Stray Voltage

[Fartin'Gary]

Has anyone done any studies on how stray voltage might effect a mantis shrimp? Like possible neurological effects?

With nothing plugged in I get 2.4 on the multimeter. With two Hydor 850's and one 240 I get around 35.4. They are all newer powerheads too.
I have a lead going into a ground from an outlet and the other lead in the tank. It's an auto multimeter and I have it set to ACV.
Wondering if this can effect their behavior or health.

I went through all the stuff I have plugged in and it's not one device that is causing the higher voltage but all of them together. I just ordered a rid volt titanium ground. Hopefully that will take care of the stray voltage. Everything in there is doing great but I have read that is can cause a bunch of neurological issues and stress the animals out. Kind of like if you lived next to high voltage transformers with big magnetic fields.

[Fartin'Gary]

Ok since I couldn't wait for the rid volt to get here I improvised a ghetto ground rod. I took an old extension cord and split it in half and attached one end to the ground on my circuit breaker and the other to a part of a stainless steel tool that I wasn't using. This is just temporary.

As you can see, I was getting 40 volts in the water and sometimes higher with all my stuff plugged in. They all added up, it wasn't just one causing this voltage leeching. After I dropped the rod end into the water it's almost zero. After reading about the negative effects of stray voltage on fish, coral, and inverts, I think having a well grounded tank is essential. Especially if you can't afford top of the line equipment.
Here is a link with a video describing how to test your water. http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2182599

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[Calappidae]

I'm following this because I personally never heard of voltage in the water...

[Islandoftiki]

I've thought about grounding my tanks but never have. You can make a nice DIY ground rod with an old titanium bicycle spoke. I wonder if you couldn't rig up a stray voltage alarm? I've heard people advise against using a ground rod on a tank connected to a GFI outlet. Something about tripping the GFI way too easily.

[Fartin'Gary]

I've thought about grounding my tanks but never have. You can make a nice DIY ground rod with an old titanium bicycle spoke. I wonder if you couldn't rig up a stray voltage alarm? I've heard people advise against using a ground rod on a tank connected to a GFI outlet. Something about tripping the GFI way too easily.

Yea I have read that as well but for now I will keep it grounded. I have a hunch that is what killed my last peacock. Remember? I tested everything and it all checked out. Added charcoal, ammonia absorber, used only R/O water, ect. I couldn't for the life of me figure out why she started twitching like crazy like she suddenly developed parkinsons and it just got worse until she died. I think it was the stray voltage over time affecting her nervous system.

[Islandoftiki]

That's entirely possible.

My thought is this. A properly set up tank has redundant systems and fail-safes. What I mean is, you could do something like this:

Have two separate GFI circuits.

Have multiple powerheads or circulation methods with at least one on a different GFI circuit.

Same goes for the heater. It's recommended that we have two heaters that are half the needed wattage for the tank. If one fails fully on or off, it takes longer for the tank temperature to get way out of whack. Each one should be on a separate GFI circuit.

Then ground the tank with a titanium ground probe. Obviously titanium is the ideal metal for a saltwater tank.

If a heater or a power head should start leaking voltage (and they do), it would only trip the GFI for that half of the system. You would only loose half of your critical system components and would likely discover the problem before any harm was done.

Make sense?

[Islandoftiki]

My other thought is that someone could build a really simple voltage alarm for aquariums. It would be exceedingly simple and cheap to build. There may be an untapped market here.

[Fartin'Gary]

My other thought is that someone could build a really simple voltage alarm for aquariums. It would be exceedingly simple and cheap to build. There may be an untapped market here.

Sounds great, get to work! It would be even cooler if it would alert you via smartphone if you are away.
I like the idea of a split system on two outlets. I have 3 powerheads now and two are on a wave maker. The third is just a tiny 240 that sits low in the back center shooting under the rocks.
I do need to upgrade my heater. It's a good heater but it's too small. I was going to get two smaller ones but I have not needed it lately. Winter is coming though. I'm just going to keep an eye on the fish and inverts to see if I notice any change in their behavior. After a week I will putt the ground rod out and observe.

Cheers.

[TundraGuy]

Lol always always always ground your tank people. I learned hard way in 91 when I had my arm in a 20 long and knocked a vho ballast in the tank and got a hell of a shock for my troubles. Plus grounding probes are cheap. $10 bucks and no voltage in the water is hard to beat. Long term shark/ray keepers will tell you if you don't ground the water you end up putting your pet in the ground :( glad to see this up here I always forget to remind people about the safety aspect of a highly conductive liquid we keep in the living room that we hang high powered equipment over.

[Fartin'Gary]

Lol always always always ground your tank people. I learned hard way in 91 when I had my arm in a 20 long and knocked a vho ballast in the tank and got a hell of a shock for my troubles. Plus grounding probes are cheap. $10 bucks and no voltage in the water is hard to beat. Long term shark/ray keepers will tell you if you don't ground the water you end up putting your pet in the ground :( glad to see this up here I always forget to remind people about the safety aspect of a highly conductive liquid we keep in the living room that we hang high powered equipment over.

I have had a saltwater tank for over two years and several freshwater tanks before that. This is the first time I have come across this information. I don't know how I missed it. No one ever said anything at the fish stores and I didn't find it mentioned in any of the beginners guides. Just by chance today I was searching about shrimp twitching because it's still a mystery to me about how my last peacock died. That's when I decided to pull out my multimeter and test the water. I was very surprised at how much potential current was flowing in the water.

[TundraGuy]

Lol I know it. Funny how the obsessive we can be over these things and yet the simple stuff gets skipped over. Most kids in the USA play with magnets in a lab class at some point and the creature shows you how passing a magnet between to metal post will generation electricity. The feature may or may not show the kids how adding magnets to a wheel and spinning the wheel in between the post will generate electricity. Better teachers will show you if you add electricity to the post you make the wheel spin. At this elementary level you have learned that how to make a motor and a power generater. Now even when you are adding power to the post and the wheel is spinning ie a motor to a power head or pump you are still generating power from the magnets spinning on the wheel. The power must go somewhere and in the case of water especially salt water (a good conductor) it bounds around in the tank looking for a home to ground itself in. rudimentary as this all seems unless you stop and think about it you will never see it as a problem. I am always surprised when I see someone figure it out on there own, I never did until I was having problems keeping wabigone sharks on a big ungrounded 600 gallon tank I had way back when. All my pumps I had mounted in that stock tank to help the sharks was messing with them. Then one day a buddy from the fish store pointed it out and broke it down the way I just did. Talk about face palm moment having just finished a science class that year where we made small generaters/motors.

This pound was open to the sky inside a glass sun room in an apartment I rented. Lol the things we learn seem to always be just out side of our full comprehension.

[TundraGuy]

My phone's spell checker is changing words and if you read that last post it reads like a madlib.

[Fartin'Gary]

My phone's spell checker is changing words and if you read that last post it reads like a madlib.

Awe come on it was entertaining and made you sound like a mad man:lolspin:

I looked up those sharks, crazy looking. I'm guessing all those seaweed looking whiskers detect electric impulses from bottom dwelling food?

Can you describe what kind of odd behavior you were noticing with the sharks?

[TundraGuy]

Mostly injurys over the front of the sharks and fins from them running into things. They would swim and act as if they were disoriented. I also found strange growths on them I don't think it was related but it ended after grounding the stock tank. Hard to remember the order of how I built that thing. I also rember having them jump over the side of the tank. But this never happened again after grounding the tank, again I don't think this was related.

[Fartin'Gary]

Weird my clowns have jumped out twice. One time one of them got out of the egg crate top. They were also swimming strangely like kind of on their side. I have not heard them jump since I grounded it but I'm still waiting and observing. Tomorrow I'm going to see what happens when I remove the ground rod.

[Fartin'Gary]

Before I added the ground I noticed that my new O.Scyllarus had developed twitchy anntenal scales and a little with her maxillipeds. This was not apparent when she was in the fish store for several months. It started a little less than a week after she went into my tank. Since I added the ground, I do not see those symptoms anymore. I double and triple checked water parameters and I always run a carbon pad in my canister. This was the same symptoms that my last one had and I chalked it up to a bad molt but even after a few more molts the twitching never went away and gradually got worse until she died. I just thought since she was fully grown it was a molt that killed her. I am now almost 100% positive that the voltage was the cause.
The Rid Volt came in the mail. The ghetto ground is out. It's working nicely from the tests with my meter.

[Fartin'Gary]

It's been 14 days since I put the ground in and observing my peacock closely I am happy to say that all limb twitching has now ceased. I thought for about a week that the damage may have been permanent but she's totally back to normal.

[Islandoftiki]

That's awesome! It's good to know what the physical symptoms of voltage leakage are for a mantis. I'll suggest it to the next person to describe that behavior. I've seen posts about twitching behavior a number of times. Might have been voltage leakage.

I might have missed it... did you determine where your voltage leakage was coming from?

[Fartin'Gary]

That's awesome! It's good to know what the physical symptoms of voltage leakage are for a mantis. I'll suggest it to the next person to describe that behavior. I've seen posts about twitching behavior a number of times. Might have been voltage leakage.

I might have missed it... did you determine where your voltage leakage was coming from?

Yea, it was coming from all of my devices and not just one. I just wish I had found this out sooner than I did. I unplugged everything and measured them coming online one at a time and they all added up. The biggest offenders were the power heads but they were still within normal specs. I think it's this houses wiring actually. I never had this problem back in Vegas. It started when we moved here to Maryland(I advise against it). We are just renting now. With my wife's job we have been moving around a lot so there is no point in buying. We might be moving to Japan soon. If that happens I will have a peacock free to a good home.