Worm's S. Gig

[worm5406]

OK Yeah I got it.

I am uploading pictures right now.

I did put it right into a QT and I will be doing Cipro here in a few minutes.

I have to keep my spirits down, so here is my one outburst...

It looks cool as a sunset on the beach after an enjoyful day.

OK... so I hope it does good. The mouth was good when I picked it up, straight after being unboxed from it's flight from LA. It was very hard to see through the plastic bag. The bottom/foot looked black.

Once I got it home and the QT/HT setup, and put it in, the mouth was a little loose. There was a bit of junk in the bag but no black poop.

After 10 minutes in the tank the mouth closed and you could see two teeth.

The camera will be able to see it, but it is at a strange angle, until I can find a better place or another camera to use.

[OrionN]

Waiting for pictures.

[D-Nak]

Sorry, looking at the photos this anemone appears to be a haddoni.

Just kidding. I know you're excited for a gig, I just had to give you a nudge in the gut.

Congrats -- very happy for you! Now finish uploading your photos!

[worm5406]

OK A few pictures:

This is what was sent to me prior to being shipped:
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/--QnefhTLtyI/Uvp3jU3wniI/AAAAAAABPSM/GRrNXYVyyU8/s800/gig1.jpg

This is the first family snapshot:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-3RT4Jma8EpI/UvwIrjHgCHI/AAAAAAABPWM/wF4JxatfITM/s800/20140212_184911.jpg

First pic of a facedown splat:
http://worm5406.smugmug.com/photos/i-Ljn7CW6/0/X3/i-Ljn7CW6-X3.jpg

Sitting:
http://worm5406.smugmug.com/photos/i-ZsJbkgH/0/X3/i-ZsJbkgH-X3.jpg

After a few minutes and attached to it's cup-o-coffee before flow started:
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-K-WMEzE46uA/Uvws_WFr8XI/AAAAAAABPWM/pjYj7LsFc4M/s800/20140212_212426.jpg

During some flow:
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-FBkCSuDEYu4/UvwvsYNSFyI/AAAAAAABPWM/OYMPnFf8nW8/s800/20140212_213445.jpg

Video 1:
<iframe width="1280" height="720" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/zaHkIPblG84" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Video 2:
<iframe width="1280" height="720" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/6UZuZ-KwlZQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>




I know Orion wants to see that it is a Haddoni, so let me appease him and D-Nak
http://worm5406.smugmug.com/photos/i-nRJ4pGN/0/X3/i-nRJ4pGN-X3.jpg



OK so the mouth got a lot better after the flow stated. It looked really happy.

If you promise no to tell anyone, I set up a web cam just for it.

http:.//worm5406.from-md.com:84

Username is : guest
No Password

Thanks!!

Ohhh CIPRO in at 2300.

[OrionN]

That is a Haddoni. Did you photoshop those spots?

[worm5406]

No... I tattooed it on the anemone. It was ok after the first 3.

[flakey]

No... I tattooed it on the anemone. It was ok after the first 3.

:lolspin:

i was just about to say you should step it up and give us a live feed, but sadly it isn't working

:deadhorse:

[sh0ck]

When I replace http:. with http: it works for me

[flakey]

When I replace http:. with http: it works for me

oh yes.....

Thanks.

[Deepsea2005]

It's a nice one.
Congrats

[MelloW33]

Good thing you got that in yesterday!

That's a good looking Gig. Good luck with it!

[SNAKEMANVET]

Congrats on the gig,looks like a nice one.

[coker98]

:lolspin:

i was just about to say you should step it up and give us a live feed, but sadly it isn't working

:deadhorse:

The live feed works. I was just on it at about 130am this morning.

[Newbie Aquarist]

What is Cipri?

[worm5406]

What is Cipri?

It is actually CIPRO.

Look here:

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?p=21259888


Yes for those that found the correct link to the camera, you passed the test. HAHAHAHA. (I did not know it was not working.)

Here in a bit you will be able to see it in light, as the light comes up about 1pm. Then sits about 11pm.

[worm5406]

For all those of you that sent kind words.. THANKS!!

For the rest of you, it is ok to sit back and watch. LOL

OK back to the gig.

I got up a few times last night and looked at it on the camera, the IR really helps!! I actually noticed it getting bigger, or should I say relaxing. I would say that the movement and darkness would scare me too.

Hope to have a few more pics up later today as things progress.

[OrionN]

worm,
He looks great for something that just arrive less than 24 hrs ago. best of luck with him.

[Jamie1210]

good luck w/him! has a lot of potential with color, I think. I hope he makes it ...will be following closely for the next few days, so pls update w/pics! :p haha

[worm5406]

So the lights have come up and I put my time lapse camera on it to record a time lapse for today.

The live webcam and the tank cam can both see the new gig.

[worm5406]

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-IWXCXp7Ed6Q/Uv0zY-PWmNI/AAAAAAABPYQ/El6X46dm0cU/s800/20140213_143457-SNOW.gif

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-fX4UANaPvJk/Uv0vj5An9dI/AAAAAAABPYI/hWRPvDaaHT8/s800/20140213_154756.jpg

[D-Nak]

Looking a bit flat in the photo, but I looked at the live feed and it looks better. What kind of lights it is sitting under? I've never seen that color before -- looks cool! It definitely does have potential to be some sort of rainbow.

[y0ung0ne]

looks like a great gig worm hope everything works out greats I know its in great hands....I will keep checking back.

[RJT]

It does look better on the live cam than the pic. He looks great swaying in the flow

[worm5406]

Looking a bit flat in the photo, but I looked at the live feed and it looks better. What kind of lights it is sitting under? I've never seen that color before -- looks cool! It definitely does have potential to be some sort of rainbow.

looks like a great gig worm hope everything works out greats I know its in great hands....I will keep checking back.

It does look better on the live cam than the pic. He looks great swaying in the flow

Yeah I know... Dosent it??!!??

It is in 12k mode right now under a radion.

It started this lights up nice and tall, when the lights hit it, it shrank down. At first I thought floppy pancake.. THEN I could see it actually start to grow under the light.

NICE... I was really happy. I think it was just scared. HAHAHAHA

I have been judging the progress based on what letters are in the back ground in the camera. Well I can not see the letters anymore, so that says a lot!!

It is holding up and staying up with no problems. It is swaying in the flow and it is also pulsing.

So far so good.. I think it has been 22 hours so far.

Pics to come later tonight.

[flakey]

It's looking good!! What colour do you think if will eventually turn out to be?

[taylor t]

[QUOTE=worm5406;22432104]For the rest of you, it is ok to sit back and watch. QUOTE]

Thanks! This be me! :) Typing takes a lot of work, this type of thing requires too many little details to accurately get ideas across... Just keep the updates coming so we can all enjoy your gig (with out paying for it or taking care of it! ha ha).


oh, and.... CONGRATS! We all know you've been wanting one for a long time. :dance:

I saw the live feed this morning, it looked good in the dark, but the lights came on and like you described, floppy pancake mode. But on the live feed right now it looks good. The color looks like it will be a real nice one after it's acclimated. On the live feed right now the mouth looks nice and tight.

So what's your plan for water changes with it? How are you doing them? DT water, or fresh saltwater? If freshly made saltwater, how long aged? What %? How high is that light? What's the max % of intensity? Do you have an airstone in the HT, or any air? Is there surface scum skimming? What temp are you aiming to keep the HT at?

Sorry for the questions... inquiring minds want to know! See why I don't post a lot now? I usually end up with more questions than answers.....

[worm5406]

It is funny to see it react to the light change.

Now I have been home all day due to snow so I have seen DAY ONE of the lights come up and go down.

Before lights on nice and stretchy...

Lights on.. A little limp

As they came up all the way it stretched out. Like it was wanting the zooxanthe to kick in, feeding it, instead of it reaching for something.

Then it stretched out and almost double it's size from lights on.

NOW... that lights are going back down... it has shrunk down to morning lights on size.

OK so feeding time for the MAIN DT's then I will do a 5g water change.

CIPRO at midnight.

[taylor t]

wow, that was fast. I just looked at the webcam... what the heck happened!

[worm5406]

[QUOTE=worm5406;22432104]For the rest of you, it is ok to sit back and watch. QUOTE]

Thanks! This be me! :) Typing takes a lot of work, this type of thing requires too many little details to accurately get ideas across... Just keep the updates coming so we can all enjoy your gig (with out paying for it or taking care of it! ha ha).


oh, and.... CONGRATS! We all know you've been wanting one for a long time. :dance:

I saw the live feed this morning, it looked good in the dark, but the lights came on and like you described, floppy pancake mode. But on the live feed right now it looks good. The color looks like it will be a real nice one after it's acclimated. On the live feed right now the mouth looks nice and tight.

So what's your plan for water changes with it? How are you doing them? DT water, or fresh saltwater? If freshly made saltwater, how long aged? What %? How high is that light? What's the max % of intensity? Do you have an air stone in the HT, or any air? Is there surface scum skimming? What temp are you aiming to keep the HT at?

Sorry for the questions... inquiring minds want to know! See why I don't post a lot now? I usually end up with more questions than answers.....

Wanted to address your post separately.

Thanks... Yea I type for a living most of the day at work.. LOL

I am unsure of the true color yet as it shows both yellow and brown colors.

Water changes are going from the DT to the HT. Re supplying the DT with made SW. So the aging is a while, mixed that is.

I am using 1.026-7 for my water. Want to keep it as close to where it is going to not cause another deflate cycle.

The light is 2 inches above the water level and running at 50% of 12k out of a radion 2G pro.

I am running an air stone since zero hour.

No skimming, only water changes of 50% planned. NO LR or live media.

Currently I am running it at 82 degrees.

I am slowly moving my DT up per some threads that orion posted in the past/present to 82 degrees for my DT.

For others... Please keep/start asking questions.

Knowing is 1/2 the battle.

I am waiting till after water change and lights out to take the time lapse camera off and let you see it so sorry for the lack of pictures today.

[OrionN]

Mine two is on their third night, so one day ahead of your's. Mine are doing well. Only deflated one time. Both are very stiff and hold up well to current. Mouth still a little large. Continue to look a little better each day.

[Percula_Clown]

I can't see it, the camera is pointed up

Also, Grats on Gig!

[Percula_Clown]

I want an anemone so badly. My tank just isn't ready for one yet....

[worm5406]

Camera adjusted.

I wonder why it went up. Hummm..

It is ok now.

When looking at it, right now, it is small, waiting on sunset, earlier today you could NOT see the EMT symbol in the background. That is how fluffed it was.

[Percula_Clown]

I'll have to check him out after work tomorrow when he is full.

He has great looking colors though!

Dumb question, what is that string like thing in-between him and the cup?

Edit: thanks for fixing the camera, I am living out my anemone fantasies atm.

Edit again: I can honestly see him deflating right now, its weird.

[worm5406]

Yeah it is strange.. He is adjusting to the light. Once the timelapse is done you should be able to see it better too.


The string thing is some slime, to put it nicely, I have seen it before on anemones. It is like a outer skin layer. It will come off as a sheet and bunch up to make a string like that.

Kidna like us humans getting sun burned and a layer come off. Almost like it is getting rid of the previous protective layer from the previous water and making a new one.

You are welcome on the camera. I watch it too as the computer is in the other room.

[worm5406]

OK Promised video:

After about 1/2 the light started to go to blue, I have since edited it to 12k throughout the duration of 'day'.

Watching it in High Def is much better, just let it buffer and then click play.

<iframe width="1280" height="720" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/lX3B9ZOrWTg" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>


<iframe width="1280" height="720" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/PhqBAoqrrM8" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Thanks!

[worm5406]

Start of day 2: (when it stops snowing I wont be able to do 'start pics' LOL)

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-Sn-oewi-bQQ/Uv5Z9lyCSRI/AAAAAAABPY4/QK-_CzOMxNE/s800/20140214_130040.jpg

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-4if9vs_hmHw/Uv5Z1g3eEAI/AAAAAAABPY4/Awz0DfiuNgg/s800/20140214_130014.jpg

[worm5406]

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-rOBYSct3zCs/Uv5-gcdi0fI/AAAAAAABPZc/1DEo-w1IACQ/s800/20140214_153635.jpg

[taylor t]

The above pics look good. But, the live feed I've been keeping an eye on, it's deflated now. IMO, still too much light. When I was qt mine, when they did that and I noticed, I killed the light for the rest of the day. To me, my mind thinks (may be wrong, don't know) if it's inflated, it's healthier/easier for the internals to "flush" the rotting/dying gunk/algae (the biggest hurdle to overcome IMO). When it sits in a pile like that, more damaging than good ( I would think any rotting material will just spread to good material it made contact with internally). I would think keeping the lights on the lower end would be better, get it to stay inflated 24/7 through all the cycles, then ramp things up to where you/it wants/needs them, once it stabilizes and remains inflated all the time. I know some say "let er rip" when it comes to gigs and lights as far as acclimation, but I've killed plenty trying it that way. Any other thoughts from anyone else?

Worm, do you know or did you notice, did it stay inflated longer yesterday than today, in regards to the light period? Or did it shrink the same time? Seems like it shrank earlier today. ?

[flakey]

I usually only see it during the night when the lights are out and every time I looked it has been fully inflated and standing up tall

[worm5406]

I agree whole heartely... I have been watching it for quite a bit today.

I noticed it shrunk after the full lights came on at 25%.

Right now I have lowered them down to 15% and did a 100% water change.

I think it shrunk about the same time. I would have to go back and look at the camera though.

ALL last night it was nice and plump.

[worm5406]

If I had a par meter I could tell you how much it was getting at least.

[D-Nak]

The above pics look good. But, the live feed I've been keeping an eye on, it's deflated now. IMO, still too much light. When I was qt mine, when they did that and I noticed, I killed the light for the rest of the day. To me, my mind thinks (may be wrong, don't know) if it's inflated, it's healthier/easier for the internals to "flush" the rotting/dying gunk/algae (the biggest hurdle to overcome IMO). When it sits in a pile like that, more damaging than good ( I would think any rotting material will just spread to good material it made contact with internally). I would think keeping the lights on the lower end would be better, get it to stay inflated 24/7 through all the cycles, then ramp things up to where you/it wants/needs them, once it stabilizes and remains inflated all the time. I know some say "let er rip" when it comes to gigs and lights as far as acclimation, but I've killed plenty trying it that way. Any other thoughts from anyone else?

Worm, do you know or did you notice, did it stay inflated longer yesterday than today, in regards to the light period? Or did it shrink the same time? Seems like it shrank earlier today. ?

I may have been one of those people who said "let it rip potato chip" when it came to blasting gigs with a lot of light, but I agree with your statement. For gigs that are acclimated and are thriving, I don't think they can have too much light.

HOWEVER, I think sick gigs are capable of only doing one thing at a time, and when sick they need to focus their energy on getting better, from an internal perspective. This means not exposing the zooxanthellae to a lot of light where the nem ramps up zoox production. This, of course is all anecdotal, but I now believe that with Cipro treatment, the nem needs to focus its energy on purging its internal contents. Cipro is used to combat an infection, and this infection is what I believe leads to dead zoox. For some reason the nem is not able to purge it in a normal fashion -- sometimes we see anemones with dark stringy stuff coming out of their mouths, which we believe to be excess zoox. With sick gigs, we see it purged as hard, black "rat poop" like particles, sometimes large, sometimes small. What we can agree to is that this doesn't happen with healthy gigs. For some reason, it stays inside the nem longer than it should. Very similar to constipation.

So, my thinking is, keep the gig under relatively low light during the first days of treatment, allow the Cipro to work, and once the mouth tightens or we see other signs of progress, then we can gradually give it more light.

The caveat to this is that I think there is a tipping point. Gigs that are too far gone never show signs of improvement with Cipro, while some don't need treatment at all and can be blasted with light right away. Those that are on the tipping point are the ones to focus on -- such at the gig in this thread. This gig looks like it's reacting positively to Cipro. It doesn't look like it has reached the "puffy pancake" state where without treatment, it will die and with treatment there is a chance it will pull through.

My suggestion is to keep the light relatively low, until it appears that the nem can handle more light -- no deflation, able to hold itself upright, etc. Good luck!

[Loganeri]

I agree with keeping lights low. I didn't feel like buying window screen so I used a couple sheets of Xerox paper on a plexi cover. After first 3 days of treatment removed one sheet, after next two days removed the final sheet. Gig responded well. Good luck with your continued treatment

[worm5406]

OK I have since bumped it down to 10% it is is looking much better.

It defiantly does not like the lights yet.

[worm5406]

Took a bit to upload this last night.

<iframe width="1280" height="720" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/Uzq9Qh-CI5E" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[flakey]

These time lapse videos are really good worm. What was happening at 1:45 mark when it shrunk? We're the lights coming on? You got a small clock you can put in the corner?

[OrionN]

It was fully inflated at about 7:00 when the light turn out.
Best of luck. Hope he will get better for you.

[worm5406]

These time lapse videos are really good worm. What was happening at 1:45 mark when it shrunk? We're the lights coming on? You got a small clock you can put in the corner?
That was when the lights came up and I realized that I needed to cut them back even more. Then even more again, later.

It was fully inflated at about 7:00 when the light turn out.
Best of luck. Hope he will get better for you.

Yes and it stayed inflated most of the night.

I think it is doing better a little bit each time. Just keeping the regiment going.

Thanks!

[Breadman03]

I'm so jealous! I've seen a couple Haddoni's locally, but never a gig.

That video feed is sweet. I got on it the first day, but didn't have time to comment.

[flakey]

This is in a way quite funny. We're probably all hanging around our tanks watching gigs. :spin3:

[FernandoReef]

Wow it is getting better! Let's see more pictures man!

[worm5406]

I think it is looking good today, but trying to NOT be too optimistic.


Took some pictures a few minutes ago. Waiting for them to upload.

Will post them soon.

[worm5406]

This is in a way quite funny. We're probably all hanging around our tanks watching gigs. :spin3:

I can always pull up the video stream so.. I can.. HAHAHA

Wow it is getting better! Let's see more pictures man!


I know I know... I am.. It is uploading both video and pics.

[worm5406]

Here is one from the cell phone about 5pm (1700)

<iframe width="1280" height="720" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/QJoN4Dx8BHM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Pictures still uploading plus a HD video from the camera.

[worm5406]

Another one with the HD camera.

<iframe width="960" height="720" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/TFZd6Cgdync" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[worm5406]

http://worm5406.smugmug.com/photos/i-Lwd67XJ/0/X3/i-Lwd67XJ-X3.jpg

http://worm5406.smugmug.com/photos/i-cD8JDnJ/0/X3/i-cD8JDnJ-X3.jpg

http://worm5406.smugmug.com/photos/i-x2mtFBG/0/X3/i-x2mtFBG-X3.jpg

http://worm5406.smugmug.com/photos/i-2jmvGd3/0/X3/i-2jmvGd3-X3.jpg

http://worm5406.smugmug.com/photos/i-6h5GZtG/0/X3/i-6h5GZtG-X3.jpg

http://worm5406.smugmug.com/photos/i-nc7fH23/0/X3/i-nc7fH23-X3.jpg

[Breadman03]

Another one with the HD camera.

<iframe width="960" height="720" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/TFZd6Cgdync" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

I'm just going to set my laptop up behind my tank and play this on a loop...

[flakey]

Is that you on the organ? :spin3:

[worm5406]

I play but not that good. LOL... I had to drown out the kids yelling and screaming in the video, I made them touch the ritteri with the underside of their bicep.

I think they will now clean the house when asked.

Actually didn't want to hear the water sound. Was making RO/DI at same time, QT, HT and Dehumidifier running... LOL

[worm5406]

When I replace http:. with http: it works for me

oh yes.....

Thanks.

I said to not tell anyone.. Geezes...

Was trying to make it hard to figure it out.

LOL

[D-Nak]

Looks like it's still poop dead zoox. You're removing it from the tank, right? Other than that it's looking good.

[worm5406]

Yes even doing 100% water change to get it all.

It looked kick butt today when the lights were just right.

I think a few more cycles of getting the old stuff out and it will look better!

[worm5406]

Bubbles...

<iframe width="1280" height="720" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/AzVpMUbYjNs" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[worm5406]

OK this is day three.

Sorry after 2:40 it is graphic. You can see it work to expel some zoonanthe, and eventually get rid of it.

If this is too much documentation please tell me.

Right now it is looking better and better.

Live feed shows it fluffed back up and looking nice. (yeah at night too)

Thank you for those sending PM and asking questions here in the forum.

<iframe width="1280" height="720" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/jAIizdIrAq0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Temp running at a constant 82. Sg of 1.027 Water change today was 100% Cipro given just after camera pulled to d/l time-lapse.

[flakey]

That's a very good video worm. It looked terrible after it pooped. Glade it's looking much better now.

[terri_ann]

OMG! OMG!! He's AWESOME!!!!! +1 on low light.....SLOWly :0) Looks like both of you are doing VerY GOOD! Subscribed, of course :0)

[flakey]

Why are the lights off?

[worm5406]

Lights do not come up till like 1300 ish...

I subscribe to 100% light control.

My day is
13:00 @ 10%
15:15 @ 50%
21:30 @ 50%
25:55 @ 0%

So ramp up and back down from 1300 to midnight.

Right now its only 1411 and you posted at 13:35.... LOL

The HT/GIG tank is on a reduced % compared to the main tank, so I think it had just not come on yet when you looked.

[worm5406]

OK.. So a cycle of about 7 hours of light is about all it wants to take right now.

I am going to set the control to knock back at 7 hours instead of going for 10.

As we always state, watch it and it will tell you.

OK here are a few pics:

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-rOBYSct3zCs/Uv5-gcdi0fI/AAAAAAABPZc/1DEo-w1IACQ/s800/20140214_153635.jpg

Behind the scenes at the production studio:

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-fWlZjYSTde8/UwALEmByAJI/AAAAAAABPeM/m99GFzQgC4M/s800/20140215_194842.jpg

You can see the green screen and stand-in's waiting. The camera crew was out to lunch and let their cameras in place, so I took a quick shot.

This is just after water change and right before I took the camera off. In the timelaps (whihc is uploading) near the end you will see what looks light lightening. That was the flash pic. Timing I guess. LOL

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-9qQsYe9QCvU/UwF-KEo-8iI/AAAAAAABPeI/pTTh6Koc0HY/s800/20140216_220927.jpg


Once it is done uploading I will post in today's video.

Personally.. I feel real great about today. One of my boys turned 20. My 19yo 11yo and I went to the range...

OOPS... the gig... Sorry.

It has shown so much more life and many of the positive signs like holding its self up and closing its mouth all the way.

In the video you can see waves of fluid pushing and even a knot where it is working on dislodging something inside and it just keeps on and on..

I know it looks like a time-lapse... Take a look at this next video in full screen and high def. See and sense what it is doing. Over my years I have always like to use a time lapse to show people what is really going on. Weather it be large scenes or even something as small as this.

OK I guess that was the teaser for the video.

Thanks for stopping by and seeing how it is going.

[OrionN]

That Gigantea looks great. He is well on his way to recover.
The light I got on my HT is much less powerful than Radion which you have on your's. Mine is doign well also. Tonight is the last night I will treat with antibiotic. I will do a 100% water change tomorrow and we will see.
Good luck with your's. He is lovely. Like D-Nak, I think any healthy Gigantea is beautiful, regardless of color. Some color is better than other. Your multi-color Gigantea looks like he will be a looker.

[worm5406]

This got done uploading sometime after I went to bed. So sorry for the late post.

<iframe width="1280" height="720" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/JnvHEBTr9R0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[915MANG]

Whats sup WORM! Pretty Sweet Mang!

[worm5406]

Hey how are you?? Where ya been? -- Thanks!!

OK so... I was looking at the camera today and I took the full tank camera and moved it over to see the qt tank. almost a straight down look. I looked at the other cameras view finder first. Just to see what it saw, interesting to see.

Then I noticed the gig... It is wider than it was yesterday, now I am marking some of it up as the angle, but it is still relaxing more and more each day.

In the midst of day 5... things are going strong so far.

[y0ung0ne]

looking great worm.......I am a bit jealous.........wish I had a tank large enough for a gig as well lol.

[worm5406]

For those of you that have never looked over to my build thread, here is a quick over view. The first tank is the 120, where the gig will end up going.

BTW... there is a quick 30 sec or so of the gig at the end of this video. I know the other one is still uploading... so I thought you would like to see it while you wait.

<iframe width="1280" height="720" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/B7A0S6V6l0k" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[worm5406]

@Orion

Hummm.... Mine has had nice open day and no shrinkage/expunging. (well I am uploading the video, I always look through it all the way (got kids ya know...) and I do not remember any.)

I know you are a day ahead of mine. I might do another day of cipro and try a no-cipro day and see how it does.

What do you think?

[ocellaris123]

Nice video, really like the Melanopus pair you have in the 180. How do they get along with the occies?

[terri_ann]

:thumbsup: :bounce2:

[maxxII]

Looks good. I'm jealous.

Cant find a healthy S.gigantea in my neck of the woods and now I'm going to be full up on anemones with my H.magnifica's.

Glad to see its doing well and responding to treatment and your lighting regimen.

I've seen newly acclimated anemones act like that when they get too much light...

[Pinkskunk]

Worm

where did you get that green Nepthea leather? i have been looking for that.

nice tank.

[OrionN]

I am not sure what happen to my post. I think I may have posted on the other thread.

I think you should treat it a little longer, until 3 days of no deflation. I do think you got too much light on your sick Gig and decrease light as you did helps.

Since your aquarium does not have any anemone in it. Put him there directly should be OK, or you can keep him for a day or two in the HT with no Cipro, all up to you.

Best of luck with him. I think he will do well.

[worm5406]

I am not sure what happen to my post. I think I may have posted on the other thread.

I think you should treat it a little longer, until 3 days of no deflation. I do think you got too much light on your sick Gig and decrease light as you did helps.

Since your aquarium does not have any anemone in it. Put him there directly should be OK, or you can keep him for a day or two in the HT with no Cipro, all up to you.

Best of luck with him. I think he will do well.

Yeah 3 days after last deflation is the plan.

I am glad I reduced the light also. It does seem to help him.

The 120 is plumbed into the same system that the 180 is. This means while it is not directly in the same 120, it is in the same water column.

Once three days of no deflation are done I will do two days of no cipro in the HT.

Thanks!

[worm5406]

Nice video, really like the Melanopus pair you have in the 180. How do they get along with the occies?
They get along nicely. The Alpha is Cinnamon female. The Omega OC keeps her distance and they do swim together at times. The Cinnamon male is prob 1/4 the size of the female and he is very subservient.
:thumbsup: :bounce2:
Thanks Terri_ann !! Glad to see you.
Looks good. I'm jealous.

Cant find a healthy S.gigantea in my neck of the woods and now I'm going to be full up on anemones with my H.magnifica's.

Glad to see its doing well and responding to treatment and your lighting regimen.

I've seen newly acclimated anemones act like that when they get too much light... Yeah that is what I am thinking too. It is doing better each day espc after the light reduction.

Worm

where did you get that green Nepthea leather? i have been looking for that.

nice tank.
Thanks. I got the leather from a friend that was getting out of reefing. It just came out of 5 week QT

[worm5406]

Here is Day 5 video.

<iframe width="1280" height="720" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/ZpK_I_PvCOw" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[flakey]

So when should you start increasing light to match you display tank? You don't want to shock it when you move it in.

[worm5406]

Well the bigger issue is I am using a 10g tank with a radion that is just above the tank. The light is no where near any sort of "percentage' of what would be in the DT.
I need a par meter to see what it is in both situations and adjust according ly.

It is possible that the light put into the 10g @7% is perfect compared to what is in the DT @50%

[worm5406]

Maybe I can get the par meter from a friend during out next meet and greet.

[worm5406]

OK... so I got home and it was looking pretty swell. Had to take a small video.

<iframe width="960" height="720" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/jn6WiU7AGzM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

It might be uploading so if it errors out give it another try in a few minutes.

Any one want some spaghetti?

[y0ung0ne]

looking good worm hope all is going well with your gig

[RJT]

Nice tight mouth. The video seems a little cloudy. How is the anemone color in person?

[worm5406]

@Youngone -- Yes things are doign grat. I just looked at the video I am uploading from today and I had ZERO deflation. I am real happy now!!

@RJT -- Hummm I do not see any cloudyness. I will check, well I clean it out quite a bit lately, but I will still check. Thanks, maybe I am over looking it.

Here is a video from 10pm

<iframe width="960" height="720" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/CuKaghL4DBQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[worm5406]

OK so to catch up on documentation some:

Over the past few days there has not been any change in the regiment, of treatment: (I will start at lights out just as a zero point.)

At lights out 100% water change to get rid of all the previous sloth and xooanthae.
Water has been 1.026 at 82 degrees, fresh saltwater that has been mixing and aerating to ensure O2 in water since this is such a small tank.

Add 1x 250mg tablet of cipro, via squishing it between two fingers to let it dissolve.

Lights come on at 1300 and go off at 1900, This was later but changed when I could see when it was retracting from enough light for the day.

Remove suck off any particles floating.

Observations:

Over the past few days I have seen, via the time-lapse playback, lots of xooanthae and also some sloth/peeling of the skin come off. You can see the anemone work segments in increasing the pressure to work out different areas and expel the xooanthae. One video showed a large section get expelled.

The waves, of increase in pressure, show a lot of work being done by the anemone to flush out different sections and there have been times where it has increase all the segments to engorge it's self, most likely flushing out other particles. You can see a 'knot', short of any other word, in the segments as it works extra pressure in certain areas and moves it to other sections to work on them. I say extra pressure because you can see a pushing/torque on the flesh.

Just these past 36-48 hours was the first time it has not deflated totally. On inspection of the mouth I have seen it go from toned but wide, all the way to tight and puckered. Currently it is slightly opened and toned.

Coloring:
Coloring has changed/expelled over the time frame I have had it. Now it is a tan overall instead of a slight multi color view. Granted this may be from the light as I have not always had the same light or camera at the same time looking at it.

Outlook and plan:
With today being it's first day of zero deflation I will now count down to another two days, where, as long as there is no deflation, under existing treatment program. I will stop the cipro.

Tomorrow I will check to see if the tentacles are sticky, as they are currently very active under low/no flow.

[terri_ann]

Great job on nursing him back to health!:love1: I know the journey isn't over yet but you have done wonderfully! I definitely think he's going to make it!:bounce1:

[maxxII]

My suggestions, (worth exactly what you paid for them, although I'm not experienced with S gigantea, I've nursed one of my H.magnifica's back to health using this methodology...see This thread (http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=749311) "Heteractis magnifica - tell me some success stories" for more on that....)

Start feeding slowly, without clowns in the tank, small amounts every other day.

When you feel like moving the anemone to the display, measure the distance of the anemone from the light, (total distance the anemone is from the light, and the distance the anemone is under the surface of the water) and replicate that in the display tank.

Then slowly, (ie once per month) increase the intensity of the Radion 5%. Once you've reached 80%, you're at about 250 Watt HQI MH 10K bulb levels for par. I base this on my own experience of running 10k XM SE bulbs with my H.magnifica's and then switching over to Phoenix 14K SE bulbs with no change in behavior, (ie no panning for more light no movement to seek higher intensity lighting), and then switching to Radion Gen 1's at 12K setting at 80% intensity level again with no change in behavior, (ie no panning for more light no movement to seek higher intensity lighting).

Obviously this is anecdotal with a sample size of one...but there it is. If your anemone begins to show signs of unhappiness, go back to what you were doing before.

Slow and steady wins this race.

IMO/IME clowns with a weakened anemone, (from shipping stress, tank stress whatever) are a bad idea. I've seen anemones that should have survived killed by clowns that stole food from it. The anemone's attempt to capture and ingest food that is later stolen by clowns is a net loss of energy and metabolic resources that a weak anemone cannot sustain.

If the anemone is not at 100%, IMO/IME you should either keep clowns out of it, or watch them carefully and be prepared to intervene and chase the clowns out of the anemone, (I've used an algae scraper in the past although anything similar will work) until it fully ingests the food item. Once the food item, (small at first) is fully ingested, the clowns can be allowed to return to the anemone.

This can take as long as 60 minutes in a seriously weakened anemone in my experience. You may be "guarding" this anemone for as long as several months, until it is healthy enough to resist the clowns from stealing food from it.

IME, once the clowns cannot steal food from the anemone, you've won, and the anemone should survive barring any further complications.

Good luck, and once again, I'm jealous.

You have a beautiful anemone that looks like its on the right track to becoming a show piece of your tank.

[SNAKEMANVET]

The gig is looking a lot better.

[worm5406]

Great job on nursing him back to health!:love1: I know the journey isn't over yet but you have done wonderfully! I definitely think he's going to make it!:bounce1:

I too think it will be a centerpiece in the 120 and will be healthy, thanks.


Then slowly, (ie once per month) increase the intensity of the Radion 5%. Once you've reached 80%, you're at about 250 Watt HQI MH 10K bulb levels for par. I base this on my own experience of running 10k XM SE bulbs with my H.magnifica's and then switching over to Phoenix 14K SE bulbs with no change in behavior, (ie no panning for more light no movement to seek higher intensity lighting), and then switching to Radion Gen 1's at 12K setting at 80% intensity level again with no change in behavior, (ie no panning for more light no movement to seek higher intensity lighting)..... ...... ....

Good luck, and once again, I'm jealous.

You have a beautiful anemone that looks like its on the right track to becoming a show piece of your tank.

I have wondered what the setting % was, from another person. I keep getting different opinions and ideas, and charts, on what people think the equivalent is.

Thanks for ideas and suggestions.

The gig is looking a lot better.

Thanks, I can't wait to see it relaxed and back to what ever its normal size was.

[worm5406]

OK the upload failed last night. Youtube did not like the video format, so I will try again to upload it.

[worm5406]

This upload took forever. WOW... Someoneelse at home must have been downloading a movie or something.

This video shows over a full 24 hours of no deflation.

<iframe width="1280" height="720" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/YlO5tj2MNtU" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[davocean]

Nice informative thread, and I like that time lapse vid.
That red hadonni is impressive as well, hopefully there is no allelopathy between the two tied systems.
Gig looks real nice!

[worm5406]

With running carbon, any attempted cou`p, to be the dominant anemone will be washed/filtered away. I even have the capability to run two chambers of carbon.

LOL

In my system right now I have (in order of palcement) LTA, Ritteri, RBTA, Haddoni.

They get along fine.

I am really trying to document the treatment and hopefully will have a better write up at the end with some pro's and con's with some lessons learned too.

[worm5406]

It finally updated Day 7.

Day 8 in the process of uploading.

<iframe width="1280" height="720" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/VJBPdaxdpvQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Sorry for my slow internet connection. One would think they would have run FIOS out all over the place here in DC by now.... NO...... Not in DC.... :/

[worm5406]

Day 8 (thursday)

Take a look 7:30 forward. During this time frame it really tries to get rid of what I can only say the last bit and it is mostly a dry heave. (sorry for the usage of human terms). A little but comes out and it tries to take some tentacles and get the rest out.

Interesting.

Do you have any thoughts or ideas?

<iframe width="1280" height="720" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/eX6KTnN8e-g" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[D-Nak]

Day 8 (thursday)

Take a look 7:30 forward. During this time frame it really tries to get rid of what I can only say the last bit and it is mostly a dry heave. (sorry for the usage of human terms). A little but comes out and it tries to take some tentacles and get the rest out.

Interesting.

Do you have any thoughts or ideas?


I noticed the same happening with my gigs. I think "dry heaving" really is a good description. I noticed that the dead zoox slowly collects right under the surface of the disc, then radiates inward toward the mouth where it is expelled. In other words, it's not ingested and coming from the nem's "bowels" but more from the skin itself.

I think this further illustrates why -- about six months to a year ago when we saw a bunch of them -- the bleached gigs had a better survival rate than the fully colored up ones. With nothing to expel, the bleached gigs could focus on rebuilding their zoox population.

Though the typical recommendation is 7-10 days of treatment with Cipro, I definitely recommend keeping yours in QT until it stops deflating and expelling dead zoox for at least a few days. Keep up the good work, and as always... best of luck!

[worm5406]

Thanks... It has not 'deflated' in the sense compared to day 1-4. So that is a good thing. While I am at the 3+ day after last deflate, I will wait to put it in the DT.

I know that being in a live tank with live items and better lighting will help in the long run.

Today/night I will not do any cipro and see how it reacts.

[taylor t]

Worm, I'm just curious about your lights... How high off the tank are they, and at what %? How long (hours) of exposure? I know you've changed them since you got it, I'm just wondering where they are now. What is the flow from? How many GPH pumps? How many pumps? I'm curious, that's all... :)

Also, can we have some details on the water quality "control"? What's the water change schedule and % of change? Cipro is done, right? How many days did you cipro? Are there other media's you're using? Again, I'm curious to attempt to understand, that's all. I've seen all the video's, and watched the cam (thanks by the way!) and I'm just wondering about the "mechanics" behind the scenes. Thanks. :)

[worm5406]

Not a problem... Lets get started up to last night:

Water change:
Day 1-2 I was doing 50%.
Day 3-current I have been doing 100%
The reason I changed was a lot of debri and once I started it looked 100% compared to doing 50%. I know there is still stuff floating around even with 50%, so I kept up 100% to reduce what was in the water. Most water changes were at lights out, a few were done during the day/ morning due to amount of particles in water.

Water:
RODI with SG at 1.026 (+/- .001)
Airated/circulated with MJ1200 pump
Heated to 80 degrees, since doing 100% did not want anemone to be at 50 degrees.
I have done DT water a few times also, mixing it up, I have not seen any change in reaction either on camera or video from change. Frankly I can not remember the dates I did DT, and just now looking back at all the video, I can not tell, as there is no physical change.

Pump:
1x mj1200 on 24/7

Lights:
Radion set to 8 %.
Day 1-2 was at 30% (too much)
Day 3+ at 7-8%
Heigth is about 6 inches off water.
Lights on at noon and off at 1900. First 1.5 hour is a slow ramp to 12k working through the blue. At 1900 OFF, no ramp down.

Cipro:
1x 250mg tab put in after 100% water change, reguardless of time of day. Most water changes were at lights out, a few were done during the day/ morning due to amount of particles in water. The past two days (FRI and SAT) I have not put cipro in tank. Last was Thurs at Lights Off/WC.

--
--
--

Thanks on the video and cam comments.

I am thinking of putting that cam near the 120 with a view on the gig, when it gets put into the DT.

That might be as early as Sunday. Need to get it moving. Will do a WC this evening with only DT water.

[worm5406]

<iframe width="1280" height="720" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/wYr76MvoB9k" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Day 9

About 7:00+ again tryign to get last bit out. It is doing a really good job at working on it. It is nice to see!!

No cipro yesterday and none today.

Looking to move it into the DT on Sunday.

[taylor t]

Thanks for the info. I don't mean to step on anyone's toes, I know too many cooks in the kitchen can "spoil the meal"... And, I've been biting my tongue the last week... But, in my book, at the 7+ minute mark of the video you just posted, that's a deflate (again, in my book with a fresh arrival). I would be really careful adding that guy to the DT too early. IMO, Sunday is too early. Again, I don't want to offend, or step on toes. I know you have some great people helping you through, and I'll not post any more opinions of mine after this post, but I think I'd be really careful adding this guy to the DT too early. IMO, it should increase in size when lights come on, stay that way ALL day, and reduce size (not go flat or floppy) at night (still firm, just smaller). Yours looks pretty good at night, from what I've seen, (at times, almost looks better size at night) but because your lights are too close to the water's surface, it's struggling to adapt to daytime lights - all day - and not shrink. It does look good a large portion of the day, don't get me wrong. In the email I sent you last week, I mentioned I'd raise that light up 6"... Now, I think I'd raise it up a whole foot... more than you currently have it... Again, I know you didn't, but just what I'd do. I know you don't want to... up to you. (the battle of too many cooks with differing opinions). I feel raising it will better blend the led's. Just my thoughts, I'm pretty sure your light has UV in it, maybe it's too much too close. I fully understand, gigs can handle more light than we can provide, (when healthy) AND need tons of it to look good, but it takes time and acclimation, some more than others. Some can go full bore out of the gate, while others can take weeks to months. There comes a point though, more light MUST be given for it to improve. It needs to be inflated 100% all the time, before lights are ramped up. Just like us, some of us can run miles today, some would die from a heart attack. We are not all in the same shape or condition. Takes time to train for a marathon. (my wife is a personal trainer, works out all the time, I can out run her any day, and have, distance and speed, I don't regularly excercise). Every one is built differently.
Now flow, I'll leave this one alone. Better too much flow than not enough, but I will say this, yours is getting much more flow than the one's I have in my DT.
Final one. Water changes from a DT with other anemone's in it, isn't proven bad, but MAY have things in it from other nems that don't agree with a new arrival. It may be ok, BUT, IF there's things in it that don't agree, the recovery won't go as well, or easy as it could. Why chance it. Everyone's tanks are different, what works for some, won't work for others. IF it was mine, ONLY fresh SW would be used, until I was happy with the recovery, (100% inflated all the time, not 100% size all the time)THEN I would use DT water to acclimate it where it's going. Just what I would do - OCD. Salt is cheap, compared to the nem and the effort.

Again, no disrespect to anyone, just trying to help. I know the guys behind the scenes with you are fully capable and experienced, but from where I'm sitting, just how I see it. I really DO want to see you bring this guy back, and bring it to "full glory" again. Bottom line, we ALL want to see the same thing. 100% inflation all the time. NOt 100% size all the time, but 100% inflation all the time. (I know, there's always the exception it deflates one day, then looks great for months later).

The mouth. I can't see it, it tells part of the story too. You may be seeing a nice tight mouth all the time, but the few times I've seen it.....

Worm, you alone see it first hand everyday, and have the best perspective. You’ve got to go with your own thoughts. The things I am seeing may not be accurate to real life. Maybe in person, you're seeing them progress better than I'm seeing. If you feel Sunday is a good move, then I hope you're right and wish you the best. Again, I'm sorry if anyone is offended by my opinions. Not my intension. Only trying to help. Just my .02

[OrionN]

I also think at about 7:30 mark, you anemone deflates. He looks great the rest of the day.
I have always treat my anemone HT with water from DT, with multiple anemones in it. This have never give me any problem.
I do have less light, a lot less than you most of the time, but do have full sunlight for about 4-5 hrs or so, and have less flow in my DT. I use a smaller PH bounce it against the top of the water and the wall, not directly toward the anemone.

[flakey]

There are some very good comments in there Taylor. I think it's important to share your knowledge. I will be switching to using fresh salt water rather than water from the display tank as my one does look very good this morning and maybe that's because of the point about having multiple nems while in the recovery period. Worm has a massive advantage with his time lapse videos in that he can see everything that happens. Most of us don't have this, I inly get to see mine between 7pm and midnight and everytime I was home it was looking fantastic which is why I moved it into the display tank so quickly. Maybe I missed it deflate. People like me especially need a firm kick as well to listen to others advice. In hindsight I should have put it in treatment again a lot sooner. I guess I was in denial and hoping for the best.

[worm5406]

No offence taken. If I was to take offence I would not be posting and sharing my experiences.

I will leave it in the QT for a while.

The major reason I want to do a DT water change is it will eventually need to get in that water and the lack of exposure to it now will be a sudden shock on it's system when it is put in.

I agree they look like deflations, but to me a deflation is more of a flat piece of paper look, not keeping its structure.

I am in no rush, the color is reducing more and more daily, from day one, which is a concern of mine.

The stringy and xooanthae has gone to almost zero floating in the tank.

I have increased the height again in the tank.

[worm5406]

<iframe width="1280" height="720" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/uhIm1r6dk_k" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[worm5406]

During some maintenance I turned off the pump.

Wanted to get a pic/video anyway. Here is the mouth and some tentacle reactions during pump off.

<iframe width="1280" height="720" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/MRMsXDORMWw" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Keep on commenting. Do not worry about being critical and please out your ideas out there. I am wanting this to live, not some bedside etiquette telling me that things will be ok.

Thanks fellow reefers.

[OrionN]

It is looking good right now. Consider cut back on the flow a little.

[taylor t]

Thanks worm. Again, I'm sorry if my post seemed a bit harsh - didn't mean it that way. Sometimes I speak my mind with out thinking how to deliver it nice. I live with girls that tell me I'm mean all the time... I'm working on it!

We're all pulling for your gig to recover. :) Like I told you before, I'm one of your biggest fans, and appreciate reading the help you give to others, your advice/intentions are always good. I really want to see you succeed with this.

It loosing color is my/our least concern. I know you don't think those are deflates, but I've seen tooooo many, I know what I'm staring at now. Someone needs to step up here. I don't want to be that guy, but here I am... For a gig, those are deflates. Staying inflated 24/7 is my biggest concern. It will regain color no problem, if it lives. Takes time, and needs to stay inflated to pass time. If it doesn't stay inflated, color won't matter, ever. It shouldn't be struggling like this so far into the game. I'm impressed it's made it so far with the intensity it's gotten, to be honest... Tells us it's a fighter. Like I said, everyone's different, and that one you've got needs a good internal flushing, still. IMO. If that guy you have was mine, it is still over one week, maybe two, from me even thinking about going to DT, and that's if it never deflates from here on out, and the mouth is closed all the way in that time frame also - all the time. I still believe 100% water changes everyday will be your nem's best friend too. What a hastle... I know!

Just to give you some insight as to why I feel the way I do about lighting... I want to show you my HT.
Bear with me, I'm going somewhere with all this... Just to give a peek inside of my OR... This is my 10 gallon, with a HOB filter with no media, just a surface scum skimmer. Not really doing anything but skimming the surface scum and moving a little water. I have an air stone in the back of it, poor man's oxygenator. Then a heater, and the smallest korillia I think they make. Very low flow. My lights are (2) runs of 12, (24 total LED's) of 3 watt cree, xre (old school from a few years ago, not the strong ones they sell now) with both white and blue on dimmers, seperate drivers. Manually dimmable.

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh180/dave1748/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zpsbfc91742.jpg (http://s256.photobucket.com/user/dave1748/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zpsbfc91742.jpg.html)




Here's my driver dimmers. It's DIY, so not pretty. It works.
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh180/dave1748/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps95d2074e.jpg (http://s256.photobucket.com/user/dave1748/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image_zps95d2074e.jpg.html)

I run mine 9 hours, right out the gate, LOW INTENSITY. I'm blessed (or cursed, depending on the side of the fence you're on) to be self emplyoyed, so I've been able to be home with new arrivals, and see how they adapt to the lights throughout the day, and make manual adjustments on lighting as I see how they can handle it. I'm using (24) 3 watt cree LED's, which puts me around 72 watts, (less, I've got a couple burned out) which is about 100 watts less, I believe, than the fixture you're using. Isn't the radion 175 watts or so? I think? I start mine at about 5%, and slowly ramp it up on day one, until I see them start to shrink in size, then back it down to 75% of that. That's my starting LED intensity. Usually it's around 15-20% (of 72 watts). If it deflates later in the day and I catch it deflated, lights are out that second, for the rest of the day. (no lights fo you! next!) I back down the lights a little more, and we try again the next day, until they go all day with no deflate. One thing is sure. I can make any and every gig in my QT, so far, shrink by turning my lights too high. That's how I find their "breaking point", then back it down. I've done this with more than a few now. :) So far this works very well.
When I'm ready to move mine to my DT, the HT lights are usually turned up to around 25-40% area by then, and they are starting to color up. It's not super intense. Super intense light comes later, after it's gained some color, then you can put the screws to it. Needs to stay inflated before this, and during all the light cycle. IMO, one week of absolutely NO deflation (IMO) for them to be welcomed into the DT.


Worm, you've been doing a great job so far, I know it's a lot of work. Don't give up! We're all cheering you on! I still think yours will make it, but it's got to start staying inflated 24/7. It's not, yet. Watching your cam, my gut is telling me it's still your lights. Water quality, only you can know that, and you have the experience for it, so non-issue, you know what you are doing. When it comes to DT water acclimation, it pales in comparison to light acclimation, IME. I have to agree with Minh, gigs aren't tough to keep, once acclimated and healthy. Getting them healthy, and acclimated is typically tough to do, and lots of work and time, but worth it! But, there's always that one that drops right in to the DT under the 1000 watt MH and does great. Not the norm. Doesn't take a degree to find thread after thread of dead gigs. Now with cipro, the biggest hurdle to overcome, IMO, is acclimation.

Everything I've typed is my opinion/my experience. Nice thing about cipro, it's like a reset button. Gig deflates all the time now? Reset. After reset, then acclimation. Thanks Doc (Minh). :)

I'm just trying to give you the best chance of your gig's survival from what I've done in the past, with great results, with what is in my opinion, the best chance of success. I've read a lot, I've talked a lot, I've killed a lot. Now, I feel I've learned a lot. One reason I hate responding to threads, too many details, and one detail left out can make a huge difference. Are 100% water changes really needed? Maybe not, but I feel everything I do just adds to the chances of a gig making it, and if it's one little detail that gets it over the hump, it's a win.

Best of luck my friend. :) That last pic you posted, the top down, looks good. I really think this guy will make it, but it's a long road ahead. :)

[taylor t]

Also, did it deflate at the end of the light cycle again today? I missed it today.

[worm5406]

OK took light down even more...

It is at 5% right now.

At about 6 inches off water.

I do not think I can take it any lower, but I will see, with out it cutting out.

YES... I appreciate and look for the comments.

Just like that person the other day, who did not think we were wrong, his anemone is gone now.

Listening takes more than ears.

Thanks!

[worm5406]

Also, did it deflate at the end of the light cycle again today? I missed it today.

Uploading video now, it wont let me review until it is done, but I think so, right at water change.

[taylor t]

I think it may be a better quality light if you raise it up 2', and turn it up a hair so it doesn't flicker then. That light you're using is a real power house.

[worm5406]

The bigger issue is, also, it is a 10gal tank.

It is not a 24 inch tall tank...120 or 180 or what ever.

The readings are way off compared to a normal tank.

I just did up it two more inches.

Now it is 10 inches off the water top, as it is not even filled to the edge.

[worm5406]

Hummm I can set it to 2 feet above the tank. I have the hanging wires and open joist construction rafters.

[OrionN]

Hang in there worms. He will turn around.

[worm5406]

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[worm5406]

OK 100% water change today.

Added cipro after water change.

Moved the Power head so that the flow is in a different direction now.

I moved it 90 degrees to the right. As if in a 10 gal tank that that makes a big difference. LOL

Uploading today's video so it will be up when it is finished.

Still trucking along.

Ohh there is a good size expel today. I am unsure what is left to expel. When looking at the flesh and the light shining through it there are less spots/shadows in it now.

[worm5406]

Day 12:
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Playlist of all videos:

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[worm5406]

Is it possible that there is too little light?

It was doing very nicely until I started to raise the light higher and higher.

[OrionN]

How far? and what at percentage is your Radion?

[worm5406]

I am at 9 inches and at 5% on 12k

[OrionN]

I think that is too little light. May be 20-30% at 9 inches would be OK. I got 30 W LED at about 8-9 inches. Watt for watt, 20-30% of Radion should be at about 30-40 Watts.
I know that my anemones did well, no problem, with this level of light.

I do have less flow that you seem to have in your HT. I use the smallest Koralia

[worm5406]

I have adjusted my PH to bounce off three walls at the top of the tank. So it only gets residual circular flow.

Once I upload todays video you will see it hold the leading edge at an almost 90 degree while the rest floated behnd it and just sat.

I will up the light and see what we get. I will leave it the same height though, and I can remote in and change the light % if need be.

[taylor t]

Sorry to see this guy struggling so much. You're the only one with in person view to make adjustments. What ever it takes to get it to stay inflated. Priority #1. One day of low light is nothing more than a storm in the reef, or a cloudy day. If you feel ramping it up will help, do it. You're only one day behind strong lights, right? Are you able to make fine tune adjustments during the day, dependant on it's reactions?

Got to get it to stay inflated. The window is closing. If it deflates with lights on, I would kill the lights. If lights come on, and it does not inflate, I would increase lights. Need to find where that guy's needs are, and I have a feeling their needs are on a sliding scale dependant on too many other things that go on, or have gone on.

I've kept them alive for over a month, with a gapped mouth, when I knew they were good as dead. I used a power head on a wave maker to be the "internal pump" to inflate it. It would puff up, look great (with open mouth) then slowly deflate. Ultimately it died, I pulled the plug, but was interesting to watch. Would have kept going. The insides were almost all gone, it was nothing but a shell with tents. Makes me wonder, if we need to think of them as 2 things, outer shell, and inside guy that's fed from hitchhikers (algae) from the outer shell. I also wonder, if hammering with strong light in the beginning, algae makes oxygen with light, right? Maybe it raised the oxygen level too high, (maybe internally oxidized?)it deflated, kept making high oxygen with dead/rotting material, just makes things worse... Who knows... That's my thoughts as to why I kill the lights if they deflate during light cycle. Not sure if I'm right, or way off. No one else seems to be coming up with anything though....

side note, IMO, the water has quite a lot of stuff in it, and I see snot strings in there at times too. I always make sure I get all the stuff out ASAP.

The smallest korillia works great. THat's what I use too.

I also think that radion comes with some really big LED's, not the little 3 watters I'm using, or that come in the par lamps Minh's using. Next round, I'd get a different light.

[worm5406]

When I get home from work I get the stuff out that I see. Watching on the camera gives everyone a sight that they normally would not get, and unless you are sitting right there, right then, you can not get that particle that just came out.

I am more like 4-5 days behind strong lights if I understand your statement.

Today is Feb 25.

[davocean]

I know those lights are pretty strong, but I too would think a little more than 5% might be needed.

[worm5406]

That is what I thought too, when I dropped it down to 5% it looked a bit worse.

I agree lets find that happy medium again and get it moving from there.

Thanks orion, taylor, davocean, and others.

[terri_ann]

Does anyone in your area have a MJ 400 PH they could loan you? If not, maybe you could put something over the outlet (sponge/filter floss) or use layers of eggcrate to deflect/disperse the flow alot? I was even thinking if you had an air pump for oxygen? Just wanting him to only expend his energy on what's important... Keeping the faith :0) You too, friend :0)

[worm5406]

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[flakey]

Hang in there man
There seems tone a lot of dirt in you tank. Should we be cleaning the glass etc and siphon the dirt out during water changes? I am, using a glass cleaner. How about inside your cup? Maybe the dirt is affecting water quality?

[worm5406]

True... I did not think, but I saw that.

I'll knock that out tonight. I might use my hand (and get stung doing it hahahaha). Keep an eye on the camera tonight in-case I grab my chest and keel over.

[flakey]

If you do keel over please try not getting I the way of the camera :p
I find the egg crate attracts a lot of stuff and clean it at every water change and also throughout the day when I see it looking dirty.

[worm5406]

Yeah I clean the egg crate like a washboard everytime too.

[D-Nak]

I wouldn't worry too much about it being completely clean. With daily water changes, you should be removing anything that will cause the water quality to degrade quickly, especially if you're removing any dead zoox and what sloughs off of the base.

Questions:

1. Can you switch to the smallest Koralia as others have mentioned, or turn down the flow so that the gig isn't moving at all? I use the same Koralia as well.

2. How consistent is the temperature? I just noticed today that my green gig was looking a bit odd -- the edge of the disc was curled on top of itself. Then I noticed that the heater was unplugged and the tank got into the low 70s.

3. The gig is starting to look bleached. Is that your assumption as well? I agree with others that it's to give it more light.

4. Is this a new QT tank? Was it ever used for anything else? Is it possible that there is residual "something" (I don't know what) that's affecting the nem?

5. Where us the replacement water coming from? Apologies if you've answered this already.

Keep up the good work. I know it's tough. This is probably the longest I've seen a gig hang on before either starting to show a full recovery, or dying. Something else is at play here, not just the illness. We just need to pinpoint what it is.

[worm5406]

I wouldn't worry too much about it being completely clean. With daily water changes, you should be removing anything that will cause the water quality to degrade quickly, especially if you're removing any dead zoox and what sloughs off of the base.

Questions:

1. Can you switch to the smallest Koralia as others have mentioned, or turn down the flow so that the gig isn't moving at all? I use the same Koralia as well.
I will have to get a PH then.

2. How consistent is the temperature? I just noticed today that my green gig was looking a bit odd -- the edge of the disc was curled on top of itself. Then I noticed that the heater was unplugged and the tank got into the low 70s.
The temp stays at a constant 82 except during water change where the temp gauge is out of the water.


3. The gig is starting to look bleached. Is that your assumption as well? I agree with others that it's to give it more light. I agree that is why I said that I think I should increase the light. Right now it is at 12%

4. Is this a new QT tank? Was it ever used for anything else? Is it possible that there is residual "something" (I don't know what) that's affecting the nem? Brand new fresh out of the box from the store. Nothing else has ever been in it. I did not start having this type of deflation until everyone sated to raise the light.

5. Where us the replacement water coming from? Apologies if you've answered this already.It is fresh made SW that has been airated and temperature raised. I thought the water might be off too so I tested it and there was nothing abnormal.

Keep up the good work. I know it's tough. This is probably the longest I've seen a gig hang on before either starting to show a full recovery, or dying. Something else is at play here, not just the illness. We just need to pinpoint what it is.

Exactly.... It is strange.

I have raised the light and lowered the intensity. I had it set to lights on at 1200 and then off around 1900.

I have even double water changed in one day when it was expelling more xooanthie. (snow day so I was off work)

[worm5406]

I have a MP40 I can put in there and set it to like night mode.

[terri_ann]

You could try it in a different container to see if there is a big difference in the flow :0) I know it gives a broader flow vs' the MJ's stream. I've never used the night mode so I can't tell you if it would work...reasoning says it would be better than the MJ.

Hopefully you cleaned the inside of the tank (like vinegar RO/DI) before filling it. I know this might sound crazy but do you have any bacteria in a bottle? Like Dr. Tim's One & Only? Good bacteria/probiotic may be helpful...

[OrionN]

Night mode for MP 40 is a little strong I think. Just dial it back until you have adequate flow, not too much. Night mode is a constant 50% flow for Vortech PH

[flakey]

Night mode only lasts for 10 hours before it returns to normal mode

[OrionN]

Forgot about the 10 hrs. I use the automated reeflink. The pumps go to night mode when the light go down.

[worm5406]

You could try it in a different container to see if there is a big difference in the flow :0) I know it gives a broader flow vs' the MJ's stream. I've never used the night mode so I can't tell you if it would work...reasoning says it would be better than the MJ.

Hopefully you cleaned the inside of the tank (like vinegar RO/DI) before filling it. I know this might sound crazy but do you have any bacteria in a bottle? Like Dr. Tim's One & Only? Good bacteria/probiotic may be helpful...
I have Dr Tim's and I did rinse it out with RO.

Should I add a bit of bacteria to let it eat away incase there is something else that I do not see. I can do that.

Night mode for MP 40 is a little strong I think. Just dial it back until you have adequate flow, not too much. Night mode is a constant 50% flow for Vortech PHAt 5% it goes down to 200 gph. Not night mode, but just the lowest setting. Manual mode not a varying reefcrest mode or anything. I use an Apex to control mine as it is.

Night mode only lasts for 10 hours before it returns to normal mode I use an Apex so I can set it to what I want it to do. Not having to manually opush the buttons for night mode works much better.

Forgot about the 10 hrs. I use the automated reeflink. The pumps go to night mode when the light go down.
+1 I have expericnce creating the different modes. I am currently changing my DT to about 11+ modes throughout the day.

[worm5406]

One thing is funny... If you watch the mug in the background it moves.

Something is moving it. :)

I do like the way it is looking lately. Like it has gotten over the extremes. Today marks two weeks in HT tank.

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[D-Nak]

Something is still very wrong. The balling up at 1:12 and 3:30 is not normal. I still think flow is an issue, but not the culprit. You don't want the gig to have to fight the flow to stay upright, which forces it to use energy. I would drop the flow down so that it barely blows over the top of the oral disc, allowing the current to remove any waste. I still can't believe this has been going on for two weeks. I'm stumped.

[worm5406]

For those watching the live camera you will see that it has moved some.

I re-directed the power head, so that there is low flow now, and it seemed to respond positively to it.

Lights up is about 12:30-1300.

[worm5406]

I am getting a korrola 750 tonight so it will have much lower flow tonight. I will change it and make the flow low and over the disc once I get it.

[worm5406]

Hummm since I moved the powerhead and the flow was reduced where it was sitting, it has moved closer to the grate where there is more flow.

Interesting.

http://worm5406.from-md.com:84/

username is guest and there is no password.

[OrionN]

Live video feed right now does not seem to show excessive flow. I would leave flow just as is. I think with time elapse movie, I may have over estimate the amount of flow.

[worm5406]

Hummm you might WANT to go look at the live feed.

[worm5406]

Quite a few are hitting the feed all at once so it may look laggy. Flow is deff reduced and it is climbing the wall, it left holding onto the cup that it was pulling on yesterday.

[OrionN]

I did. I went to look at the live feed.

[OrionN]

IMO, I think right now you have perfect flow for him. I would leave it as is.

[worm5406]

I am as it seems happy in both its movement and lighting.

[worm5406]

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I modified the lights to replicate what you see up until the blueing comes in. That is about 3:30pm today.

[worm5406]

I modified the lights to replicate what you see up until the blueing comes in. That is about 3:30pm today.

Let me re-word that.

After watching the video of day 15 I noticed about 3pm that the blues came up and it retracted. I have since modified the light pattern/frequency to what was before 3pm and hope to see a difference today.

If you read my old wording, it sounded like I modified it then took the video. As a reminder this is timelapse video, 5 minutes of video is squishing 24 hours (roughly) of time. That means that between frames is currently set to 10 seconds. There are 30 frames per second.

[worm5406]

Right now it is attached to the wall of the tank, so it looks bad. When I looked at it this morning it was nice and holding its self, even though the camera looks like it is very bad.

I guess I need to adjust the camera.

[worm5406]

Well things looked worse than I though.

It is still holding on to the wall.

I saw some of it on the camera but was at work and could not get home.

I did a triple water change when I got home hoping to get most of the junk out of the tank and the haze.

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[D-Nak]

As you probably have already realized, the anemone is showing signs of necrosis. I have never seen a gig come back when in this stage (where the tentacles begin to fall off). Unlike other anemones that detach when sick and lose the ability to stay attached to a surface -- be it a rock or the tank wall -- gigs can remain attached even though they are in very bad shape. The first gig I had began to decompose but was still attached to the rock. Sometimes, no matter what we do or how hard we try, the nems are just too far gone by the time we get them. Sorry.

[OrionN]

I think he is gone too. I think what he got is resistant to Cipro. The antibiotic slow the infection down but not eliminate it. I am sure the anemone does not smell bad, but I think he is too far gone.
With time elapse movies we can clearly see the waves rhythmic contractions of your when he tried to eliminate stuff from his body. IMO, in the future, we can look for continue contractions like this as evidence that treatment is not working.

I am sorry and better luck in the future.

[hecdr34]

Very sad to see this one go. I've been following since day one. I'm very sorry

[worm5406]

Yes it is gone. I looked at it this morning and I am about to dispose of him.

I do not know what is in the one red container. Looks like it was pregenant or something and it tried to let loose the young, or it was some sort of internal items. I have not seen them like that before. They are about the size of a grain of uncooked rice.

I am moving the live web feed to the 120, so if you are looking at it still, that will be the new view. Most people have not really seen into that tank as I have not publicized it that much since dealing with the Gig.

I went to the LFS that I got it from, today at an open house, and met a guy that was following my thread, nice to meet people outside of the screen.

Thanks for the notes/texts/e-mails with ideas/questions/recomendations.

I am going to wait about a month or so before I pursue any additional gig's. I need to do some tank work/update that I should have been doing. I am not going to give up on getting one.

-Larry

[davocean]

Sorry to hear despite all your efforts.
Look forward to seeing other tank cam.

[Pinkskunk]

sorry to hear Worm, you put so much effort toward the process........ hope for better luck next time.

[flakey]

Sorry to hear this worm. You certainly did try your best but I guess this one didn't play ball. Don't loose hope...

[worm5406]

Do not worry. I will not. I have already cleaned out the QT, PH, Heater, and Airpump.

I bleached it out and then flushed it all. Just to make sure nothing else was attached or left behind. Tossed the airstone and already have a new one ready.

My LFS is looking for one. I went to an open house at LFS today and they had three there, about the same color as the one I had too.

I did not get it, as I had to clean things out when I got home.

They are looking for a blue/purple one.

This will give me time to finish aquascaping the 120 and fine tune the way things are running.

[terri_ann]

:( :sad2: :sad1: So very sorry friend... Both of you gave it your all. :love1:

[worm5406]

Thanks for all the kind words, everyone.