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View Full Version : Cross Hatch passed away from Live Aquaria


AJsTank
03/19/2013, 11:32 PM
I got it from Divers Den. The box was smashed. There was 3 inches of water in the bag because it was torn. Fed Ex documented it and I took pictures. I could not acclimate because there was no water in the bag, so I put it into my tank. Personally, I don't think the fish ever recovered from it. I could not get it to eat anything but live ghost shrimp and it barely did that. I tried clams on a half shell, silver sides, krill, brine, 2 kinds of mysis, many kinds of dry foods and I even went to the deli and tried some fresh seafood like Live Aquaria recommended. It would not eat. It's basically been slowly dying for 2 months. I've been doing this for 10 years and if I didn't have the knowledge and confidence to keep a 600 dollar fish, I wouldn't have purchased it. I'm really annoyed at the moment... I called them right after it happened and they documented it and said they would extend my warranty past the 14 days. I just contacted Live Aquaria again and they told me that I was supposed to call them every week and tell them that it was not eating, and since I did not call them on a weekly basis, they voided the extended warranty. The reason I didn't call them is because the FISH WAS ALIVE!! AND they never told me to call every week or else I would have. ESPECIALLY cause it was such an expensive fish. I kind of feel like I was put between a rock and a hard spot. What was I supposed to do? Send the fish back? I got it when it was half dead, I tried to nurse it back to health. I spent nearly a $100 on foods trying to get it to eat and then it dies a slow death. I have had incredible good luck with Live Aquaria in the past, so it disappoints me that they basically told me too bad. Honestly, I'm not upset about them not giving me a new fish or giving me a refund, I'm super annoyed at how badly they handled the situation and how they didn't care. So yeah, there's my rant for the day. haha

Dapg8gt
03/19/2013, 11:37 PM
I would be upset.. You think they would have been more clear on the weekly calling thing but I see where they are coming from.. They know nothing about you or your tank so I kinda don't blame them for it but they should have handled the initial contact different IMO..

AJsTank
03/19/2013, 11:42 PM
I would be upset.. You think they would have been more clear on the weekly calling thing but I see where they are coming from.. They know nothing about you or your tank so I kinda don't blame them for it but they should have handled the initial contact different IMO..

I have all my water parameters measured every week and 10% water changes done every week as well. The tank is monitored really closely and I discussed it with Live Aquaria. I even offered to send them water samples and I have all my records of dosing, water changes and parameters through a 3rd party. I offered it to them, but they declined. They just said "You needed to call us every week or else it voids the extended warranty, so we can't do anything".

AJsTank
03/19/2013, 11:44 PM
And I'm not saying, do not buy from them. I actually will always buy from them, because I've had amazing luck in the past, but I'm just annoyed at the way the handled my situation with the fish. I felt screwed because I got a half dead fish and I tried everything in my power to get it turned around, but it wasn't going to happen.

Dapg8gt
03/20/2013, 12:05 AM
I would be upset too and with all you say you did I'm sure if they told you you had to call weekly you would have. Me personally never order fish online but I have good stores around me. I just can't get over the stories I hear about by a friend that works for UPS and the added stress of yet another shipment after the numerous they have already gone thru. That's just my opinion though and I'm sure if I didn't have any good stores I would be ordering from them also.

I think your right to feel the way you do especially the money you paid and if It was me next time you order and you have any issues be that guy who calls every few days to keep them in the loop and annoy them LOL..

ladyshark
03/20/2013, 12:14 AM
Sorry to hear this. Must be very upsetting to work so hard and lose the fish.

AJsTank
03/20/2013, 12:25 AM
Sorry to hear this. Must be very upsetting to work so hard and lose the fish.

Yeah, I'm more upset about losing the fish than anything, I guess. I would do the same thing for a $5 fish, like most people here on this forum.

Ostara
03/20/2013, 01:07 AM
I have had incredible good luck with Live Aquaria in the past, so it disappoints me that they basically told me too bad.

I had them tell me pretty much the same thing in a similar situation. They extended the warranty for a week on a fish that was skinny and clearly hadn't been eating with them. A few days after the three week mark it died and their response was basically "Sorry, sometimes fish don't eat." Super helpful. :facepalm:

I'm sorry to hear about your loss. I agree about continuing to use them; I do even though I have had several less-than-satisfying experiences with them. I've had plenty more experiences that were great, so I'll continue to order from them.

AJsTank
03/20/2013, 06:06 AM
I had them tell me pretty much the same thing in a similar situation. They extended the warranty for a week on a fish that was skinny and clearly hadn't been eating with them. A few days after the three week mark it died and their response was basically "Sorry, sometimes fish don't eat." Super helpful. :facepalm:

I'm sorry to hear about your loss. I agree about continuing to use them; I do even though I have had several less-than-satisfying experiences with them. I've had plenty more experiences that were great, so I'll continue to order from them.

If the fish flat out did not eat, I probably would not have called. But because I received it in bad shape, I addressed the situation.

PinkPunisher
03/20/2013, 07:09 AM
Unfortunately your only real option would have been to send it back to them immediately. Then wait for them to either send you another one, or (assuming it didn't die in transit to them) have them try to nurse it back and send it to you on a later date (also assuming they could nurse it back).

Maybe I'm considered cheap but when its $600 on the line I would have been trying to recoup my money by sending it back them as soon as possible. Though I do applaud you for attempting to save it, so please don't feel offended by my comment.

AJsTank
03/20/2013, 07:17 AM
Unfortunately your only real option would have been to send it back to them immediately. Then wait for them to either send you another one, or (assuming it didn't die in transit to them) have them try to nurse it back and send it to you on a later date (also assuming they could nurse it back).

Maybe I'm considered cheap but when its $600 on the line I would have been trying to recoup my money by sending it back them as soon as possible. Though I do applaud you for attempting to save it, so please don't feel offended by my comment.

If a fish shows up and the package is damaged, they instruct you to take it, keep them informed on a weekly basis (Which I know now that it's supposed to be weekly). There is no way I could have shipped it back. The box it came in was smashed. It looked like it had been run over or hit with a fork lift or something. The bag, sitting on the ground was about 1-2 inches of water and when you lift the bag in the air, it was about 3 inches of water. Barely enough for the fish to not be tipped on the side. Ethically, there was no way I could turn it away. Money wasn't what I was thinking about at the time. I really thought it was going to be okay, but it just would not eat. I think the shock of the shipping like that did so much damage to the fish, that it was destined for death.

PinkPunisher
03/20/2013, 07:31 AM
Obviously a new box and bag would be required. What my comment meant to say (which I should have included) was that I would contact them upon receiving the animal, and see how they would want me to go about shipping it back to them. Whether that be holding the animal for a few days until a better day during the week, or simply rebagging it with your water and sending it out. I don't know, I'm not LiveAquaria.

If you were to just refuse the package because of the damages that would clearly ensure the death of fish; I would not be able to just refuse it either though.

So then does that mean if you had been properly notified of the weekly updates and the fish still passed, you would receive a refund/a new fish in place of the one that passed or would you still be stuck in your current position?

AJsTank
03/20/2013, 07:45 AM
Obviously a new box and bag would be required. What my comment meant to say (which I should have included) was that I would contact them upon receiving the animal, and see how they would want me to go about shipping it back to them. Whether that be holding the animal for a few days until a better day during the week, or simply rebagging it with your water and sending it out. I don't know, I'm not LiveAquaria.

If you were to just refuse the package because of the damages that would clearly ensure the death of fish; I would not be able to just refuse it either though.

So then does that mean if you had been properly notified of the weekly updates and the fish still passed, you would receive a refund/a new fish in place of the one that passed or would you still be stuck in your current position?

If I would have notified them on a weekly basis and elf them know, "the fish is eating, but it's dying". They would have refunded me the money. But because I never called them on a weekly basis, they cannot warranty the fish. I didn't call because the fish was alive. I just didn't think to call to tell them it was alive. I notified them in the first place thinking it was okay. My mistake, I guess.

AJsTank
03/20/2013, 07:46 AM
I can't do anything at this point. At least the lady told me to have a nice day at the end of the call.

Irenicus
03/20/2013, 07:52 AM
I've bought a few high end fish through Diver's Den and LiveAquaria. They've always been good to extend my warranty. One HTusk I received was blind; another arrived in a smashed box with leaking water.

It's probably a tough call if there was no communication between you and the Diver's Den. Putting myself in their shoes... when do you call determine when a warranty has been completed and when it needs to be extended. Because it was such a high dollar purchase, perhaps there should have been better communication from the representative.

I'd call again and speak to someone who has more discretion. Maybe you can get a partial credit? They are a good company and have always shown to me to be reasonable.

gsiegel
03/20/2013, 08:04 AM
Yeah, I'm more upset about losing the fish than anything, I guess. I would do the same thing for a $5 fish, like most people here on this forum.

That sucks! For what it's worth did you try talking with one of the higher ups there? - explain you and many you know (all of us) order from them all the time - maybe a manager has more authority and take care of you. I would throw out there that the only reason you purchase from them is due to their great service and history, as well as recommendations from others from this forum. Hopefully insinuating some bad publicity for them will get them to do the right thing.

Sorry for your loss.

geaux xman
03/20/2013, 08:18 AM
Sounds like they didn't hear from you for about a month?

sorry for the loss..

AJsTank
03/20/2013, 08:22 AM
Sounds like they didn't hear from you for about a month?

sorry for the loss..

Yup. My mistake, I guess. Lesson learned. I thought by contacting them, that would be enough. I didn't think in my mind that I needed to call if the fish was still alive and I was nursing it. I understand where they are coming from. They just don't understand my end.

MrTuskfish
03/20/2013, 10:10 AM
Fed-Ex damaged the box & probably the bag. Get them involved too.

indyjaco
03/20/2013, 10:17 AM
I would have more rage at Fedex then LA. The fish would have been fine if Fed Ex didn't attempt to kill it.

AJsTank
03/20/2013, 11:17 AM
I would have more rage at Fedex then LA. The fish would have been fine if Fed Ex didn't attempt to kill it.

But shouldn't that be a claim with LA? I would think they would be the ones who would have to make a claim. I can't imagine going back to Fed-Ex now and trying to explain what happened. They did document it though. I know that. The lady who delivered it felt really bad and she watched me pull the fish out.

humaguy
03/20/2013, 11:18 AM
absolutely also a Fed Ex issue....la/dd, I am assuming dd because it was a ch, was generous to extend the warranty...I had the same thing happen with an Interrupta delivery and called the vendor every day until I lost the fish as I wanted a clear record- a month is a long time to wait...tough situation...sorry...

humaguy
03/20/2013, 11:32 AM
But shouldn't that be a claim with LA? I would think they would be the ones who would have to make a claim. I can't imagine going back to Fed-Ex now and trying to explain what happened. They did document it though. I know that. The lady who delivered it felt really bad and she watched me pull the fish out.

They did a great thing by extending the warranty...we all know them very well and I bet if you had kept in touch with them they would have done something when you lost the fish...in fairness to them- how long should they be responsible for dying livestock? also, the fish held on for two months- which might mean it wasn't necessarily a result of the shipping incident...just my.02...very sorry the fish was lost, that is the shame...

MrTuskfish
03/20/2013, 12:20 PM
But shouldn't that be a claim with LA? I would think they would be the ones who would have to make a claim. I can't imagine going back to Fed-Ex now and trying to explain what happened. They did document it though. I know that. The lady who delivered it felt really bad and she watched me pull the fish out.
I wouldn't care if she felt bad. There is obvious liability with Fed-Ex. LA would have a claim against Fed-Ex if the fish died and was reimbursed under the terms of the guarantee. You kept the fish for so long, with no progress reports to LA, that there is no real evidence that either LA or Fed-Ex did anything wrong. But I'd still file a claim with Fed-Ex and nicely ask LA for help in doing so. You kept a fish for at least 2 months+, who knows what happened? Drag this out farther. What if the fish died at 6 months, one year, two years? Knowing the DFS companies; I think you may have been reimbursed if you kept them informed.

MrTuskfish
03/20/2013, 12:25 PM
I would be upset too and with all you say you did I'm sure if they told you you had to call weekly you would have. Me personally never order fish online but I have good stores around me. I just can't get over the stories I hear about by a friend that works for UPS and the added stress of yet another shipment after the numerous they have already gone thru. That's just my opinion though and I'm sure if I didn't have any good stores I would be ordering from them also.

I think your right to feel the way you do especially the money you paid and if It was me next time you order and you have any issues be that guy who calls every few days to keep them in the loop and annoy them LOL..

Just for the record; LA & DD use Fed-EX, not UPS. IMO & IME, Fed-Ex is much better with fragile and time-sensitive packages.

Rapide
03/20/2013, 12:43 PM
I have worked with UPS and I was disgusted by the way they handle the parcels!!
If possible, I never ever EVER have anything shipped via a delivery company. Once I had some fishes shipped from Germany (24h shipment) and they arrived barely alive... All died in a week. The shipping water was freezing cold. I have got dead corals for 1000€ carried to my door, and the answer has been "Ok, so?" from the deliverer AND the sender! You are lucky to have a company like the Diver's Den...

ladyshark
03/22/2013, 08:53 PM
Following this thread, very upsetting. I don't think it would hurt to try to get FEDEX on the hook for this. Not sure but worth a try. I agree that a talk to a supervisor and emphsizing all the business you give them, that you have never tried returns or refunds before, might get you somewhere, in terms of a partial refund--they want good will. If you look on liveaquaria, thier "in stock" inventory is a lot smaller than I remember in years past. Gotta think the economy has affected them and that they would want to please good customers.

Also, isn't there a vendors form with LA as a listed vendor? Maybe we should transfer this thread to the LA vendor forum and let them know that a lot of their good and repeat customers are unhappy about this.

MrTuskfish
03/23/2013, 08:49 AM
Following this thread, very upsetting. I don't think it would hurt to try to get FEDEX on the hook for this. Not sure but worth a try. I agree that a talk to a supervisor and emphsizing all the business you give them, that you have never tried returns or refunds before, might get you somewhere, in terms of a partial refund--they want good will. If you look on liveaquaria, thier "in stock" inventory is a lot smaller than I remember in years past. Gotta think the economy has affected them and that they would want to please good customers.

Also, isn't there a vendors form with LA as a listed vendor? Maybe we should transfer this thread to the LA vendor forum and let them know that a lot of their good and repeat customers are unhappy about this.

Sure, I hate to see the fish lost. But what did LA do that contributed to the loss? They offer a 14 day guarantee, extended it, the damage was caused by Fed-Ex handling and the OP never contacted LA until the fish died. Over a month later.

Jasanden
03/23/2013, 09:30 AM
Idk. I just went thru a claim with fed ex. My package was 24hrs. Late and damaged. Fed ex told me to file a claim which I did immediately. After jumping thru hoops for 2 months talking to multiple different people with fed ex they told me they don't handle claims with live fish. The told me I needed to make a claim with LA. So I called LA and they told me I should have contacted them 2 months ago the best they could do was a $50 credit. I didn't think it was LA s problem and was great full for the $50 cred on a $200 loss but really wanted Fed Ex to make good on there end. :(

Charfish
03/23/2013, 09:31 AM
sounds like a bummer deal...you definitely have your bad karma bill paid up...sorry

jaybfresh
03/23/2013, 11:33 AM
I might be wrong, but I don't think fedex will offer any sort of insurance for live animals

MrTuskfish
03/23/2013, 02:08 PM
I might be wrong, but I don't think fedex will offer any sort of insurance for live animals

I'm sure you're right. I wasn't all there when I posted above. If they did; there would be such a big surcharge that would make shipping live fish much more expensive. Makes sense; LA (or any live whatever dealer) covers loss with a "arrive alive " . LA/DD extends the "arrive alive" to 14 days and will add time in unusual cases, like this one. I've never known any company, in any field, that goes to such great lengths as the DFS group does.

These forums spread info instantly among specialty groups (like fish-geeks) and I'm sure this encourages competition. But I've done business with DFS companies since well before anyone shopped online and they have always been at the top of any customer service list.

rayn
03/23/2013, 02:58 PM
Fed-Ex damaged the box & probably the bag. Get them involved too.

Kinda surprised this took this long to be said, was my first thought. I understand trying to save the fish, but you can bet it didn't leave DD crushed and leaking water. That makes it FedEx fault. I would contact DD/LA and either have them start a claim or work with them to make a claim on FedEx.

MrTuskfish
03/24/2013, 08:53 AM
Kinda surprised this took this long to be said, was my first thought. I understand trying to save the fish, but you can bet it didn't leave DD crushed and leaking water. That makes it FedEx fault. I would contact DD/LA and either have them start a claim or work with them to make a claim on FedEx.

I'm sure that Fed-Ex has wording in their shipping contracts that exempts damage to livestock.

AJsTank
03/24/2013, 04:54 PM
Kinda surprised this took this long to be said, was my first thought. I understand trying to save the fish, but you can bet it didn't leave DD crushed and leaking water. That makes it FedEx fault. I would contact DD/LA and either have them start a claim or work with them to make a claim on FedEx.

I know it wasn't DD. The Fed Ex delivery gal felt really bad and she documented it. She said it was most likely done at the warehouse in Salt Lake City.

rpjaws74
03/24/2013, 09:47 PM
To put any kind of claim exceeding $100 on any damaged pkg with FedEx the shipper would have to purchase insurance which I doubt they do. Because its expensive for Live animals! Just an FYI

MrTuskfish
03/25/2013, 01:13 PM
To put any kind of claim exceeding $100 on any damaged pkg with FedEx the shipper would have to purchase insurance which I doubt they do. Because its expensive for Live animals! Just an FYI

The guarantee vendors offer would make any insurance totally unnecessary and the buyer isn't going to get reimbursed twice if the fish is DOA.