Added sump...tank crashing...????

[Wills612]

On sat. I installed a 10g sump on my 29g using a hob overflow. I was previously using a modded ac110. On Sunday I noticed my green slimer and horn coral completely bleached. I thought they might have been slightly shaded by the ac110, so I chalked it up as a loss. I also noticed all my lps and zoas looked p-off. I lowered the intensity of my leds and did a 5g wc. Today, arriving home from work my 3 monti frags were almost completely bleached and lps and softies still ticked off. I did another 10g wc, and tested parameters. (Ph-8.2, ca-410,alk-9.0, mg-1400, phos- .175api, trates-0, ammo-0)

I used ge II 100% silicone let cure for 24 hours dry, 24 hours ro/di. I have also added carbon. Anything else I should do? Also nass. Snails are alive but just sitting on sand. 2 clowns look fine and other inverts look ok. Thanks

[YoungREEFA]

GE II is toxic!!!!!!! You need the ge #1!! im pretty sure that kind uses mold inhibiters.

[Wills612]

Ok, I jut took the sump off-line to be safe. Added the carbon to the display and will give time some time. I'm thinking I should just build another sump and use aquarium safe silicone, rather than debate and read through the debates of wether ge II is safe or not. I will continue daily 5g wc.

[Wills612]

Anything else i could do beside carbon and water changes? Starting new sump tomorrow.

[thegrun]

GE-I is reef safe, GE-II is not (it has anti-bacterial and mold additives which will kill off your beneficial bacteria). You are going to have reduced biological filtration for a while, so go light on feeding and no new livestock for a month.

[Wills612]

So I have taken out the sump an removed all silicone and re-did with marineland stuff. Going to let it cure for a couple days. I'm running carbon and bio-chem zorb also. Corals seem to be doing a little better zoas opening up a little, and no more deaths. My question is what would any long term issues be? could the toxins be trapped in lr or sand?

[Wills612]

Yea the tube said nothing about mold or anything just 100% silicone. I re-did the sump with aquarium silicone on the side of caution.

[plasmacon]

It sounds like you are rushing things a bit. I don't remember about which silicone has the mold inhibitors etc, but it sounds like you solved that. You still need to slow down some. Building a sump one day and putting it online the next is not good husbandry.

There is no reason to rush. Take your time. Give the silicone a couple of days to cure and degas. Use a fan if needed. Then soak the sump for a couple of days in fresh water with flow and heat. Once it's "ready", put it in position with tank water, heater, and flow for about a week. Drop a piece of live rock rubble inside and give it a week to build up a biofilm. You can shock the system by not having enough biofilm established. Some sensitive corals don't like swings in pH or alkalinity etc. Some can live through live rock curing, but the main point is to slow down. The only things that happen fast in this hobby are bad.

[YoungREEFA]

Let it cure for two weeks, its still sticky inside and will leach into the water

[Wills612]

It sounds like you are rushing things a bit. I don't remember about which silicone has the mold inhibitors etc, but it sounds like you solved that. You still need to slow down some. Building a sump one day and putting it online the next is not good husbandry.

There is no reason to rush. Take your time. Give the silicone a couple of days to cure and degas. Use a fan if needed. Then soak the sump for a couple of days in fresh water with flow and heat. Once it's "ready", put it in position with tank water, heater, and flow for about a week. Drop a piece of live rock rubble inside and give it a week to build up a biofilm. You can shock the system by not having enough biofilm established. Some sensitive corals don't like swings in pH or alkalinity etc. Some can live through live rock curing, but the main point is to slow down. The only things that happen fast in this hobby are bad.

I like the idea of cycling the sump with a piece of lr. As far as taking it to fast, I should have waited a little long but I figured 48 hours to be enough. The tank has been running for almost 3 years, I don't think adding 7 gallons of water would "shock the system". No there new equipment was added besides the sump and return pump. And all that was in my hob fuge was lr rubble and chaeto which was transferred to sump.

[plasmacon]

The reason I mentioned shock is because of surface area, not water. We do water changes all the time. What I meant was for dry rock mostly. Every surface that you add to the system will eventually be colonized by a slimy layer of life. Putting in too much dead surface area at one time can cause an upset with alkalinity and pH. Now typically this is due to the extremelly large area that makes up most dry rock. Typically when people put a refugium online, it's starts with dry rock, unless they are lucky enough to have spare living base rock. The refugium is normally located in their sump. I didn't know what you had planned, but I thought I would mention it anyway.

Whenever I add dry rock to a system, to replace rock Ive stolen or whatever, I run it in another tank to build the slim layer first. It is just a little extra precaution that I take. Putting a 10 gallon tank online in a 30 gallon system could end up being a large surface area, but you are using live rock, so you are good.

[dublo8]

Most silicon when curing will create ammonia during the curing process. This is your problem and it typically needs 48 hours cure time (temperature differentiations can change this) *a week to be safe*. Just like the poster mentioned before and to be clear to others. GE II is not reef safe.

I see you fixed your mistake and re-built the sump but I would let it sit for a couple days and also run some fresh water through it for a night to make sure you got all the nasty out.

[Wills612]

Thanks everyone for your help. I'm going to let it cure for dbl the marineland recommended time(48h), then flush with fw for a few hours,and let ro/di circulate for a day or so.

My zoas have started to come around, lps still p-offed, and a couple pieces of sps still hangin in there. 2 clowns seem uneffected.

[jimmyj7090]

GE II is toxic!!!!!!! You need the ge #1!! im pretty sure that kind uses mold inhibiters.

It's toxic when you don't cure it long enough. GE II needs at least a week, preferably more like 2 or 3 before it's fully cured.

Take the sump offline and run a lot of carbon.

[lmsmith]

I wouldn't worry about circulating RO for a day - I'd be more inclined to let it cure for an extra day.

[Wills612]

It's toxic when you don't cure it long enough. GE II needs at least a week, preferably more like 2 or 3 before it's fully cured.

Take the sump offline and run a lot of carbon.

Sump is offline and running carbon and some API chemi zorb stuff.

[jimmyj7090]

Sorry, got called to eat before reading the rest of the thread. Good luck, I made the same mistake once, stressed the tank out but pretty much everything did recover.

[Wills612]

Np jimmy, good to hear something similar happen and tank recovered.

[Wills612]

All sps has bleached and been removed from tank, bummer but all frags, at least no big pieces. Loosing a favia, frogspawn and hammer, but so far my large reverse eye prism Favia is looking ok. Zoas and pallys are starting to open normally, goniopora that I've had for 9 months is showing about half mass, but looking semi healthy with no tissue loss. The Favia, hammer, and frogspawn, i mentioned earlier seem to be melting showing skeleton around around the perimeter and quickly moving inward. Would it benefit for a revive dip? I'm thinking there on their way out so don't really have much to loose.

[plasmacon]

I would not stress them anymore. I would just leave them be. Keep an eye on ammonia and nitrite. Keep up with small water changes if you think it's needed. Remove any loose and dead tissues. Your CUC should cover it. Change out fresh activated carbon everyday two days for a week or more. Sorry to hear about this...

Save what you can. Let us know what happens in a week or two if you remember to post on this thread. Remember, take your time and let stuff circulate with fresh tap water before you put stuff online. Run tank water for at least 7 days to break in large additions, especially dry base rock. Bad things happen fast, so take your time.

[Wills612]

So a couple weeks later, I think everything has leveled back out. Lost all sps, lps recovering, and zoas and plays recovered. I got the new sump up and running and all seems well now. Couple pics of the tank and sump.

213539213540213541