Hanna Phosphate meter

[RxMike]

I have the hanna hand held phosphate meter. a few weeks ago i was testing my phosphate levels with my hanna and got a reading of 0.1. I decided to test the phos with my ELOS phosphate kit. the reading was 0.00 or 0.05. i took a sample to a local fish store and they used the millwakee phosphate meter and the reading was 0.04.

I thought it was a bad batch of reagent. Tried testing phosphtate with the hanna with a new batch of reagent and I got reallly weird readings 0.8 0.9
and I test water with ELOS showing 0.05

I am starting to think the ELOS is better than the hanna meter. I lost faith in the hanna meter.

Do you know if the millwakee is better? Hanna also makes a more expensive larger phosphate meter is better than the pocket versions?

[Quintis]

I also would like to know about this as I'm not too confident in my hanna phosphate tester. The numbers after consecutive testing vary too much for me.

[kaserpick]

I've always heard great things about Hanna's larger meter. It's been out much much longer than the checkers. I have a Hanna Checker as well. It was designed for hobbyists, so I didn't expect it to be super precise. I run the check with the reagent sample three times. You have to use both glass tubes for this. I then average the three readings together. They always fall within a range of 0.05ppm, so I think it's pretty accurate. My averaged readings always come out to be ~0.02ppm (it's an average of three samples so it's usually not a neat number, that's why I use the '~').

As a side note, make sure you're holding the button down after you've placed the reagent sample (C2) in it. I didn't read the directions well when I first got mine. I was getting very funky readings. :D

[jscarlata]

im in the same boat as the OP...my readings were always low, so low that i shut down GFO for about 2.5 weeks, then i get readings at .09, .1 etc. but if i repeat the test i get a varyance reading of .06, .05 etc. im going by the book with t mixing etc...
going to look into the other tests as well. maybe im doing somehting wrong, but i dont think so. i think that the metyer doesnt give enough time to propelry mix the reagent, 3 mins isnt enough IMO, even if you have the reagent poured out onto a card before you start the test so its ready to pour...

[ptreef]

My Hanna Phosphorus ULR is supposedly better than the phosphate as it reads lower range and more in the range we look for. I seem to pretty much always get 0 which is no way.....I think I have given up hope for these.

[Savoie83]

If you forget some powder in the bag, it will ~. Found it hard to get them all out sometime or throw a shot on the table lol.

[outssider]

a little after 2 minutes press and hold in the button. this will give you an additional 3 minutes as the timer counts down.

Milwaukee makes a meter that is nearly identical to the hanna. I doubt if it's any more accurate.

[Nanook]

[moved]

[shifty51008]

Dont forget these meters have a +/- of. 04 so if it reads, 06 it could actually be, 02 or. 1

[jscarlata]

So for sps tanks, where we want phosphate .03-.05 these meters are basically useless...
What gives more accurate readings? The ultra low phosphorous, Elos titration test, any othes?
Boy this is frustrating

[shifty51008]

From what i hear, the ultra low phosperous is better.

[ptreef]

So for sps tanks, where we want phosphate .03-.05 these meters are basically useless...
What gives more accurate readings? The ultra low phosphorous, Elos titration test, any othes?
Boy this is frustrating

From what i hear, the ultra low phosperous is better.

I have it and has pretty much read 0 for the last yr and half......
seemed to read right for first 6 mos or so. Tried different batches of reagent and still keep getting 0. I know it can't be that low.....

I gave up on the meter and just use coral colors and algae as the guide!!

[Chronicj7]

I have the ULR Phosphorus test kit and it has been relatively accurate for me. I too test 3 times with the same reagent/mixture and take the average as my reading. Usually between .02-.05 ppm. You will need to convert the ppb - ppm.

[RxMike]

When you say ULR unit is it a hanna meter?

[shifty51008]

Yes it is a hanna checker. It test phosphorus instead of phosphate so you have to do the calculations to read phosphate

[jscarlata]

How are you guys doing the test w the same sample 3x? 1 tube has tank water for step 1, and you just run the tested sample thru the machine 3x?

[ptreef]

How are you guys doing the test w the same sample 3x? 1 tube has tank water for step 1, and you just run the tested sample thru the machine 3x?

I have the ULR Phosphorus test kit and it has been relatively accurate for me. I too test 3 times with the same reagent/mixture and take the average as my reading. Usually between .02-.05 ppm. You will need to convert the ppb - ppm.

Yeah I'd like to hear your test process?

use one vial with just tank water, and then the other with the reagent and just simply run a full test 3x's with these same original vials from test 1?

[Shaummy]

Yeah I'd like to hear your test process?

use one vial with just tank water, and then the other with the reagent and just simply run a full test 3x's with these same original vials from test 1?

It adds some variation to the test by using a separate vial, but once you've gone through the regular "1 vial" test process, you can use the second vial with regular tank water (un-reacted) to zero out the meter again, but instead of doing another 3 minute wait, you press/release the button at C2 instead of holding it down for the 3 minute timer to start.

At least I think that's how you do a "read immediately" test with the checkers.

I have a problem with my Hanna ULR meter where the first reading (using the 3:00 timer) comes out way high, and when I run them through using the above, I get readings that are much closer to what I expect. I checked my water with my friends full size Hanna meter and it's closer to the 2nd, 3rd,4th readings than the first.

Anyone else have that happening?

[hoaglanddiver]

my hanna UL phosphorus usually shows around .08 ppB... a standard ppM meter would most likely show a 0 reading as .08ppB = .00008ppM

[jerpa]

my hanna UL phosphorus usually shows around .08 ppB... a standard ppM meter would most likely show a 0 reading as .08ppB = .00008ppM

The Hanna 736 doesn't have a resolution that low. It's resolution is 1 ppb with a margin of error of 5 ppb or .003 ppm and an error of .015 ppm phosphate.

[Shaummy]

specifically..I get readings similar to this:

1st test with 3 min timed - 24ppb phosphorus = ~.073 Phosphate
2nd test (2 vial immediate) - 12ppb phosphorus = ~.036 Phosphate
3rd test (2 vial immediate) - 14ppb phosphorus = ~.043 Phosphate
4th test (2 vial immediate) - 13ppb phosphorus = ~.039 Phosphate

I use PPB *3.066/1000 as the conversion.

If you add in the +/- .04 accuracy of the 736 meter then I'm in the ballpark with the 2-4 tests, but consistently high on the initial tests?

[Shaummy]

Anybody else seeing results like I am? Maybe I have a bad meter?

[jscarlata]

I wish there was a more reliable test for phosphate. I think it's one thing to use coral color and algal growth, but that's useful if your tank is already on track. For anyone trying to correct a tank that's a little off, high or low, having a tester that's not accurate or reliable is a real pain...

[LouH]

Anybody else seeing results like I am? Maybe I have a bad meter?

I just got the low range meter, and all of my tests show 0 ppb. I don't believe it.

[Shaummy]

That's actually how it started..I had a Cyano problem, so after a few attempts at lights out I decided I would give in and start GFO. Due to my test results still showing a consistent .06-.07 I couldn't figure out why GFO wasn't reducing Phos.

I switched out GFO media (probably too soon) because even the effluent showed the same .07 reading!

I borrowed a friends phosphate meter (not a checker) and it came back .01 and .02 so I now know my levels are actually quite low. I even tried new cuvette's to see if that was affecting the reading.

Then I read on RC here where someone had this issue, but nothing was resolved. I'm going to get a new set of reagent and see if the readings come back where I know the tank is.

If that doesn't work, I guess I have to contact Hanna to find out what's going on.

[Almondsaz]

I have used the Hanna Phosphate Checker and for the price isn't bad, but I have switched back to use the Milwaukee Low Range (Martini) Phosphate meter. It is really easy to use and consistent on the results. I had one when I started several years ago and then sold it with my 125. Now I remember why I bought it to begin with.

[jscarlata]

Looking at the specs, the low range martini says it's accuracy too is +-.04mg/l...what does that translate to in ppm?

[Yogre]

Mg/l = ppm

[ReefKeeper64]

I have the standard Hanna Checker and use both vials. It will consistently read higher the first 3 minute test, say for example 0.08. Then I'll give it another 3 minute test and it will be 0.02. Then a third test and I get something like 0.03. The first test always seems to be higher than the tests that follow. My question is, which test is more accurate? The first one 3 minutes after mixing the reagent in? Or other tests that follow 4 to 8 minutes later? It would seem that the directions need improvement to mention how long after the reagent has been mixed into the water sample the measurement can be made and still be valid. Perhaps mix and wait a few minutes, then test. Or --- Mix and test right away with 3 minute count down - no more.

[reefmutt]

I don't own a checker because I don't trust them. I know too many people that do own them and have the same issues as people on this thread..
I rely on my Red Sea test kit and my d&d test kit..
I also know people who swear by them but I'm not sure if they have ever cross referenced them..
I really want to invest in a good po4 tester but it won't be a checker..
I wonder if the higher end, larger po4 testers are more reliable..
And really, what use is a meter with a +\- .04 variance for a reef.. As jscarlata pointed out..

[jscarlata]

Mutt, I haven't had much luck w Red Sea, There's a few threads on here about bad reagents and funky test scores, I'd be wary on phosphate,
Plus, if I recall correctly the Red Sea phosphate test does not go into the low range needed for sps tanks. I've ditched my Red Sea pro kits and went w salifert for nitrate and calcium. I got a Hanna checker for alk, and am looking for something for phosphate, seems like lamotte may be the way to go but I'm still hunting, not spending any more $ till I find something that's more accurate than Hanna and more reliable than other test Kits..

[jscarlata]

Mutt, I haven't had much luck w Red Sea, There's a few threads on here about bad reagents and funky test scores, I'd be wary on phosphate,
Plus, if I recall correctly the Red Sea phosphate test does not go into the low range needed for sps tanks. I've ditched my Red Sea pro kits and went w salifert for nitrate and calcium. I got a Hanna checker for alk, and am looking for something for phosphate, seems like lamotte may be the way to go but I'm still hunting, not spending any more $ till I find something that's more accurate than Hanna and more reliable than other test Kits..

[Yogre]

Mutt, I haven't had much luck w Red Sea, There's a few threads on here about bad reagents and funky test scores, I'd be wary on phosphate,
Plus, if I recall correctly the Red Sea phosphate test does not go into the low range needed for sps tanks. I've ditched my Red Sea pro kits and went w salifert for nitrate and calcium. I got a Hanna checker for alk, and am looking for something for phosphate, seems like lamotte may be the way to go but I'm still hunting, not spending any more $ till I find something that's more accurate than Hanna and more reliable than other test Kits..


I'm one of the Red Sea Pro PO4 test folks who could never get the test to work properly. No matter what I tested, including freshly made saltwater with 0 TDS RO/DI water, I could never get a reading below 0.08 ppm PO4.

I may try a reagent refill before I pitch the thing in the trash.

[jscarlata]

That's because the range of the red sea pro kit is 0-5...

Specs from the Red Sea site:
Specifications:
Test type: Colorimetric
Test range: 0-5 ppm of PO4
Accuracy: 0.02 ppm of PO4

http://www.redseafish.com/index.aspx?id=4369

[reefmutt]

Not that it means much, but the Red Sea kit does give colour comparison options for (don't have the kit in front of me) something like .03 and .05... A couple of po4 levels below .08..
Doesn't mean it'll test for those levels, but they are there..
I'm wondering if the D&D test kit is any better.. Seems pretty similar in its reagents supplied..
I think Hanna makes a more sophisticated (much more expensive) po4 tester... Just wondering if its more accurate...
I haven't started to do the research yet...
Now I don't trust ANY of my kits!!
:headwally:

[reefmutt]

Does anybody have experience with this:
HI 96713 HANNA Instruments
Phosphate, Low Range, Portable Photometer
It costs about $200 but if its accurate and reliable, I'd buy it in a minute..

[RxMike]

Hello

I just purchased the Hanna 96713. I am wondering if I can use the hanna HI 713-25 phosphate reagent I have a good supply of from my checker. The 96713 instructions say to use the hanna HI 93713-0 reagent.

I am going to give Hanna a call and try to get some more information. I will update the thread with what I learn.

[reefmutt]

Hey mike, thanks for the info..
I might buy the same machine.
I was looking at the specs and it still has the same range of error as the checker.. +/- .04 which worries me a little..
Out of curiosity, where did you purchase it?
Thanks

[Chronicj7]

I get a little higher reading with my initial 3 minute phosphorus checker as well. I run 5 tests though and take the average. The first is usually 5 ppb higher than the rest. I think they work reasonably well.

Phosphates are just tough to test with hobbyist photometers. If you want precise, consistent measurements every time, you need a lab test kit. The Hanna checkers are great compared to having to figure out if its 1 shade of blue lighter than the other IMO.

[reefmutt]

Boy, that's a lot of testing to get one result..
Certainly would give you a more accurate end result, however..

[Chronicj7]

Boy, that's a lot of testing to get one result..
Certainly would give you a more accurate end result, however..

I usually prep the photometer first and run one test and right each one down while I test everything else. Seems to finish at the same time as the rest of the stuff. I figure its better safe than sorry for how much I have invested in livestock.

[rlpardue]

Am I the only person who has a hard time getting ALL of the powder reagent into the little vial? I've tried all sorts of methods but I spill some half the time. I'm clumsy but not unduly so...

Any ideas guys?

[reefmutt]

I recently bought two hanna ulr phosphorus test kits so that I could compare the results and I must say I am pleasantly surprised with the consistency between the two meters..

Lee, I give the packets a few good flicks before opening, then I cut off the top, open it up and themnfold it opposite to the bonded edges so that you get a diamond shaped opening. I try to make sure the corners are open and then give it another flick or two to get everything out of the corners. I then pour the contents out from one of my new folds... With more gentle flicking.... Hope that helps! And makes sense...

[rlpardue]

I feel retarded. My coffee table looks like a scene from Scarface...

Thanks Matt. Good to hear about the ULR test kit's consistency. I'll try out your method.

[joel g]

To get all the regent out I first fold up a pc of printer paper in quarters with a nice sharp crease then with scissors cut open the regent package and empty into the crease of the paper then it easily pours into the vial with no spills

[atp0726]

Wow, just got the Phosphorus checker. What a frustrating test!
So is it pretty much accepted that you use both vials, one for a water sample and another with sample water and reagent mixed in? I tried twice to mix up the reagent in the same tube and got timed out both times.

[reefmutt]

I bought two phosphorous checkers and used them both simultaneously.
I used both vials for each test kit and got acceptably similar results from both.
I now always put tank water in one and the reagent in the other..

[atp0726]

That would be a lot easier and make the most sense. I will do it that way from now on.