Ordering 2 fish...help!

[LGB76]

I am preparing to order a tank bred Ocellaris and a yellow prawn goby. I was reading the acclimation guide on LA and I was thinking that leaving the fish in the shipping water/bag for 4-5 hours is an awful idea... should I just float then drop them into QT or should I get a batch of water set to the salanity the bag is and put them into the new water and then drip acclimate from the QT to match?

[wooden_reefer]

In general, the QT (hopefully) tank water will have a higher ph than that of the bag water. PH drops in the bag as CO2 accumulates. As you know, ammonia is much more toxic at higher ph. So it is entirely possible that ammonia in the bag can become more toxic even when diluted by the QT tank water.

So one thing you must not do when acclimating fish that has been in a bag for many hours is to drip high ph water into the bag, especially slowly. Not as bad but still not a good idea is to allow the bag to be open and than do nothing for a long time so that the CO2 can escape and the ph in the bag can rise.

[LGB76]

So I should just float the bag and then open it and then leave it sitting for a long time. Then start acclimating?

[dthorn]

I ordered from live aquaria once and followed their acclimation guide and lost 2 out of 3 fish before I could get them in the tank. Some people say not to acclimate mail order fish at all. Their reasoning is that ammonia in a sealed back is nontoxic, but instantly becomes deadly toxic ammonia when the bag was opened which sounds about right from the fish I watched die in the bucket. These people say to contact seller and get exact salinity from seller, and have your salinity matched before they arrive. Then float sealed bag to acclimate temp and put them in tank immediately without any acclimation to other parameters. Do not put any shipping water in tank.

If memory serves correctly this advice came from trusted sources on this forum. Also, the science about the ammonia becoming toxic the second you open the bag is definitely proven. Hopefully one of them will come along and confirm this. Take it as you will and do what seems most logical to you. Also, if you use this method and do have a casualty you would be wise to tell la that you followed their procedure so you don't void the guarantee. Also, note that matching salinity in advance will likely be the biggest factor deciding whether this works or not. Might also help to know that live aquaria uses reef crystals salt mix. They may be able to give you more information to ensure success like alkalinity, calcium, magnesium, ph, etc. If you could match everything then change in oxygen is the only change the fish could notice.

I will definitely use this method if I order from there again, pretty far trip to deliver to me doesn't help matters any. Happy reefing!

[Sk8r]

When you get the fish, float them in your quarantine tank 15 minutes for temperature equalization. Do not open the bag.

Your quarantine should be set to the salinity at which they ship: phone and ask them. THere will be no 'acclimation' if things are as they claim: and I am firmly convinced that acclimation has killed more fish than salinity change.

Now open one bag. Use a refractometer to do that check on the bag to be sure they didn't lie about the salinity and that your qt tank is 'on.'

Just take the fish in your hand (nonpoisonous) in the bag, and carefully, OVER the qt tank, let him gently into the water. Caution: they can jump high and wide. Close your hand firmly but gently.

Samething with fish #2.

Drip acclimate only if they were wrong about the salinity.

Leave your new fish in that qt for 4 weeks. You can breathe easy after 2: most disease will show up by then.

On week 3, bring the salinity in the qt up to match the tank. This gives a second chance for disease which may have been depressed by the lower salinity. If nothing breaks out, you're good to go in week four. Catch your fish, prevent their jumping, and gently let them free in their new home, which is (thanks to your quarantine) disease free, just like them.

[dthorn]

Thought I was quoting sk8r but wasn't positive. As I said from a very trusted source at rc! Lol

[Unome]

On week 3, bring the salinity in the qt up to match the tank. This gives a second chance for disease which may have been depressed by the lower salinity. Some people on here have advocated that you can take a gallon of water from display tank & put it in the QT every day and eventually you'll have the right salinity and the water parameters should almost be identical for both tanks.

[Spyderturbo007]

I use the method Sk8r wrote up for you. I did lose one fish during the process from what some forum members thought was pH shock. If I remember someone said that it might be a good idea to check pH to ensure it's close to that of the bag water (+/- 0.3).

As for bringing up the salinity, I just let it evaporate and then top off with saltwater. It normally takes about 2 weeks for things to come up where I want them, but that will vary based on the starting salinity of your place of purchase.

One thing I would recommend is an Ammonia Alert (http://www.petsmart.com/product/index.jsp?productId=11147371) for your QT. In my opinion, they are the best thing you can do for your livestock when they are in QT. It also makes your life much, much easier.

[LGB76]

so I should drip acclimate only if the salinity doesnt match, as in drip in the bag? or...

[Sk8r]

Exactly. But under NO circumstance allow any drip acclimation to take longer than 30 minutes.

PH shock in 'good' water is rare. I'm a little suspicious the lfs didn't want to say 'swallowed a bubble in shipment' or 'damaged during bagging' or 'caught using cyanide.' But they could be right, and with certain more fragile species it's a good idea to check everything you can possibly check.