Tanks for newbs question!

[Mantisshrimpman]

What are the best size and type of tank for a newb with no saltwater tank experience a plain saltwater tank or a reef tank? And I would like to start small like below 50 gallons if at all possible.

[kwroberto]

I started with 5 gallon, fluval makes a nice 5 gallon tank called a spec, give it a look!

[crn005]

The higher the water volume the easier it will be. Your chemistry is very important in a saltwater tank. The lower the volume, the easier it is to sway on concentrations, which could potentially be harmful to its inhabitants. The more water you have, the more stable the system will be. It is much more forgiving.

[Tuton]

A 40 gallon breeder tank full of damsels would be an easy to maintain tank....
(If you go this route research the damsels because alot are extremely aggressive)

[Reef Frog]

Need to know your priorities, goals, budget, what you want to keep.

But maybe consider some of the AIO tanks (all in one). Great choices from Red Sea, Elos, Innovative Marine and many more. There are some really great designs out there of all sizes where you can keep anything.

[hersheyb]

I would recommend anywhere between 40-90 gal would be a great start, you have more room for error.

[SoLiD]

40 breeders are super sweet…
http://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd285/SoLiDST33L/TANK-FTSLIGHTS.jpg

[BlindZide]

40 breeders are super sweet…
http://i223.photobucket.com/albums/dd285/SoLiDST33L/TANK-FTSLIGHTS.jpg

OMG that tank is beautiful SoLiD!!

I started with a 30g, moved to a 75g, and just purchased a 40 Breeder. As stated above, the larger the tank the more forgiving it is.

[dkeller_nc]

If you're just starting out, don't get a tank with less than 30 gallons. If you're going to set things up yourself instead of buying an all-in-one, there are 3 standard tank sizes to consider in the smaller range: a 40 gallon breeder, a 65 gallon or a 75 gallon tank. The reason for this limited selection is the front-to-back glass dimension: all 3 of these tanks are 18" front to back. You need this width for aquascaping; anything narrower will feel very cramped.

Those 3 sizes are do-it-yourself drilling. And you need to get your tank drilled and use a sump. Not doing so will limit your equipment choices, and force you to place a good bit of ugly equipment in the tank itself.

If you're willing to consider a reef-ready marineland, they make several sizes that ready-to-go, just add a sump, stand and return pump:

http://www.marineland.com/Products/glass-aquariums-and-tanks/corner-flo-pre-drilled-aquariums.aspx

[mh6i]

I moved up several years ago from 20 gal fresh water to a 46 gal salt water reef tank and it's proven to be easy to maintain; the chemistry is pretty stable. Granted I don't have anything too crazy in it but it's been a great intro to salt water.

[Mantisshrimpman]

I just love everyone's input! I'm learning so much! One thing that fascinates me is that this hobby specifically reefs you basically are making you're own microbiome. Instead of currents washing in new food and keeping chemicals balanced you have to provide nutrients and water. Pretty much from what I've learned so far that all the changes that happen in nature to keep that stuff balanced you have to take over for since your creatures don't have natural ocean currents and weather to keep things balanced.

[dkeller_nc]

I kept freshwater for many years before setting up my first reef tank. With that in mind, I will tell you that a considerably greater amount of equipment is necessary for a reef tank vs. your average freshwater planted or african cichlid tank.

Here's a list to get you started:

Minimum equipment:

Drilled tank with an overflow and sump (you can use a standard glass aquarium for the sump to save some $$$), or an all-in-one tank from Innovative Marine, Red Sea, etc...

Stand

Heater - minimum Ebo-Jager or a Cobalt Aquatics (do not go cheaper). Upgrade is a titanium heater with a separate temp controller.

Return Pump - pump with greatest history of bullet-proof reliability is Eheim hobby pumps for submersible, Iwaki or ReefFlo for external pump. Sicce are very close seconds to Eheim, they just don't have quite the history. Another option is the new crop of DC pumps that are considerably more energy efficient than AC pumps (but more expensive).

Lighting - You are way, way better off blowing your budget on high-quality, high-intensity lighting once than buying a cheaper, lesser fixture and having to replace it. If you're new to this, going with a T5, Metal Halide or combination T5/Metal Halide fixture will produce guaranteed coral growth. LEDs can be a bit more challenging - many find the low-end just blue & white fixtures to produce inconsistent coral growth and survivability.

Powerheads - go with propeller pumps, especially if you go with metal halide lighting, as traditional powerheads are too inefficient and produce too much heat. Least expensive route is Hydor Koralias and a wave controller. But for a larger tank, you will probably find yourself replacing them. You might be better off purchasing one Vortech or Tunze w/ controller for your tank, and adding another when funds allow.

Skimmer - there are a lot of good skimmers out there for tanks with a sump. Not so many for all-in-ones or tanks without a sump. Some good brands are AquaMaxx, Reef Octopus, and Vertex (there are others, but check out your intended purchase on RC in the equipment forum before you pull the trigger. There are also a lot of dogs out there as well).

RODI Unit - you can get by with buying purified water from your local fish shop, but this will very, very quickly get to be a strain on your back and your wallet. You can get a pretty functional RODI system for about $130.

ATO - An auto-top-off unit may seem like a nice-to-have, but salinity stability is important for many reef-tank animals, and as a newbie, you have enough other things to pay attention to. Tunze osmolators are the best bang-for-your-buck because they have built-in safeties and don't rely on mechanical float switches.

Glass Cleaning Magnet - self-explanatory. Best ones are strong-magnet types like the Tunze and Algae-Free brands. Mag-Floats are also very popular.

Tests/Testing Equipment:

Specific Gravity Measuring Device (Hydrometer or Refractometer) - a cheap plastic hydrometer can work if used carefully, and if re-calibrated against another reefer or LFS's refractometer. Otherwise, get a refractometer. The manual refractometers work and are about $50. But if you're not used to scientific instruments, do yourself a huge favor and spend another $50 on a digital refractometer.

Ammonia, Nitrate, Alkalinity, and Calcium - in that order. Most here like Salifert or Red Sea. Phosphate will be important a little later on. You will not need the ammonia test kit except for the initial stages of setting up your tank. If you prefer, and you're patient, you can just set up the tank w/ rock, sand and saltwater, wait 4-6 weeks, and use the nitrate kit to confirm that your cycle is over.

Thermometer - Lifeguard Aquatics makes the only reliable digital ones that I'm aware of, although Pinpoint Marine has just come out with a promising wireless digital one that's not too expensive. The coralife units are inaccurate, though it's possible to calibrate them if you have some electronics experience. High-quality laboratory-style glass thermometers work extremely well and can be purchased through Amazon for just a few bucks. You might want to start with one of these, since it's a very good idea to have an "analog" thermometer as a back-up and a calibration check for a digital one.

Initial Tank Contents:

Rock: I highly suggest you spend the $$ on high-quality indo-Pacific live rock from Premium Aquatics, or from Tampa Bay Saltwater for gulf-of-mexico aquacultured live rock. It's possible to start a tank with dry rock and a bottle of bacteria, but I don't recommend this for a beginner, particularly if you're interested in the "biotope" aspect. I'll also go out on a limb here and tell you flat-out not to purchase "Real Reef Rock". It's a totally man-made product that's been "aquacultured" in a closed system, and in my opinion it is not appropriate for use in a reef tank, particularly not if you're a beginner (and it's expensive and isn't eco-friendly, despite the company's insistence to the contrary). Be very careful here - some LFS sell this stuff as authentic live rock, which it isn't. Also be cautious about buying LR from a LFS in general. There are definitely some high-quality LFS out there that know the difference between high-quality air-freighted live rock and "Fiji Boat Rock", but there are a lot that don't make that distinction. Same goes for buying LR from another hobbyist that's getting out, it's a great way to have your initial reef tank experience be about battling difficult-to-eradicate pests.

Sand: Many hobbyists go with a bare-bottom tank for ease of cleaning. If you're new to the hobby, though, put a 1-2" layer of aragonite sand on the bottom of the tank. That will allow you to keep many species that need sand. You can buy bagged aragonite sand from Carib-Sea, or live sand from Premium Aquatics/Tampa Bay Saltwater. You can buy dry aragonitic sand from several web outlets as well.

Water: Other than a source for purified water for evaporation make-up and for making saltwater (see RODI system, above), you need salt. There's a lot of folks that have specific salt brands that they are very fond of (and there are a lot of salt brands out there), but for now, good ole cheap Instant Ocean will serve you well. BTW - it's far cheaper to buy this as a 200g box from one of the online sellers like Drs Foster and Smith than it is to buy 50g bags from your LFS.

[Mantisshrimpman]

Thanks that is a lot of info I'll try to remember this.

[Derrick12]

I use distilled water for evaporation anyone see anything wrong with that?

[SoLiD]

Not really. Back in the day distilleries used copper lines and components, but today they use stainless steel. You should be ok.

[Derrick12]

Yes that is good info

[Derrick12]

Ok what is the best way to top off tank if Rodi unit is not available ??

[Derrick12]

Is store bought spring water better?

[SoLiD]

Windmill water is good...

[Derrick12]

Thx SoLiD. What do u think

[Derrick12]

Windmill? Seriously my tap water is horrible
Does every one have a Rodi unit

[SoLiD]

http://blogs.sacurrent.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/windmill.jpg

[SoLiD]

It's cheap RO water.

[Mantisshrimpman]

RO units are expensive from what I've seen

[SoLiD]

You could pick up a simple used one for about $100

[SoLiD]

My first simple RO unit came from eBay.

[Tuton]

A lot of LFS sell RO/DI or give it away....

[Mantisshrimpman]

You could pick up a simple used one for about $100

Really? That's good to know. But doesn't the whole set up with buckets and stuff take a lot of space. A herp I know uses RO water for his amphibians and he has huge trashcans full for his RO unit

[Fish Biscuit]

I love the 40 breeder, get one when petco has their $1 per g sale.

I keep my RODI in the shower of our unused downstairs bathroom & make my water outside. Most LFS sell RO water for 50 cents a g out here. It will pay for itself in the long run.

[dkeller_nc]

Really? That's good to know. But doesn't the whole set up with buckets and stuff take a lot of space. A herp I know uses RO water for his amphibians and he has huge trashcans full for his RO unit

Yep, and you're going to have trashcans setting around as well. The funny thing is that many, many prospective new reefers before you have resisted an RODI unit, even though the cost of it is a tiny, tiny fraction of what is spent on the tank, equipment and livestock. Personally, I've never understood this, as it's the one piece of absolutely no-brainer piece of equipment any aquarist ought to have, regardless of whether they keep saltwater or not.

[Mantisshrimpman]

Well looks like I've got extra work ahead of me if I wanna start this hobby while still living with my parents. They're gonna make me work to use the space where those trash cans are gonna be

[dkeller_nc]

There's one other item I forgot to include on the list: a quarantine tank, with the necessary minimal equipment for life support (i.e., heater & filtration). This is an absolute requirement if you want to keep fish in this day and age of consolidated livestock import and distribution.

[Derrick12]

Thx SoLiD. That's what I need

[jimnchal]

Craigslist is a great place to find used saltwater equipment. Just have to check everyday as the good deals dont last long.

[Mantisshrimpman]

Sounds like fun. Can't wait till I get my budget back up again.

[Calappidae]

Some RODIs can cost 200 dollars... the main expense is the replacement filters, thats what I'd look for rather than the price for the unit as it will eventually pay for itself in no time after a couple filter replacements.


I wouldn't buy anything that looks used IMO.. been there, done that, and regretted it. You get what you pay for in this hobby.

[Mantisshrimpman]

Good to know. I'll keep that in mind

[Bpawl]

I used walmart distilled water for years when I had my 5 gal tank. Now I got a RO filter off BRS for a great price and haven't looked back since.

[Mantisshrimpman]

5 gal is tiny! What did you have in there?