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fullonsound
01/14/2014, 07:48 PM
Hello everyone,

I am about six months into this tank and I believe my big (2-3") clown fish killed my two yellow tail damsels and sand sifting goby last night. Tank parameters are not perfect but nothing crazy; however, i have also noticed my GSP has been closed up for a few days and know it can be a sign of poor water parameters. Looking for some suggestions as to what happened and also how I can improve my tank to reduce clown fish aggression. I may also be getting rid of the larger clown..

30g innovative marine
Ai blue light
intank filtration with carbon sponge, filter floss and ammonia reducing sponge. Also have ceramic "bio balls"
Hydor Skimmer

Tank stock consisted of

2 Yellow tail damsels
2 O clown fish
1 Peppermint Shrimp
1 Chocolate chip star fish
invertebrates

Hammer Coral
Frog Spawn
Zoas
GSP

Last water parameters were..

Salinity: 1.024

Ammonia: .04ppm

NO2: 0ppm

no3: 5ppm

Calcium: 460-480ppm

Hardness: 196.9ppm/kh

Phosphates: .25ppm

Use API marine and Red Sea testing kits.. Any help is greatly apprecieated as this is my first tank..

dmh41532
01/14/2014, 08:24 PM
I find it hard to believe that an oscellaris clown would kill fish, but I suppose anything is possible. Have you seen any signs of aggression between the fish? how long has the ammonia been at .04ppm? to me, that seems alittle high.

MSreefdoc
01/14/2014, 08:30 PM
My clown is the most aggresive fish in my tank, but I don't think it has ever killed one of my other fish. One fish did die for no apparent reason over the last 2 years, so maybe it was him! But 3 fish in one night? Someone must of really pi$$ed this little guy off! Have you fed him in the past 4 days? lol

rlm2005
01/14/2014, 09:16 PM
5 fish in a 30 gallon and you have what I assume a mated pair of clowns? I suppose she could have gone on a killing spree, what did the dead fish look like?

fullonsound
01/15/2014, 11:32 AM
There was no obvious trauma to the fish and I don't suspect one clown killed three in one night but I just don't know.. The larger clown has shown aggression but I just assumed it was showing dominance. It gets along well with the smaller clown.. Um.. I have been battling higher than 0 ammonia and NO3 levels; however, they are not in extremes. I did a water change afterwards as a precaution and the GSP opened up after having been closed up for a few days.. Perhaps my levels are higher than I suspected? I think I will take a sample down to the LFS and work on getting my levels completely down to 0... Any other suggestions?

Thanks all for your input.

Kyle918
01/15/2014, 11:47 AM
Over what period of time did you add all those fish? That is a decent amount of fish in a 30 gallon. Damsels are aggressive. Clownfish are damselfish so they would be aggressive towards each other regardless. If you have ammonia higher than zero, then that is a problem. Stress, coupled with aggression coupled with present ammonia can lead to death of fish. Once one dies, ammonia rises further, causing a domino effect. I do think it would be an extreme case for that one clownfish to kill three fish over night though. One fish dying causing an ammonia spike, thus killing two more seems more likely.

How were the fish prior to addition? How long did you quarantine them for and what was their health during that time? How were they acclimated?

ken6217
01/15/2014, 01:52 PM
Anything is possible but I would seriously doubt a clownfish killed the fish.

Every maroon clown I have ever had was as nasty as could be, but only to me. Not other fish.

Why do you have an ammonia reducing sponge? You should have no ammonia without the sponge. Especially at 6 months.
Ken

fullonsound
01/15/2014, 09:55 PM
I will have to try a larger water change tomorrow to see if I can get the ammonia levels down to zero. I added the ammonia sponge about two weeks ago which resulted in lowering levels.. I was also told the API kits will never read 0 ammonia- is this correct?

The inverts and chocolate chip star fish were added first followed by the yellow tail damsels, larger clown and then the smaller clown and goby.. I would say they were added a week or so apart.. Perhaps to many fish for a small tank?

Kyle918
01/16/2014, 11:47 AM
I will have to try a larger water change tomorrow to see if I can get the ammonia levels down to zero. I added the ammonia sponge about two weeks ago which resulted in lowering levels.. I was also told the API kits will never read 0 ammonia- is this correct?

The inverts and chocolate chip star fish were added first followed by the yellow tail damsels, larger clown and then the smaller clown and goby.. I would say they were added a week or so apart.. Perhaps to many fish for a small tank?

API test kits are terrible and known to be inaccurate as well as difficult to discern the differences in color. They are really only recommended for use during the cycling stages. It's probably time for you to upgrade but truthfully at 6 months, you should never have ammonia and really don't have a need to test for it by once a week or so maybe.

You may have too many fish for a 30 gallon. You have to remember the tank is probably not filled to the rim and displacement fr rock and sand must be accounted for. You may have 22 gallons of actual water.

You must move slow. Patience is probably the most important factor in any aspect of this hobby. Fish really shouldn't be added a week apart. 6 weeks apart is recommended to allow your live rock to adjust to the new bioload. But even then, that isn't too pratical if you follow sound quarantining practices which is a 7-8 week long quarantine period. I quarantine for 9 weeks but I am buying a second quarantine tank and will stagger new fish purchases by 4 weeks. So every month I can add fish to the main tank as they finish their 9 weeks quarantine.

I would buy a better test kit for ammonia to see for certain if you really have any present. If you do, then your current bioload is too great for your biological bacteria to handle (live rock isn't mature yet; at least not mature enough for your current livestock)

Cdiggy
01/16/2014, 12:04 PM
Doubtful that a clownfish would do that (but my clown does bite me when my hand is in the tank)

julie180
01/18/2014, 07:42 AM
In case you are not aware, CC stars are not reef safe. I had on in my refug and he ate mushrooms and zoas

H.reidi.MN
01/18/2014, 09:26 AM
Is it just me or does it seem like the reason your battling ammonia is the tank never fully cycled and your suppressing it with WC and ammonia filter pads etc...

enzo0000
01/18/2014, 09:42 AM
Anything is possible but I would seriously doubt a clownfish killed the fish.

Every maroon clown I have ever had was as nasty as could be, but only to me. Not other fish.

I wish my maroon only attacked me...It killed all my fish...got rid of her.

Your clown may not be outright killing your fish, but if its aggressive towards your other fish..it may be stressing your other fish out which inturn can kill them. Thats what mine did....constantly chasing them, my fish got to the point where they just stayed in the corners for fear of getting chased...after awhile my clown found them, then just bugged the crap out of them....

snorvich
01/18/2014, 10:15 AM
In case you are not aware, CC stars are not reef safe. I had on in my refug and he ate mushrooms and zoas

That is correct. Also, they should not be kept in the tank size of the original poster. But as far as killing fish, that they will not do. I am a bit skeptical of the chemistry of this tank by the way.

fullonsound
01/18/2014, 10:33 AM
The two clowns are happy as can be now that they have the tank to themselves.. Yes I have lost a frag of pink zoas to the chocolate star fish.. My ammonia levels are lower now (.25) via API kit which apparently always read some hint of ammonia.. The GSP has opened back up and everything looks happy.. I think I will keep with the two clowns and get rid of the chocolate chip star fish eventually... He only goes after certain corals (usually on the frag rack); however, he never goes after the zoas growing all over the lower rocks..

Cowdogz
01/18/2014, 06:44 PM
Damsels are aggressive. Clownfish are damselfish so they would be aggressive towards each other regardless.

+1

I saw my O Clown kill a Blue-Green Chromis one night.