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View Full Version : another unfortunate noob post about loss of fish...with questions?


mkalbi
03/27/2013, 09:20 AM
sorry for the long post but wanted to give as much info as possible

tank info
tank size 59 gal. ,60-70# lr, 60# sand, no sump, aquac hob protein skimmer,
eheim canister filter (no media, using for additional water circulation mostly), t5 lighting

stock list (fish now deceased :( ):
2 tomato clowns
1 diadema dottyback
1 yellow tail damsel
1 coral beauty
3 peppermint shrimp
1 coral banded shrimp
10-15 hermit crabs
3 nassarius snails
1 serpent starfish
bunch of mushroom corals
1 xenia coral

tank has been up and running since January 1, 2013. cycle completed around 2/6/13.
did not add any fish until Feb 18: (2 clowns, damsel, dottyback which were transferred from old tank)
Keep weekly log and all levels were pretty stable, average:
78-79 deg / 1.024-1.025 salinity / 440-480 calcium / 143.2 kh / .5 phos /8.4 ph / 0 nitrate,nitirite,amonia

now the events leading to the demise.
Mar 4, 2013-i added the coral beauty and xenia coral. All was going well but she (?) was not eating a bunch. but she was eating all of the algae in the tank. i tried pellets, seaweed sheets, mysis shrimp, brine shrimp,& krill.
Mar 14, 2013- I used instant ocean reef accelerator to help feed xenia and mushrooms and trying to boost coraline algae
Mar 17, 2013- I added coral banded shrimp and also supplemented a dose of marine snow
Mar 19, 2013- discovered deceased coral beauty being munched on by peppermint shrimp, hermit crabs, and nassarius snails.
removed deceased fish. I initially attributed the death to starvation as there were no signs of visible disease/stress
ammonia and nitrate were tracing in test so i performed 10% water change
Mar 20, 2013 - dottyback and damsel showed immediate signs of stress after passing of coral beauty, cloudy eyes and deterioration fins.
Mar 22, 2013 - parameters back to acceptable level and both fish seemed to be rebounding
Mar 23, 2013 - all fish and inverts doing well and eating like at golden corale on a bender!
Mar 25, 2013 - came home from work to a dead clown, and damsel
removed them and did another water change
Mar 26, 2013 - last clown is barely hanging on. dottyback is missing. i think it is in a cave in one of the l/r.
not sure if it is alive or dead?
all inverts doing fine. removed canister filter to make sure it was not an "amonia factory"

Additional info as I know where this is heading...
- no i did not quarantine the coral beauty. my LFS held it in a separate isolated tank at their location for a week of observation.
- I do not have a hospital tank and it is probably too late for the last clown anyway.
- all research said i did not have to q/t the coral banded shrimp.

my questions:
- can coral banded shrimp introduce disease?
- could the cbs induce a level of stress that would cause this type of chain reaction?
- how long should i wait before adding any other new livestock? 2-3 weeks? if it was a parasite or other disease, i want to make sure it is dead.
- could the reef accelerator or marine show been the cause?
- if the dottyback is dead in a cave, how long before it will decay if i can't retrieve it?
- if i add a sump/refugium to my system, will that help down the road?

thanks for any input and please don't blast the noob! i am already disappointed and discouraged.

thegrun
03/27/2013, 09:36 AM
1. If is unlikely a CBS would introduce disease unless you also added the water it came in.
2. A coral banded shrimp may kill your fish, but not add enough stress for them to die from it.
3. Wait at least 8 weeks after the last is removed/dies. 10 weeks would be better.
4. I doubt the accelerator is the cause unless you overdosed, but I don't advocate using any supplement you are not testing for. I assume you did not see any increase in ammonia once you started using the marine snow.
5. Usually your CUC will dispatch of any fish carcass within 3 days, but if they can't get to it would probably take 2-3 weeks to decompose.
6. A sump would add stability to the tank but I do not believe it would have helped your current situation. You need to get a QT and use it, otherwise you place all your fish at risk.

Sk8r
03/27/2013, 10:40 AM
Green serpent star is a fishkiller, so is coral banded shrimp, and tomato clowns can be, in cramped circumstances. The tomatos belong in 100 gallon or more; everybody else should have been ok. The fish load was likely too much too soon. Schedule should be 1. end of cycle in Feb, 4 weeks CUC only, with fish in qt; March, add smallest fish, start new fish in qt; April, add second fish...etc.

thegrun
03/27/2013, 10:53 AM
Good catch Sk8r, I passed right over the serpent star.

mkalbi
03/27/2013, 11:32 AM
thanks to both of you. i'll wait until june before any fish additions. the serpent star, clowns, and damsel were together for about a year in my old tank prior to the move to this one. he/she has always been a model citizen as far as i can tell. I did not add the water from the cbs. already visiting the stickies for setting up a qt. thanks again.