current tank I have one durso drain and I have never had any issues with water levels in my overflow box. Also I feel like the noise level in my current tank is fairly low so I am trying to decide if a Herbie is worth the extra effort. But I do know that I will have an emergency drain.

Thanks for your suggestions and I can provide additional information if needed!

http://www.pcoxphoto.com/photos/i-7cNBb8r/0/L/i-7cNBb8r-L.jpg

[tidewater]

Why not go bean animal? Dead silent and fail safe.

[Herbie]

You can almost completely eliminate the need for constant adjustment when using the "herbie" overflow, by letting the slightest amount of water trickle down the emergency overflow. Dont worry, it will still be silent and completely safe. Been running the emergency drains this way for years, no issues. The slight trickle of water is just a little buffer for the gate valve adjustment.
Btw, the "herbie" overflow is quite simple to plumb, and worth the extra effort.

HTH,
Herbie

[SGT_York]

A Herbie is certainly worth the extra effort, Guaranteed dead silent. But your current design will fit the Bean Animal method better. (the two can be mixed to form a hybrid system)

The bean is better as it uses the second drain to establish the overflow height. The Herbie uses gravity and pressure to push more water through until an equilibrium is met. The Bean you reduce the flow until water flows through the second line. The Herbie works with pre-drilled tanks. The Bean works but is more difficult.

My recommendation is to use three 1" lines one Durso, one Emergency, and one Herbie Style syphon as it's easier. You can use the down 90 version (bean) if you want to regulate the level of the overflow box during power outages.

One more item to consider is the syphon line is prone to sucking in small inverts make sure you have adequate protection (my snails kept climbing over the overflow wall) So I put a 1.5" strainer on my herbie style, would have been far more difficult with the bean method (I believe bean used the bottom of his coast to coast to eliminate this problem)

My setup is a 120G dual overflow AGA. 3/4" is the syphon running at 90% durso taking about 20% of the flow, emergency line is on the other overflow and is only used when the syphon gets clogged loud sounds tell me it's time for a cleaning. Would have been a problem both times the snails found their way into the syphon. The other 1" is for my closed loop. Downside is my CL needs to have less flow than my sump (I also increased the overflow wall flow to that side)

[tidewater]

My bean animal was super simple. The second line is for fluctuation in the pump and water movement, the third is the emergency. I set it and forget it.

[Patrick Cox]

Why not go bean animal? Dead silent and fail safe.

When I first ordered my tank, I hadn't really read a lot about the Bean so I asked for only two drain holes in my overflow box, one primary and one emergency. I am going to get with my builder to see if I can add a third hole if that is really the best option. Still haven't made up my mind but the concept makes sense. Thanks.

[Patrick Cox]

You can almost completely eliminate the need for constant adjustment when using the "herbie" overflow, by letting the slightest amount of water trickle down the emergency overflow. Dont worry, it will still be silent and completely safe. Been running the emergency drains this way for years, no issues. The slight trickle of water is just a little buffer for the gate valve adjustment.
Btw, the "herbie" overflow is quite simple to plumb, and worth the extra effort.

HTH,
Herbie

Thanks for your reply Herbie. Do you think this is still an option with 2 equally sized drains? I understand if the emergency drain is larger than the primary but what if they are equal? I guess the likely blockage scenario would not be a completely sealed off primary drain line but rather a partially obstructed drain so the emergency drain would not likely need to handle the full drain load?

[SGT_York]

Only two will work fine, Herbie's design was based on pre-drilled tanks with only two holes. Just make sure nothing will clog the syphon and do just like he says "by letting the slightest amount of water trickle down the emergency overflow." The reason the syphon is a higher risk for clogging is because of the gate valve. You certainly will have a much quieter system and less micro bubbles by using the syphon.

Oh and Thanks Herbie my wife would have put the keibosh on my tank without your silent method long ago!

[Herbie]

Thanks for your reply Herbie. Do you think this is still an option with 2 equally sized drains? I understand if the emergency drain is larger than the primary but what if they are equal? I guess the likely blockage scenario would not be a completely sealed off primary drain line but rather a partially obstructed drain so the emergency drain would not likely need to handle the full drain load?

The drains will be fine if they are equally sized.
In theory, the gated drain with no air being drawn in can flow more water, but in reality since it is being dialed back it will not be at full capacity anyway. An equal sized emergency drain will work fine, even in the event of a 100% blockage of the main (gated) drain, it will be able to hande the flow.

If you are custom building the tank, it cant hurt to go with an extra hole and adopt the Bean method wich is very simliar, and can be considered safer due to the extra drain capacity. Will the extra hole give you some more piece of mind ? Your call, but I have yet to hear of anyone having a "flood" situation when using the Herbie method properly plumbed. You could always drill as many holes as you want if it makes you feel safer, lol. It all relative.

In a nutshell, the herbie overflow method works great, and is really designed for "off the shelf" reef ready tanks. If you are building a custom tank, the Bean method can be considered safer because of the redundancy of the extra drain capacity.

Herbie

[Herbie]

Oh and Thanks Herbie my wife would have put the keibosh on my tank without your silent method long ago!

Thats the whole reason why I racking my brain way back then, trying to quiet down my tank, lol. The wife was not happy at how loud it was. :uhoh3:. Being in the living room, I guss I really couldnt blame her. :D .

Herbie

[shaggss]

Hi Herbie! A big thank you from me too! I have had ZERO trouble with your drain, it's so simple and dead silent.

[wildman926]

Thats the whole reason why I racking my brain way back then, trying to quiet down my tank, lol. The wife was not happy at how loud it was. :uhoh3:. Being in the living room, I guss I really couldnt blame her. :D .

Herbie

Dead silent. I used plastic screening and a bioball to ensure nothing clogs. When food, algae, etc. clogs screen, it will "slurp" letting me know it is time to clean. You can click on the pic to see the video.

http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s86/wildman926/Aquariums/New%20110/th_7cecfdf1.jpg (http://s150.photobucket.com/albums/s86/wildman926/Aquariums/New%20110/?action=view&current=7cecfdf1.mp4)

[LeslieP]

Hi Herbie,
Would you post the link to your design? I think I have it but I'm not quite sure. I have a 75G with a single overflow and two drains and was planning on using the Herbie design.
Thank you!

[Herbie]

Hi Herbie,
Would you post the link to your design? I think I have it but I'm not quite sure. I have a 75G with a single overflow and two drains and was planning on using the Herbie design.
Thank you!

Bulk Reef Supply has a great video that nicely describes how to set-up a "Herbie" overflow. Check it out ............
https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/index.php/video/index/view/id/84

Also, if you really like to read.........here is the original thread, should take you a few days, lol.
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=344892

HTH, Its really quite simple and effective.
Herbie